When is the US going to collapse?

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Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,326
6,039
126
I am curious when you guys think that the United States will collapse and food shortages will take place and violance and starvation that kills millions?

Obviously, the country is on a unsustainable path for financial suicide.

This isn't a troll, just jenuinly courious what Americans think here.

The concern over the end is a projection of your own death wish and the death wish of millions who all conspire unconsciously to create the conditions that lead to such an end.

A hidden psychological truth, unknown to those who do not know themselves, is that we create what we fear.

The psychological mechanism by which that happens, although it is useless to tell you since you don't have the fundamentals to understand, is that you died psychically as a child from trauma which is now deeply deeply repressed. This creates a force of gravity that impels you to get close to the feelings that are repressed from that trauma, because your life ended there and you are unconsciously trying to get it back, so instead you create emotional catastrophes, again unconsciously, so you can experience similar emotions vicariously.

For example, you may relive your feelings of rejection from your Mother's love, by getting into relationship. Suddenly you feel loved again. Then you being the 'tests' Can you love me now? How about now, until you alienate the other person. Then you get to wallow again in feeling rejected but without facing the real cause and memory of when you learned you were worthless and unlovable.

We destroy the world, the environment, create war after war, for the same reason. We need to get near death, we think, to get back our lost life.

The answer, the answer to everything, of course, is to relive and remember what happened and see, from the real knowledge of what really happened, that it was all a lie. There was never anything wrong with you at all. The sickness was all in your Mother who could not raise you otherwise because she couldn't take your love in.

See how actually hearing what is really going on, the real truth you have not ever heard and will not likely ever hear again, does you absolutely no good? This is why the real truth is always hidden. You are hiding it from yourself.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,894
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Learn to spell, dammit! Quote:
Originally Posted by Mithan
I am curious when you guys think that the United States will collapse and food shortages will take place and violance and starvation that kills millions?

Obviously, the country is on a unsustainable path for financial suicide.

This isn't a troll, just jenuinly courious what Americans think here.


If you want your posts/threads to be taken seriously learn to at least spell. You probably have automatic spell checking going on (I do), so use it (right click underlined words and pick the one with correct spelling. If you don't know what correct spelling is, well, you need remedial English).


If you want your posts/threads to be taken seriously learn to at least spell. You probably have automatic spell checking going on (I do), so use it (right click underlined words and pick the one with correct spelling. If you don't know what correct spelling is, well, you need remedial English).

Maybe he is singing 867-5309 Jenny all the time
 

heyheybooboo

Diamond Member
Jun 29, 2007
6,278
0
0
I have yet to see any of the paperwork done on this. In fact I believe majority of it is in stocks/bonds and publicly funded companies. Yes, than can recall every cent of it if they so desire.

Uhhh, no.

An entity holding a US Treasury note or bond has no right of 'recall'. The holder of that note has one right: to receive the defined interest on the principle amount as stated on the bond or note.

Interestingly enough, the holder of the note or bond does not even have the right to hold the bond or note to maturity. The US Treasury generally reserves the right (as stated on the face of the bond) to call the bond or note early - the only right that the holder has is that the Treasury is required to announce its intent to your 'call' four months before the call date.


This thread is a hoot. And US Treasury securities are recognized as the safest investment available in the world.


I predict the US will have an accumulated GDP over the next 75 years of $2,644 trillion and that less than 2% of that total will be used to pay for social security and medicare.

Of that total accumulated $2,644 trillion GDP, Walmart will be responsible for 63% of it and the 340 direct heirs of Sam Walton will control 87% of the total net worth (somewhere around $14,350 trillion) of the United States.

May you be one of the select lucky few to join that gene pool.



-
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,085
5,618
126
"Collapse" is unlikely, but possible. Decline is inevitable, but not necessarily soon. It all depends whether People are willing to meet the Challenges facing them.
 

nobodyknows

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2008
5,474
0
0
I thought it was going to collapse at the millineum, but miracuoulsy we made it through. Now I hear the end of the world is going to be 2012 when all the planet line up? I guess what difference does it make if we all die broke or rich?? Dead is dead.
 

HannibalX

Diamond Member
May 12, 2000
9,361
2
0
I am curious when you guys think that the United States will collapse and food shortages will take place and violance and starvation that kills millions?

Obviously, the country is on a unsustainable path for financial suicide.

This isn't a troll, just jenuinly courious what Americans think here.

In the year 3000...
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
76
2012 - didn't you see the movie ? Damn and I worked so hard on that :(

Seriously I have to wonder if their isn't some secret race in government to see who can do the most damage in the shortest amount of time.
 

Siddhartha

Lifer
Oct 17, 1999
12,502
1
81
The fundementals the US had before the start of WWII are still in placed. Lots of farmland, natural resources, and a multitalented workforce.

So I do not see mass starvation happening here unless it is purposely caused. What the country needs is bring back as much manufacturing onshore as possible. That would boister the middleclass, lower the deficit, etc.
 

alphatarget1

Diamond Member
Dec 9, 2001
5,710
0
76
What the country needs is bring back as much manufacturing onshore as possible. That would boister the middleclass, lower the deficit, etc.

