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NON_POLITICAL China Coronavirus THREAD

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killster1

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
5,880
372
126
Don't be stupid. If you ingest body fluid that is teeming with intact respiratory virus, you can certainly get infected.
Does callimg names make you right? Did you not read all the facts about zero infections from eating food? How would you get infected your gi tract?? Maybe sores in your mouth or bleeding strep throat?? Those are not common at least never happens to me. Not sure about ur dirty mouth ;)
 

CZroe

Lifer
Jun 24, 2001
24,178
841
126
Does callimg names make you right? Did you not read all the facts about zero infections from eating food? How would you get infected your gi tract?? Maybe sores in your mouth or bleeding strep throat?? Those are not common at least never happens to me. Not sure about ur dirty mouth ;)
"GI tract?!" Again, your mouth is as much a part of your respiratory tract as your nose, which is why we cover BOTH with a mask. How do you think food gets to your GI tract? ;)

"Infected food?!" You mean contaminated food.
...and, yes, of course you can get it from your food, since droplets would enter your mouth (again, part of your respiratory tract) before anything goes into your stomach.

I wasn't exactly eating his straw, though I was getting his saliva and respiratory droplets deposited directly into my respiratory tract while attempting to consume a beverage. Whether or not you can get infected in your stomach is inconsequential since your food doesn't teleport into your stomach. It passes through your mouth and throat, which are obviously part of your respiratory tract.

What does bleeding in your mouth have to do with anything? Even if it can also be transmitted through blood, that wouldn't mean you have to have a cut in your mouth since your mouth is already one of the primary pathways to infection.

Everyone knows that you can get pretty much any respiratory imfection through your eyes, nose, or mouth, since it's all connected. That includes influenza viruses, rinoviruses, and, yes, coronaviruses.

SARS-CoV and SARS-CoV-2 target the same ACE2 receptor used in epithelial cells lining the airway. Here's a good old article about it from 16 years ago:

We know it infects the upper respiratory tract (mouth, nose, etc) as readily as the lower respiratory tract (lungs, bronchial tubes, etc) since anosmia comes from COVID-19 infection in your sinues.

I love how you confidently claim there isn't a single case of someone getting the virus from contaminated food when China went into a second lockdown and blocked imports over supposedly-contaminated salmon. Millions of people directly affected after they found a contaminated chopping board. I think they wanted to blame it on imported salmon since they didn't want to admit that the virus was still spreading domestically and preferred to blame it on imported cases, but it doesn't matter whether the food was contaminated from outside the country or inside: It was still contaminated.

Were the people in your "real world example" licking 1,200 utensils moments before the 1,200 served ate with the same utensils without washing them? No? Then I fail to see the relevance. Even when considering inevitable surface contamination (since food is also a surface), there's also this little thing called "viral load" to consider. Swapping saliva with an infected person is many orders of magnitude worse than eating a salad that an infected person breathed over.
 
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Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
30,149
3,555
126
are you joking? there has been this thing called contact tracing, if it was coming from food it would be traced back to the source of someone working in a establishment infecting peoples food. i would be pretty confident eating the virus, funny out of 20 million cases they say there have been zero reported cases from eating food infected with the virus. but yet you say "how would they know!" hahaha so funny, you guys are joking maybe.

my real world example is at my job the entire kitchen crew was infected with the virus, they cooked food for 1200 people and zero of those people became infected after eating the food handled and prepared from those infected kitchen staff. amazing right!? Now the kitchen crew infected each other no one that ate the prepared food contracted the virus.
Dude, a great many cases have unknown transmission. Wash your hands, don't touch your face. You seriously think that if you eat the virus you can't catch it? Show me that study. Laugh all you want, it's your life.
 

killster1

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
5,880
372
126
Dude, a great many cases have unknown transmission. Wash your hands, don't touch your face. You seriously think that if you eat the virus you can't catch it? Show me that study. Laugh all you want, it's your life.
Show me a single case that has been from eating the virus and not breathing it. Just a single case from the 20 million current cases
 

killster1

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
5,880
372
126
"GI tract?!" Again, your mouth is as much a part of your respiratory tract as your nose, which is why we cover BOTH with a mask. How do you think food gets to your GI tract? ;)

"Infected food?!" You mean contaminated food.
...and, yes, of course you can get it from your food, since droplets would enter your mouth (again, part of your respiratory tract) before anything goes into your stomach.

