When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: XxPrOdiGyxX
If there were other students who had concealed weapons and used them in this incident how would the students necessarily know who is the good guy and who is the bad guy if a bunch of them pull out guns? How will the cops necessarily know? I am not saying this is what would definitely happen, but I would imagine that in a situation like this it is somewhat difficult to think clearly and know exactly what is going on and what to do.

Can someone answer this man's question?
I think it's a fair question.

If I shoot attempt to shoot someone, and he kills me with his gun, how can someone tell who the assailant is?
Won't people automatically assume that the person dead on the floor is the victim and not the assailant?

Well then there'll be 2 dead instead of 32. Sounds ok to me.

The correct procedure, fyi, would be take down the threat, secure the area, contact emergency services (by phone or messenger), and lay your weapon down before police arrive. It isn't rocket science.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Lothar
Allowing students to carry guns on campus is the most idiotic thing I've ever heard.

I don't see any good reason for carrying a gun around campus, maybe a can of good pepper spray?

But what about a place for gun lovers to store a gun so they can go shooting/hunting in their free time?

As long as it stays off campus, they can do what they want with it.

How about the trunk of their car?

My previous post already answers this question.
That depends on where the car is.

LOL, I'm not going to bother reading the whole thread.

I guessing if it's parked in the campus parking lot you don't think it should be there. I have to disagree with you then.

How do you enforce such a law, search everyone's car every day?

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: WHAMPOM
29 confirmed.

Originally posted by: Lothar
Allowing students to carry guns on campus is the most idiotic thing I've ever heard.

That's too bad because maybe if one of those 29 was packing the number wouldn't be 29.

That's pretty much nonsense.
If student was packing a gun I can guarantee you that there will be a shooting incident at least once every 2 week.
Sure 29 students won't die in one day like today, but the total deaths from guns will either still be the same (or may even end up higher) by the end of the year.
How many students on campus has died from guns at VA Tech this year?

Like was said earlier most college students aren't mature enough.
People will shoot while drunk, shoot the boyfriend their ex is going out with, and shoot teachers who gave them bad grades.

Hell, since I've been going to this school for 5 years now there has been numerous suicides...
1.) A student jumped from the School of Business.
2.) A student jumped from the School of Engineering.
3.) A medical school student stabbed himself to death because of class stress and also girlfriend issues.
4.) A lesbian student jumped from the 9th floor of my dormitory because she saw her partner talking to another girl and was jealous. This was particularly disgusting as I saw the blood stains and the head separated from the body on this one as I was entering the dormitory.
5.) A male student jumped from the 10th floor of the opposite dormitory to the one above because his girl dumped him for one of his friends.

In each of those cases, I would prefer if such mentally unstable idiots keep jumping off buildings killing themselves and no one else than to be parading around with guns in my dormitory or school department.

In Washington State a couple hundred thousand people carry a concealed gun every day, including students like me.

The total number of shootings by a CPL holder over the last 55 years is 1. Not 1 every two weeks, 1. Period. There are more violent crimes committed by law enforcement officers than by concealed weapon holders. Furthermore these laws are VERY new and in the past there weren't shootings even when people carried on campus.

The ONLY thing allowing already licensed people to carry on campus would do is give them a fighting chance when these shootings occur.

Awesome, thanks for the data on your state.

Sounds like Washington is the model from which every state should be following.

Everyone arm up. :thumbsup:

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
My grandpa used to bring his gun to school when he was in 6th grade. No school shootings then...in fact, it wasn't until all schools were "Gun Free" that we started to have school shootings.

God your making feel old. When I went to school almost everyone with a car had at least one gun in it. Usually two and sometimes three or more.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Lothar
Allowing students to carry guns on campus is the most idiotic thing I've ever heard.

I don't see any good reason for carrying a gun around campus, maybe a can of good pepper spray?

But what about a place for gun lovers to store a gun so they can go shooting/hunting in their free time?

As long as it stays off campus, they can do what they want with it.

How about the trunk of their car?

My previous post already answers this question.
That depends on where the car is.

LOL, I'm not going to bother reading the whole thread.

I guessing if it's parked in the campus parking lot you don't think it should be there. I have to disagree with you then.

How do you enforce such a law, search everyone's car every day?

Most schools offer storage options, or allow it in the cars. I check mine into the security office every morning, pick it up every night. Well, I did. I've already sent a notice to the director of security and the president of the school that I will no longer surrender my weapon to be made a victim. They can allow me my rights or they can assign an armed officer as a bodyguard. Otherwise I'm suing. I won't win probably, but I'll do it to make the point, then I'll leave school.