QFT. It saddens me that the productive states like Ohio and Michigan are in such bad shape. Whereas people in places like urban NY and CA got rich from speculating (which doesn't creat real wealth) and made bank at the expense of ordinary hard working Americans.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
In the year 2525. If man is still alive.

I like Siddhartha's plan, bring back the manufacturing even if it means we can buy fewer things. I don't see a collapse except that at some point we will be forced to live within our means, when foreign countries and corporations get too nervous to roll over their US T-bills. I can see some lean years there when we lose our AAA rating and face a budget shortfall, but we do have a lot of natural resources; perhaps some day we'll be able to use our own oil reserves. I doubt there are any American oil companies left at that point, but foreign companies can pump it for us.
 

allthatisman

Senior member
Dec 21, 2008
542
0
0
I am reasonably certain that if Americans stopped watching the news and stayed away from the internet for a solid month we, as a society (without Obama's credit card advance) would spend our way out of this "recession". At least here in Sacramento, I go out to dinner on a WEDNESDAY, and you would never know that "bad times were upon us"... this has been the case since the onset of the recession. His "cash for caulkers" plan, as they are calling it, is going to buy me half of the air conditioner for my house that I was going to buy anyway.

Stop the handouts, kill the doomsday speak, and Americans will go back to work... naturally. Oh and please, don't tell me there aren't any jobs out there... my buddy has changed/promoted three times in last 18 months, and so have I. No one will take a job at a warehouse or gas station because the governement will pay them more not to, THAT is the problem.
 

boomerang

Lifer
Jun 19, 2000
18,890
642
126
I am reasonably certain that if Americans stopped watching the news and stayed away from the internet for a solid month we, as a society (without Obama's credit card advance) would spend our way out of this "recession". At least here in Sacramento, I go out to dinner on a WEDNESDAY, and you would never know that "bad times were upon us"... this has been the case since the onset of the recession. His "cash for caulkers" plan, as they are calling it, is going to buy me half of the air conditioner for my house that I was going to buy anyway.

Stop the handouts, kill the doomsday speak, and Americans will go back to work... naturally. Oh and please, don't tell me there aren't any jobs out there... my buddy has changed/promoted three times in last 18 months, and so have I. No one will take a job at a warehouse or gas station because the governement will pay them more not to, THAT is the problem.
There's a whole lotta truth in this post. If you tell people often enough that things are bad, they eventually think things are bad. I would not agree totally however. Until small businesses know what their expenses are going to be, they're sitting and waiting to see what shakes out. The potential for increased costs associated with health care, cap and trade, etc. are paralyzing them to a great extent.

In regards to the U.S. collapsing, I read today that revenues are down 48% this year and that we are borrowing $0.52 for every $1 we spend. I would hope that even the most ardent supporters of this administration realize that this is unsustainable. I don't think we'll make it through 2010 unless we do an about face very soon. It most likely is too late already.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
There's a whole lotta truth in this post. If you tell people often enough that things are bad, they eventually think things are bad. I would not agree totally however. Until small businesses know what their expenses are going to be, they're sitting and waiting to see what shakes out. The potential for increased costs associated with health care, cap and trade, etc. are paralyzing them to a great extent.

In regards to the U.S. collapsing, I read today that revenues are down 48% this year and that we are borrowing $0.52 for every $1 we spend. I would hope that even the most ardent supporters of this administration realize that this is unsustainable. I don't think we'll make it through 2010 unless we do an about face very soon. It most likely is too late already.
The media will begin telling us how much better things are as the 2010 election cycle heats up, never fear. You're exactly right about business being paralyzed at the moment; in addition to what you mentioned, Obama has also said he wants to completely revamp our regulatory and tax structures.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
83,716
47,399
136
I am reasonably certain that if Americans stopped watching the news and stayed away from the internet for a solid month we, as a society (without Obama's credit card advance) would spend our way out of this "recession". At least here in Sacramento, I go out to dinner on a WEDNESDAY, and you would never know that "bad times were upon us"... this has been the case since the onset of the recession. His "cash for caulkers" plan, as they are calling it, is going to buy me half of the air conditioner for my house that I was going to buy anyway.

Stop the handouts, kill the doomsday speak, and Americans will go back to work... naturally. Oh and please, don't tell me there aren't any jobs out there... my buddy has changed/promoted three times in last 18 months, and so have I. No one will take a job at a warehouse or gas station because the governement will pay them more not to, THAT is the problem.

Guys, don't let your macroeconomic data get you down, I have an anecdote about how my friend is doing well!

The only thing that is more baffling than this post's ignorance is the pride with which it's said.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
What do you mean by collapse?

USA can never collapse like some third world shit hole we have too many workers, intelligence and improved/high value assets like farms, machinery, and coal.

But we will slowly decline if stranglehold of bankers and govt doesn't get off our necks.

