What does a parent "owe" their child?

[nakedfrog]

Originally posted by: DLeRium
Aren't you the guy who didn't even finish college? Come on. College today is ESSENTIAL. In fact a BS degree is worth a HS degree 30 years ago. Engineering? Good God, do you know how hard it is to get a job in my field with a BS? EE friends I know too are all planning to go to get a MS if not PhD. My manager had a talk with me and he was pushing me to go back to school because he knows I'll need it to keep moving.

I'm a professional and I don't have a degree. I have some credit hours from the Community College of the Air Force from tech school, but not enough to get an Associate's degree, and they're completely unrelated to my career field (programming).
The misguided belief that "everyone has to go to college" is exactly what cheapened degrees to the point that, as you say, a BS = HS degree.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: DLeRium
Aren't you the guy who didn't even finish college? Come on. College today is ESSENTIAL. In fact a BS degree is worth a HS degree 30 years ago. Engineering? Good God, do you know how hard it is to get a job in my field with a BS? EE friends I know too are all planning to go to get a MS if not PhD. My manager had a talk with me and he was pushing me to go back to school because he knows I'll need it to keep moving.

I'm a professional and I don't have a degree. I have some credit hours from the Community College of the Air Force from tech school, but not enough to get an Associate's degree, and they're completely unrelated to my career field (programming).
The misguided belief that "everyone has to go to college" is exactly what cheapened degrees to the point that, as you say, a BS = HS degree.

Yep. Simple supply and demand at work. You'd think people who attended college would understand the concept.


Also I'm a high school graduate who started at the bottom as a junior programmer/helpdesk in a small company. Several jobs and promotions later I'm the IT Director at a medium sized company making six figures and without spending a dime on college.

People who will be successful after college would be successful without college. Will they make as much money? Maybe not. But people who are bitching about 65K/yr jobs after $80K in schooling have nobody to blame but themselves, because clearly college is no guarantee of income.

 

[Mo0o]

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: DLeRium
Aren't you the guy who didn't even finish college? Come on. College today is ESSENTIAL. In fact a BS degree is worth a HS degree 30 years ago. Engineering? Good God, do you know how hard it is to get a job in my field with a BS? EE friends I know too are all planning to go to get a MS if not PhD. My manager had a talk with me and he was pushing me to go back to school because he knows I'll need it to keep moving.

I'm a professional and I don't have a degree. I have some credit hours from the Community College of the Air Force from tech school, but not enough to get an Associate's degree, and they're completely unrelated to my career field (programming).
The misguided belief that "everyone has to go to college" is exactly what cheapened degrees to the point that, as you say, a BS = HS degree.

Maybe but college will open more doors. I think parents should push their kids to succeed in HS and try to get into a top university. These kind of opportunities dont around a second time and transferring in to one of those school from a CC or even state school is much more difficult. Even if the kid finishes the 4 years and wants to do something else, at least he'll have been exposed to higher education and people from all walks of life. I think college is one of the few places where you really get to meet kids from all parts of the united states. It's pretty cool

 

[ConstipatedVigilante]

I think they only "owe" the child food, shelter, education, and a good upbringing. My parents were especially generous in that I had my own computer in my early teens, a good car as soon as I got my license, and am now going to a good university paid for by them. I'm not complaining, but my life may have been too easy thus far. All I really had to do was get good grades in school, which really isn't hard.

 

[Jephph]

Originally posted by: her209
Food, clothing, and shelter until 18 years old. That's it.

Wow, SOMEBODY should NEVER have kids, or if you already do, you must hate them. It's unfortunate that there are parents like that.

Own bedroom? Nah, I shared with my bro until I went to college, worked out fine for us.
Own bed though? Definitely.
Reliable car? I like the idea of you pay half, I pay half of whatever car the child is willing to save up for.
Education- Parents are already obligated by law to send their children to school.
As far as college education, kids should know that they will have to pay off loans when they're out of college. Parents should help if they need help financially when they're in college initially, but parents shouldn't pay their whole way.
Computer? At least one in the house is sufficient. If each kid has their own, it can get very addicting, whether it be facebook or video games or porn.
If they do have their own, it should be in plain sight where it can be monitored (not like so that people can read their IMs or Facebook posts, but so that a parent can see if they're watching porn or spending too much time playing games, etc.

