UN solution for the North Korea problem

[fskimospy]

Why not? He can sink a warship and the only answer is pay the man. He can shell an island and the only answer is pay the man. I can accept that you can conceive of a line, somewhere, that North Korea could cross and you'd theoretically agree that subsidizing him is not a good idea, but subsidizing him allows North Korea to move that line back. Maybe it's not using ten nukes and holding twenty, maybe he can only use one or two and hold thirty; if he nukes, say, Hyangsan but immediately declares he has thirty or forty more nukes aimed at Seoul and Tokyo and every major city in South Korea and Japan, are you really going to flip and say okay, now he's gone to far? If so, is it just nuclear weapons? Is there also some magical number of people he can kill in a given period that would make you withdraw your support?

Either way, subsidizing him certainly allows him to become more powerful, more quickly.

Nuclear weapons are certainly different, and they have been for a very long time. If North Korea nuked South Korea or anyone else (except for maybe Iran, haha), we would obliterate them either through conventional or nuclear means. What stops people from nuking their opponents now is basically a gentleman's agreement that nukes are off the table until someone uses them. Once they do, all bets are off.

I have no idea the number of people it would take for me to decide that foreign aid was not worth it. It really has far less to do with the number of people and more to do with the circumstances.

 

[bfdd]

Nuclear weapons are certainly different, and they have been for a very long time. If North Korea nuked South Korea or anyone else (except for maybe Iran, haha), we would obliterate them either through conventional or nuclear means. What stops people from nuking their opponents now is basically a gentleman's agreement that nukes are off the table until someone uses them. Once they do, all bets are off.

I have no idea the number of people it would take for me to decide that foreign aid was not worth it. It really has far less to do with the number of people and more to do with the circumstances.

So there are no circumstances until "to late" that you would stop giving aid? I mean every time they receive aid, that's more money and time they can sink into improving their military which they use as a reason for us(the world) to give them aid. So it will be a perpetual cycle until he can eventually overpower SK completely and dominate it. Also, if you think they're magically going to want to play nice what gives you that hint? They haven't for 50+ years, they won't for another 50+ years.

 

[Pocatello]

China is the one who is keeping the N. Korean regime from falling apart. The U.S is also playing the part, if unwillingly. We buy Chinese products, export our jobs to China, making China stronger, and with the extra cash, the Chinese government can prop up N. Korea, which acts as a buffer against American influence. China doesn't want a unified Korea that is friendly to the U.S and right next to its border.

 

[iGas]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what the hell North Korea have to do with SouthEast Asia security?

IMHO, the NK posturing is much larger than most people willing see. NK is being supported by China, and they are creating waves as a distraction/excuse for China to built up arsenal. The built up is needed because they want a share of the world resources that the West have been hogging for decades, and to show that NK/China isn't going to sit idly while American navies run around in area what China deems as its economic interest zone.

[add]
poster above beat me to it.

 

[iGas]

China is the one who is keeping the N. Korean regime from falling apart. The U.S is also playing the part, if unwillingly. We buy Chinese products, export our jobs to China, making China stronger, and with the extra cash, the Chinese government can prop up N. Korea, which acts as a buffer against American influence. China doesn't want a unified Korea that is friendly to the U.S and right next to its border.

Exactamundo

 

[DucatiMonster696]

North Korea's Foreign Policy: I am gonna punch yo ass (SK) in the face until yo punk ass gives me some money for my "necessities". I gotz to provide fo my baby's mama (To be honest am just gonna spend it on some weed to smoke with my homies and maybe save up fo a stolen pistol on the black market to ensure that I can further intimidate yo punk ass and then if need be use that gun to rob yo kids and neighbors.) bitch. /punch

I'll be back in a month fool fo the next round "talks". Cuzz in the end I know yo'z a bitch made lovely human and I can keep on doing what I do punk and yo friends/family/neighbors ain't gonna do nothing bout it.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The mistake being made here by some is that they think they can rationalize and honestly deal with the criminally and non-rational minded leadership of North Korea. A leadership who feels entitled to do as they please when it suits their needs. Putting off the inevitable conflict to free the region and the rest of the world from having to deal with the asshole(s) who run North Korea for the future generation to deal with is cowardly and dangers as North Korea continues to expand it nuclear capability.

