UFC 117: SILVA vs Sonnen 8/7/10 @10pm EST

[Miramonti]

Silva was so much quicker than Griffen it was laughable.

Not so with Sonnen. The fact that he was able to land numerous solid shots against Silva standing up was a complete shocker. That and Sonnen was able to take him down virtually at will.

It's a shame that sonnen dominated nearly the entire fight only to throw that out the window with one fatal mistake that silva capitalized on. In the long run, it could have been a million dollar+ mistake.

 

[shopbruin]

Somebody please point me to another UFC fight that was stopped after 1 tap, I have VHS or DVD's of every single UFC PPV. Not saying it hasn't happened before, I just don't recall ever seeing it. I thought the official rule was 3 taps in a row = tapping out. But 1 tap = stop is new to me. I am not saying Chale would have came back, but I think the stoppage was utter bullshit. It doesn't matter if that was where it was headed, Chale should have been given the chance to either make a magical escape or tap a proper amount of times. And yes, I've seen more miraculous comebacks from submissions before, so it is possible.

The only one I could think of is Fedor, but that's not UFC. He only tapped once. That fight also took place in CA.

As someone else stated, Team Quest one-taps, hoping that the ref won't notice but the opponent does, so that they let up and they can try to improve. Apparently Matt Lindland has done this before (and Matt Lindland was in Chael's corner.)

One angle showed Chael's face in agony. Plus this has happened to Chael before - he'll take the guy down, and then get submitted, only Maia submitted him much faster.

http://www.sportpost.com/video/view/Demian+Maia+vs+Chael+Sonnen FF to 4 min mark.

 

[CRXican]

round 5: silva on his back yet again.

game over. Chael wins!!!!!!!!!

lol

 

[TurtleCrusher]

Anyone saying this is scripted or staged, well, you're a fucking idiot. It was a tap. You should be banned for posting such nonsense in a thread.

Been a Sonnen fan since I began watching a few years ago. Not to mention he's a local. I bet my bloodp ressure was through the roof watching that fight. I just knew Silva was waiting on a triangle by the way Chael seemed to let himself be available most of the fight. Most of the fight Silva couldn't capitalize with that move due to possible failing and giving up side mount or back control to Sonnen. Sonnen was laying down bricks on his head and body the whole fight. Silva risked major defeat for one submission attempt and it worked.

Props to Silva. I wanted him kicked out of the UFC for his playing around the cage. He took a beating like no other and won without the judges.

I remember saying the same thing about Lesnar. He got his ass kicked early but pulled it out with a strong submission.

 

[CRXican]

Yep, can't believe the fact that he tapped was being debated here.

He tapped so his arm didn't get broken off.

 

[waggy]

yes its in doubt. he did it once. that is not a tap.

the ref should not have stopped it. Silvia didn't and neither did sonnen. it was a bad stop.

 

[CRXican]

too bad you're wrong

 

[Number1]

yes its in doubt. he did it once. that is not a tap.

the ref should not have stopped it. Silvia didn't and neither did sonnen. it was a bad stop.

Dream on waggy, I looked at the video several times. There is no doubt, he tapped.

It was good to see Silva get a beating. The guy is not invincible after all.

 

[JEDI]

It was good to see Silva get a beating. The guy is not invincible after all.

yes, mr silky smooth has a weakness. its being on his back.

now the problem is getting him there. he stuffed all the tries that Maia did during his last title defense.

now you need the take down skills of Sonnen plus the smarts of not being stupid when you're up 4-0 and it's Round 5.

now the question is will Dana White force Silva to move up to Light Heavyweight since he overcame everything that was thrown at him during the last 4 years as Middleweight champ? 😱

Silva said he would never fight his friend Machida. Well, Machinda is no longer light heavyweight champ.

 

[aceO07]

The tap is to let the other person know that you give up or are in pain. There isn't a requirement that you need to tap more than once. Multiple taps are just to make sure that your opponent notices and stops, or the ref sees and rescues you.

If you look at the videos, you can see that it was a 'tap'. It was a solid open palmed tap on Silva's leg. If it was a fist hitting his leg, then I would agree with you.

 

[QueBert]

Yep, can't believe the fact that he tapped was being debated here.

He tapped so his arm didn't get broken off.

Did you watch the fight? Nobody was sure what happened when the ref stopped it, even Josh (the ref) wasn't sure what to do. This never happens when a person taps 3 times, which is protocol in MMA. If it was as clear cut as you make it out to be there wouldn't have been 10 seconds of confusion. Even Silva was a bit stunned. I don't care what he said in the press conference after, I didn't watch it. But if he said he knew Chale tapped he was lying. I'm not a fan of either, but at best that tap was very very suspect. Josh made a semi bad call, I think he realized what he did right after he started to pull Chale off. The sad thing is he knew he couldn't let them keep fighting. He fucked up, I'm sure he'll even admit it in the 1st interview he does. He had a "OMGWTFBBQ!" look on his face for a good 6 seconds after he stopped it. I expect shitty Steve Mazagatti to fuck up like this, not Josh though.