 

[imported_Lothar]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: XxPrOdiGyxX
If there were other students who had concealed weapons and used them in this incident how would the students necessarily know who is the good guy and who is the bad guy if a bunch of them pull out guns? How will the cops necessarily know? I am not saying this is what would definitely happen, but I would imagine that in a situation like this it is somewhat difficult to think clearly and know exactly what is going on and what to do.

Can someone answer this man's question?
I think it's a fair question.

If I shoot attempt to shoot someone, and he kills me with his gun, how can someone tell who the assailant is?
Won't people automatically assume that the person dead on the floor is the victim and not the assailant?

Well then there'll be 2 dead instead of 32. Sounds ok to me.

The correct procedure, fyi, would be take down the threat, secure the area, contact emergency services (by phone or messenger), and lay your weapon down before police arrive. It isn't rocket science.

Are you saying only CCW holders should be allowed to carry a gun or EVERY student should be allowed to carry a gun?
There's a BIG difference between the two.

I was arguing with someone else who believes the later.
What is your position?

If your position isn't that EVERY student be allowed to carry a gun, then we don't have disagreements.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Lothar
Allowing students to carry guns on campus is the most idiotic thing I've ever heard.

I don't see any good reason for carrying a gun around campus, maybe a can of good pepper spray?

But what about a place for gun lovers to store a gun so they can go shooting/hunting in their free time?

As long as it stays off campus, they can do what they want with it.

How about the trunk of their car?

My previous post already answers this question.
That depends on where the car is.

LOL, I'm not going to bother reading the whole thread.

I guessing if it's parked in the campus parking lot you don't think it should be there. I have to disagree with you then.

How do you enforce such a law, search everyone's car every day?

Most schools offer storage options, or allow it in the cars. I check mine into the security office every morning, pick it up every night. Well, I did. I've already sent a notice to the director of security and the president of the school that I will no longer surrender my weapon to be made a victim. They can allow me my rights or they can assign an armed officer as a bodyguard. Otherwise I'm suing. I won't win probably, but I'll do it to make the point, then I'll leave school.

I could live with a secure storage location as long as it was handy, or the trunk of my car. When I went to college (for a short time) I had my deer rifle and shotgun in my dorm room, but things have changed. Bust as Blanco ponted out, back then nobody shot each other. Society is sick and getting sicker by the day it seems. It seems people's egos have grown faster then there common sense???

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: XxPrOdiGyxX
If there were other students who had concealed weapons and used them in this incident how would the students necessarily know who is the good guy and who is the bad guy if a bunch of them pull out guns? How will the cops necessarily know? I am not saying this is what would definitely happen, but I would imagine that in a situation like this it is somewhat difficult to think clearly and know exactly what is going on and what to do.

Can someone answer this man's question?
I think it's a fair question.

If I shoot attempt to shoot someone, and he kills me with his gun, how can someone tell who the assailant is?
Won't people automatically assume that the person dead on the floor is the victim and not the assailant?

Well then there'll be 2 dead instead of 32. Sounds ok to me.

The correct procedure, fyi, would be take down the threat, secure the area, contact emergency services (by phone or messenger), and lay your weapon down before police arrive. It isn't rocket science.

Are you saying only CCW holders should be allowed to carry a gun or EVERY student should be allowed to carry a gun?
There's a BIG difference between the two.

I was arguing with someone else who believes the later.
What is your position?

If your position isn't that EVERY student be allowed to carry a gun, then we don't have disagreements.

Well, that's a little silly, since most people can already carry. My view is that every adult should be able to carry pretty much everywhere after being licensed (thru a simple, fair, and inexpensive manner).

 

[6000SUX]

The easy answer, if you're worried about gun violence, is for no one to carry guns. Guess how many mass shootings Britain has on their school campuses?

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Lothar
Allowing students to carry guns on campus is the most idiotic thing I've ever heard.

I don't see any good reason for carrying a gun around campus, maybe a can of good pepper spray?

But what about a place for gun lovers to store a gun so they can go shooting/hunting in their free time?

As long as it stays off campus, they can do what they want with it.

How about the trunk of their car?

My previous post already answers this question.
That depends on where the car is.

LOL, I'm not going to bother reading the whole thread.

I guessing if it's parked in the campus parking lot you don't think it should be there. I have to disagree with you then.

How do you enforce such a law, search everyone's car every day?

