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The Official If Bernie Sanders wins the nomination thread.....

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sportage said:
I don't get Sanders supporters.
They act like should they not get their way they will screw it up for everyone else. They will refuse to support the democrat and they simply will not vote.
And if Bernie did win, he would need a democratic super majority house and senate to follow him.
Which reminds me... when any of the candidates campaign why are they not also pleading for people to vote for a democratic senate? None of the candidates including Bloomberg with his billions of dollars would get one thing done or one law passed as long as republicans control the senate.
Who is kidding who here?
As strong as the candidates toot their own horn they need to toot for every democrat running as well. Otherwise all the talk means nothing and they have no credibility. House democrats thought they could impeach Donald Trump despite of the republican senate and look where that got them.
If democrats can not win the presidency and the senate then why bother? And should democrats lose the house, senate and the presidency then we might as well hand Donald Trump his oval office throne, cape, and golden crown.
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Where are you getting the idea that Sanders supporters won't support the Dem candidate should he not win the nomination? The vast majority of them will. Sanders has told his supporters to do so. More Clinton supporters voted for McCain in the 2008 election over Obama than Sanders supporters that voted for Trump in the 2016 election.
 
mect said:
Where are you getting the idea that Sanders supporters won't support the Dem candidate should he not win the nomination? The vast majority of them will. Sanders has told his supporters to do so. More Clinton supporters voted for McCain in the 2008 election over Obama than Sanders supporters that voted for Trump in the 2016 election.
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There were a few polls recently that suggested Sanders and Yang voters, in stark contrast to the other candidates' supporters, would not vote for the Dem nominee if it were not their candidate. Something just north of 50%. Take it for what it's worth, shrug.
 
While I agree with a few of his policy positions I believe he has zero leadership or legislative skill. He has shown he doesn't know how build coalitions, which he will need. He would be relying entirely on Nancy Pelosi to enact anything, so essentially Sanders policy positions would have nearly zero political impact. I don’t believe he has the ability to persuade legislators to go along with anything.
 
boomerang said:
Everything is going to be just fine. Republicans won't accomplish much of anything and eventually you'll have that Democrat president you're dreaming of. Now, it may get uncomfortable when Republicans start the impeachment process before your savior even takes the oath of office, but hey, that's the way the game is played now. It's just politics!
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Republicans will undermine the foundation of this country until it collapses. Then all bets are off as to what happens next. Fascism or Socialism or civil war.
 
TheVrolok said:
There were a few polls recently that suggested Sanders and Yang voters, in stark contrast to the other candidates' supporters, would not vote for the Dem nominee if it were not their candidate. Something just north of 50%. Take it for what it's worth, shrug.
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Interesting, I hadn't seen that poll. Thanks.
 
TheVrolok said:
Totally agreed. Turn out is the only thing that has any hope at overcoming the corruption (and stupidity).

I don't care for Bernie as a candidate, but I won't have a moment of hesitation to vote for him over Trump.
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Yup, if you stubbornly abstain, then you discard the right to complain about the consequences
 
TheVrolok said:
There were a few polls recently that suggested Sanders and Yang voters, in stark contrast to the other candidates' supporters, would not vote for the Dem nominee if it were not their candidate. Something just north of 50%. Take it for what it's worth, shrug.
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I found this: https://www.newsweek.com/over-40-an...atic-nominee-that-isnt-him-poll-shows-1485458
The poll by Emerson College, which was released last week, showed that 42 percent of Yang's supporters – or the "Yang gang" as they call themselves – would refuse to support any other Democratic candidate that became the party's nominee. An additional 9 percent said it would depend on the nominee.

Senator Bernie Sanders supporters have the next highest level, but it's far lower at just 16 percent saying they'd refuse to back a different candidate. But 31 percent of Sanders backers said that it would depend on who the nominee turned out to be.
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Which doesn't paint quite as dire a picture as you portray.
 
It seems to me that the more deeply one is committed to the idea that radical and moderate conservatism have proven to have destroyed democracy in America handing real control to the wealthy, the less likely anybody who sees that and believes it will want to vote for any traditional candidate. Sanders, with a lifetime commitment to returning democracy to the people, and Yang with no commitment to anything traditional both seem to offer, in my opinion, viable options to those with such vision. As I said before, there are three parties in the race, cult fanatics, moderate conservatives, and progressives, the first two having decades of having proven to be pretty worthless and preventing run away wealth inequality.

People talk about issues but there is only one real issue and it is that ordinary people have no say in what their own government does. Even legislation is is written by corporations for their own benefit. Legislators don't have time to legislate. They are too busy raising money to keep their jobs in the next election.
 