 

[nanette1985]

Originally posted by: vi edit

and yes we have accounts set up for college for both of my kids. i just hop eits enough by the time they are able to go to college. if they don't go to college i have enough for a one hell of a vacation

Assuming the stock market doesn't stink it up like it has last 6 months and actually posts some more historically traditional gains of 7% over the next 15 years, my $100 a month should net us around $32,000 or so for her college fund. Double that if I bump it to $200.

Even at that amount, it's $8,000 a year that she doesn't have to pay. If she gets a little bit in scholarships, then it's even less.

Right now, start researching the financial aid racket. Way too many parents don't realize that any money you've put away will be subtracted from financial aid, which effectively negates all the savings. There are ways to structure the money so that it doesn't have that negative effect, but you can't do it at the last minute.

 

[fstime]

Paid for college tuition, car, and house, that's about it after 18.

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: vi edit

It costs close to $25,000 a year just to go to the University of IL as an IN STATE resident. Many private schools are approaching 30k+ a year. That's not something you simply "get a fucking job and pay for yourself" without taking on a ton of debt when you get out.

Out-of-state tuition is always high. If you're too rich for grants, too stupid/lazy for scholarships, and your parents won't help you, then go to a state school in your state. Or go live in the state where you want to go to school for a year, work, save up money, and THEN go to school. Either way, education is very affordable and while the decision should be made on a case-by-case basis, no parents owes their child money for college.

let me guess you are one fo those lazy, stupid students eh?

considering he said IN STATE hell it was even in caps.

I went to school for two years in IN state. So, that's what I interpreted it as. All caps backfires in this case.

Yes, I missed that. Obviously IL state schools are a ridiculous waste of money, and kids should go to better schools in better states.

 

[ponyo]

Originally posted by: princess ida

Originally posted by: vi edit

and yes we have accounts set up for college for both of my kids. i just hop eits enough by the time they are able to go to college. if they don't go to college i have enough for a one hell of a vacation

Assuming the stock market doesn't stink it up like it has last 6 months and actually posts some more historically traditional gains of 7% over the next 15 years, my $100 a month should net us around $32,000 or so for her college fund. Double that if I bump it to $200.

Even at that amount, it's $8,000 a year that she doesn't have to pay. If she gets a little bit in scholarships, then it's even less.

Right now, start researching the financial aid racket. Way too many parents don't realize that any money you've put away will be subtracted from financial aid, which effectively negates all the savings. There are ways to structure the money so that it doesn't have that negative effect, but you can't do it at the last minute.

Only if your kid qualifies for financial aid. Who knows the terms that will be in place in 17 years.

College costs will come down la la land.

 

[StinkyPinky]

College degree is not essential to having a good life. Talk about the great Brainwashed. Lots of my friends don't have a degree and they're doing just fine (all in the 20's or early 30's)

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: StinkyPinky
College degree is not essential to having a good life. Talk about the great Brainwashed. Lots of my friends don't have a degree and they're doing just fine (all in the 20's or early 30's)

True enough, but it does make it much easier to start out in life. More jobs open to you.

 

[vi edit]

Originally posted by: Naustica

Originally posted by: princess ida

Originally posted by: vi edit

and yes we have accounts set up for college for both of my kids. i just hop eits enough by the time they are able to go to college. if they don't go to college i have enough for a one hell of a vacation

Assuming the stock market doesn't stink it up like it has last 6 months and actually posts some more historically traditional gains of 7% over the next 15 years, my $100 a month should net us around $32,000 or so for her college fund. Double that if I bump it to $200.

Even at that amount, it's $8,000 a year that she doesn't have to pay. If she gets a little bit in scholarships, then it's even less.

Right now, start researching the financial aid racket. Way too many parents don't realize that any money you've put away will be subtracted from financial aid, which effectively negates all the savings. There are ways to structure the money so that it doesn't have that negative effect, but you can't do it at the last minute.

Only if your kid qualifies for financial aid. Who knows the terms that will be in place in 17 years.

College costs will come down la la land.

With our household income, we aren't going to be awarded a dime of financial aid aside from non-subsidized federal loans. I'm actually the named owner on the account as from what I've read, it's better to have it in my name than the child's. Everything I've read says that pretty much every dime in the kids name gets dinged against them for aid.

