Two year old killed by a pack of pit bulls

[Elfear]

Found a really interesting video on dog attack styles and the pressure of their bites. They only focused on four breeds but it was pretty fascinating. National Geographic found a correlation with the size of the dog's head and bite pressure. Might explain one of the reasons Pits cause a disproportionate amount of lethal attacks. Link

 

[William Gaatjes]

Found a really interesting video on dog attack styles and the pressure of their bites. They only focused on four breeds but it was pretty fascinating. National Geographic found a correlation with the size of the dog's head and bite pressure. Might explain one of the reasons Pits cause a disproportionate amount of lethal attacks. Link

Would not only size be important but also how the jawbone is shaped and hinged ?
And where the muscles are attached and how much muscles are present ?

An example is a crocodile.
It's bite is of enormous strength but a grown man can keep the jaws closed with his hands and fingers.


Found something too , the mastiff is not included here .
Dr. Brady Barr of National Geographic just had a show on (Dangerous Encounters: Bite Force, 8pm est 8/18/2005) where he measured bite forces of many different creatures. Domestic dogs were included in the test.


Here are the results of all of the animals tested:

Humans: 120 pounds of bite pressure

Domestic dogs: 320 LBS of pressure (a GSD, APBT and Rott were tested using a bite sleeve with the computer intrument in it. The APBT had the LEAST amount of pressure of the 3 dogs!!)

Wild dogs: 310 lbs

Lions: 600 lbs

White sharks: 600 lbs

Hyenas: 1000 lbs

Snapping turtles: 1000 lbs

Crocadiles: 2500 lbs

 

[bfdd]

I linked the video to the dog bite pressure tests earlier in this thread.

 

[William Gaatjes]

I linked the video to the dog bite pressure tests earlier in this thread.

Indeed you did.

Simple logic for me :
I guess if my neighbour will buy a pitbull, i have to buy a hyena .

Look at those teeth. Molars and premolars selected for bone crushing. The canine teeth are actually a bit small.

But still it is the combined intelligence and aggression mode that decides a lot.

One animal being such an aggressive creature is the tasmanian devil.
Because they hurt eachother so much, they infect each other with a parasitic cancer that is slowly killing them all.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devil_facial_tumour_disease

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyvPjn2m240

If you want a real awful killer take a komodo dragon. It has a poisoned bite filling the prey with bacteria and poison of it's own.

 

[woolfe9999]

Rather than create a new thread, I thought I'd post this new dog story here, as an antidote to the earlier topic. This one is very weird.

This terrier's owner apparently had a deadly infection in his toe. Owner gets drunk and passes out. Terrier, sensing that owner's toe is infected, EATS the toe. Owner wakes up to find bloody stump were toe was, goes to hospital, is informed that toe was infected, doctors finish the amputation job that the dog started.

http://bodyodd.msnbc.msn.com/_news/...ers-toe-and-may-have-saved-his-life?gt1=43001

Is this even possible, that a dog can sense an infection?

- wolf

 

[dahunan]

The most nurturing and loving dog I ever met in my whole life was a pitbull. Most incredible moment...

We were sitting inside a track on the grass (shared dog park and track) and in came a couple with 3 dogs. They all looked fine.. one was a pitbull.. she came over to my shih-tzu and laid her right cheek on the ground in front of her and even laid her hip down slowly and seemed to be telling my little dog.. "I'm no threat I really want to say hi to you" to me it really seemed amazing considering how brutal these dogs are supposed to be...

Just like children running wild and promoting terrible behavior.. the ones in charge are always the problem

**I can't even click on the story... I don't do well with information like that.

 

[bfdd]

Rather than create a new thread, I thought I'd post this new dog story here, as an antidote to the earlier topic. This one is very weird.

This terrier's owner apparently had a deadly infection in his toe. Owner gets drunk and passes out. Terrier, sensing that owner's toe is infected, EATS the toe. Owner wakes up to find bloody stump were toe was, goes to hospital, is informed that toe was infected, doctors finish the amputation job that the dog started.

http://bodyodd.msnbc.msn.com/_news/...ers-toe-and-may-have-saved-his-life?gt1=43001

Is this even possible, that a dog can sense an infection?

- wolf

not uncommon for dogs to try and care for their sick master.

