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Zen 2 APUs/"Renoir" discussion thread

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Tup3x

Senior member
Dec 31, 2016
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I am still curious as to why anyone needs AI enhancements in iGPUs, phone SoCs, and the like. What's the play here? Run massive AI learning clusters with these things?
Image segmentation for camera etc. on phones.
 

soresu

Golden Member
Dec 19, 2014
1,387
564
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I am still curious as to why anyone needs AI enhancements in iGPUs, phone SoCs, and the like. What's the play here? Run massive AI learning clusters with these things?
AI/ML accelerators in these things are mainly for inference purposes - training most NN's takes considerable time and power (watts and TOPS), whereas inference using a fully trained NN can be extremely efficient even on these relatively small ASIC's.

As for actual use cases, ML can be used for various vision/imaging and audio based tasks (feature/facial recognition, image stabilisation, speech synthesis, voice recognition, handwriting recognition?) - basically anything with identifiable patterns will benefit from it, if the NN can be compressed efficiently enough to run on a small footprint.

One of the Daala/AV1 developers (Xiphmont) recently developed a new audio codec that uses ML for ultra low bandwidth (1.6 kbps), presumably for narrow band only (voice). Link here.
 
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cortexa99

Member
Jul 2, 2018
86
110
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Though this is an old topic that had no update since last year but I think this topic is still suitable to place some leaks here.



150719mncz9ls022wo9wjk.jpg

this guy running 8C Renoir with fclk2100 memory, seems they implied 4000mhz is easy.


emmm ok there is another one in same thread:

(the guy who leak this one said he turned off igfx before testing AIDA64 then result in 49ns)

194834cz0iqi0055jm5imv.png
 
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NostaSeronx

Diamond Member
Sep 18, 2011
3,171
677
136
Take this as rumors for now...

Small Zen2 APU:
Four Zen2 cores
Three Vega CUs or Two RDNA2 Poly-CUs.
6nm(N6-AMD) Refined/Custom process node(weakened up-port of N5A which is the 5nm custom node AMD will be using)

6W TDP/12W Slow PPT/18W Fast PPT is the target for all SKUs.
 

Antey

Member
Jul 4, 2019
44
42
51
Take this as rumors for now...

Small Zen2 APU:
Four Zen2 cores
Three Vega CUs or Two RDNA2 Poly-CUs.
6nm(N6-AMD) Refined/Custom process node(weakened up-port of N5A which is the 5nm custom node AMD will be using)

6W TDP/12W Slow PPT/18W Fast PPT is the target for all SKUs.

that would be banded kestrel (raven ridge 2) 2.0

1593183556763.png
 

Kenmitch

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,040
1,295
126
Maybe that guy's memory kit win silicon lottery. But still it might be a bug of recognize latency of Renoir, cuz Renoir is not fully support by AIDA64 yet...... But OTOH the FCLK is pretty real.
With those timings and memory clocks the latency is somewhat believable.
 
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AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
13,444
2,292
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Though this is an old topic that had no update since last year but I think this topic is still suitable to place some leaks here.



View attachment 24190

this guy running 8C Renoir with fclk2100 memory, seems they implied 4000mhz is easy.


emmm ok there is another one in same thread:

(the guy who leak this one said he turned off igfx before testing AIDA64 then result in 49ns)

View attachment 24192

Where does it say FCLK 2100MHz ??
 

Asterox

Senior member
May 15, 2012
370
413
136
Yes, but only if Renoir APU/AM4 will jump into any older AM4 motherboards.

B450 is main target, i use B450 motherboard and aiming at Ryzen 3 4200GE.


2020-06-26_184527.jpg
 

ttechf

Senior member
Jun 11, 2012
351
12
81
I too am waiting for the 4700G, but I've heard and read numerous articles that it's now renamed the Ryzen 7 Pro 4750G? It's either that or there will both be the 4700G and Pro 4750G. But the more alarming thing I've heard is that these high end APUs won't be available for regular consumers and more integrated builders and prebuilts. I hope this isn't the case. If anyone can say differently, I'd love to hear it as I don't want to give my hopes up waiting for nothing.

EDIT : Now that I am reading more it seems that there will be PRO and NON Pro versions? But who knows. I just finished reading this article - https://www.wepc.com/news/3dmark-listings-amd-ryzen-pro-4750g-4650g-4350g-apus/

Thanks!
 
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moinmoin

Golden Member
Jun 1, 2017
1,767
1,753
106
That's an interesting automatic balancing between latency and bandwidth. So essentially in effect starting with Renoir AMD is applying Zen 2's fine tuned core frequency algorithm to the different memory domains as well.

The three examples focus on Renoir being an APU, with the iGPU being the bandwidth sensitive example. It will be interesting to see if this tech is still also applied to the next GPU-less Zen 3 CPUs. I'm expecting that to be the case, with the use of e.g. memory bandwidth sensitive AVX instructions making the memory domains switch frequency accordingly.

Such behaviors could be tested on Renoir already, does anybody know of reviews that took a detailed look at that area (considering the shared image is from AMD's reviewer guide, so all reviewers equipped by AMD already know this)?
 
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dark zero

Platinum Member
Jun 2, 2015
2,541
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Sorry if I am late, but I know that Athlon got revived, but AMD has plans to make Sempron or Duron come back? BTW these new chips from AMD makes me think to move to them now.
 

NostaSeronx

Diamond Member
Sep 18, 2011
3,171
677
136
AMD has plans to make Sempron or Duron come back?
Official answer is no.

Duron and Turion were succeeded by Sempron. Thus, leads to below:

Unofficial answer is Sempron FX/One might potentially be a thing;
sFX => Unlocked PPT (OEM-decided(BGA socket) or User-decided(PGA socket))
sONE => Locked PPT of at most 18W.

However, it won't be Zen but a from-scratch module architecture that scales across GlobalFoundries Advanced FDX nodes (12FDX -> 10FDX -> 7FDX).
 
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Asterox

Senior member
May 15, 2012
370
413
136
Very intresting, but it is kind of expected because of Renoir APU monolithic design.


https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/hkxigg

Hm, 8/16 65W R7 4700G has higher Cinebech R20 score vs R7 3800X.

 
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DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
16,352
5,266
136
That's interesting. Wonder if the 4700G got anywhere near 88W during that CBR20 run?
 

VirtualLarry

Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
48,792
5,302
126
Wow, 4700GE @ 35W TDP and still being an 8C/16T with 8CU, really intrigues me, for a DeskMini A300 build. I've been thinking (actually, more than thinking, I purchased a 6U mining server shell from Newegg recently) about separating out my mining activities (building a dedicated 6/8-GPU mining rig), from my daily desktop usage, which could easily be accomplished with one of these new Renoir APUs on a DeskMini.

I could then sell off my three "huge" (*not really) gaming PCs, for appropriate prices, after I remove all storage drives from them. (And remove the GPUs for mining with.)

Edit: The only thing that gives me a bit of pause, is if AMD updates their chipset lineup, with something like an "A500" chipset, that supported PCI-E 4.0 x4 for the NVMe port. Of course, given appropriate firmware, they could probably do that already on their DeskMini A300 line, but would have to be supported by AGESA mods from AMD, I guess.

Anyways, that would be my ultimate "casual" desktop PC, an 8C/16T Renoir, @ 35W TDP, with a PCI-E 4.0 NVMe SSD installed. Just because. :)
 
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