I'm pretty much assuming we aren't getting anything and trying to plan accordingly. We've got other ways we're saving too. The little turd walked away with over $700 worth of savings bonds for her first Christmas. She'll add to that with any birthday funds she receives.

Plus just this week we switched daycare providers and went from paying $1200 a month to $850 a month. A portion of those savings are getting directed back to her college fund.

I'm not expecting college costs to come down, but I can't help but think they'll cool down the inflated rates they've been soaring too.

 

[BrownTown]

I would say pretty much all the basics until the graduate college. I can't someone would be so heartless as to kick their kid out of the house at 18. In our society that isn't old enough to make it in life if you expect to be a successful individual. "Working you way through college" sounds great and all, but why would you want someone working for 8$ an hour to pay for college when they will be make 25+ after they graduate?

Also, on the topic of college funds, do not under ANY circumstances save money for your kids college, it is effectively throwing it down the toilet. I thought everyone knew that?

EDIT: i'm amazed at people views on a car though, even the total asses who want to kick their kid out at 18 think they deserve a car. Are you talking about borrowing the family car, or having your own? A kid is definitely NOT owed his own car.

 

[Shadow Conception]

Originally posted by: BrownTown
Also, on the topic of college funds, do not under ANY circumstances save money for your kids college, it is effectively throwing it down the toilet. I thought everyone knew that?

Huh, why?

 

[vi edit]

Originally posted by: Shadow Conception

Originally posted by: BrownTown
Also, on the topic of college funds, do not under ANY circumstances save money for your kids college, it is effectively throwing it down the toilet. I thought everyone knew that?

Huh, why?

If you have the money to save for college, then you are already making too much to not save.

Does that make sense?

There is more to "saving for college" than just throwing money in a savings account. My little $100 monthly contribution to the college IRA could double itself twice over under fairly conservative estimates. If I use that for college it's tax exempt at the federal level. That's an instant savings of 15% (long term capital gains). Plus it's a savings of whatever my daughter would pay in interest on that principal amount if it were under a student loan.

She's not going to qualify for any financial aid based on need. If she gets scholarships that's icing on the cake. But there's no magical way that my household income being what it is is going to save me money by NOT saving.

 

[nanette1985]

Originally posted by: vi edit



With our household income, we aren't going to be awarded a dime of financial aid aside from non-subsidized federal loans. I'm actually the named owner on the account as from what I've read, it's better to have it in my name than the child's. Everything I've read says that pretty much every dime in the kids name gets dinged against them for aid.

I'm pretty much assuming we aren't getting anything and trying to plan accordingly.

Never assume. The system is really complex. It's not good to keep it in your name either - keep an eye on the system and on the changes.

Trust me, it goes by faster than you think!

Good job on the savings.

 

[vi edit]

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: vi edit

It costs close to $25,000 a year just to go to the University of IL as an IN STATE resident. Many private schools are approaching 30k+ a year. That's not something you simply "get a fucking job and pay for yourself" without taking on a ton of debt when you get out.

Out-of-state tuition is always high. If you're too rich for grants, too stupid/lazy for scholarships, and your parents won't help you, then go to a state school in your state. Or go live in the state where you want to go to school for a year, work, save up money, and THEN go to school. Either way, education is very affordable and while the decision should be made on a case-by-case basis, no parents owes their child money for college.

let me guess you are one fo those lazy, stupid students eh?

considering he said IN STATE hell it was even in caps.

I went to school for two years in IN state. So, that's what I interpreted it as. All caps backfires in this case.

Yes, I missed that. Obviously IL state schools are a ridiculous waste of money, and kids should go to better schools in better states.

Riiiiiight.

That's why UofI Chicago is one of the top ranked Medical professional (nursing, pharmacy, occ & phys therapy) and UofIUC is top ten ranked in more than a dozen other areas including engineering, business, and it's masters and doctorate programs.

:roll:

 

[mrrman]

Originally posted by: her209
Food, clothing, and shelter until 18 years old. That's it.

you are dreaming about the car....get a job and buy one yourself...no one gave me any freebies in life

 

[mrrman]

Originally posted by: JMapleton

Originally posted by: nkgreen
How old are you OP?

Late 20s.