 

[William Gaatjes]

Rather than create a new thread, I thought I'd post this new dog story here, as an antidote to the earlier topic. This one is very weird.

This terrier's owner apparently had a deadly infection in his toe. Owner gets drunk and passes out. Terrier, sensing that owner's toe is infected, EATS the toe. Owner wakes up to find bloody stump were toe was, goes to hospital, is informed that toe was infected, doctors finish the amputation job that the dog started.

http://bodyodd.msnbc.msn.com/_news/...ers-toe-and-may-have-saved-his-life?gt1=43001

Is this even possible, that a dog can sense an infection?

- wolf

Theoretically yes. Because us humans lack the power of smell dogs have we are usually not aware that everything we do creates a chemical byproduct.
And smelling is nothing more then sensing molecules of chemicals present in the air. As such, an infected wound would have a certain distinct smell. If this dog try to help it's master or that it just smelled some meat that could not possibly be his master himself, he might just started eating it. Because the toe had a different smell. There is a lot of research going on to make an artificial nose. There is already a lot of progress. Because in a sense it would then be very easy to sniff what is wrong with someone and compare the results with data in a database to determine what a person has for sickness.
Measuring breathing, sweat glands, odor of the skin. And in the proximity of wounds.

Insects have antennae that can pick up ppm traces of chemicals.

Sense of smell from dogs :
http://www.aces.edu/pubs/docs/U/UNP-0066/UNP-0066.pdf

Sense of smell from insects :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antenna_(biology))

 

[woolfe9999]

Theoretically yes. Because us humans lack the power of smell dogs have we are usually not aware that everything we do creates a chemical byproduct.
And smelling is nothing more then sensing molecules of chemicals present in the air. As such, an infected wound would have a certain distinct smell. If this dog try to help it's master or that it just smelled some meat that could not possibly be his master himself, he might just started eating it. Because the toe had a different smell. There is a lot of research going on to make an artificial nose. There is already a lot of progress. Because in a sense it would then be very easy to sniff what is wrong with someone and compare the results with data in a database to determine what a person has for sickness.
Measuring breathing, sweat glands, odor of the skin. And in the proximity of wounds.

Insects have antennae that can pick up ppm traces of chemicals.

Sense of smell from dogs :
http://www.aces.edu/pubs/docs/U/UNP-0066/UNP-0066.pdf

Sense of smell from insects :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antenna_(biology))

I have no problem with the notion that an infected wound would have a distinctive odor that is detectable by a dog. It's why the dog eats the toe that I'm not clear about. The dog cannot "know" that it's owner is sick. It must have responded to the infected body part as if it was food, which is what I think you are saying.

- wolf

 

[alkemyst]

What needs to happen is people need to be held fully accountable for their pets (and children), this would solve a ton of issues.

Your dog kills someone, you get the sentence. It was shepherds/dobermans, then rotties, then pitbulls, now everyone and their brother is going to the S. American breeds and other mastiff mixes for a bigger dog then their homies.

Dogs inherently become what their owners make them (short of mental issues)

 

[OutHouse]

You are such a fvcking tool. You don't know if they are illegal or not and quite frankly it has not got jack to do with this kid getting mauled.

oh god... [roll eyes]

Its very easy to tell who is illegal where i live especially at walmart during harvest season.

 

[William Gaatjes]

I have no problem with the notion that an infected wound would have a distinctive odor that is detectable by a dog. It's why the dog eats the toe that I'm not clear about. The dog cannot "know" that it's owner is sick. It must have responded to the infected body part as if it was food, which is what I think you are saying.

- wolf

Well the best way is to find out if canines have this kind of behaviour in the wild. To give you a little doubt and make you curious again : ^_^

I do have read about stories where the saliva of a dog is actually a rather powerful disinfectant in certain occasions.


Although your own saliva actually helps you. I did a test once and i noticed my wounds heal faster too when i cover them with my own saliva. Do not allow saliva of other people since your own saliva is filled with bacteria that live in symbiosis with you. As such these bacteria cover the wound and your immune system has no problem removing them if necessary. And your "own" bacteria protect you from foreign bacteria. At least that is my hypothesis.
I do have noticed my wounds heal faster when using this method. Can take 2 or 3 days off the healing process. And it seems no infection ever occurs.
I healed from a severe burning wound quite rapidly in less then 2 weeks. I burned my hand with a cigar(accident while smoking). For some reason the wound did not get infected and healed within 2 weeks fully without scar tissue. Although i think that the composition of the ash of the cigar had something to do with it as well. The wound was open without skin and was about an inch big.
It was on the inside of my hand on skin that moves and stretches every time the fingers move. I still do not know why it healed so fast and without scarring.