Most schools offer storage options, or allow it in the cars. I check mine into the security office every morning, pick it up every night. Well, I did. I've already sent a notice to the director of security and the president of the school that I will no longer surrender my weapon to be made a victim. They can allow me my rights or they can assign an armed officer as a bodyguard. Otherwise I'm suing. I won't win probably, but I'll do it to make the point, then I'll leave school.

I could live with a secure storage location as long as it was handy, or the trunk of my car. When I went to college (for a short time) I had my deer rifle and shotgun in my dorm room, but things have changed. Bust as Blanco ponted out, back then nobody shot each other. Society is sick and getting sicker by the day it seems. It seems people's egos have grown faster then there common sense???

I can no longer accept this as an option. Having it in the security office or in my car wouldn't have given me any options if the shooting had been on my campus. Instead I would have been just one more sheep for the slaughter, and I'm allergic to wool. Nope, no more. I carry everywhere. Period. Or someone else has to provide armed protection. That is, until the social issues that cause these crimes are addressed and solved so that I no longer feel the need to be armed.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: 6000SUX
The easy answer, if you're worried about gun violence, is for no one to carry guns. Guess how many mass shootings Britain has on their school campuses?

Easy to say, nearly impossible to implement in America.

 

[6000SUX]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands
Most schools offer storage options, or allow it in the cars. I check mine into the security office every morning, pick it up every night. Well, I did. I've already sent a notice to the director of security and the president of the school that I will no longer surrender my weapon to be made a victim. They can allow me my rights or they can assign an armed officer as a bodyguard. Otherwise I'm suing. I won't win probably, but I'll do it to make the point, then I'll leave school.

You made inconsistent statements. If you lose in court, you will have discovered that you didn't have the rights you thought you had.

 

[kmmatney]

I'm in the UK right now, where this is big news. I've spent time in Uk and Japan, and you can have a society function perfectly fine without guns. However the UK had a very low murder rate before all the gun laws took effect.

Mexico does have a higher murder rate than the US, but a lot of it is non-gun related.

Here is a good site with a lot of stats either way. Pretty interesting - Norway and Finland have a high rate of gun ownership, but low gun homicide rates.

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvinco.html

The U.S, has the highest gun homicide rate for every country with gun stats, except N. Ireland. It basically looks like gun homiocide has more to do with social issues, rather than gun ownership, but I'd still like it harder for people to have guns...

 

[lozina]

This incident just goes to show how dangerous it is to try and make a "gun-free zone". You disarm the people who follow laws and beleive in morals, so that when the idiot comes along who manages to illegaly obtain and smuggle a gun, everyone else is helpless.

Yes but now they can push their Nazi-style anti-gun laws they had sitting on the shelf waiting for an event such as this.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Originally posted by: 6000SUX

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands
Most schools offer storage options, or allow it in the cars. I check mine into the security office every morning, pick it up every night. Well, I did. I've already sent a notice to the director of security and the president of the school that I will no longer surrender my weapon to be made a victim. They can allow me my rights or they can assign an armed officer as a bodyguard. Otherwise I'm suing. I won't win probably, but I'll do it to make the point, then I'll leave school.

You made inconsistent statements. If you lose in court, you will have discovered that you didn't have the rights you thought you had.

Wrong. Courts don't grant rights, they merely affirm or infringe upon the rights you already have. Rights are inherent in humans. To say otherwise declares absolutely that blacks were actually property without rights for the period of time that courts declared it so. That statement is not just abhorrent, it's incorrect. Law isn't justice.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: 6000SUX
The easy answer, if you're worried about gun violence, is for no one to carry guns. Guess how many mass shootings Britain has on their school campuses?

Guess how much smaller of a country Britain is? Guess how many school shootings Switzerland has too?

Even if it doesn't make a different, it's the principle of the matter. There's no reason that responsible people shouldn't be allowed to protect themselves. Having a gun sitting inside a backpack isn't hurting anybody...it's how it's used. If I'm planning to shoot up the school, do you really think I'm not going to do it because it's against school policy?

 

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: 6000SUX
The easy answer, if you're worried about gun violence, is for no one to carry guns. Guess how many mass shootings Britain has on their school campuses?

And we see how well "Gun free" zones work dont we.
Britian still has crime. Dont be naive. You can change the weapon of the crime, but you cant stop crime itself.

To blame the weapon for the crime is pretty silly.

 

[imported_Lothar]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands

Originally posted by: Lothar

Originally posted by: XxPrOdiGyxX
If there were other students who had concealed weapons and used them in this incident how would the students necessarily know who is the good guy and who is the bad guy if a bunch of them pull out guns? How will the cops necessarily know? I am not saying this is what would definitely happen, but I would imagine that in a situation like this it is somewhat difficult to think clearly and know exactly what is going on and what to do.

