X-Men: Days of Future Past

[smackababy]

The only saving grace of Wolverine is that despite being pretty much immortal, he isn't that powerful. I mean, sure he can't die, but he can't do really anything else except stab people at close range (unless that person can control metal, and he is fucked).

 

[HumblePie]

Wolverine can die, just takes a complete cellular transformation of every cell at once to do it. Been done and he has died permanently that way. Took god-like powers to bring him back from another character.

But he doesn't go up against that, and so his normal "tough" foes are magneto which controls the metal in him, and other psionic characters which mess with his mind.

 

[Schfifty Five]

Apocalypse will happen now after in the new "corrected" timeline. It's suppose to have an adult Rogue, which Anna is now considered "adult" enough looking for her character. Personally I still hate the choice of Anna for Rogue. Rogue is the ultimate unattainable "beauty" queen that while she does get a bit lonely, still knows what affect her appearance has on men. She is suppose to be a flaunter of her looks. Anna doesn't look that good and the made Rogue in the series into an emo whiner. Ugh.

Ok, so then in the last scene of DOFP where Prof X says "we have a lot of catching up to do", the whole Apocalypse battle had already occurred before that right?

 

[smackababy]

Ok, so then in the last scene of DOFP where Prof X says "we have a lot of catching up to do", the whole Apocalypse battle had already occurred before that right?

It should have, yes. Although, in the comics, the Age of Apocalypse happened in an alternate reality. Legion went back in time to kill Magneto and ended up killing Charles instead on accident (as they were still friends). Magneto then goes along with Charles plan and Apocalypse invades 10 years before he does in the normal time line, causing it to be drastically different. I doubt that will be in the movie though. =)

 

[SP33Demon]

Yah wolverine is the ragdoll of Marvel. He is invincible/immortal except unless every cell structure in his body is changed all at once to something else. In the case he was completely morphed by magic into crystal then shattered. He doesn't come back from that sort of death on his own. But they sure love beating the hell out of him in the comics. Which is its own morbid fun. But what ground him as a character is he isn't immune to psychic attacks/controls, and his offensive output is fairly weak overall.

Yup, don't forget when the Sentinels killed him in DoFP comics. I was hoping that would happen in the movie (it kind of did but we didn't see what the blast did to him) but oh well.
http://www.complex.com/pop-culture/...-10-most-memorable-deaths-in-comics/wolverine

 

[SP33Demon]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kitty_Pryde

Nope



The power she uses in this movie was introduced in this movie. Has nothing to do with the comics at all.

As for the telepathy thing, she is affected by telepathy differently when phased then other people in normal state. Attacks to her aren't as strong, and certain broadcasts she can receive and somewhat echo them back. That part of her power is made stronger with the alien dragon Lockheed which is later becomes her pet.

From your quote:

Kitty is a mutant with the ability to pass through solid matter by passing her atomic particles through the spaces between the atoms of the object through which she is moving. In this way she and the object through which she is passing can temporarily merge without interacting, and each is unharmed when Shadowcat has finished passing through the object. This process is called "phasing" or quantum tunneling and it renders her almost completely intangible to physical touch.[1] Shadowcat passes through objects at the same speed at which she is moving before she enters them. Since she is unable to breathe while inside an object, she can only continuously phase through solid objects (as when she travels underground) as long as she can hold her breath. However, contrary depictions of the duration of her phasing ability have been presented, such as when she has phased miles within an object. The use of her abilities also interferes with any electrical systems as she passes through by disrupting the flow of electrons from atom to atom, including the bio-electric systems of living bodies if she concentrates in the right way.[58] This typically causes machines to malfunction or be destroyed as she phases through them, and can induce shock and unconsciousness in living beings.

It would have been awesome to see her phase through a Sentinel and see what happens. Dammit it all Singer.

