UN solution for the North Korea problem

[hal2kilo]

The number of people on an internet message board that hold an opinion about an issue is irrelevant as to if it's right or not. If you took that standard, according to internet message boards pikachu is probably real.

You realize that this is the person that says Fox must be doing the right thing because of their ratings. What can I say.

 

[fskimospy]

Actually, I can argue back. If you think having some "friend", who you admitted never said they need more aid money", is your I-WIN card, then you are sadly mistaken.

Here is my argument:

North Korea is bad. They do bad things with their money. They invest heavily in their military and leave their populace to rot. Naturally, giving them more money would worsen the situation. UN aid is bad. More aid is worse, especially when some of that is my tax money.

Cant argue back, lol. So tough to argue against North Korea aid money. How will I ever form a thesis?

What are you babbling about, and where did I 'admit' that? Again, he's not my friend. His view is absolutely that we should continue to give North Korea aid. I only didn't want to speak to the specifics of his opinions because I'm not him.

Your argument about North Korea being 'bad' is irrelevant. It's an emotional argument that has no place in a real conversation about international relations. North Korea being bad or good doesn't matter, the only question is what policy brings the greatest benefit to the United States at the lowest cost. Once you understand that, this will all make a lot more sense.

 

[fskimospy]

You realize that this is the person that says Fox must be doing the right thing because of their ratings. What can I say.

I know, I'm almost certainly wasting my time.

Kids these days.

 

[nick1985]

You realize that this is the person that says Fox must be doing the right thing because of their ratings. What can I say.

I called you out before, and you didnt answer. Do you feel North Korea needs aid, and more of it at that?

 

[nick1985]

Your argument about North Korea being 'bad' is irrelevant. It's an emotional argument that has no place in a real conversation about international relations. North Korea being bad or good doesn't matter, the only question is what policy brings the greatest benefit to the United States at the lowest cost. Once you understand that, this will all make a lot more sense.

Its not at all irrelevant. Its completely relevant and the entire crux of the debate. They use their funds for nefarious purposes, so giving them more is not a good idea. I'm not sure what kind of benefits you are seeing with the current funding to North Korea. They developed nukes and are extremely belligerent. What kind of results are those? How about we turn off the aid faucet and let them rot. Once you understand that, everything will make a lot more sense. I love talking in a condescending elitist way, its so much fun. Thanks for teaching me how to do it.

 

[nick1985]

I know, I'm almost certainly wasting my time.

Kids these days.

Glad your little lapdop came into this thread to offer you some moral support. He sure is contributing to the discussion.

 

[fskimospy]

Its not at all irrelevant. Its completely relevant and the entire crux of the debate. They use their funds for nefarious purposes, so giving them more is not a good idea. I'm not sure what kind of benefits you are seeing with the current funding to North Korea. They developed nukes and are extremely belligerent. What kind of results are those? How about we turn off the aid faucet and let them rot. Once you understand that, everything will make a lot more sense. I love talking in a condescending elitist way, its so much fun. Thanks for teaching me how to do it.

What you think they use the funds for is only relevant in terms of the cost/benefit analysis for the United States. The goodness or badness of it by itself is meaningless, because this isn't an emotional argument. As I've said numerous times before, we already tried the 'turn off the aid' plan. It failed miserably, so we stopped. He is belligerent within limits, and while it's not a good situation, it's better than the alternative.

I'm condescending to you because I'm getting tired of repeating myself, and you're aggressively, proudly ignorant.

 

[fskimospy]

Glad your little lapdop came into this thread to offer you some moral support. He sure is contributing to the discussion.

Well according to you, his presence makes my viewpoint more valid.

 

[nick1985]

Well according to you, his presence makes my viewpoint more valid.

How, he hasn't said a damn thing about the situation. He just came in to bust my chops, not sure how that validates your claims. Could you explain?

 

[hal2kilo]

I called you out before, and you didnt answer. Do you feel North Korea needs aid, and more of it at that?

If you really want to know what I would want to happen, I think that Kim Ill Jung should mysteriously die and that temporarily through some magical means the head of the military gets a pay bonus. This of course never happened, no ones to blame. Korea suddenly decides to cooperate. Get my drift.

It's ugly but the alternative is even uglier. These things could and have unfortunately created the Sadam Huseins of the world. This of course is for the good of mankind not the United Fruit Company like in the old days. This last sentence you probably won't get.

I think I'll will add this to my quote. I'm a liberal because I'm a realist.

 

[nick1985]

What you think they use the funds for is only relevant in terms of the cost/benefit analysis for the United States. The goodness or badness of it by itself is meaningless, because this isn't an emotional argument. As I've said numerous times before, we already tried the 'turn off the aid' plan. It failed miserably, so we stopped. He is belligerent within limits, and while it's not a good situation, it's better than the alternative.

I'm condescending to you because I'm getting tired of repeating myself, and you're aggressively, proudly ignorant.

What benefits are we seeing with our aid? Please explain. All I see is a nuclear North Korea becoming increasingly belligerent.

And take your condescending tone and shove it. Dont you think I'm tired of repeating myself? Should I start posting like a know-it-all snob too?

 

[nick1985]

It's ugly but the alternative is even uglier.

Whats the alternative? What happens if we stop giving them aid?

When your kids scream, do you give them what they want?

 

[fskimospy]

Whats the alternative? What happens if we stop giving them aid?

When your kids scream, do you give them what they want?

You do realize that George W Bush already tried your strategy, right? He started it in 2002 and abruptly ended it in 2006. Go figure out why.