Can someone answer this man's question?
I think it's a fair question.

If I shoot attempt to shoot someone, and he kills me with his gun, how can someone tell who the assailant is?
Won't people automatically assume that the person dead on the floor is the victim and not the assailant?

Well then there'll be 2 dead instead of 32. Sounds ok to me.

The correct procedure, fyi, would be take down the threat, secure the area, contact emergency services (by phone or messenger), and lay your weapon down before police arrive. It isn't rocket science.

Are you saying only CCW holders should be allowed to carry a gun or EVERY student should be allowed to carry a gun?
There's a BIG difference between the two.

I was arguing with someone else who believes the later.
What is your position?

If your position isn't that EVERY student be allowed to carry a gun, then we don't have disagreements.

Well, that's a little silly, since most people can already carry.

My view is that every adult should be able to carry pretty much everywhere after being licensed (thru a simple, fair, and inexpensive manner).

Yes, but not legally. AFAIK, most campuses don't allow it.
Just like some teenagers can already drive without a license. States don't allow it, but people can still do it without getting into accidents and without authorities knowing it.
Just look at illegals. For every illegal pulled over, there are tens more driving without being licensed and not being noticed.

Campus police can't check the trunk of every campus vehicle for guns, and Police can't pull every car over to check for drivers license.
Are driver's licenses a little silly now?

Your view differentiates between licensed vs unlincensed.
We don't have any disagreements.
The person's post I originally quoted in this thread doesn't differentiate between the two.

 

[eleison]

check out the abc poll(http://abcnews.go.com/):

too bad there isn't an option for conceal carry.. but then that's the liberal media for you :-(

-------------------------------------------
There are at least 29 confirmed dead in the shooting at Virginia Tech University, making it the worst campus shooting in American history. Law enforcement officials believe the gunman was firing at least two 9mm semi-automatic pistols.

Do you think this incident is a reason to pass stricter gun control legislation?
1)Yes. This shows the violence that can occur when someone has access to handguns.
2)No. Violent shootings are isolated incidents and it's irresponsible to link them to gun control.
3)I'm not sure. I need more information.

 

[6000SUX]

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: 6000SUX
The easy answer, if you're worried about gun violence, is for no one to carry guns. Guess how many mass shootings Britain has on their school campuses?

And we see how well "Gun free" zones work dont we.
Britian still has crime. Dont be naive. You can change the weapon of the crime, but you cant stop crime itself.

To blame the weapon for the crime is pretty silly.

Just pointing out the obvious: remove guns from the equation and you don't have mass shootings. :disgust:

 

[totalcommand]

hey arsefaces here who say gun carrying students would've solved this problem. how many police were out there WITH guns and couldn't solve the problem for two hours?

 

[OrganizedChaos]

saw a great quote today.

"Virginia Tech is an example of gun control at its best. No one but the bad guy had a gun"

 

[Conky]

Originally posted by: 6000SUX

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: 6000SUX
The easy answer, if you're worried about gun violence, is for no one to carry guns. Guess how many mass shootings Britain has on their school campuses?

And we see how well "Gun free" zones work dont we.
Britian still has crime. Dont be naive. You can change the weapon of the crime, but you cant stop crime itself.

To blame the weapon for the crime is pretty silly.

Just pointing out the obvious: remove guns from the equation and you don't have mass shootings. :disgust:

Why not just cut the index fingers off of everybody's hands instead? Without trigger-fingers there can be no mass shootings either. :roll:

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: 6000SUX

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: 6000SUX
The easy answer, if you're worried about gun violence, is for no one to carry guns. Guess how many mass shootings Britain has on their school campuses?

And we see how well "Gun free" zones work dont we.
Britian still has crime. Dont be naive. You can change the weapon of the crime, but you cant stop crime itself.

To blame the weapon for the crime is pretty silly.

Just pointing out the obvious: remove guns from the equation and you don't have mass shootings. :disgust:

No, then someone would resort to little homemade pipebombs or maybe poison darts?

Your point?

 

[Conky]

Originally posted by: OrganizedChaos
saw a great quote today.

"Virginia Tech is an example of gun control at its best. No one but the bad guy had a gun"

Nice quote. :thumbsup:

But lawmakers will not learn from this lesson and will no doubt further restrict the rights of law abiding citizens.

Hows this for a new law... maybe they should make it illegal for a person to shoot and kill other people. :laugh: