NON_POLITICAL China Coronavirus THREAD

[Kaido]

That article is two weeks old now. It currently seems that China is actually starting to legitimately recover, but they are going to have to worry about the rest of the world reinfecting them.

I hope so, but they don't exactly have a spotless track record:

Chinese Authorities Admit Improper Response To Coronavirus Whistleblower

Li Wenliang's warnings about the virus initially got him reprimanded by authorities in Wuhan. Now, six weeks after he died of COVID-19, Chinese investigators say they should have acted differently.

www.npr.org

Experts are worried about a second wave once the precautions are dropped:

Chinese Authorities Admit Improper Response To Coronavirus Whistleblower

Li Wenliang's warnings about the virus initially got him reprimanded by authorities in Wuhan. Now, six weeks after he died of COVID-19, Chinese investigators say they should have acted differently.

www.npr.org

 

[Kaido]

A third of American citizens told to stay home:

America Closes Down: A Third of Citizens Told to Stay Home

www.bloomberg.com

Surreal.

 

[Jon-T]

Germany has more than double the respiratory ICU's PER 100K people than Italy. That WILL help tremendously in facing this crisis.

For example, Portugal has roughly 1 / 3rd the respiratory ICU's Italy has, and we just crossed the 1000 cases mark ourselves.

Forbes did a comparison of ICU's across several countries.

The Countries With The Most Critical Care Beds Per Capita [Infographic]

As the COVID-19 outbreak pushes Italy's ICU bed capacity to breaking point, which countries have the highest number of critical care beds per capita to cope with the extra pressure?

www.forbes.com

 

[spacejamz]

That's why I asked the question about 2 pages back - how many people do you think in the US still don't understand the severity of the issue to the point of continuing to do shit like door to door sales, and going up to neighbors to shake hands and say "Hey Bob how have you been?"

I honestly think the answer is higher than we realize, because while we might be fully aware - there are plenty of Americans that are just obliviously stupid.

This can clearly be seen every election as over half don't show up - or even know that elections are occurring.

There are posts in my local facebook group asking if the DMV is open, are the dog parks open, etc....you can tell based on these questions these people have no idea why people are working from home, pro sports are cancelled, etc ....

Even with all the restaurants in our area only doing take out/delivery, you are still risking exposure (but definitely alot less than dining in)...

By next week when the infection rates are skyrocketing, you really need to avoid ALL unnecessary human contact for two or three weeks which is why you should be buying food now while the infection rates are lower....

This is exactly why this isn't going to get back to normal anytime soon...

 

[Red Squirrel]

I do feel there may be a second wave. Especially if the Olympics actually happen as planned. That is going to be a huge incubator for the virus to spread and then go to each country. The olympics are 2 weeks right? That's the incubation period of the virus. Nobody will know they have it until they get back to their home country. It's the perfect storm.

 

[spacejamz]

Correct.

I've been told by several people that the filing date had been moved back, which is not true. I thought that's what you were saying in your above post.

The filing deadline has been moved to July...

IRS extends tax filing deadline to July 15 as coronavirus spreads, Mnuchin says

President Donald Trump ordered the IRS federal income tax filing extension to help deal with the coronavirus pandemic's economic fallout, Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin said.

www.cnbc.com

The IRS moved the national income tax filing day ahead to July 15, three months after the normal deadline for Americans to send in their returns.

 

[Svnla]

New Orleans, Louisiana is under "stay home" mandate - https://www.nola.com/news/coronavirus/article_e8b5a83e-6aec-11ea-b095-d308ecec69a6.html

In other note, strippers will be in a world of hurt from lack of table dance clients. Poor things.

 

[shortylickens]

Allegedly Jared Leto has been on a trip for 12 days and did not know anything.

A high women washed her hands with a block of cheese. She was high was babysitting.

 

[pmv]

I do feel there may be a second wave. Especially if the Olympics actually happen as planned. That is going to be a huge incubator for the virus to spread and then go to each country. The olympics are 2 weeks right? That's the incubation period of the virus. Nobody will know they have it until they get back to their home country. It's the perfect storm.