 

[fskimospy]

So there are no circumstances until "to late" that you would stop giving aid? I mean every time they receive aid, that's more money and time they can sink into improving their military which they use as a reason for us(the world) to give them aid. So it will be a perpetual cycle until he can eventually overpower SK completely and dominate it. Also, if you think they're magically going to want to play nice what gives you that hint? They haven't for 50+ years, they won't for another 50+ years.

Building up their military to overpower and dominate South Korea is absolutely the last thing they are doing with our aid money. You are thinking of this situation like it's a game of Risk, and it's not. Kim Jong Il is trying to remain in power, nothing more, nothing less. Taking over South Korea isn't even on the radar.

 

[nick1985]

Building up their military to overpower and dominate South Korea is absolutely the last thing they are doing with our aid money.

 

[fskimospy]

Of course I'm serious. You guys have absolutely no clue how international relations really work. This is the problem with politics in general, people feel like they have equally valid opinions about topics they don't understand.

 

[nick1985]

Of course I'm serious.

 

[fskimospy]

Of course you don't understand. Like I said before, you think international relations is like a game of Risk, or a game of Starcraft. That's not how the real world works though, and the sad thing is that you're probably so convinced you're right (based upon nothing) that you'll never try to learn how the world actually works.

 

[nick1985]

Of course you don't understand. Like I said before, you think international relations is like a game of Risk, or a game of Starcraft. That's not how the real world works though, and the sad thing is that you're probably so convinced you're right (based upon nothing) that you'll never try to learn how the world actually works.

Yeah, and you profess from the mountain tops about how you know N Korea doesn't spend their aid money on their military. LOL. You sure are one hell of an expert. I'm sure you have primary sources feeding you that valuable intel. Surely you do, with the tone you talk to others with whom you disagree with, you MUST know something the rest of us knuckle-draggers dont. Us troglodytes just dont get it. We see N Korea with one of the worlds largest militaries and see their citizens starving to death, but we should never think aid money is being diverted to their military. Ever. They do great deeds with it. They NEED the aid money. It helps our foreign policy! Dont you see how well they behave? Lets increase their aid and look like a bitch.

All hail the North Korea expert, eskimospy!

 

[fskimospy]

Yeah, and you profess from the mountain tops about how you know N Korea doesn't spend their aid money on their military. LOL. You sure are one hell of an expert. I'm sure you have primary sources feeding you that valuable intel. Surely you do, with the tone you talk to others with whom you disagree with, you MUST know something the rest of us knuckle-draggers dont. Us troglodytes just dont get it. We see N Korea with one of the worlds largest militaries and see their citizens starving to death, but we should never think aid money is being diverted to their military. Ever. They do great deeds with it. They NEED the aid money. It helps our foreign policy! Dont you see how well they behave? Lets increase their aid and look like a bitch.

All hail the North Korea expert, eskimospy!

They do spend aid money on their military you idiot, but it's not to take over the south. I've already said this several times. While I'm not an expert on them, I know a fair bit about it. I also work with someone several times a week who was recently hired by the CIA to do an analysis on North Korea and assess our options there.

But hey, you're a jackass on a tech website, I'm sure you're equally well informed.

 

[nick1985]

They do spend aid money on their military you idiot, but it's not to take over the south. I've already said this several times. While I'm not an expert on them, I know a fair bit about it. I also work with someone several times a week who was recently hired by the CIA to do an analysis on North Korea and assess our options there.

But hey, you're a jackass on a tech website, I'm sure you're equally well informed.

And you're a classless POS that has to use personal attacks in order to debate.


So you have a friend in the CIA that tells you that they use their aid money for their military, but its not to invade South Korea. lol. Did you know my dad is an astronaut?

