Russia on brink of ... NOPE! Russia INVADES Ukraine!

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Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,613
11,255
136
Looks like an Aeroflot 737 didn't get the memo and is circling around Eastern Greece over the Greek-Turkish airspace boundary due to restrictions. Greece won't allow it to land.
Let it land, and then live there until the end of this.
 

interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,026
2,879
136
I think deposing is much more likely with the sanctions in place. The sanctions are much more effective because they dropped quickly, over a weekend. Don't think we should give them time to adjust. I am sure the generals understand the best way to unfuck the situation to overthrowing Putin and pulling out.

The likelihood goes way up when it becomes clear that they have something tangible to gain as a result of that action. Right now, if they off Putin and pull out of Ukraine, they are left in economic shambles with only China and India as meaningful partners to be part of the world economy. We shouldn't end sanctions. Just offer a pause for a chance for them to come to the table and have a chance to restructure their nation.
 
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interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,026
2,879
136
Wait... didnt the entire world denounce colonialism and imperialism?
So just standing-by watching a country with an aggressive military take over another is not a "bad idea"?
Why did we stop Iraq over Kuwait? Was it for humanitarian reasons or just for the oil?

If Russia invaded a NATO country, declaring was on Russia is exactly what would happen...

So what you are really saying is that the people of Ukraine are less important than the people of Poland, Germany or England? Or not worth saving because they don't have any oil?
Gee we feel real bad about Russia invading your county and destroying your homes and murdering your people, but not enough to invite you into our members only club or actually help you defend yourself in a non-passive way.
What dumbfuckery form of racism/classism/elitism are you propagating?


Thoughts and Prayers and Economic Sanctions.

Ukraine has oil. And natural gas. This is Putin's major motivation to keep them from advancing in partnership with the West and allowing foreign energy companies to operate in Ukraine.
 

Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,613
11,255
136
The likelihood goes way up when it becomes clear that they have something tangible to gain as a result of that action. Right now, if they off Putin and pull out of Ukraine, they are left in economic shambles with only China and India as meaningful partners to be part of the world economy. We shouldn't end sanctions. Just offer a pause for a chance for them to come to the table and have a chance to restructure their nation.
A pause gives them time to adjust to the sanctions and ends the need to depose Putin. I think it's pretty clear to everyone if they pull out of Ukraine and especially if Putin is gone, a lot of the sanctions will go away. They can talk while they starve.
 
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HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
38,871
31,963
136
What if NATO and any country against Russia make a plea to his military. Leave Ukraine, go back to Russia and put a bullet in the head of Putin? Tell them they are killing their own kind and they don't really want to do this.
 

conehead433

Diamond Member
Dec 4, 2002
5,569
901
126
"Why did we stop Iraq over Kuwait? Was it for humanitarian reasons or just for the oil?"
Iraq was using a slant drilling technique to extract oil from under Kuwait soil. We should have never gotten involved and allowed them to settle their own dispute. But the oil...

Edit: It was Kuwait that was slant drilling into Iraq.
 
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thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
12,042
2,257
126
I think deposing is much more likely with the sanctions in place. The sanctions are much more effective because they dropped quickly, over a weekend. Don't think we should give them time to adjust. I am sure the generals understand the best way to unfuck the situation to overthrowing Putin and pulling out.
Exactly...removing sanctions during negotiation is just going to be used by Putin to get back on a better footing. IMO any negotiations in the short term are just a stalling tactic. Having said that, to stop the hostilities and prevent bloodshed the Ukranians do need to show up to the table.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
25,757
12,067
136
More Stinger targets.

Damn, beat me to it^^^
I really don't know why the general military establishment won't recognize that relatively cheap portable smart munitions have completely changed the game. Everything emanating a heat signature is a target and GPS tech compounds it. A different division of the company I used to work for makes that most advanced GPS chip in the industry. Harris bought it out for that reason.
 