I wasn't exactly eating his straw, though I was getting his saliva and respiratory droplets deposited directly into my respiratory tract while attempting to consume a beverage. Whether or not you can get infected in your stomach is inconsequential since your food doesn't teleport into your stomach. It passes through your mouth and throat, which are obviously part of your respiratory tract.

What does bleeding in your mouth have to do with anything? Even if it can also be transmitted through blood, that wouldn't mean you have to have a cut in your mouth since your mouth is already one of the primary pathways to infection.

Everyone knows that you can get pretty much any respiratory imfection through your eyes, nose, or mouth, since it's all connected. That includes influenza viruses, rinoviruses, and, yes, coronaviruses.

SARS-CoV and SARS-CoV-2 target the same ACE2 receptor used in epithelial cells lining the airway. Here's a good old article about it from 16 years ago:

We know it infects the upper respiratory tract (mouth, nose, etc) as readily as the lower respiratory tract (lungs, bronchial tubes, etc) since anosmia comes from COVID-19 infection in your sinues.

I love how you confidently claim there isn't a single case of someone getting the virus from contaminated food when China went into a second lockdown and blocked imports over supposedly-contaminated salmon. Millions of people directly affected after they found a contaminated chopping board. I think they wanted to blame it on imported salmon since they didn't want to admit that the virus was still spreading domestically and preferred to blame it on imported cases, but it doesn't matter whether the food was contaminated from outside the country or inside: It was still contaminated.

Were the people in your "real world example" licking 1,200 utensils moments before the 1,200 served ate with the same utensils without washing them? No? Then I fail to see the relevance. Even when considering inevitable surface contamination, since food is also a surface, there's also this little thing called "viral load" to consider. Swappong saliva with an infected person is many orders of magnitude worse than eating a salad that an infected person breathed over.

Show me 1 case from someone who ate the "respiratory virus" and was infected
 

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
30,149
3,555
126
Show me a single case that has been from eating the virus and not breathing it. Just a single case from the 20 million current cases
Science man, I can't show you anything. Think what you want, how do you know where X got the virus? You don't. Prove to me you can't get it by eating the virus? I said it above, I'll say it again, show me the study that says you won't contract covid-19 if you eat something with the virus in/on it? Show me. If you can't, then you just don't know.
 

killster1

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
5,880
372
126
Science man, I can't show you anything. Think what you want, how do you know where X got the virus? You don't. Prove to me you can't get it by eating the virus? I said it above, I'll say it again, show me the study that says you won't contract covid-19 if you eat something with the virus in/on it? Show me. If you can't, then you just don't know.
I just posted 4 sites and Every site on the internet says the same its from breathing it or touching nose or eyes. Even touching nose or eyes isn't a main source its in the air. I just showed and you didn't show anything saying food could be a source. No one would eat out if this was a issue. Every person damn near wohld be infected if it was a issue. Wake up and actually read EVERY expert and see its in the air
 

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
30,149
3,555
126
I just posted 4 sites and Every site on the internet says the same its from breathing it or touching nose or eyes. Even touching nose or eyes isn't a main source its in the air. I just showed and you didn't show anything saying food could be a source. No one would eat out if this was a issue. Every person damn near wohld be infected if it was a issue. Wake up and actually read EVERY expert and see its in the air
Oh, for sure, it's in the air, I'm not disputing that air transmission is mainly what's going on. All I'm saying is AFAIK there aren't any studies saying you can't get it by ingestion. CVroe says he's gonna get tested after sipping from a strangers drink. He's much better informed than you. Why don't you argue with him? :rolleyes:

I realize lots of people are eating out, mainly take out. I ate takeout on my birthday a few weeks ago, the only time since this pandemic got going. It wasn't my idea, but I went along. Because it was my birthday. But odds are I won't again before I get vaccinated. This disease is scary. It ain't the flu. I'm not saying you shouldn't eat take out. I don't do it a lot, pandemic or not. But right now, I'm very SIP.
 
