Rep. Alan Grayson

[Ausm]

Originally posted by: OCguy

Originally posted by: Ausm

It's not baseless so in the last Presidential Election when the GOP got crushed does that mean Republicans forgot to vote? doubt it

No, it means you could have ran a legally blind feces-eating walrus against any Republican in '08, and the (D) would have won due to the timing of the tanking economy and the debacle in Iraq.

Did this mean the country was suddenly all (R) ?

No that means that the people running for office were a joke for the Democratic party sort of like for the Republicans in '08.

 

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: WHAMPOM

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: CitizenKain

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: ayabe

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Yes.. saying Republicans want people to die quickly is a fact.. :roll: I guess its about as much of a fact as saying democrats want terrorists to live and get free healthcare and kill innocent people.

People are dying right now, every 12 minutes someone dies from a lack of insurance, Republicans do not want reform, they want to kill every single proposal, that is standing up for the status quo, the status quo is KILLING PEOPLE RIGHT NOW.

You simply cannot grasp what is occurring.

And yet the democrats did not bring up healthcare for the past 8 years. People are DYING every 12 minutes because of the lack of healthcare and they don't EVEN TRY to bring up a bill? Even when they controlled both houses of congress?!

The democrat plan won't even take effect for a few years.. WHY ARE THE DEMOCRATS KILLING AMERICANS?!?!

Democrat plan: Die slowly so we can continue to vote democratic and we'll just keep extending the issue out for decades without passing anything.

You see, there is this thing called a "veto." Go look it up, then remember who the president was.

Could you link to me the healthcare bills GWB vetoed? As I recall he passed one of the biggest expansions of healthcare ever with the prescription drug benefits.

Yes Bush did sign the biggest example of Republican sponsored Big Government Wasteful Spending. Now what else do you want to honk about?

Totally agree.. so why would he not have signed this wasteful government program into law?

It lacked nearly every aspect of price control and was a gold plated "Gimme" for the drug companies.

 

[BMW540I6speed]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
I have to admit, I'm enjoying the Republican reaction. The faux outrage, the chest clutching, the near fainting at the fact that someone could say such an awful thing, it's hilarious. I guess they are just hoping that people don't remember a word they have said over the last 2 months or so. (they may be right... haha)

It's a terrible tactic from an honest debate standpoint. It does nothing to add to the discourse, and it simply adds more stupid fuel to an already really stupid fire. The only problem is that Republicans have shown little inclination for an honest debate, so what do you do?

I agree with the bolded, the "holocaust" schtick was also over the top. this is an example of how pathetic political, critical thinking discourse and debate has become.

BUT, this is how the debate has been framed by the Republicans. They can demand that he apologize for his comments right after they apologize for "death panels" and every other crazy nazi/socialist/terror/omg/1984/kill grandma/kill my baby/kill myself because it's good for the state/WTF ever bullshit argument they've been so eager to throw around these past few months. Grayson's comments might be uncomfortably hyperbolic to them, but it's not even close to the level of the lies and slander that have been employed on a regular basis. Its this your side against my side, left - right bullshit mentality. Just throw some dumb comments out there as red meat and let the ideologues feed.

Since the Republicans have seen fit to attack any attempts at reform with ridiculous hyperbole, they got a taste of their own medicine and should clarify their position. Enough of this mincing, timid debate. Time to put everything on the table.

 

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: shira

Originally posted by: rudder

Originally posted by: SammyJr
I love this. Someone in the DNC finally woke up and decided to fight fire with fire. We had Joe Wilson screaming "You lie!" in an obvious attempt to turn attention away from Obama's speech. I'm glad that a Democrat finally has had the balls to stand up and cause a ruckus rather than trying to play kiss ass with the minority party that might represent the views of 20% of Americans.

More people should have yelled "you lie."

And the latest polls continue to show that the majority OF AMERICANS (not broken down into Dems and Repubs) ARE NOT in favor of Government run healthcare.

I'll bet you could do a poll that asks if Americans are for or against forced abortions for all unmarried pregnant girls, forced sterilization of anyone with more than two children, forced euthanasia of all sick people over 55, forced blood donations from all healthy adults, and forced organ-harvesting from everyone who dies before the age of 30. And I'll bet you'd find that an overwhelming majority of AMERICANS oppose all of these things. Of course, none of them has anything to do with HR3200, and neither does "government run healthcare."

It does all depends on how the question is asked.

Are you in favor of Universal Health Care or Government run healthcare would get quite different answers.

 

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: ayabe

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Yes.. saying Republicans want people to die quickly is a fact.. :roll: I guess its about as much of a fact as saying democrats want terrorists to live and get free healthcare and kill innocent people.

People are dying right now, every 12 minutes someone dies from a lack of insurance, Republicans do not want reform, they want to kill every single proposal, that is standing up for the status quo, the status quo is KILLING PEOPLE RIGHT NOW.

You simply cannot grasp what is occurring.

Where did we go wrong where it became acceptable for a man to make a living off another mans work?

This is what is wrong. Not who does or does not have insurance, but believing one deserves the work of another.