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thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
12,042
2,257
126
Which is weird since he's the invader and losing. You're supposed to stall if you're the defender and losing. This just means more dead Russians (and now Belarusians).
I figure he would want to stall because the quick victory didn't happen for Putin. Stalling allows him time to call up more forces, with which he will push harder.
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
19,828
6,917
136
What if NATO and any country against Russia make a plea to his military. Leave Ukraine, go back to Russia and put a bullet in the head of Putin? Tell them they are killing their own kind and they don't really want to do this.
That is what back channel communications are for. Some things can never be said publicly, but before Putin would be taken out of the equation, those responsible would want something in return.
 

rommelrommel

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2002
4,426
3,209
146
Yes, it’s unlikely that any Ukrainians will stop defending and harassing RussIan invaders. Talks are to see if Putin can shake major concessions out of Ukraine I guess.
 

nOOky

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2004
3,232
2,289
136
Wait... didnt the entire world denounce colonialism and imperialism?
So just standing-by watching a country with an aggressive military take over another is not a "bad idea"?
Why did we stop Iraq over Kuwait? Was it for humanitarian reasons or just for the oil?

If Russia invaded a NATO country, declaring was on Russia is exactly what would happen...

So what you are really saying is that the people of Ukraine are less important than the people of Poland, Germany or England? Or not worth saving because they don't have any oil?
Gee we feel real bad about Russia invading your county and destroying your homes and murdering your people, but not enough to invite you into our members only club or actually help you defend yourself in a non-passive way.
What dumbfuckery form of racism/classism/elitism are you propagating?


Thoughts and Prayers and Economic Sanctions.

I think the U.S. is weary from our recent never ending wars in the middle east. Kuwait was a just cause, fully embraced by most Americans IIRC. It's not like every American wants to stay out of it, I suspect if you ask many members of our armed services they'd certainly want to help. It would seem easier to get Russians to take care of the Putin problem themselves versus risk a devastating war that could end badly.
 

sao123

Lifer
May 27, 2002
12,653
205
106
"Why did we stop Iraq over Kuwait? Was it for humanitarian reasons or just for the oil?"
Iraq was using a slant drilling technique to extract oil from under Kuwait soil. We should have never gotten involved and allowed them to settle their own dispute. But the oil...

Drilling must be some new slang euphemism for Bombing, Invasion & Territorial Occupation... Unless you deny the fact that 4 Iraqi divisions actually took control of Kuwait City and forced the current government into exile...



Ukraine has oil. And natural gas. This is Putin's major motivation to keep them from advancing in partnership with the West and allowing foreign energy companies to operate in Ukraine.

Oil and Natural gas and still refuse to help them? so now Ukraine people are even less important than Kuwaitis?
Super Extra Triple Racist?

Or is it bad to help them because they have oil? Saving Ukraine = adding to CO2/Pollution = against Bidens agenda??
 

brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
29,585
30,092
136
Drilling must be some new slang euphemism for Bombing, Invasion & Territorial Occupation... Unless you deny the fact that 4 Iraqi divisions actually took control of Kuwait City and forced the current government into exile...





Oil and Natural gas and still refuse to help them? so now Ukraine people are even less important than Kuwaitis?
Super Extra Triple Racist?

Or is it bad to help them because they have oil? Saving Ukraine = adding to CO2/Pollution = against Bidens agenda??
Ukraine welcomes your direct personal assistance. Book your flight to Warsaw and then head to the border.

Given how the US is organizing the international community to destroy Russia's finances and shipping weapons to Ukraine I guess you're very confused about Biden's agenda.
 

Pens1566

Lifer
Oct 11, 2005
13,504
10,949
136
"Why did we stop Iraq over Kuwait? Was it for humanitarian reasons or just for the oil?"
Iraq was using a slant drilling technique to extract oil from under Kuwait soil. We should have never gotten involved and allowed them to settle their own dispute. But the oil...

Uh, they kind of invaded and took over the whole of Kuwait. Concern was they wouldn't stop (for long) and continue into SA, which would have been a major strategic nightmare for the US.