Some signs are:
-FDIC broke, Pension Guarnetee Corp broke, FHA broke, FNM broke all sucking teet.
-Construction down 80%, auto sales down 50%, tax receipts down 44%.
-Cities, schools, counties and states all broke firing workers and raising taxes.
-Layoffs skyrocking and job market crashing.
-Regional Bank, business and personal bankruptcies and loan defaults exploded to levels never seen before - following trajectory, we are on our way to universal insolvency.
-Earning of corps are almost universally negative and small businesses too.


Volker said economy is structurally broken and until we address this we will continue downward spiral into less and less with a few up top hold all the marbles.
 

Wreckem

Diamond Member
Sep 23, 2006
9,458
987
126
2032 is when the US will start its decent into failing "empire" that will last 10-15 years. It will bottom out and the US will be a shell of what it once was. That shell will still be a 1st world country though.
 

Svnla

Lifer
Nov 10, 2003
17,999
1,396
126
I don't think the US will "collapse" but will not be a #1 Superpower anymore, just like the Rome Empire, Spain, France, Britain, et al.

Look at the history of those former superpowers and look at us now and you will see:

* Excessive spending/borrrowing
* Relying on goods from oversea
* Far away conflicts/wars
* Internal corruption/bad government
* People are getting lazy
* Entitlement mentality
* Lack of investment inside the country/spending money oversea to build up remote areas

and so on.

I am wondering who will take over as #1 Superpower in the future?

China? India? not likely due to too many mouths to feed and lack of natural resources.

EU? Too many chiefs and not enough indians.

Who will it be?? Stay tuned.
 

zeruty

Platinum Member
Jan 17, 2000
2,276
2
81
I am curious when you guys think that the United States will collapse and food shortages will take place and violance and starvation that kills millions?

Obviously, the country is on a unsustainable path for financial suicide.

This isn't a troll, just jenuinly courious what Americans think here.

I believe this will occur when our public education system becomes unable to educate our youth on proper spelling and grammar.
 

zeruty

Platinum Member
Jan 17, 2000
2,276
2
81
You're watching it before your very eyes.

It started a slow decent with Reagan and is falling off a cliff thanks to Bush Jr.

Jury out if the Messiah and his buds can save it but doubtful with all the damage done by Bush & Co.

If Bush Jr had it wobbling on the edge, Obama & Co. shot it off into the abyss with a canon.
 

zeruty

Platinum Member
Jan 17, 2000
2,276
2
81
We are very dependent on the uninterrupted flow of oil. If that stops:

- Farming stops
- Transport of food stops
- Transport of other energy sources (coal via rail, uranium, etc) stops

Without electricity and transportation, food prices will skyrocket, businesses will shut down, and mass panic and starvation will drive people to violence particularly in larger cities.

This would only happen with a sharp cutoff of oil, though. That could happen with a "perfect storm" of conditions, for example the following:

- Massive natural or man-made disasters (hurricane, earthquake, terrorism) destroy US refining capacity
- War erupts in oil-exporting countries (Venezuela is already there; if Russia and the Middle East went to war, that would knock off a lot more production)

Disasters can happen at any time, and the ME is always on the brink of war...

If the flow of ME oil were to stop, there would be some drastic changes to be taken:

  • Severe rationing of consumer fuel
  • Dedication of as much fuel as necessary to transporting other fuel, food, and military purposes.
  • A MASSIVE push to begin more domestic drilling (we should be doing this anyways)
  • People finally realizing we NEED to build more refining capacity within the US
  • A drastic expansion of public transportation. I would consider taking the bus if it wasn't completely inconvenient and take 3-4 hours out of my day.
  • Politically force America's Hat to dedicate their energy exports to the US.
 

TruePaige

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2006
9,878
2
0
If the flow of ME oil were to stop, there would be some drastic changes to be taken:

  • Severe rationing of consumer fuel
  • Dedication of as much fuel as necessary to transporting other fuel, food, and military purposes.
  • A MASSIVE push to begin more domestic drilling (we should be doing this anyways)
  • People finally realizing we NEED to build more refining capacity within the US
  • A drastic expansion of public transportation. I would consider taking the bus if it wasn't completely inconvenient and take 3-4 hours out of my day.
  • Politically force America's Hat to dedicate their energy exports to the US.

Wow, and not one mention of electric power to replace oil based applications.

...
 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
17,844
1
0
I think there's a high probability that it will take a very long time for it to fade away. Take Rome. Lots of people say it fell in the centuries following Christ but the Byzantine Empire, the Holy Roman Empire, and even Russian Tzars considered themselves the continuation of Rome. I could see something similar happening to the US. The name and legal trappings could survive longer than our current conception of what America is.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,378
7,443
136
The fundementals the US had before the start of WWII are still in placed. Lots of farmland, natural resources, and a multitalented workforce.

So I do not see mass starvation happening here unless it is purposely caused. What the country needs is bring back as much manufacturing onshore as possible. That would boister the middleclass, lower the deficit, etc.

We also had half the population.