 

[Patranus]

If we want to talk about holocaust, why not talk about the one the Democrats endorse ever day?

 

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: ayabe

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Yes.. saying Republicans want people to die quickly is a fact.. :roll: I guess its about as much of a fact as saying democrats want terrorists to live and get free healthcare and kill innocent people.

People are dying right now, every 12 minutes someone dies from a lack of insurance, Republicans do not want reform, they want to kill every single proposal, that is standing up for the status quo, the status quo is KILLING PEOPLE RIGHT NOW.

You simply cannot grasp what is occurring.

Where did we go wrong where it became acceptable for a man to make a living off another mans work?

This is what is wrong. Not who does or does not have insurance, but believing one deserves the work of another.

Hay now, living off another man's work is the definition of Capitalism.

This is what is wrong. To have a large boat in which to escape a flood and leave your neighbors to drown. "Not enough caviar on board to share with those folks."

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: ayabe

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Yes.. saying Republicans want people to die quickly is a fact.. :roll: I guess its about as much of a fact as saying democrats want terrorists to live and get free healthcare and kill innocent people.

People are dying right now, every 12 minutes someone dies from a lack of insurance, Republicans do not want reform, they want to kill every single proposal, that is standing up for the status quo, the status quo is KILLING PEOPLE RIGHT NOW.

You simply cannot grasp what is occurring.

Where did we go wrong where it became acceptable for a man to make a living off another mans work?

This is what is wrong. Not who does or does not have insurance, but believing one deserves the work of another.

Blah blah blah, your point presupposes that everyone works at a level playing field where they get the true value of their labor, which is obviously untrue. Save the Ayn Randian crap, she was a terrible author and a bad philosopher.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: ayabe

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Yes.. saying Republicans want people to die quickly is a fact.. :roll: I guess its about as much of a fact as saying democrats want terrorists to live and get free healthcare and kill innocent people.

People are dying right now, every 12 minutes someone dies from a lack of insurance, Republicans do not want reform, they want to kill every single proposal, that is standing up for the status quo, the status quo is KILLING PEOPLE RIGHT NOW.

You simply cannot grasp what is occurring.

Where did we go wrong where it became acceptable for a man to make a living off another mans work?

This is what is wrong. Not who does or does not have insurance, but believing one deserves the work of another.

Blah blah blah, your point presupposes that everyone works at a level playing field where they get the true value of their labor, which is obviously untrue. Save the Ayn Randian crap, she was a terrible author and a bad philosopher.

Outside of supply and demand, the very basis of the free market, how do you determine the true value of labor? I'd love to hear this.

 

[Patranus]

Originally posted by: BoberFett
Outside of supply and demand, the very basis of the free market, how do you determine the true value of labor? I'd love to hear this.

The value of labor is equal regardless of the skill set required to do the work.

Didn't you get the memo?

 

[Sclamoz]

Originally posted by: Patranus
If we want to talk about holocaust, why not talk about the one the Democrats endorse ever day?

What holocaust is that?

 

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: ayabe

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Yes.. saying Republicans want people to die quickly is a fact.. :roll: I guess its about as much of a fact as saying democrats want terrorists to live and get free healthcare and kill innocent people.

People are dying right now, every 12 minutes someone dies from a lack of insurance, Republicans do not want reform, they want to kill every single proposal, that is standing up for the status quo, the status quo is KILLING PEOPLE RIGHT NOW.

You simply cannot grasp what is occurring.

Where did we go wrong where it became acceptable for a man to make a living off another mans work?

This is what is wrong. Not who does or does not have insurance, but believing one deserves the work of another.

Blah blah blah, your point presupposes that everyone works at a level playing field where they get the true value of their labor, which is obviously untrue. Save the Ayn Randian crap, she was a terrible author and a bad philosopher.

I agree the playing field is not level. Its ridiculous to think a high school grad bushing a broom for a union makes as much or more then someone with a 4 year degree from college. None the less, neither should be forced to work to provide for another who doesnt wish to work at all.

And it has nothing to do with any authors or books. The simple fact is no man should be made to work for another. Its slavery, regardless of how you wish to sell it.

 

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: WHAMPOM

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: ayabe

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Yes.. saying Republicans want people to die quickly is a fact.. :roll: I guess its about as much of a fact as saying democrats want terrorists to live and get free healthcare and kill innocent people.

People are dying right now, every 12 minutes someone dies from a lack of insurance, Republicans do not want reform, they want to kill every single proposal, that is standing up for the status quo, the status quo is KILLING PEOPLE RIGHT NOW.

You simply cannot grasp what is occurring.

Where did we go wrong where it became acceptable for a man to make a living off another mans work?

This is what is wrong. Not who does or does not have insurance, but believing one deserves the work of another.

Hay now, living off another man's work is the definition of Capitalism.

This is what is wrong. To have a large boat in which to escape a flood and leave your neighbors to drown. "Not enough caviar on board to share with those folks."

Then you do not understand capitalism. You can choose to assign whatever meaning or definition to a word you wish, but this does not make your position in any way relevant.

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

Are you guys arguing that we have a fully capitalist economy in this country? Really?