 

[Skel]

Spoiler

In the comics, Kitty had that power. It isn't like they just made it up. In fact, Kitty couldn't send Wolverine because he was "too old" I believe, and went herself in the Days of Future Past story arc. The reason the movie sends back Wolverine is because he is easily the most popular character in the franchise. The first 2 X-Men movies were literally Wolverine movies and the third was Wolverine + Phoenix. Wolverine's job, also, was not to fight the fight, but to set the characters on the correct coarse to avoid the current future. The reason he pops back into the current, now non-Sentinel timeline is because his mind (from where they were in the present) synced up to where it was in the new present. He is now the only person who remembers the past, because he was the only one that lived it. What they didn't show, was whether he had the adamantium claws, neither confirming or rejecting if the Weapon X project still happened. Mystique was also used, because she was the one who killed the senator in the comics spawning Trask to create the sentinels. Her DNA was adaptive, in appearance, and allowed for them to learn how that adaptation at a cellular level works. I would imagine any of the other mutants with such adaptive power would have worked as well, however, Mystique was the one caught and experimented on. For someone who claims to be a comic fanboy, you sure missed the Days of Future Past story arch.

With respect.. It was Rachel summers..

I should point out, that the older lady on the floor was Kitty Pryde, or Kate Pryde in the future. Rachel Summers is the telepath that sends her back. She also shows up in the books 30 or so issues later and joins the X-Men starting the tradition of complicated Summers family trees.

 

[nageov3t]

was the original DOFP in B&W? that would explain why the coloring in the book I read last week was so shitty...

 

[Skel]

was the original DOFP in B&W? that would explain why the coloring in the book I read last week was so shitty...

Sorry no.. They were in color. Those pages are the original art that they made into the "essential version". I pulled it from John Byrne's site.. the guy who plotted and drew the story. Words by Chris Claremont... of course I'm a crappy fanboy

 

[JEDI]

That is not true. Shadowcat did just that in the comics. I am fairly certain she used her power to phase her mind backwards in time. Also, in another comic, Charles telepathically communicates with past X-Men.

The Uncanny X-Men issues #141-142 is when it happens.

oh god.. now I gotta look in my collection and find those 2 issues.

edit:
ahh.. thx skel.
thought it was the baby phoenix that initiated the time travel thing

 

[nageov3t]

Sorry no.. They were in color. Those pages are the original art that they made into the "essential version". I pulled it from John Byrne's site.. the guy who plotted and drew the story. Words by Chris Claremont... of course I'm a crappy fanboy

too bad. lol. I should scan a sample in from the TPB... there are several pages where it's clear that Marvel had a huge surplus of yellow ink they needed to use up.

 

[Schfifty Five]

It should have, yes. Although, in the comics, the Age of Apocalypse happened in an alternate reality. Legion went back in time to kill Magneto and ended up killing Charles instead on accident (as they were still friends). Magneto then goes along with Charles plan and Apocalypse invades 10 years before he does in the normal time line, causing it to be drastically different. I doubt that will be in the movie though. =)

Oh man, I forgot about the Legion series. So many memories flooding back now.

 

[Ancalagon44]

Spoiler

It's not a week he is in the past. Again a couple of days, which is all the time they have between Sentinel findings of them in the future. I don't know where you are getting a week from. They didn't take commercial airlines to travel around. Xavier back then still had his own jet and could make a short hop to the pentagon in a hour or so in a really fast private jet, and then a few hours to Paris after, and a few hours back to DC. It can all conceivably take place in a couple day span, for which Kitty most certainly could hold out, if barely.

As far as the reaction of the President in putting faith in mutants. You are right, he wouldn't. But the story was to break faith in Trask, which is what happens. Then Xavier can work on the president and others through mental persuasion with his powers over time to make them come to light in using "good" mutants for defense against bad ones. Which is the whole point of the X-Men. Also, the president doesn't know what Xavier can do or if he even is a mutant. Remember, the president first hears about the mutants after the fiasco in Paris. Only people like Trask know more about who are mutants and which ones they can do. Of which the breaking faith in Trask would prevent his info from reaching the president for a while I bet if ever.

Spoiler

Flying from the east coast of the US is probably a 12 hour flight. I would put the entire adventure at 3 days minimum. Do you really think Kitty could hold her concentration that long?