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[DHT]Osiris

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2015
8,535
4,524
146
I just posted 4 sites and Every site on the internet says the same its from breathing it or touching nose or eyes. Even touching nose or eyes isn't a main source its in the air. I just showed and you didn't show anything saying food could be a source. No one would eat out if this was a issue. Every person damn near wohld be infected if it was a issue. Wake up and actually read EVERY expert and see its in the air
It's in airborne water particulates, which can just as easily end up on food as anywhere else. You absolutely can get it from food, although you're far more likely to get it from being around the sick person that prepared it for you just due to breathing it in.
 
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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
105,771
20,600
136
if you owned a business would you stop people from entering the store with out a mask?
yes

If so how would you stop them?
bar from entry and toss them out

how long do you think before you got sued and lost.
are you serious? there is literally no non-discriminatory law protecting a consumer from entering my private business and violating the established rules for entry. And no, virus deniers are not a protected class. Do you honestly think such a suit would find anyone to back it? Really?

Do you think they should pursue theft physically too? Maybe you just like to say things you dont really believe in.

....I'm starting to wonder if you understand "how things work."
 
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killster1

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
5,880
372
126
yes



bar from entry and toss them out



are you serious? there is literally no non-discriminatory law protecting a consumer from entering my private business and violating the established rules for entry. And no, virus deniers are not a protected class. Do you honestly think such a suit would find anyone to back it? Really?




....I'm starting to wonder if you understand "how things work."
cant think of anything other then taxi's and airplane travel that are strict on masks and get away with it. good luck putting hands on someone in your business for not wearing a mask or wearing it improperly.

and technically by law the mask mandate states that if you are medically unable to wear the mask then you don't have to.

It's in airborne water particulates, which can just as easily end up on food as anywhere else. You absolutely can get it from food, although you're far more likely to get it from being around the sick person that prepared it for you just due to breathing it in.
so again id like just one instance of someone being infected from water or food that has been infected. If this was the case no one would eat out and restaurants / food take out would be getting zero business.
 

Scarpozzi

Lifer
Jun 13, 2000
25,345
1,110
126
It's in airborne water particulates, which can just as easily end up on food as anywhere else. You absolutely can get it from food, although you're far more likely to get it from being around the sick person that prepared it for you just due to breathing it in.
Right...so we all breathe air that others already had in their lungs. Think about it like this...every time someone around you is vaping that crap they buy these days and you can SMELL vanilla or whatever those precious little millennials are huffing, you are smelling air that has already passed through their lungs...

If you can smell what they're vaping, that should give you an idea of how easy it is to breathe air from other people. The real challenge is trying to establish how MUCH virus it takes to infect an individual. If all parties in the room are wearing masks, it's gotta reduce the spread...even if the barrier leaks...I mean, 50% is something if it deflects the droplets, right? At the end of the day, no one knows how much virus it takes to take hold and replicate. What they do know is that coronavirus is more contagious, likely from those scary little prongs that look like a burr that have the ability to stick to things.

I'm going to continue avoiding other people at least until next Spring...has nothing to do with a vaccine...just assuming the worst will pass this Winter.
 

[DHT]Osiris

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2015
8,535
4,524
146
so again id like just one instance of someone being infected from water or food that has been infected. If this was the case no one would eat out and restaurants / food take out would be getting zero business.
Well fuck man, if that's your reasoning please point to one instance of proven transmission by inhalation of particulates from an infected person.