"A Second wave" is apparently common in such things, either it's because the warm weather damps things down, then it gets going in again in the autumn, or it's because strict quarantine is relaxed and people start mixing again.
I don't think the Olympics on it's own would cause it, and really I find it hard to believe the Olympics is actually going to happen. I reckon it's only the IOC and the Japanese government who seriously think that it's still a possibility.

 

[H T C]

"A Second wave" is apparently common in such things, either it's because the warm weather damps things down, then it gets going in again in the autumn, or it's because strict quarantine is relaxed and people start mixing again.
I don't think the Olympics on it's own would cause it, and really I find it hard to believe the Olympics is actually going to happen. I reckon it's only the IOC and the Japanese government who seriously think that it's still a possibility.

Ofc it's not going to happen: @ least not @ it's current scheduled time. Both IOC and Japanese Government are deluding themselves if they think otherwise.

Why? Because most of the athletes are currently forced to NOT properly train so, even if they were allowed to compete, their performances would be subpar compared to their normal performances. This would result in a condemnation of the event which both IOC and Japanese Government DO NOT want.

They will lose hundreds of millions, if not billions, regardless of which decision they ultimately make.

 

[pmv]

Forbes did a comparison of ICU's across several countries.

The Countries With The Most Critical Care Beds Per Capita [Infographic]

As the COVID-19 outbreak pushes Italy's ICU bed capacity to breaking point, which countries have the highest number of critical care beds per capita to cope with the extra pressure?

www.forbes.com

Interesting - though you mean "Forbes reported on a 2012 paper from an academic journal, that did a comparison...". Forbes didn't do the comparison!

I do wonder why there would be such a disparity though. Generally medical systems don't build in lots of excess capacity that sits unused in normal times, as it would be hugely wasteful. I'd want to see more about how 'critical care beds' is defined. Does it include ventilators, for example?

Maybe that is part of the reason for the low German death rate? They have just as many cases as everyone else in Europe but far smaller number of deaths. I was thinking that that must be because the virus hasn't started spreading among older people there yet, and that maybe Italy has more interaction between different generations than Germany does.

Edit - also the paper that article is based on says it 'excludes private health care', which I don't understand, as isn't it _all_ private in the US case?

 

[BUTCH1]

Wow, fines here too now.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/opp-warns-businesses-social-distancing-1.5505439?fbclid=IwAR0ci6QdwE737oqLCkZbiGw_t20HFGLuph-4GGfglDekhGyUHUc1uF1oznk

I hate to see it come to this, it almost feels authoritarian... but people aren't listening. They were showing on the news today a bunch of people lined up at EB games for a new release. Seriously!? And why didn't the game postpone the release or make it an online download only?

And I agree 100%, here in FL last Sunday, (Disney's last day open) there were many thousands gathered around the exit area as cast members were all out waving them goodby, this is EXACTLY the kind of scenario officials wanted to avoid. Spring breakers had to be told "beaches closed", go home, local news interviewed some who displayed an astonishing level of stupid and I don't give a fuck attitude.

 

[shortylickens]

I just realized the handful of people who DO have to work will be competing for groceries with folks who are off, or working from home, and have lots of free time.

 

[pmv]

I just realized the handful of people who DO have to work will be competing for groceries with folks who are off, or working from home, and have lots of free time.

Already happening - complaints from medical staff coming off shift late going to buy food, only to find the supermarket has been stripped bare.

Surely to God, people are going to run out of space for food-hoarding soon, though? Then the shops can restock and things will return to normal? Or do some people just have near unlimited space for stashing stuff?

 

[DrMrLordX]

Not 100% true because some more rare influenza strains, such as the 1918 Spanish Flu, can also cause it, but compared to the "normal" influenza, you're right.

What's interesting is that even "normal" flu seasons can kill people in the tens of thousands without overwhelming ICUs. I have almost never heard of anyone I know dying of the flu, either. Apparently most flu deaths are from cytokine storm, which is rather sudden and doesn't involve long hospitalization.