Here is something about wound licking.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wound_licking

As such, a dog can see his owner as part of the pack although the owner is seen as the alpha leader. Woundlicking seems to occur and as such makes sense. But i do not know if animals bite infected limbs of to survive.
Maybe it was a combination of food and wound licking behaviour.

 

[alkemyst]

Here is something about wound licking.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wound_licking

did not deliver

 

[nobodyknows]

No matter how "domestic" you think they are, dogs are wild animals and can turn on you in a New York second. I think some breeds are more likely to go ballistic then others due to what ever traits that breed was specifically bred for.

That said WTF does a city dweller need with 5 pit bulls? I hope the family sues his ass out of his house over this deal. He used to leave one of his pit bulls tied up in his front yard?? What a dumb ass, that was nothing but a tragedy looking for a time to happen. If I was his next door neighbor and had a small child I've of killed the damn dog myself, when no one was looking of course.

 

[Kirby]

A family friend had a pit and few other bull dogs he'd use to catch wild hogs. Pretty cool. :thumbsup:

 

[hal2kilo]

Rather than create a new thread, I thought I'd post this new dog story here, as an antidote to the earlier topic. This one is very weird.

This terrier's owner apparently had a deadly infection in his toe. Owner gets drunk and passes out. Terrier, sensing that owner's toe is infected, EATS the toe. Owner wakes up to find bloody stump were toe was, goes to hospital, is informed that toe was infected, doctors finish the amputation job that the dog started.

http://bodyodd.msnbc.msn.com/_news/...ers-toe-and-may-have-saved-his-life?gt1=43001

Is this even possible, that a dog can sense an infection?

- wolf

I'll be damned if I can remember what program I saw this on, but supposedly there are dogs that can sniff out cancer. Also, some dogs seemed to be attracted to nasty stinky things and if it was gangrenous that would apply.

 

[Josh]

I have a pitbull, I love him and he's as gentle as they come. In fact he LOVES people. Will wag his tail extremely excitedly everytime he meets someone new.

It's all about how you raise the dog. Any dog who is beaten, mistreated or left to run wild is susceptible to being an aggressive dog. You bring a dog up from a puppy and treat it kindly and socialize it, it will be a good dog.

 

[Hacp]

I have a pitbull, I love him and he's as gentle as they come. In fact he LOVES people. Will wag his tail extremely excitedly everytime he meets someone new.

It's all about how you raise the dog. Any dog who is beaten, mistreated or left to run wild is susceptible to being an aggressive dog. You bring a dog up from a puppy and treat it kindly and socialize it, it will be a good dog.

Starve him out for a week and put him in front of a 2 year old. See how loving and caring he'll be then.

 

[StageLeft]

What needs to happen is people need to be held fully accountable for their pets (and children), this would solve a ton of issues.

Your dog kills someone, you get the sentence. It was shepherds/dobermans, then rotties, then pitbulls, now everyone and their brother is going to the S. American breeds and other mastiff mixes for a bigger dog then their homies.

Dogs inherently become what their owners make them (short of mental issues)

Agree. A strong dog can be every bit as dangerous as a firearm in the hands of a moron who practices no restraint or gun safety and the owner must be held legally responsible.

Starve him out for a week and put him in front of a 2 year old. See how loving and caring he'll be then.

Haha, but you are right, although as long as he doesn't do that his dog will probably be fine.

 

[Josh]

Starve him out for a week and put him in front of a 2 year old. See how loving and caring he'll be then.

You, sir, are an idiot. That contradicts my whole point. What if someone starved you for a week, chained you to a tree and put you in front of a human, or dog. See how loving and caring you will be then.

What a stupid arguement. You starve any animal for a week and not care for it, of course it is going to act outrageous.

And, quite honestly, I think if I did starve him for a week (horrible to even think about) he still wouldn't attack a human. He might go for a bird or something like that...I really don't think he'd attack and try to eat a 2 year old. It takes a long time to un-develop something he has learned since he was born (that humans care for him, feed him and love him). That's why these Pitbull attacks you hear about are usually dogs that were born into fighting and/or abusive homes.