Even if that was the intent - that the timelines proceed simultaneously - it patently makes no sense and they did it purely to create artificial drama. If time travel were possible, and if events at X would be able to influence events at X + 1, then it would not be possible for X and X + 1 to occur at the same time and still influence each other. That would mean that any change would be instantaneous and there would be no drama relating to Sentinel attacks.

Think about it from Nixon's point of view - yes, Trask has been discredited, but why? His inventions failed to stop a powerful mutant from attacking. If anything, Nixon will be thinking that Trask did not go far enough. Mystique and Magneto did not prove that Trask's inventions were unnecessary, they proved that they were ineffective, which is worse from the timeline point of view. So now Nixon will step it up - with or without Trask.

Remember what happened before the timeline was altered - Trask was killed but his work lived on. Same could easily happen with him being discredited. His ideas of mutant danger have not been discredited, only his ideas of how to stop them, because they were ineffectual. I highly doubt that Nixon, or anyone else, would think to trust Xavier as a defense against mutants.

"Civilian, how can you protect us against these mutants?"
"Err, well, I'm a powerful mutant myself with the ability to control minds. And I train a group of other powerful individuals."
"WHAT??? Arrest him!"

Like I said, would you trust another terrorist group to fight against Al Qaeda on your behalf? Would you sit back and not develop your own weapons? No, you would not.

I felt that Magneto's actions were forced, because I suppose I see him as a guy who is trying to do the right things, but is haunted by the past. However, he is incredibly smart. I would find it difficult to believe that he is cold blooded enough to try to kill Mystique because of the danger she poses. It goes against everything that he stands for - killing one mutant to help the race. And given what information Logan gave him, his attack on the US government made little sense to me too. Why provoke them like that?

I do think Fassbender is great as Magneto though.

 

[HumblePie]

Flying from the east coast of the US is probably a 12 hour flight. I would put the entire adventure at 3 days minimum. Do you really think Kitty could hold her concentration that long?

Even if that was the intent - that the timelines proceed simultaneously - it patently makes no sense and they did it purely to create artificial drama. If time travel were possible, and if events at X would be able to influence events at X + 1, then it would not be possible for X and X + 1 to occur at the same time and still influence each other. That would mean that any change would be instantaneous and there would be no drama relating to Sentinel attacks.

Think about it from Nixon's point of view - yes, Trask has been discredited, but why? His inventions failed to stop a powerful mutant from attacking. If anything, Nixon will be thinking that Trask did not go far enough. Mystique and Magneto did not prove that Trask's inventions were unnecessary, they proved that they were ineffective, which is worse from the timeline point of view. So now Nixon will step it up - with or without Trask.

Remember what happened before the timeline was altered - Trask was killed but his work lived on. Same could easily happen with him being discredited. His ideas of mutant danger have not been discredited, only his ideas of how to stop them, because they were ineffectual. I highly doubt that Nixon, or anyone else, would think to trust Xavier as a defense against mutants.

"Civilian, how can you protect us against these mutants?"
"Err, well, I'm a powerful mutant myself with the ability to control minds. And I train a group of other powerful individuals."
"WHAT??? Arrest him!"

Like I said, would you trust another terrorist group to fight against Al Qaeda on your behalf? Would you sit back and not develop your own weapons? No, you would not.

I felt that Magneto's actions were forced, because I suppose I see him as a guy who is trying to do the right things, but is haunted by the past. However, he is incredibly smart. I would find it difficult to believe that he is cold blooded enough to try to kill Mystique because of the danger she poses. It goes against everything that he stands for - killing one mutant to help the race. And given what information Logan gave him, his attack on the US government made little sense to me too. Why provoke them like that?

I do think Fassbender is great as Magneto though.

Uhh, the X-Jet is suppose to be one of, if not the fastest jet possible. The modern Concorde can make a trans-atlantic flight in less than 3 hours. I have no idea why you are so hung up on this 12 hour flight time. They were in a private plane, not the X-Jet, but something akin to a Concorde. Again, the whole sequence of the movie took place in less than 2 days time. Kitty was injured in the last 12 hours or so of that time. She was hurt, but obviously wasn't life threatening enough they couldn't staunch the bleeding long enough for her to hold out on her task.

As for the time problem you are having a hard time wrapping your head around, the whole thing wasn't done for the sake of drama per say. The movie was based off the comics. Which was using THIS http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternalism_(philosophy_of_time) model of time theory. That all time happens at the same time. I don't know why you have such a hard time following this concept.

The comics had a telepath with some minor time manipulation powers send someone's consciousness back in time stream in the comics. Again, I hate that they made Kitty the one with the power in the movie. As Kitty's character was never a telepath or had control of any time manipulation powers in the comics.

As for your still disbelief in the actions of the characters, again the purpose was to make the president and the world disbelieve in Trask's idea of the Sentinel program and to keep Mystique out of Trask's hands. It was not at that point to make the president and world believe there was another alternative way yet to deal with mutants. That is Professor Xavier's job to work on in the future with the building of the X-Men team. It's not something that was suppose to happen in one movie. Their job was to show how falliable Trask's robots were and that they were incapable of stopping mutants and instead could harm humans. Magneto did a magnificent job displaying that. How you can't seem to understand that concept I don't know. Yes, Magneto also proved to the world that not all mutants can be trusted and added to the paranoia with his actions worldwide. His actions didn't solve the greater problem of humans versus mutants. If it did, there wouldn't be a need in the future for the X-Men would there? What Magneto did was show how fallible Trask's robots were and that he couldn't be trusted nor his program be trusted. If I saw some dude trying to sell me robots that was being promised as able to protect me, but instead are able to be controlled by my enemy against me and almost kill me, I highly doubt I would be so willing to give the guy who built those robots more money to build more.

And no, Magneto is not a guy trying to do the right thing at all, despite what your interpretations are. He is a dyed in the wool villain. He cares nothing for humans and humanity at that time. If he could slaughter every human on the planet at that time he would have gladly done so. Some of his actions are a bit "dramatic" but hey it's a comic book story and dramatic is part of the story. He was dramatic in making a display to the world with his actions in showing the world how powerless even the mightiest of human leaders are and how he could at any moment snuff them out. He was on the verge of doing so in his dramatic gamble before being stopped by Mystique and Charles.

Again, the point of the time travel was not necessarily to discredit that mutants pose a threat to humans, but to discredit that Trask's Sentinel program is a good idea to combat them at all. Doesn't mean that humans wouldn't look to some other way to combat mutants, but it would prevent the invincible Sentinel from being built. It also gives Xavier a heads up on what to look for in the future and what to combat to prevent anything like those invincible Sentinels from being ever made.

 

[SP33Demon]

Spoiler

Flying from the east coast of the US is probably a 12 hour flight. I would put the entire adventure at 3 days minimum. Do you really think Kitty could hold her concentration that long?

Even if that was the intent - that the timelines proceed simultaneously - it patently makes no sense and they did it purely to create artificial drama. If time travel were possible, and if events at X would be able to influence events at X + 1, then it would not be possible for X and X + 1 to occur at the same time and still influence each other. That would mean that any change would be instantaneous and there would be no drama relating to Sentinel attacks.

Think about it from Nixon's point of view - yes, Trask has been discredited, but why? His inventions failed to stop a powerful mutant from attacking. If anything, Nixon will be thinking that Trask did not go far enough. Mystique and Magneto did not prove that Trask's inventions were unnecessary, they proved that they were ineffective, which is worse from the timeline point of view. So now Nixon will step it up - with or without Trask.

Remember what happened before the timeline was altered - Trask was killed but his work lived on. Same could easily happen with him being discredited. His ideas of mutant danger have not been discredited, only his ideas of how to stop them, because they were ineffectual. I highly doubt that Nixon, or anyone else, would think to trust Xavier as a defense against mutants.

"Civilian, how can you protect us against these mutants?"
"Err, well, I'm a powerful mutant myself with the ability to control minds. And I train a group of other powerful individuals."
"WHAT??? Arrest him!"