DrMrLordX thinks that restaurants are so clean and immaculate

Again, learn some formal debate tactics. Putting words in people's mouths is fallacious. And extremely rude. At no point did I say they were "clean and immaculate". Honestly it feels like a waste of time discussing anything with you when you behave in such a fashion.

that the virus simply cant be spread from teh food served. (i think its total shit, that no place is beyond a cough or sneeze)

We've already had at least two articles posted in this thread (one by me) showing how airborne upper respiratory diseases (such as influenza and Covid-19) might or might not spread through food. In general, you're more likely to get it from a coughing patron or from a door handle (or other frequently-touched surface) than you are the food itself. Any contact with humans outside of your immediate dwelling is a risk. The fact that it is a restaurant does not specifically enhance the risk.

If the virus can attach to surfaces, it can attach to food, bags, receipts, napkins, etc. Nope.

How Long Does the Coronavirus Last on Surfaces?

Researchers looked at how long the virus can survive on cardboard, plastic, and stainless steel, as well as after being aerosolized and suspended in midair.

www.wired.com

Between cardboard (which should roughly approximate paper), plastic, and steel, cardboard presents the least transmission risk. And seriously you are talking about disposable items in single-contact scenarios. Reused items are more dangerous, such as . . . credit/debit cards.

The reason why government keeps the restaurants open is because otherwise some people would starve and we would have mass riots.

Hell, people gotta eat. Not everyone can get through those lines at Walmart or get what they want off the shelves.

First of all, that's only 8 bullets per rifle... and why would the US government buy obsolete Russian rifles anyway?! At 600 rounds per minute, "2 million bullets" is less than one second of continuous firing for each of those 250,000 AK-47s.

They're cheap? It's hard to apply reason to conspiracy nuttery regardless.

In other note, strippers will be in a world of hurt from lack of table dance clients. Poor things.

I can help a few shelter in place. If they'd like.

Already happening - complaints from medical staff coming off shift late going to buy food, only to find the supermarket has been stripped bare.

Surely to God, people are going to run out of space for food-hoarding soon, though? Then the shops can restock and things will return to normal? Or do some people just have near unlimited space for stashing stuff?

Sounds like the military should start sending hospitals some spare MREs for the staff.

 

[shortylickens]

Already happening - complaints from medical staff coming off shift late going to buy food, only to find the supermarket has been stripped bare.

Surely to God, people are going to run out of space for food-hoarding soon, though? Then the shops can restock and things will return to normal? Or do some people just have near unlimited space for stashing stuff?

I dunno. Some folks might be willing to fill up a spare bedroom.
I have a large basement, in theory I could have tons of food down here but thats too much work to lug it.
I COULD have been stockpiling slowly over the last year, which is something I kinda wanted to do but kept putting off.
Stock up on 5 gallon water jugs too.
And medical supplies.
But I was lazy and showed little foresight.

 

[H T C]

What's interesting is that even "normal" flu seasons can kill people in the tens of thousands without overwhelming ICUs. I have almost never heard of anyone I know dying of the flu, either. Apparently most flu deaths are from cytokine storm, which is rather sudden and doesn't involve long hospitalization.

Patients that require hospitalization due to COVID-19 require it for an extended period, which aggravates the problem that is so many people @ the same time requiring it to begin with.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Patients that require hospitalization due to COVID-19 require it for an extended period, which aggravates the problem that is so many people @ the same time requiring it to begin with.

Yup! It's like they're drowning in their own fluids/dead lung cells. Eww. Nasty way to die.

 

[pmv]

I think by the time this is over most businesses will have gone bust, excepting only the major retailers who sell food and other essential goods.

The country will be split into rival warring kingdoms, each owned by a different supermarket chain, plus the dominion of Amazonia, ruled by Jeff Bezos, now known as Lord Amazon Prime. All infractions against Lord Prime will result in exectuion by drone...administered the next day if you commit the crime before 6pm, otherwise it will take two days.

