My first gaming build plan ^^ opinions and improvements needed

[mfenn]

There seems to be a lot of suspicion that Nvidia will launch their 700 series cards at Computex. Any thoughts on this?

They won't be a significant bump from the current cards because they'll still be Kepler GPUs. It'll be more like the difference between GTX 400 and GTX 500, not GTX 500 and GTX 600. The true next-generation Maxwell parts aren't due until late 2014 at the earliest.

So sure, you could wait, but are you seriously going to stretch a build over 6 months?

 

[Splenyi]

You're both definitely right. I want to get a 7970 anyway because of the free games, and its really cheap now.

Talking about 7970, Pccasegear just got an MSI twin frozer stocked in, and its $520! Not even lighting edition. A direct CU II TOP is cheaper than that, and that can have its voltage unlocked using the matrix bios.

No HIS 7970 card yet.

 

[mfenn]

$520 is way too much for a 7970, get the least expensive multi-fan card. From PCCaseGear, that would be this Gigabyte 7970 for $409.

 

[Splenyi]

That's the card I was thinking of getting, I have heard good things about it, but I have heard a lot of bad stuff about Sapphires card. Thanks again.

By the way, I want to buy an aftermarket thermal compound, just in case I have to remove my cooler for any reason. Any suggestions? I heard Arctic Silver 5 is really good, but apparently it needs a 200 hr burn in time, which I wont be keen on doing. Other ones I was looking at is Noctua's NT-H1 and Arctic's MX-4.

I wont be using this stuff on my first application, because there is some compound pre-applied, but I just want some in case I need it. It's only $10 max, so I don't mind.

 

[Sleepingforest]

PK-1. IC Diamond. Liquid Ultra. Those are the top ones--they are basically really high quality cold solder.

 

[Splenyi]

Thanks for the references, I'm ordering IC Diamond 24 carat now.

By the way, I haven't got my motherboard yet, and I noticed MSI releasing their gaming series boards. Should I consider it, or is ASRock's Extreme4 still a better value?

 

[Sleepingforest]

Listen: the cheapest Z77 board with 4 DIMM slots is probably the wisest option. People who plan for SLI or CFX in the future rarely, if ever do it, plus dual-cards is not as money efficient as upgrading a single card over time. You don't really need things like a superior NUC.

 

[Splenyi]

I just saw Corsair's 350D, and I have to say I am extremely jealous. Looks just as good as the 900D.

Maybe I could ebay my c70, buy the 350D if it hits the shelves any time soon, and switch to a micro ATX build.

Thanks again for your input sleepingforest, but I'm not particularly keen on getting the cheapest board with the absolute minimum of what I need, the layout for them boards is rather poor sometimes (ASRock z77M, ASUS P8Z77-M, for example). I would like some headway, which is why I would rather get ASRocks Extreme4 because it has everything (and a little more) of what I need.

If I change to the m-ATX case though, that would cut a lot of cost off the motherboard too. The 350D just doesn't have much 3.5" mounts, which is the only thing putting me off at the moment (+ it's super fat). Maybe more cages can be added? I've already purchased 2 WD drives, so that's all the HDD I can have if I got this case.

PS. I'm starting to see how ugly the C70 really is

 

[mfenn]

Thanks again for your input sleepingforest, but I'm not particularly keen on getting the cheapest board with the absolute minimum of what I need, the layout for them boards is rather poor sometimes (ASRock z77M, ASUS P8Z77-M, for example). I would like some headway, which is why I would rather get ASRocks Extreme4 because it has everything (and a little more) of what I need.

The point is not to get the cheapest board just for the sake of spending the least amount of money. The point is to preserve as much of your budget for the parts that actually matter (CPU, GPU, SSD).

 

[Splenyi]

Well seems as Haswell is just a little more than a month off, ill just wait for that. Hopefully 1150 boards will be cheaper, seems as more and more components are being intergrated into chip itself.

 

[Sleepingforest]

1150 boards won't be cheaper for a while, as motherboard manufacturers like to gouge at the beginning of a generation (just like graphics cards). You might be waiting for a long, long time.

 

[Splenyi]

Ah ok, thanks.

Some good news; pccasegear reduced their msi 7970 by $100, so now its only $420, that's the OC Boost Twin Frozer 3. Probably going to get that card.

Also, I want to sell my c70 case to a friend and buy the new 350D. But just wondering, are the mATX boards just as good quality?

 

[mfenn]

Yes, good MicroATX boards are just as high-quality as full ATX.

 

[Sleepingforest]

The only thing you can't do well with mATX is dual-card setups (the PCIe slots are often really close, and lots of cases lack enough expansion slots). The board quality is just as good though.

Why can't you just return the case? Did you get it shipped from the states (therefore shipping is too expensive), has it just been too long, or are you just getting a better price from your friend?

 

[Splenyi]

It was shipped from the states, so return shipping would be $60 minimum, so I would only get $110 back for it (I payed $170). My mate would pay well for it though, I'll probably get $150 seems as it sells for $160 (no shipping) in the AU.

For my mATX motherboard, there are a few options I am looking at.