Like I said, would you trust another terrorist group to fight against Al Qaeda on your behalf? Would you sit back and not develop your own weapons? No, you would not.

I felt that Magneto's actions were forced, because I suppose I see him as a guy who is trying to do the right things, but is haunted by the past. However, he is incredibly smart. I would find it difficult to believe that he is cold blooded enough to try to kill Mystique because of the danger she poses. It goes against everything that he stands for - killing one mutant to help the race. And given what information Logan gave him, his attack on the US government made little sense to me too. Why provoke them like that?

I do think Fassbender is great as Magneto though.

Spoiler

All of what you said is still negated by the fact that Charles Xavier can enact mind control whenever he wants, and on who he wants, via Cerebro. Right after your "WHAT!? Arrest him!" is where Charles will change Nixon's opinion for him. Hell, he used that get past White House security in the movie. The only reason the Sentinels happened in the first place was because of the timing of Charles being in a bad place, i.e. not being Professor X nor wanting to use his powers.

Summary: The fact that Professor X can enact mind control on any human, Trask and Nixon included, means that mutants will always have protection from humans as long as he's around and utilizing his powers with Cerebro. He can also make anyone he wants forget what his powers are, Trask and Nixon included. Mind control is simply one of the greatest powers ever in my opinion.

 

[Ancalagon44]

Spoiler

Uhh, the X-Jet is suppose to be one of, if not the fastest jet possible. The modern Concorde can make a trans-atlantic flight in less than 3 hours. I have no idea why you are so hung up on this 12 hour flight time. They were in a private plane, not the X-Jet, but something akin to a Concorde. Again, the whole sequence of the movie took place in less than 2 days time. Kitty was injured in the last 12 hours or so of that time. She was hurt, but obviously wasn't life threatening enough they couldn't staunch the bleeding long enough for her to hold out on her task.

As for the time problem you are having a hard time wrapping your head around, the whole thing wasn't done for the sake of drama per say. The movie was based off the comics. Which was using THIS http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternalism_(philosophy_of_time) model of time theory. That all time happens at the same time. I don't know why you have such a hard time following this concept.

The comics had a telepath with some minor time manipulation powers send someone's consciousness back in time stream in the comics. Again, I hate that they made Kitty the one with the power in the movie. As Kitty's character was never a telepath or had control of any time manipulation powers in the comics.

As for your still disbelief in the actions of the characters, again the purpose was to make the president and the world disbelieve in Trask's idea of the Sentinel program and to keep Mystique out of Trask's hands. It was not at that point to make the president and world believe there was another alternative way yet to deal with mutants. That is Professor Xavier's job to work on in the future with the building of the X-Men team. It's not something that was suppose to happen in one movie. Their job was to show how falliable Trask's robots were and that they were incapable of stopping mutants and instead could harm humans. Magneto did a magnificent job displaying that. How you can't seem to understand that concept I don't know. Yes, Magneto also proved to the world that not all mutants can be trusted and added to the paranoia with his actions worldwide. His actions didn't solve the greater problem of humans versus mutants. If it did, there wouldn't be a need in the future for the X-Men would there? What Magneto did was show how fallible Trask's robots were and that he couldn't be trusted nor his program be trusted. If I saw some dude trying to sell me robots that was being promised as able to protect me, but instead are able to be controlled by my enemy against me and almost kill me, I highly doubt I would be so willing to give the guy who built those robots more money to build more.

And no, Magneto is not a guy trying to do the right thing at all, despite what your interpretations are. He is a dyed in the wool villain. He cares nothing for humans and humanity at that time. If he could slaughter every human on the planet at that time he would have gladly done so. Some of his actions are a bit "dramatic" but hey it's a comic book story and dramatic is part of the story. He was dramatic in making a display to the world with his actions in showing the world how powerless even the mightiest of human leaders are and how he could at any moment snuff them out. He was on the verge of doing so in his dramatic gamble before being stopped by Mystique and Charles.