As others have mentioned, he had Matt Lindland in his corner, that dude is known for doing shit like tapping once to try and get his opponent to think he tapped and ease up on the submission. He even doesn't shower 3-4 days before a match do his opponent won't want to mount him. Chale tried a Matt trick and it backfired big time.

 

[waggy]

Did you watch the fight? Nobody was sure what happened when the ref stopped it, even Josh (the ref) wasn't sure what to do. This never happens when a person taps 3 times, which is protocol in MMA. If it was as clear cut as you make it out to be there wouldn't have been 10 seconds of confusion. Even Silva was a bit stunned. I don't care what he said in the press conference after, I didn't watch it. But if he said he knew Chale tapped he was lying. I'm not a fan of either, but at best that tap was very very suspect. Josh made a semi bad call, I think he realized what he did right after he started to pull Chale off. The sad thing is he knew he couldn't let them keep fighting. He fucked up, I'm sure he'll even admit it in the 1st interview he does. He had a "OMGWTFBBQ!" look on his face for a good 6 seconds after he stopped it. I expect shitty Steve Mazagatti to fuck up like this, not Josh though.

As others have mentioned, he had Matt Lindland in his corner, that dude is known for doing shit like tapping once to try and get his opponent to think he tapped and ease up on the submission. He even doesn't shower 3-4 days before a match do his opponent won't want to mount him. Chale tried a Matt trick and it backfired big time.

/agreed

it was not a tap. though he was trying to make silvia think he taped. the ref should NOT have stopped it. though i don't think it would have mattered he had a armbar on sonnen.

 

[Ns1]

/agreed

though he was trying to make silvia think he taped.

So what you're saying is he tapped

 

[Miramonti]

Did you watch the fight? Nobody was sure what happened when the ref stopped it, even Josh (the ref) wasn't sure what to do. This never happens when a person taps 3 times, which is protocol in MMA. If it was as clear cut as you make it out to be there wouldn't have been 10 seconds of confusion. Even Silva was a bit stunned. I don't care what he said in the press conference after, I didn't watch it. But if he said he knew Chale tapped he was lying. I'm not a fan of either, but at best that tap was very very suspect. Josh made a semi bad call, I think he realized what he did right after he started to pull Chale off. The sad thing is he knew he couldn't let them keep fighting. He fucked up, I'm sure he'll even admit it in the 1st interview he does. He had a "OMGWTFBBQ!" look on his face for a good 6 seconds after he stopped it. I expect shitty Steve Mazagatti to fuck up like this, not Josh though.

As others have mentioned, he had Matt Lindland in his corner, that dude is known for doing shit like tapping once to try and get his opponent to think he tapped and ease up on the submission. He even doesn't shower 3-4 days before a match do his opponent won't want to mount him. Chale tried a Matt trick and it backfired big time.

He faked a tap, then tapped. Wtf fight were you watching. If the .gif isn't clear enough, there really isn't any use commenting anymore...it isn't worth the bandwidth.

The ref did EXACTLY what he is there for...when a fighter concedes by tapping once or more, fight is over. There really isn't a gray area here, and once the replays were shown and people could see what went down really quickly, all questions were answered.

People want to make up rules as this sh!t goes along, lol.

 

[QueBert]

He faked a tap, then tapped. Wtf fight were you watching. If the .gif isn't clear enough, there really isn't any use commenting anymore...it isn't worth the bandwidth.

The ref did EXACTLY what he is there for...when a fighter concedes by tapping once or more, fight is over. There really isn't a gray area here, and once the replays were shown and people could see what went down really quickly, all questions were answered.

People want to make up rules as this sh!t goes along, lol.

Then explain why Josh was sitting there after the fight looking confused. Even Joe & Goldie were like "WTF just happened" The fact I remember about 3 controversial tap stoppages in all the UFC I've seen (all of them) what happened last night definitely raises questions. It wasn't the worst stoppage I've seen, but it was a borderline bad call. A good ref stops after 3 straight taps, hell if the ref's Mazagatti, you gotta tap 5-6 times before he stops it. (Brock Vs. Mir 1) even if he tapped 2 times, which he didn't. Give him that 3rd tap, you never know what can happen. Most ref's go with the 3 tap rule because they don't wanna stop a bout when one person does something once that can appear to be a tap when it wasn't. I watched the ending 5 times, and all 5 times everyone looks confused. And the mayhem in the octagon afterwards says it definitely wasn't a clear tap.

 

[NYHoustonman]

/agreed

it was not a tap. though he was trying to make silvia think he taped. the ref should NOT have stopped it. though i don't think it would have mattered he had a armbar on sonnen.

Possible solution: Make it official, 'three taps.' Don't call the fight in a case like this, where a fighter taps once and tries to deny it; instead, let Silva tear apart Sonnen's elbow, because that's where the fight was headed in a few seconds (no, he wasn't getting out of it, he was exhausted). Maybe that's what you guys are driving at?