If you read anything about the Pitbull breed history you will see they were trained to be extremely friendly to humans. When a pitbull attacks a human it is completely uncharacteristic of the breed. Dogs are bred a certain way. A certain tempermant. Pitbulls tempermant is to be friendly with humans, especially children.

Take a look at the ATTS Breed Statistics for Tempermant:

http://www.atts.org/stats1.html

Pitbulls ranked very well compared with a lot of other Breeds, with a passing rate of 83.9 percent -- compared to only 77 percent of the general dog population.

Unfortunately, these days, a pitbull has become a sort of "symbol" for people in lower income neighborhoods who don't treat these dogs well, don't neuter them and let them breed freely with other aggressive dogs. They are also the dog of choice for fighting dogs because of their size, determination and strength. These situations cause the media and public to equate "Pitbull" with "Fighting Dogs" or "Aggressive dogs".

 

[alkemyst]

Starve him out for a week and put him in front of a 2 year old. See how loving and caring he'll be then.

do the same with a person...give the two year old a cheeseburger.

 

[Josh]

do the same with a person...give the two year old a cheeseburger.

Hacp had no idea what he was talking about...and realizes that now.

 

[Hacp]

You, sir, are an idiot. That contradicts my whole point. What if someone starved you for a week, chained you to a tree and put you in front of a human, or dog. See how loving and caring you will be then.

What a stupid arguement. You starve any animal for a week and not care for it, of course it is going to act outrageous.

And, quite honestly, I think if I did starve him for a week (horrible to even think about) he still wouldn't attack a human. He might go for a bird or something like that...I really don't think he'd attack and try to eat a 2 year old. It takes a long time to un-develop something he has learned since he was born (that humans care for him, feed him and love him). That's why these Pitbull attacks you hear about are usually dogs that were born into fighting and/or abusive homes.

If you read anything about the Pitbull breed history you will see they were trained to be extremely friendly to humans. When a pitbull attacks a human it is completely uncharacteristic of the breed. Dogs are bred a certain way. A certain tempermant. Pitbulls tempermant is to be friendly with humans, especially children.

Take a look at the ATTS Breed Statistics for Tempermant:

http://www.atts.org/stats1.html

Pitbulls ranked very well compared with a lot of other Breeds, with a passing rate of 83.9 percent -- compared to only 77 percent of the general dog population.

Unfortunately, these days, a pitbull has become a sort of "symbol" for people in lower income neighborhoods who don't treat these dogs well, don't neuter them and let them breed freely with other aggressive dogs. They are also the dog of choice for fighting dogs because of their size, determination and strength. These situations cause the media and public to equate "Pitbull" with "Fighting Dogs" or "Aggressive dogs".

In the end, the dog is a dangerous animal. It can go crazy and berserk at any time. The owners need to be personally responsible for them. If their dogs end up killing someone, well they need to go to jail as if they murdered that person.

 

[JTsyo]

“Pit Bulls have more bite pressure per square inch (PSI) than any
other breed.” This is absolutely false.

Tests that have been done comparing the bite pressure of several
breeds showed pressure PSI (per square inch) to be considerably lower
than some wild estimates that have been made. Testing has shown that
the domestic dog averages about 320 lbs of pressure per square inch.
Recently Dr. Brady Barr of National Geographic conducted a comparative
test between a Pit Bull, a Rottweiler, and a German Shepherd. The Pit
Bull had the LOWEST PSI OF THE THREE.

The highest pressure recorded from the Pit Bull was 235 lbs PSI. The
highest from the GSD was 238, and the highest from the Rott was 328.
Dr. Barr states that as far as he knows, the PSI tested in the Rott is the
highest on record for any domestic canine.

What happened to the supposed 10,000 pounds PSI pressure that the
breed supposedly has??? It's a MYTH, pure and simple.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADDxe24ud90 (link to a video of it)

THERE HAVE NEVER been ANY TESTS done to prove that the APBT has
bite pressure PSI higher than what has been tested by Dr. Barr.

The numbers don't make sense against the average.

 

[Hacp]

The numbers don't make sense against the average.

Depends on the distribution.