Plus, I already said, nobody is as well informed as you are. You know everything. Please enlighten us simpletons.

*edit*

Note: No other lefties are in this thread backing up your claim that they need more aid money. Their silence is deafening. Take the hint

 

[hal2kilo]

And you're a fucking asshole that has to use personal attacks to argue.

Must have struck a nerve Eski.

 

[fskimospy]

And you're a fucking asshole that has to use personal attacks to argue.

So you have a friend in the CIA that tells you that they use their aid money for their military, but its not to invade South Korea. lol. Did you know my dad is an astronaut?

He's not my friend, his name is Bruce Bueno de Mesquita, and he's a department head in the program I'm currently working in. He most certainly does analysis for the CIA, and specifically did some on North Korea not too long ago. What I'm telling you is not just my opinion based on what I see, but his as well. (in a very general sense, as I'm not trying to put any words in his mouth) It jives with my understanding of the world, and he's got a pretty good track record.

Of course you don't care about any of that. You think your opinion is every bit as valid.

 

[nick1985]

Must have struck a nerve Eski.

Glad you could contribute to the thread. How do you feel about more aid money for North Korea?

Also, dont you think I struck a nerve with him? After all, he threw the 1st personal attack bombs. Wouldn't you agree?

 

[nick1985]

He's not my friend, his name is Bruce Bueno de Mesquita, and he's a department head in the program I'm currently working in. He most certainly does analysis for the CIA, and specifically did some on North Korea not too long ago. What I'm telling you is not just my opinion based on what I see, but his as well. (in a very general sense, as I'm not trying to put any words in his mouth) It jives with my understanding of the world, and he's got a pretty good track record.

Of course you don't care about any of that. You think your opinion is every bit as valid.

My buddy on facebook just said North Korea doesn't deserve a red penny worth of aid money. I guess we are 2-2

 

[fskimospy]

And you're a classless POS that has to use personal attacks in order to debate.


So you have a friend in the CIA that tells you that they use their aid money for their military, but its not to invade South Korea. lol. Did you know my dad is an astronaut?

Plus, I already said, nobody is as well informed as you are. You know everything. Please enlighten us simpletons.

*edit*

Note: No other lefties are in this thread backing up your claim that they need more aid money. Their silence is deafening. Take the hint

The number of people on an internet message board that hold an opinion about an issue is irrelevant as to if it's right or not. If you took that standard, according to internet message boards pikachu is probably real.

 

[fskimospy]

My buddy on facebook just said North Korea doesn't deserve a red penny worth of aid money. I guess we are 2-2

If your buddy on facebook is a CIA analyst or a world renowned political scientist, I would agree.

You're just mad because you don't have any way to argue back because you don't know anything.

 

[nick1985]

The number of people on an internet message board that hold an opinion about an issue is irrelevant as to if it's right or not. If you took that standard, according to internet message boards pikachu is probably real.

Personally, I think the government of Sudan needs more aid money. What do you think?

 

[fskimospy]

Personally, I think the government of Sudan needs more aid money. What do you think?

I don't have an opinion on it because I don't know enough. <---- You should probably say that more often.

 

[nick1985]

You're just mad because you don't have any way to argue back because you don't know anything.

Actually, I can argue back. If you think having some "friend", who you admitted never said they need more aid money", is your I-WIN card, then you are sadly mistaken.

Here is my argument:

North Korea is bad. They do bad things with their money. They invest heavily in their military and leave their populace to rot. Naturally, giving them more money would worsen the situation. UN aid is bad. More aid is worse, especially when some of that is my tax money.

Cant argue back, lol. So tough to argue against North Korea aid money. How will I ever form a thesis?

 

[nick1985]

I don't have an opinion on it because I don't know enough. <---- You should probably say that more often.

Please tell me what I dont know about North Korea, I'm dying to know.

 

[fskimospy]

Please tell me what I dont know about North Korea, I'm dying to know.

I've been telling you.