 

[Miramonti]

Then explain why Josh was sitting there after the fight looking confused. Even Joe & Goldie were like "WTF just happened" The fact I remember about 3 controversial tap stoppages in all the UFC I've seen (all of them) what happened last night definitely raises questions. It wasn't the worst stoppage I've seen, but it was a borderline bad call. A good ref stops after 3 straight taps, hell if the ref's Mazagatti, you gotta tap 5-6 times before he stops it. (Brock Vs. Mir 1) even if he tapped 2 times, which he didn't. Give him that 3rd tap, you never know what can happen. Most ref's go with the 3 tap rule because they don't wanna stop a bout when one person does something once that can appear to be a tap when it wasn't. I watched the ending 5 times, and all 5 times everyone looks confused. And the mayhem in the octagon afterwards says it definitely wasn't a clear tap.

You'd have to ask the ref what he was thinking after he stopped it, but he was confident he saw a tap and he stopped it. He had a d@mn good vantage point. I think what freaked everyone out is when Sonnen tried to pussy out and pretend he didn't tap when he said "WHAT??" (/edit: not to suggest sonnen fought like a 'pussy', lol)

That alone freaked everyone out into thinking there was an epic mistake/disaster of a call (I know I did briefly), altho the replays showed a clear tap soon afterwards.

I think Sonnen tried to bait Silva into releasing and hoping the ref wouldn't call one tap. That was his only chance...but the ref was too good and it failed.

I've seen a lot softer intentional taps than that, and even tho this was only one, its indisputable imo that the tap was intentional and sufficient to count as 1 tap.

Whether or not there should be a multiple tap rule is an entirely different conversation (not necessarily a bad one either), but that's not relevant right now imo in gauging whether or not the ref did the right thing.

Currently there isn't a multiple tap rule in order to protect the fighter, which could mean the difference between a stopped fight and no significant injuries or a stopped fight and torn ligaments etc. What mazagotti did was not only wrong, but was practically criminal. Lensar's knee could have been shredded from that @sshole.

 

[Miramonti]

I think what Sonnen did is similar to what A-Rod did in baseball when he was going to be out at first base...try to knock the ball out of the guys glove and hope you get away with it. If you're beat...cheat.

Sonnen's not the doucheb@g that A-fraud is, but no one likes to lose, particularly Sonnen after he dominated Silva.

 

[aceO07]

The tap is a safety for the players/opponents. 1 tap should be enough for the other person to stop and prevent any further damage. It's not something to play with.

In the case of MMA tournaments, the other person may want to get stopped officially by the ref so they hold on for a bit longer so that the ref will see.

I've taken Jujitsu and Judo. You do NOT ever want to have to tap more than once for the other person to stop. It's just instinctive to tap more since it's painful (especially if the other guy is bigger or inexperienced and doesn't know his own strength) and make sure the other guy notices. In competitions, the ref's job is to notice and stop it immediately if the other person doesn't.

 

[Jules]

lol @ "he didn't tap"

 

[Jules]

come on dude, that’s the same shit you did with filho and babalu. If you’re going to tap, then tap.

lol

 

[AznAnarchy99]

The tap is a safety for the players/opponents. 1 tap should be enough for the other person to stop and prevent any further damage. It's not something to play with.

In the case of MMA tournaments, the other person may want to get stopped officially by the ref so they hold on for a bit longer so that the ref will see.

I've taken Jujitsu and Judo. You do NOT ever want to have to tap more than once for the other person to stop. It's just instinctive to tap more since it's painful (especially if the other guy is bigger or inexperienced and doesn't know his own strength) and make sure the other guy notices. In competitions, the ref's job is to notice and stop it immediately if the other person doesn't.

Seriously. In the adrenaline of a fight, you're gonna be yanking fucking hard on that arm/choke. Even in practice when you're rolling you get that adrenaline rush and dont know how hard you are yanking that arm as well. Ive had my shoulder and joints on the verge of snapping because some guys dont feel or notice you're taps. If I tap once, I sure as hell want the guy to let go.

 

[QueBert]

was posted on Sherdog, says it all


He did an ambiguous double tap when the accepted standard is 3.

The ref grabbed them (an indication for Anderson to let go) but he wasn't sure Cheal tapped and immediately let go (indicating they should continue fighting).

When Cheal didn't admit to tapping, Anderson pushed Cheal and the ref off, stood up, turned and pointed to Cheal, saying you tapped.

Then the ref accepted Andersons assertion, on the basis that Cheal didn't protest.

Cheal and his Coach Matt Lindland have a history of such behavior.


I think either way Sonnen was going to lose, but the stoppage wasn't good.

 

[coreyb]

he tapped

/thread

he clearly had him in a clean triangle/arm bar and if he didn't tap just then he would of had his arm broken.

ive seen fighters do this before where they are hesitant to tap so they only tap once and then freak out when the fight is called.

 

[Dangerer]

Silva said he would never fight his friend Machida. Well, Machinda is no longer light heavyweight champ.

Silva still owes Belfort a fight.

On Silva vs Machida, two best friends with no interest in hurting each other plus they're both counter-strikers. Boring!