It seems like you are living in a fantasy world...grow up

 

[JMapleton]

Originally posted by: mrrman

Originally posted by: her209
Food, clothing, and shelter until 18 years old. That's it.

you are dreaming about the car....get a job and buy one yourself...no one gave me any freebies in life

That's the attitude, "If I didn't have it as a kid, you can't have it either!"

Yeah I'm the one who should grow up.

 

[Finalnight]

I believe a parent "owes" a child:

1. Food until 18
2. Medical care until 18
3. Education/educational support until 18/graduation from high school (some turn 18 in senior year) including basic equipment such as access to a computer at an appropriate age
4. Shelter (own bedroom after a certain age if financially able)
5. General enrichment/life training/character building until 18

Recommended bonuses, though not owed:

1. Basic car or use of a car at around 16-18 (i know people who got to college not knowing how to drive, it is a life skill to at least know how and have a license thus that part falls under #5 up above)
2. Leisure equipment such as TV, console, etc
3. Assistance with tuition

 

[yhelothar]

Originally posted by: Mo0o

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: DLeRium
Aren't you the guy who didn't even finish college? Come on. College today is ESSENTIAL. In fact a BS degree is worth a HS degree 30 years ago. Engineering? Good God, do you know how hard it is to get a job in my field with a BS? EE friends I know too are all planning to go to get a MS if not PhD. My manager had a talk with me and he was pushing me to go back to school because he knows I'll need it to keep moving.

I'm a professional and I don't have a degree. I have some credit hours from the Community College of the Air Force from tech school, but not enough to get an Associate's degree, and they're completely unrelated to my career field (programming).
The misguided belief that "everyone has to go to college" is exactly what cheapened degrees to the point that, as you say, a BS = HS degree.

Maybe but college will open more doors. I think parents should push their kids to succeed in HS and try to get into a top university. These kind of opportunities dont around a second time and transferring in to one of those school from a CC or even state school is much more difficult. Even if the kid finishes the 4 years and wants to do something else, at least he'll have been exposed to higher education and people from all walks of life. I think college is one of the few places where you really get to meet kids from all parts of the united states. It's pretty cool

UCs are an exception though. Transfers have priority.
That said, it's always better to get your act up as early as possible, but it's never too late.
Don't forget all the money you save from CC's too.

 

[alkemyst]

I came from a pretty privledged life...most of my friends only worked because it was at a fun place, had their bills covered by their parents, had new cars at 15/16, etc.

I believe the only thing a parent owes a kid is enough not to get the child welfare folks knocking.

Basic clothes, some place indoors to sleep, and making sure they are treated for illness.

Having the kid enrolled in school until they are old enough to decide differently.

That's about it.

Most of those that see otherwise are either in a position to deliver that level or simply seething derelects that constantly think their lives wouldn't be the shitholes they are if mommy and daddy just gave a little more.

 

[BrownTown]

Originally posted by: vi edit

Originally posted by: Shadow Conception

Originally posted by: BrownTown
Also, on the topic of college funds, do not under ANY circumstances save money for your kids college, it is effectively throwing it down the toilet. I thought everyone knew that?

Huh, why?

If you have the money to save for college, then you are already making too much to not save.

Does that make sense?

There is more to "saving for college" than just throwing money in a savings account. My little $100 monthly contribution to the college IRA could double itself twice over under fairly conservative estimates. If I use that for college it's tax exempt at the federal level. That's an instant savings of 15% (long term capital gains). Plus it's a savings of whatever my daughter would pay in interest on that principal amount if it were under a student loan.

She's not going to qualify for any financial aid based on need. If she gets scholarships that's icing on the cake. But there's no magical way that my household income being what it is is going to save me money by NOT saving.

Well, I don't know what you make, but my dad made 100,000$+ every year I was in college and only paid for 1/4th of tuition, plus I had to pay something like 1/8 in loans and then we got 5/8th in financial aid. You have to me making ALOT of money to qualify for NO financial aid.

 

[alkemyst]

financial aid is always based on last year...lose your job and last year doesn't matter. My second time in college I was told I should have been able to save 30% of my income towards education....

I told the chick if I could save 30% of my income I'd probably not be considering college again. However if I could save much more, I'd probably enroll...but then we'd not be having this conservation.

She went defensive and said 'why, is their something wrong with talking to me?!'

I can't remember the exact words, but basically I said yes.

My first 7 years of college ended up running $7000 tab, my next 2, about 5 years later was $30k.