#1 - ASRock Extreme4-M $115

#2 - ASUS Maximus V Gene $205

I know that the ASRock is the best value, and probably the best choice, but the Maximus Gene has 8+4(+2?) power phase, compared to ASRock's 4+2, which will make it great or OCing. Gene has great onboard audio and a mSATA bluetooth +wifi module (wifi is a priority for me), which will save me trying to upgrade both of those aspects in the future, or try to cram them into my PCIe slots. For SATA ports, I only need 5 max, that's the most my case will hold, and they both have that. I heard ASRock boards will generally have memory compatibility problems, and I think my Platinums will be on the top of that list. I can squeeze any 2 2-slot graphics cards into either board, not that I intend to though (Corsair 350D has 5 expansion slots). They both have the fan headers I need. ASUS' comes with Daemon Tools Pro, which I will use to play some old PS2 games on; it also comes with Kaspersky and their own CPU-Z, which both don't really phase me.

Apparently the ASUS board can have a thunderbolt upgrade, but I'm not sure if any board with a free PCIe lane can do that, or if this one has been designed for just that.

So yeah, obviously the ASUS board will be superior in every way, but I'm just thinking if its price tag is justified. The built in audio, bluetooth and wifi (value maybe $60-$70?, plus the other software), and larger power phase design is what's pushing me to buying it. Plus it looks beast. I think it's the best mATX board at this time, and just for $205 + free shipping (if I wanted the ASRock board, I don't get free shipping, it will cost about $20)

EDIT: A question, will wireless keyboards and mice work for a PCs first time setup (windows installation and going into the bios), or do they need to be wired?

 

[Sleepingforest]

Bluetooth is like $10 for a USB dongle, as is WiFi (at least, mine were when I took a quick trip to a local electronics store). The sound won't be superior enough to tell unless you have outrageously good audio equipment (and loseless music files), and the better power phases don't matter unless you happen to be going for a 5GHz or more overclock (and even then, you'd need vaporphase cooling, an exceptional chip, and far more power delivery than the Gene offers).

In other words, I find it unworthwhile. If your WiFi and Bluetooth dongles are signifcantly more, then I say you might as well.

As for the wireless KB/M: generally, no (definitely no if they require drivers). In fact, the only things likely to work without drivers are the USB 2.0 ports, the PS/2 ports, and integrated graphics.

 

[mfenn]

Bluetooth is like $10 for a USB dongle, as is WiFi (at least, mine were when I took a quick trip to a local electronics store). The sound won't be superior enough to tell unless you have outrageously good audio equipment (and loseless music files), and the better power phases don't matter unless you happen to be going for a 5GHz or more overclock (and even then, you'd need vaporphase cooling, an exceptional chip, and far more power delivery than the Gene offers).

I agree. Also, coming with Daemon Tools isn't exactly a great value considering that the software is free.

As for the wireless keyboard and mouse, you are crazy if you build a gaming machine with them IMHO. That being said, they should work during install as long as they are the normal type with their own custom dongle and not Bluetooth.

 

[Splenyi]

I'm not crazy, I just don't have a monitor yet, so ill be using it on the tv, sitting on the couch. Not what I would prefer, but cords going across the lounge room is going to cause trouble. Its a cheap Microsoft wireless desktop set, and it does have its own wireless dongle.

I always thought that I need a PCI card for WiFi and bluetooth, I didn't know you could just use a little usb dongle. Thanks guys.

 

[Sleepingforest]

No problem! Let us know if you have any other concerns.

 

[Splenyi]

Could someone please link me a WiFi and bluetooth usb dongle from Amazon?

EDIT: also, what's the max dual graphics card setup I could fit with a Corsair AXi 760W (63.3 amps on the 12V take). 2x7950/660TI at the most? Just wondering, because I might be building a pc for a friend. I think a 7970/670 needs about 30 amps, and 7950/660TI needs about 25.

Also, if I was going multi graphics card, would I be better with SLI or CFX?

 

[Sleepingforest]

Crossfire is typically considered inferior due to having stuttering issues. However, supposedly, a fix is coming over the summer. Radeon cards are considered generally better for the price though (well, it's a little more debateable since the 680, 670, 660ti, and 660 fell in price and Radeon cards rose slightly at the top end).

Anyway, 760W is plenty for Crossfire (yes, there are enough amps too) of pretty much everything but Titans and 7970 GHz Editions (unless you're overclocking the cards really high).

 

[Splenyi]

Ok thanks for the reply.

Do you have a link to a usb WiFi and bluetooth dongle from Amazon, please?

 

[mfenn]

Ok thanks for the reply.

Do you have a link to a usb WiFi and bluetooth dongle from Amazon, please?

Here ya go: link The top result (Cirago) is a combo unit that does both.

 

[Splenyi]

Thanks mfenn

I'm surprised by pccasegear today, they're selling Gigabyte's 7970 for $399. I might still go with MSI's OC Boost card thought, just for the OCability, for the extra $20.

 

[Splenyi]

Two quick questions.

1: does it matter if any cords are touching any PCBs?

2: if you were building a super itx system, would you get a titan, 690, or the new 7990?