 

[Patranus]

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian
Are you guys arguing that we have a fully capitalist economy in this country? Really?

One could only wish.

The US economy is federally regulated up the ass.

 

[jonks]

Originally posted by: Sclamoz

Originally posted by: Patranus
If we want to talk about holocaust, why not talk about the one the Democrats endorse ever day?

What holocaust is that?

the holocaust....of the unborn....DUM DUM DUMMMMMMMMMM!

(the alternative being what exactly, abortion outlawed leading to a holocaust of young mothers being slaughtered in back alleys? I'll stick with disposing of the cellular clump in the womb)

 

[Pens1566]

Originally posted by: jonks

Originally posted by: Sclamoz

Originally posted by: Patranus
If we want to talk about holocaust, why not talk about the one the Democrats endorse ever day?

What holocaust is that?

the holocaust....of the unborn....DUM DUM DUMMMMMMMMMM!

(the alternative being what exactly, abortion outlawed leading to a holocaust of young mothers being slaughtered in back alleys? I'll stick with disposing of the cellular clump in the womb)

What's funny is that Grayson even addressed that republican crutch in his original statement from the floor ... he said something about caring for americans even after they're born.

 

[cubby1223]

Originally posted by: ayabe
People are dying right now, every 12 minutes someone dies from a lack of insurance, Republicans do not want reform, they want to kill every single proposal, that is standing up for the status quo, the status quo is KILLING PEOPLE RIGHT NOW.

You simply cannot grasp what is occurring.

Every 12 minutes?

There are supposedly 47 million uninsured people in the U.S.

The average lifespan of someone in the U.S. is ~74 for male, ~80 for female, so let's just say 77 years.

77 years equals ~40 million minutes.

If those 47 million people were evenly aged out, one should be dying about every minute. With the distribution of people more slanted towards the younger generations, one uninsured person dying every 12 minutes sounds, well, normal.

Even if he may not grasp what is occurring, you certainly cannot grasp statistics.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: cubby1223

Originally posted by: ayabe
People are dying right now, every 12 minutes someone dies from a lack of insurance, Republicans do not want reform, they want to kill every single proposal, that is standing up for the status quo, the status quo is KILLING PEOPLE RIGHT NOW.

You simply cannot grasp what is occurring.

Every 12 minutes?

There are supposedly 47 million uninsured people in the U.S.

The average lifespan of someone in the U.S. is ~74 for male, ~80 for female, so let's just say 77 years.

77 years equals ~40 million minutes.

If those 47 million people were evenly aged out, one should be dying about every minute. With the distribution of people more slanted towards the younger generations, one uninsured person dying every 12 minutes sounds, well, normal.

Even if he may not grasp what is occurring, you certainly cannot grasp statistics.

This is a Holocaust! WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU! People are dying in the streets, they are dropping dead at work, they are dropping dead at never before seen rates. All because the Republicans want them to die quickly!

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: cubby1223

Originally posted by: ayabe
People are dying right now, every 12 minutes someone dies from a lack of insurance, Republicans do not want reform, they want to kill every single proposal, that is standing up for the status quo, the status quo is KILLING PEOPLE RIGHT NOW.

You simply cannot grasp what is occurring.

Every 12 minutes?

There are supposedly 47 million uninsured people in the U.S.

The average lifespan of someone in the U.S. is ~74 for male, ~80 for female, so let's just say 77 years.

77 years equals ~40 million minutes.

If those 47 million people were evenly aged out, one should be dying about every minute. With the distribution of people more slanted towards the younger generations, one uninsured person dying every 12 minutes sounds, well, normal.

Even if he may not grasp what is occurring, you certainly cannot grasp statistics.

They are referring to excess mortality, not straight mortality. Since you didn't even know what the study was talking about I think you should probably hold off on your evaluation of others' statistical acumen.

 

[jonks]

Originally posted by: cubby1223
If those 47 million people were evenly aged out, one should be dying about every minute. With the distribution of people more slanted towards the younger generations, one uninsured person dying every 12 minutes sounds, well, normal.

erm, you don't seem to be getting that the person dying every 12 minutes would otherwise have lived had they had insurance. :roll:

In other news, if a person is dying every 12 minutes, we need to find the fucker who keeps bringing him back to life. Such a one could be useful.

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: jonks

erm, you don't seem to be getting that the person dying every 12 minutes would otherwise have lived had they had insurance. :roll:

Kind of hard to prove, no?

 

[Patranus]

Originally posted by: jonks
erm, you don't seem to be getting that the person dying every 12 minutes would otherwise have lived had they had insurance. :roll:

That is complete bull shit.

Anyone can walk into a hospital and receive care regardless of their age, sex, gender, sexual orientation, race, legal status, or ability to pay.

 

[Phokus]

Grayson is a liar.

Republicans want the POOR to die quickly. And they want the middle class to join them eventually (once medical inflation gets really out of control). There, that's more accurate

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: OCguy

Originally posted by: jonks

erm, you don't seem to be getting that the person dying every 12 minutes would otherwise have lived had they had insurance. :roll:

Kind of hard to prove, no?

Why don't you go read the study?