Again, the point of the time travel was not necessarily to discredit that mutants pose a threat to humans, but to discredit that Trask's Sentinel program is a good idea to combat them at all. Doesn't mean that humans wouldn't look to some other way to combat mutants, but it would prevent the invincible Sentinel from being built. It also gives Xavier a heads up on what to look for in the future and what to combat to prevent anything like those invincible Sentinels from being ever made.

Spoiler

Did they have the X Jet in 1973? It looked like a regular private jet to me.

I don't get why you think that Xavier would be able to talk the President down and influence him - he was not able to do so after Trask was assassinated. Why would now be any different? As I've said all along, having Magneto nearly assassinate the President and his entire cabinet is way worse than having Mystique shoot Trask in the head. If you were the President, which event would be more likely to convince you of the danger of mutants? And yet somehow Xavier would be able to talk the President down, when he was not able to do so after Trask was assassinated? Don't you think that is a little thin?

As I said, which you did not respond to, the President would have lost faith not in the idea of the danger of humans, but in the idea that Trask went far enough. He would want to redouble efforts.

And you still do not respond to my comparison between Al Qaeda and what Magneto did. Would you trust a terrorist group?

I don't know why you think you are the authority on comic books, when clearly you don't know much about Magneto:

However, writers have since fleshed out his character and origin, revealing him to be a Jewish Holocaust survivor whose actions are driven by the purpose of protecting the mutant race from suffering a similar fate. His role in comics has varied from supervillain to antihero to superhero.

Magneto has lead the X Men before, and taught at Xavier's school. He is far more complicated than a mere villain.

 

[nageov3t]

can't we just say that time passes more slowly in the past then in the movie's present and call it a day? maybe gravity is all fucked up because of the mutant wars.

 

[SirStev0]

When I heard Rogue had a very small but meaningful cameo I was really really really fucking hoping it wasn't going to be a "Her and Iceman make it in the long run" bullshit.

My nerdgasm fantasy was during the climax as the future Sentinel's bust in the door and kill Magneto and Prof X and turn to mow down Kitty and Logan, Sookie flies in with her Ms. Marvel powers, haymaker's the Sentinel and says something along the lines of "Hurry up, Cher, We ain't got all day".

 

[Ancalagon44]

Spoiler

All of what you said is still negated by the fact that Charles Xavier can enact mind control whenever he wants, and on who he wants, via Cerebro. Right after your "WHAT!? Arrest him!" is where Charles will change Nixon's opinion for him. Hell, he used that get past White House security in the movie. The only reason the Sentinels happened in the first place was because of the timing of Charles being in a bad place, i.e. not being Professor X nor wanting to use his powers.

Summary: The fact that Professor X can enact mind control on any human, Trask and Nixon included, means that mutants will always have protection from humans as long as he's around and utilizing his powers with Cerebro. He can also make anyone he wants forget what his powers are, Trask and Nixon included. Mind control is simply one of the greatest powers ever in my opinion.

Screw it I'm over spoiler tags.







Do you really think Xavier would mind control people just because it suited him?

 

[Kev]

Why are people writing entire posts in spoiler tags? Why would someone read this thread if they didn't see the movie?

 

[lupi]

Because they're idiots. Same reason they state in the spoiler text they don't understand how something occured in the movie while it was clearly stated in the movie that how it happened.

 

[HumblePie]

Screw it I'm over spoiler tags.







Do you really think Xavier would mind control people just because it suited him?

Again, as for the jet, the original XJet was created with work from Hank, who was flying the plane in the movie. What they were flying in 1973 was not the X-Jet, but it was a private plane owned by Prof X and worked on by Hank. They didn't go into capabilities of speed, but I would hazard to guess it was faster than your average private jet. If you can suspend disbelief about there being mutants that can read minds, have claws, and shoot lazer beams from their eyes, why the hell are you so hung up on them using a super sonic private jet in the movie when they clearly showed it FFS? I think you are being obtuse on purpose and have an agenda at this point against the movie or just trolling. Everything you couldn't understand or you thought was stupid has been explained out perfectly clear thus far. Arguing over shit like how fast their jet may have been in 1973 to do everything in a couple of days is stupid.