VRAMdemon said:
While I agree with a few of his policy positions I believe he has zero leadership or legislative skill. He has shown he doesn't know how build coalitions, which he will need. He would be relying entirely on Nancy Pelosi to enact anything, so essentially Sanders policy positions would have nearly zero political impact. I don’t believe he has the ability to persuade legislators to go along with anything.
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Exactly, how's he going to get anything done when he has no record of achievement. Seems he does not work well with others.
 
hal2kilo said:
Exactly, how's he going to get anything done when he has no record of achievement. Seems he does not work well with others.
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Yup a guy who stands a good chance of being the Democratic choice for president has no record of achievement, a guy who has been pushing a progressive message all of his long live and a country that is now finally actively considering him as their candidate has no record of achievement and will stay that way because people unconsciously accept that no real change can ever happen to them. All we need in this life is a negative attitude to fit right in.
 
JEDIYoda said:
IMO all bets are off with the Democrats being willing to stand behind Bernie at all costs!
Also I believe if Bernie wins the nominations the Dems could lose the House and for certain the Senate is already lost with Bernie!
I see nothing but gloom and despair and agony if Bernie wins the nomination!
In fact if I may -- I believe a lot of people who would vote Democrat just won`t show up to vote at all!
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Yeah, let's just burn down the house while we're sitting on the couch and complaining about the heat. At least we'll have our principles!
 
VRAMdemon said:
While I agree with a few of his policy positions I believe he has zero leadership or legislative skill. He has shown he doesn't know how build coalitions, which he will need. He would be relying entirely on Nancy Pelosi to enact anything, so essentially Sanders policy positions would have nearly zero political impact. I don’t believe he has the ability to persuade legislators to go along with anything.
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Haven't you heard? With congress relinquishing much of their power, the President is free to rule by Executive Order. Don't need any legislative skill for that.
And do you think he is going to veto Democratic-led bills that land on his desk? Do you think any will actually make it to his desk?
If a topic comes up that actually has bi-partisan support, do you think he will throw a tantrum because somebody says it makes him look bad?

Bernie Sanders will try and convince the public that his policies are good for them, and he will succeed for some of them. With the public behind him, he should be able to get something passed (if the Dems control the Senate), or at least move the needle for future elections. Simply undoing the stench of Trump will be a monumental task occupying most of his first term.
 
Moonbeam said:
Yup a guy who stands a good chance of being the Democratic choice for president has no record of achievement, a guy who has been pushing a progressive message all of his long live and a country that is now finally actively considering him as their candidate has no record of achievement and will stay that way because people unconsciously accept that no real change can ever happen to them. All we need in this life is a negative attitude to fit right in.
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The hypocrisy of this post is off the charts considering your diatribe about unity in the other thread.
 
ivwshane said:
The hypocrisy of this post is off the charts considering your diatribe about unity in the other thread.
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How is it hypocritical?
What experience does Bloomberg have?? Raping/ Molesting and crushing women with legal disclosures.
compared to Bloomberg, Sanders has a whole life of positive contribution to society

Who are you supporting btw?
 
hal2kilo said:
Exactly, how's he going to get anything done when he has no record of achievement. Seems he does not work well with others.
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He doesn't work well with others that are trying to sell of the country to the highest bidder. Writing legislation isn't quite as fast as it is when you just have corporations write it for you and then you just present it as yours. And finally, the President isn't a legislator. It isn't his job to write laws. And finally, the idea that Sanders gets nothing done in congress is largely a myth.

www.factcheck.org

A Misleading Claim About Lawmakers' Effectiveness - FactCheck.org

A popular meme takes aim at prominent lawmakers by referencing the number of bills they've had passed. But it uses an erroneous number -- and omits context.
www.factcheck.org www.factcheck.org
 
ivwshane said:
The hypocrisy of this post is off the charts considering your diatribe about unity in the other thread.
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How quickly we forget I'm either a troll or too old to have a coherent conversation with.

You are in the habit of making claims like I can't read or my hypocrisy is off the charts. Why not just lay out your case. Here you can show me what I said now and what I said elsewhere that you think is hypocritical and I would have something I could respond to. The last time I had to drag that out of you we discovered I shouldn't have been concerned about what somebody actually said because they said something you thought I should have read differently than what they actually said for reasons..... All I said there was that I had a concern about how, if the poster meant to say something else he shouldn't have used the example of unity that he did point to. So what is it this time?
 
Win meaning he gets greater than 50% of the vote. That’s great I’m excited!
Win meaning he gets more than anyone else and does some horse trading with #2 to win. I’m good with that provided it is not a retarded horse
Win meaning he got more votes than anyone else but it is not a plurality
Like:
Bernie gets 33%
#2 gets 31%
#3 gets 26%

I’m pretty worried.
 
Ajay said:
Well, I’m pretty confused by Bernie's message, which is well described by Fareed Zakaria:
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To add to your confusion you might want to think about what the results of not doing the Sanders plan might mean for the world. I mean it would be a lot more practical, less expensive, and more realistic to just let the planet die, right. You just might have to ask yourself if you really understand what run away climate change will mean for humanity. His whole plan might look very different if you are dying of thirst or swept away by flood somewhere there has never been one before, etc.

And what do you bet the oil, gas, and nuclear people are doing with their money to support his plan?
 
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