Here's a hint: we don't have to GPS track the virus to determine the possible/probable infection vectors, we can infer it based on who gets infected. And no, people are taking what would be considered acceptable risks by getting food takeout. Would you accept a box of food from someone you knew was sick, and had sneezed on your box prior to handing it to you?
 
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njdevilsfan87

Platinum Member
Apr 19, 2007
2,091
119
106
Food can be a vector - any way the virus can get into your body is a vector, but it's not a vector that will likely cause infection. You're probably likely to get it from touching the bags/surfaces holding the food and then picking your nose afterwards.

There are many reports of a "GI version" of COVID that does not appear among the severe cases (a lot of GI versions never present with respiratory symptoms). But it's not determined if the vector for those cases was orally.
 

killster1

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
5,880
372
126
Well fuck man, if that's your reasoning please point to one instance of proven transmission by inhalation of particulates from an infected person.

Here's a hint: we don't have to GPS track the virus to determine the possible/probable infection vectors, we can infer it based on who gets infected. And no, people are taking what would be considered acceptable risks by getting food takeout. Would you accept a box of food from someone you knew was sick, and had sneezed on your box prior to handing it to you?
i assume everyone is sick, I guess you never have worked in a food service job before, how do you know what sneeze happened when, again I point to my study of the entire kitchen crew being infected and infecting other people through the air but zero of the 1200 people who ate the food where infected. whats that tell you? what is this "acceptable risk" really mean? a risk so small its acceptable? do you watch the food being prepared 100% of the time? sure at a IN n OUt burger they have a big window you can watch them all cooking and placing the order into bags etc, but that is the only place I can think where that happens. Yes I have eaten food from sick co workers, they made a cake and I ate a few slices knowing they where sick, guess what nothing happened!

as far as one proven transmission by inhalation? you are joking right? you think these cases are from anything other then inhalation of the virus? every case linked to the subway, they didn't share food or kiss or have sex they simply inhaled and exhaled next to each other. I can say 100% of the cases here are from simple talking with out mask next to another person being the transmission, I can safely say that is the transmission because the floor staff don't cook for the patients where I work, they don't kiss, they don't share drinks, or anything like that. Air droplets is the only route of transmission and it has happened many times.
 

killster1

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
5,880
372
126
Food can be a vector - any way the virus can get into your body is a vector, but it's not a vector that will likely cause infection. You're probably likely to get it from touching the bags/surfaces holding the food and then picking your nose afterwards.

There are many reports of a "GI version" of COVID that does not appear among the severe cases (a lot of GI versions never present with respiratory symptoms). But it's not determined if the vector for those cases was orally.
gi symptoms only? or it was contracted from the GI? id love to see the link / article, thanks finally someone reasonable.
 

[DHT]Osiris

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2015
8,535
4,524
146
as far as one proven transmission by inhalation? you are joking right? you think these cases are from anything other then inhalation of the virus?
My point is, there aren't studies specifically stating 'x was definitely, proven the cause of transmission, and here's the x, y and z of how we proved that'. Of course air is the obvious transmission source, specifically air droplets (which we've learned through elimination) but you cannot just exclude food served by a sick person who may have breathed or sneezed on it.
 

CZroe

Lifer
Jun 24, 2001
24,178
841
126

Show me 1 case from someone who ate the "respiratory virus" and was infected
LOL! You still think you have a point. I didn't "eat" the straw. Food doesn't teleport into your stomache and bypass your mouth (part of your upper respiratory tract). Even if you get infected from contaminated food, you still didn't get it from "eating the virus." You got it from transferring the virus to your respiratory tract from a contaminated surface.

Just how do you think surface contamination spreads any respiratory virus INCLUDING this one? You touch droplets and it gets transferred to your eyes, nose, or mouth.

DUH.