As for Professor X and using mind crontrol, he does and doesn't. He doesn't so much as use forceful mind "control" as instead uses mind "persuasion" on others. It's his ethical difference. He pushes people in a direction they may be less likely to take without that push, but it's a direction they may have taken on their own with another form of harder persuasion. He only uses direct controls in fights or emergency situations. Which he does use if needed. Don't be fooled by his power. He can shut down anyone and make them into anything he wants them. He could make anyone on the planet think they are pink fluffy bunnies for the rest of their lives (assuming they have no telepathic protection) if he really wanted to. With cerebro, he could do it to every human on the planet all at once even. This is why Professor X leads the X-Men and is one of the most powerful mutants on the planet as he is the most powerful telepath on Earth in the Marvel Universe.

 

[smackababy]

Some of you are getting really hung up on what they were trying to do in the first place. What loses the war is the sentinel project. The primary objective is to stop that, not make humans love mutants. What the final "battle" shows is that mutants are incredibly powerful, more so than they realized, and despite that power, some are still good and fighting for the humans. Trask's entire platform was "they want to eradicate us", which Mystique and Xavier showed wasn't entirely the case. Does it mean humans won't continue to fear mutants? Of course not. Does it mean the primary weapon that enslaves and destroys humans and mutants alike in the future won't be built? They hope so.

Even the ending doesn't show a real resolution. Did they actually avert the sentinel project or merely delay it?

 

[SP33Demon]

Screw it I'm over spoiler tags.







Do you really think Xavier would mind control people just because it suited him?

When faced with the extermination of mutants via invulnerable Sentinels? Yes, hell yes.

He's done shady shit with his powers before in the comics. For example:

-Making the X-Men think he lost his powers just to test them

-Letting Wolverine attempt to assassinate him because he knew he could break Wolverine’s conditioning and then have him be a weapon for Xavier, instead.

-Keeping the Danger Room’s sentience a secret

-Not letting Cyclops and Havok know that they had a brother

-Being a member of the Illuminati ... In a perfect circle jerk of arrogance, the Illuminati secretly guided the course of some of the most important events of the last 20 years. Tony Stark, Reed Richards, Blackbolt, Namor, Dr. Strange and of course Charles Xavier met in a dank basement and made everyone else's decisions for the them while patting themselves on the back. Of course, it was only a matter of time before the biggest dicks around made a fatal mistake. Blasting the Hulk into space, they felt their work was done and they could get back to talking about how awesome they were. But when ol' Jade Jaws returned to put his foot up New York's ass during the World War Hulk crossover event, Xavier claimed he didn't know about the exile decision and pulled a France and surrendered.

-Faking his own death and not telling all but one of his students

-Wiping the memory of Cyclops of the team of X-Men who died between the original X-Men and the All-New, All-Different X-Men.

-Condoning Jean’s mind wipe of Kitty’s parents in the run-up to Jean becoming Dark Phoenix

-Lying to everyone and saying that Moira was a housekeeper he’d just hired. Later... After sharing a kiss with Charles at his mansion and christening his new team the X-Men, he erased her memory of their location so that she could not reveal it to the CIA, nor be made to tell them.