 

[CZroe]

I do feel there may be a second wave. Especially if the Olympics actually happen as planned. That is going to be a huge incubator for the virus to spread and then go to each country. The olympics are 2 weeks right? That's the incubation period of the virus. Nobody will know they have it until they get back to their home country. It's the perfect storm.

Smaller waves are preferable to a big hump... not that we want to stoke any wave. Just trying to say it may not be so scary.

Allegedly Jared Leto has been on a trip for 12 days and did not know anything.

A high women washed her hands with a block of cheese. She was high was babysitting.

I don't get it.

 

[Exterous]

Went to the grocery store this morning and people are still hoarding TP. The limit was two big packs per person and most of the carts had the full two packs.

We went yesterday at 5pm and found about 70% of what we wanted for our grocery list. We went this morning and were able to find the rest except bagels. Some areas had been refilled (meat, canned beans and veggies) but were pretty low on stock compared to normal.

Already happening - complaints from medical staff coming off shift late going to buy food, only to find the supermarket has been stripped bare.

Around here there are "Health\Safety worker only" shopping hours to help people with that (and are close to shift change times\restocking times so I'm guessing it probably works out well for them)

 

[CZroe]

Steven Crowder made another low hanging fruit parody video called "Kung Flu Fighting" where he says that Swine Flu came from China. I commented to say that 2009 H1N1 "Swine Flu" came from America and got told I needed to fact check!

Why do people attempt to correct corrections like that without fact-checking themselves first?! So strange.

 

[brianmanahan]

Steven Crowder made another low hanging fruit parody video called "Kung Flu Fighting" where he says that Swine Flu came from China. I commented to say that 2009 H1N1 "Swine Flu" came from America and got told I needed to fact check!

Why do people attempt to correct corrections like that without fact-checking themselves first?! So strange.

if by america you mean north america and not the US:

"In 2009, U.S. agricultural officials speculated, although emphasizing that there was no way to prove their hypothesis, that "contrary to the popular assumption that the new swine flu pandemic arose on factory farms in Mexico," the virus "most likely emerged in pigs in Asia, but then traveled to North America in a human."

"However, a subsequent report by researchers at the Mount Sinai School of Medicine in 2016 found that the 2009 H1N1 virus likely originated from pigs in a very small region of central Mexico"

2009 swine flu pandemic - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[pmv]

if by america you mean north america and not the US:

"In 2009, U.S. agricultural officials speculated, although emphasizing that there was no way to prove their hypothesis, that "contrary to the popular assumption that the new swine flu pandemic arose on factory farms in Mexico," the virus "most likely emerged in pigs in Asia, but then traveled to North America in a human."

"However, a subsequent report by researchers at the Mount Sinai School of Medicine in 2016 found that the 2009 H1N1 virus likely originated from pigs in a very small region of central Mexico"

2009 swine flu pandemic - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Seems a slighlty-silly thing to argue over. Clearly they could emerge anywhere, though presumably it's more likely to happen in cultures that favour meat-eating or bestiality. (I'm guessing the first of those is more common.)

 

[Mai72]

There are posts in my local facebook group asking if the DMV is open, are the dog parks open, etc....you can tell based on these questions these people have no idea why people are working from home, pro sports are cancelled, etc ....

Even with all the restaurants in our area only doing take out/delivery, you are still risking exposure (but definitely alot less than dining in)...

By next week when the infection rates are skyrocketing, you really need to avoid ALL unnecessary human contact for two or three weeks which is why you should be buying food now while the infection rates are lower....

This is exactly why this isn't going to get back to normal anytime soon...

I think our lives are going to be transformed in ways we can't even begin to imagine. It's going to be "how well can you adopt to the new normal." Most are going to adopt, but there will be many who aren't. I worry about the people who are living on the edge. Paycheck to paycheck. Or people who suffer from depression, high anxiety, etc. People who have a high distrust for the government. Stuff like that.