It didn't suddenly stop being able to transmit through surfaces the moment we realized that it spreads more easily through the air than we thought. There are many reasons why more infections are predominantly airborne, like lack of community resistance, high viral shed rate, low viral load needed to establish an infection, etc.

I just posted 4 sites and Every site on the internet says the same its from breathing it or touching nose or eyes. Even touching nose or eyes isn't a main source its in the air. I just showed and you didn't show anything saying food could be a source. No one would eat out if this was a issue. Every person damn near wohld be infected if it was a issue. Wake up and actually read EVERY expert and see its in the air
LOL! Breathing on food is not the same thing as sharing a straw. You think everyone eating out is exposing themselves to the same risk I did? No.

Surface contamination is still all about viral load. If you touch a doorknob and then rub your eye the viral load has been reduced through each transfer, not to mention the transfer(s) that put it on the doorknob in the first place. An extremely low viral load is less likely cause an infection. The virus is not stable enough to last forever on a surface and the amount of viable virus remaining on a surface drops over time. The half life can be hours or days depending on the surface, temperature, humidity, etc, so the initial viral load matters a lot.

In the exact same way there is a HUGE difference between an infected person breathing over your salad and someone who spits into it. You are absolutely insane if you think the virus cares that the salad is ultimately going into your stomach.

It's in airborne water particulates, which can just as easily end up on food as anywhere else. You absolutely can get it from food, although you're far more likely to get it from being around the sick person that prepared it for you just due to breathing it in.
Exactly, and since most people don't go around licking straws in a stranger's drink, I'm probably the only weirdo who needs to be concerned about that highly risky form of transmission.
 

killster1

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
5,880
372
126
LOL! You still think you have a point. I didn't "eat" the straw. Food doesn't teleport into your stomache and bypass your mouth (part of your upper respiratory tract). Even if you get infected from contaminated food, you still didn't get it from "eating the virus." You got it from transferring the virus to your respiratory tract from a contaminated surface.

Just how do you think surface contamination spreads any respiratory virus INCLUDING this one? You touch droplets and it gets transferred to your eyes, nose, or mouth.

DUH.

It didn't suddenly stop being able to transmit through surfaces the moment we realized that it spreads more easily through the air than we thought. There are many reasons why more infections are predominantly airborne, like lack of community resistance, high viral shed rate, low viral load needed to establish an infection, etc.



LOL! Breathing on food is not the same thing as sharing a straw. You think everyone eating out is exposing themselves to the same risk I did? No.

Surface contamination is still all about viral load. If you touch a doorknob and then rub your eye the viral load has been reduced through each transfer, not to mention the transfer(s) that put it on the doorknob in the first place. An extremely low viral load is less likely cause an infection. The virus is not stable enough to last forever on a surface and the amount of viable virus remaining on a surface drops over time. The half life can be hours or days depending on the surface, temperature, humidity, etc, so the initial viral load matters a lot.

In the exact same way there is a HUGE difference between an infected person breathing over your salad and someone who spits into it. You are absolutely insane if you think the virus cares that the salad is ultimately going into your stomach.



Exactly, and since most people don't go around licking straws in a stranger's drink, I'm probably the only weirdo who needs to be concerned about that highly risky form of transmission.
To some degree I agree, but people do cough and sneeze and talk near the food being prepared. You have never seen how much spit comes out when talking ???? Why do u keep saying you didmt eat the straw. You aspirated the drink? I would think that would increase your chances of infection.
 