-Paty, wife of the late great Dave Cockrum, once told Chris Claremont that she felt Xavier really was a criminal, because he was lying to all the parents of his first class of students, promising that they would be getting a top notch education. Instead, he was taking a bunch of teenagers, forming them into a covert strikeforce, and training them to go out and fight dangerous super-powered criminals. Magneto, for all his sins, at least was not hiding behind the facade of the benign, kindly human educator, and was totally up front that his Mutant Brotherhood was a terrorist group. ...​Imagine you are a mutant teenager. Everyone hates you, you hate yourself, and everyone thinks you are dangerous, including you. You feel like you have nowhere to turn, and no one who will ever understand you. And then a bald man in a wheelchair comes to you and says he has all the answers, that he can help. He tells you that he runs a school for people like you, where you can be free to be yourself and you will be protected. You leave your family and move to a huge mansion where there are other kids like you, and everything seems okay, for once in your life. Then, all of a sudden, a giant robot attacks your new home and vaporizes a bunch of your friends. An angry mob is outside calling for your head. The bald guy in the wheelchair is now telling you that you need to strap on some tights and gives you a silly code name. You are now forced to fight for him, training yourself to use your powers for his private army. You fight against other mutants, against humans, monsters, whatever. You are flown off into outer space and the far future and all over the world, getting tossed around from team to team where most of your friends are eventually killed or de-powered or forgotten about. Meanwhile, the man who you are doing this for, this man you put all your trust in, disappears because he gets depressed or wants to bone his space alien girlfriend. Does that sound like a nice thing to do?

-And it’s worth mentioning the fact that, especially in the Silver Age, there wasn’t a memory around that Xavier wouldn’t alter. ... I was JUST reading X-Men 1-10 and was marveling (guffaw) at what a dick Xavier was. Not really a lie (just highly unethical), but also: he sure was fond of mind wiping people back then for trivial stuff. He mind wipes an entire circus for gods sake!

-Making the Xavier Protocols: ​When you lead a band of super-powered young people, it's a safe bet that one or two of them will turn bad. That's just what Charles Xavier thought. During the "Onslaught" crossover, it was revealed that Charles had created the Xavier Protocols. These were files detailing ways to defeat the world's most powerful mutants that he kept in secret in case any of them needed to be taken down. The mutant hating Bastion eventually got a hold of them, and it almost got everyone killed. Good idea, Charlie, but poor execution. Y'know, Batman did the same thing once in the pages of JLA, and it didn't work out so well for him either.

-Actually, I do kind of blame Claremont for this, because in many interviews he’s made the point that Charles Xavier is a jerk and a manipulator and completely ruthless. I think that penetrated the consciousness of everyone who’s come on the book since.

-One of my personal favorites is Uncanny X-Men 375. Prof. X “suspects” one of the X-Men is a skrull infiltrator, so he does a mass mind hallucination where he makes all the X-Men either kill their teammates and/or bear witness to their friends dying (which would probably have a lasting psychological trauma for everyone involved). Then at the end, Beast calls down from where he and Moira were doing an autopsy on the deceased Logan and let’s everyone know Logan was the skrull. To which Xavier responds ‘…as I suspected all along’ (or something similar, I’m paraphrasing). So rather than waiting 90 minutes or so for Hank to confirm his suspicions, he thought it would be the perfect opportunity to mindf–k all of his students.

-You left off the time when Xavier tried to use his powers to force Amelia Voght from leaving him, or when Xavier admitted that he lied to Rogue about helping her control her powers when she first joined the X-Men.

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2010/09/22/top-five-lies-by-professor-x/
http://marvel.wikia.com/Moira_MacTaggert_(Earth-10005)
http://www.toplessrobot.com/2010/06/8_of_professor_xs_many_many_dick_moves.php

You seriously don't think Professor X would mind erase Nixon or Trask for the greater good of the world? Ok. I think he would do it just so they do whatever the hell he wants them to, but in his own "good" and "moral" way which is probably better than Magneto's way.

 

[SP33Demon]

Some of you are getting really hung up on what they were trying to do in the first place. What loses the war is the sentinel project. The primary objective is to stop that, not make humans love mutants. What the final "battle" shows is that mutants are incredibly powerful, more so than they realized, and despite that power, some are still good and fighting for the humans. Trask's entire platform was "they want to eradicate us", which Mystique and Xavier showed wasn't entirely the case. Does it mean humans won't continue to fear mutants? Of course not. Does it mean the primary weapon that enslaves and destroys humans and mutants alike in the future won't be built? They hope so.

Even the ending doesn't show a real resolution. Did they actually avert the sentinel project or merely delay it?

It had a pretty clear resolution to your question when Trask was locked up (as the newspaper showed in the movie). Without Trask, the sentinel project = fucked.