I don't care if you're tired of repeating yourself, and I would love for you to start posting like a know it all, because hopefully that would force you to know something about what you're talking about first.

 

[hal2kilo]

Whats the alternative? What happens if we stop giving them aid?

When your kids scream, do you give them what they want?

For the time being, enabling the psycho addict, who by the way, has his hands on a nuclear trigger. is better than vaporizing the people of Soeul.

What's with you itchy trigger young'uns. Oops, I didn't mean to be condescending.

 

[nick1985]

You do realize that George W Bush already tried your strategy, right? He started it in 2002 and abruptly ended it in 2006. Go figure out why.

I don't care if you're tired of repeating yourself, and I would love for you to start posting like a know it all, because hopefully that would force you to know something about what you're talking about first.

Lets see what happened with our money when it started flowing in:

"US President George W Bush has authorised $25 million in energy aid to North Korea in response to Pyongyang's progress in complying with its denuclearisation agreement."

http://www.huliq.com/36194/bush-authorises-25m-oil-aid-for-north-korea


25 million well spent. I'm proud to have shelled out cash for that, it worked great. I cant begin to imagine where we would be if we hadn't given them that money. I see your point.

More aid to North Korea please! Whats the paypal address for this aid fund, I'll contribute right now if they can promise these kinds of results!

 

[nick1985]

Also, our aid money has created a booming North Korea. Check it out:

 

[nick1985]

You do realize that George W Bush already tried your strategy, right? He started it in 2002 and abruptly ended it in 2006.

Also, FUD

"On September 19, 2005, North Korea was promised fuel aid and various other non-food incentives from South Korea, the U.S., Japan, Russia, and China in exchange for abandoning its nuclear weapons program and rejoining the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea


For a know-it-all, you don't know it all

 

[hal2kilo]

Lets see what happened with our money when it started flowing in 2007:

"US President George W Bush has authorised $25 million in energy aid to North Korea in response to Pyongyang's progress in complying with its denuclearisation agreement."

http://www.huliq.com/36194/bush-authorises-25m-oil-aid-for-north-korea


25 million well spent. I'm proud to have shelled out cash for that, it worked great. I cant begin to imagine where we would be if we hadn't given them that money. I see your point.

More aid to North Korea please! Whats the paypal address for this aid fund, I'll contribute right now if they can promise these kinds of results!

I' m not sure why I'm pursuing this further and I mean this seriously, but, if it's so important to save all this money and get it over with, why don't you volunteer your services to your nearest military recruiter. From your posts I've seen about the second amendment which I won't participate in, this would be the perfect opportunity for you to use those neat handheld weapons you cherish.

 

[nick1985]

I' m not sure why I'm pursuing this further and I mean this seriously, but, if it's so important to save all this money and get it over with, why don't you volunteer your services to your nearest military recruiter. From your posts I've seen about the second amendment which I won't participate in, this would be the perfect opportunity for you to use those neat handheld weapons you cherish.

I see you lost the debate, offering no counter to any of the above posts, just an another(3rd in this thread) attack on me personally. Thanks for conceding that aid to North Korea is a colossal waste of money.

*edit*

Also, if you are going for the chickenhawk attack on me that really wont get you far. I was in Marine OCS where I sustained a life-altering injury. I'm not afraid to fight for my country.

 

[fskimospy]

Also, FUD

"On September 19, 2005, North Korea was promised fuel aid and various other non-food incentives from South Korea, the U.S., Japan, Russia, and China in exchange for abandoning its nuclear weapons program and rejoining the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea


For a know-it-all, you don't know it all

Literally the day after that statement was made the North Koreans rejected it, and proceeded to test nuclear weapons the next year. At the end of 2006 after the nuclear test the Bush administration re-embraced diplomacy as a way of dealing with North Korea after explicitly rejecting it in the past.

Your pedantry and attempts to 'gotcha' me are stupid, and an even bigger waste of time than the rest of the stuff you've been trying here.

 

[nick1985]

eskimospy, you skipped this post for some reason. I'll throw it at you again hoping for a retort.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30820843&postcount=115

 

[hal2kilo]

I see you lost the debate, offering no counter to any of the above posts, just an another(3rd in this thread) attack on me personally. Thanks for conceding that aid to North Korea is a colossal waste of money.

I conceed, you got the last word (as you will post a follow up to this post ). Must be nice to be like a rock and not let anything sink in. I knew I was wasting my time since my comments don't fit with your agenda. It's not about winning, it's about discussion, which doesn't exist here. That's why I usually, only give sacastic flippant responses. Are you happy now. I'm exhausted.

 

[fskimospy]

eskimospy, you skipped this post for some reason. I'll throw it at you again hoping for a retort.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30820843&postcount=115

I've already responded to the same thing probably about 5 times now. Denuclearization is a goal of US policy there, but it is not the primary goal.

You're just flailing at this point, because your pride is hurt.

 

[fskimospy]

I'm also tired, so I'm going to go to bed as well. Not only that, but I know that nothing I say will change our good friend Nick's opinion in the slightest, because he's not interested in that sort of thing.

 

[nick1985]

Literally the day after that statement was made the North Koreans rejected it,

Day after huh? Got a link?

At the end of 2006 after the nuclear test the Bush administration re-embraced diplomacy as a way of dealing with North Korea after explicitly rejecting it in the past.

And where did that get us? I seem to recall a post about million in aid to get them to stop their nuke programs. Oh yeah, it failed.