CZroe

Lifer
Jun 24, 2001
24,178
841
126
i assume everyone is sick, I guess you never have worked in a food service job before, how do you know what sneeze happened when, again I point to my study of the entire kitchen crew being infected and infecting other people through the air but zero of the 1200 people who ate the food where infected. whats that tell you? what is this "acceptable risk" really mean? a risk so small its acceptable? do you watch the food being prepared 100% of the time? sure at a IN n OUt burger they have a big window you can watch them all cooking and placing the order into bags etc, but that is the only place I can think where that happens. Yes I have eaten food from sick co workers, they made a cake and I ate a few slices knowing they where sick, guess what nothing happened!

as far as one proven transmission by inhalation? you are joking right? you think these cases are from anything other then inhalation of the virus? every case linked to the subway, they didn't share food or kiss or have sex they simply inhaled and exhaled next to each other. I can say 100% of the cases here are from simple talking with out mask next to another person being the transmission, I can safely say that is the transmission because the floor staff don't cook for the patients where I work, they don't kiss, they don't share drinks, or anything like that. Air droplets is the only route of transmission and it has happened many times.
Absolutely freaking hilarious.

Yes, inhaling is the easiest way, but it's also easy to get it on the subway a number of other ways. For example: someone coughs into their hands before they grab the bar or strap for stabilizing. They get off, you get on, and then you grab that same bar/strap.

Your nose itches so you rub it.

A seat becomes available so you sit down and open your book. You try to find your place but the pages are sticking so you lick your finger to change pages.

In the shuffle to sit you got a lash in your eye, causing your eye to water. You couldn't read through the watery eye so you rubbed out the excess tears.
 
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CZroe

Lifer
Jun 24, 2001
24,178
841
126
To some degree I agree, but people do cough and sneeze and talk near the food being prepared. You have never seen how much spit comes out when talking ???? Why do u keep saying you didmt eat the straw. You aspirated the drink? I would think that would increase your chances of infection.
Think about it for a second and it should become clear.

What happens to the airborne virus when you "aspirate it?" It goes into your repiratory tract where the spike proteins find ACE2 receptors on vulnerable epithelial cells. It enters the cells and hijacks cellular mechanisms to reproduce.

Your mouth is part of your respiratory tract. Your nose. Your sinuses. Your throat. Your bronchial tubes. Your alveoli. Your lungs.

Now, let's assume the straw was contaminated from an infected person but the virus can't infect you through your GI tract. Well, the straw and its contamination went directly into my mouth, not my stomach. I don't even care what's in the drink itself or where that ends up, but it and everything that came along with it can't just bypass my respiratory system (mouth) to get there.

The virus ABSOLUTELY CAN spread through your eyes, nose, and mouth. Your mouth is as much a part of your respiratory system as your nose, which is why we cover both with a mask. Your tears drain into sinuses which is why your eyes are also a vector for respiratory viruses and frontline workers wear hoods, face shields, or goggles.
 
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[DHT]Osiris

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2015
8,535
4,524
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Think about it for a second and it should become clear.

What happens to the airborne virus when you "aspirate it?" It goes into your repiratory tract where the spike proteins find ACE2 receptors on vulnerable epithelial cells. It enters the cells and hijacks cellular mechanisms to reproduce.

Your mouth is part of your respiratory tract. Your nose. Your sinuses. Your throat. Your bronchial tubes. Your alveoli. Your lungs.

Now, let's assume the straw was contaminated from an infected person but the virus can't infect you through your GI tract. Well, the straw and its contamination went directly into my mouth, not my stomach. It can't just bypass my respiratory system to get there.

The virus ABSOLUTELY CAN spread through your eyes, nose, and mouth. Your mouth is as much a part of your respiratory system as your nose, which is why we cover both with a mask. Your tears drain into sinuses which is why your eyes are also a vector for respiratory viruses and frontline workers wear hoods, face shields, or goggles.
Just wait until he finds out that when you smell shit, it's because particles of fecal matter just entered your nose and mouth.
 

Scarpozzi

Lifer
Jun 13, 2000
25,345
1,110
126
Just wait until he finds out that when you smell shit, it's because particles of fecal matter just entered your nose and mouth.
What's worse is when he finds out they only entered his nose and mouth because they want to join their family who already live in there....I really don't even know who we're talking about. I just thought I'd join the fun.
 
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