swiftboat part 2

[chucky2]

I guess if English isn't your first language or you got by with D's in English since about 2nd grade, then I guess you can say that's what he clearly implied. Those of us who are well versed in the English language can however tell what he indeed did mean. Now yes, if you ignore all but one sentence of his speech it can be taken the way you think it was meant to. However, if you listen to literally ANY of the rest of it, and especially if you listen to the entire thing, Obama meant that businesses thrive because of how great the American society is and how we all work together.

Now I guess if you came up with your own material to create roads, laid down those roads on your own, fought off anyone who tried to take your land with your own hands, created your own currency, built a building and a product, and got customers who came in using your brand new currency ... then Obama could be wrong. More likely you're just an idiot.

haha spin spin spin away... :thumbsup:

 

[cybrsage]

Something the last administration would NEVER engage in, right? :thumbsdown:

Ah, the "someone else did something wrong so it is ok for others to do it" idiotic line of reasoning. Thanks for using it.

 

[cybrsage]

Lotsa arguing about Obama's castigating small business and entrepreneurs, not much commentary on the Dishonorable Disclosure video itself.

Dishonorable Disclosure also indicts the Obama Administration leaking of classified material, endangering national security and the lives of those who are charged to protect us - all for the sake of political gain.

Do watch it. It is well worth 22 minutes of your time no matter if you are an R or a D, a prog, lib or conservative.

No discussion because it is obvious he did it.

 

[OrByte]

He's basically saying that he acted in his role as Commander in chief to instruct the CIA and other intelligence agencies to gather information that would lead to Bin Laden.

Funny how the editor of your link only shows a segment of the news conference that has the most usage of the word I. Instead of a longer clip found here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzD1ecqVBZY

In which after President Obama says "Today, at my direction..."

Notice that when he describes the actual operation there is no use of the word "I"

The next paragraphs have more instances of President Obama using the word We rather than the word "I"

the transcript of the speech is here.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2011/05/02/remarks-president-osama-bin-laden

In case you don't trust them

Fox News has a transcript as well.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/05/02/transcript-obama-announces-killing-bin-laden/

It's funny how someone who styles himself as a humble libertarian only shows the excerpt of a press announcement that contains the most uses of the first person personal pronoun in the shortest period of time.

It makes President Obama look like he constantly used the words "I" throughout the speech when in actuality he's using the words Us or We much more often.

If you actually search the terms in google chrome <space>I<space> and <space>We<space> with ctrl + F, the "we" is used over thirty times and the word "i" is used at most 15 times.


That definitely falls under the category of showing a segment without the context of a whole speech. :hmm:

In my opinion the editor of that video made the equivalent of a troll post If he really had a valid point why not show 7+ minutes of the press conferences from both of the Presidents instead of selected clips?

Based on the link you provided then comparing it to the links that are available that show a more complete picture of President Obama's statements; this humble libertarian needs to pick another adjective to describe himself.

TLDR: Way to go picking the link that distorts the President's speech in which the death of Bin Laden was announced.

This thread has been /end since post #61

quoted again for the slow.

 

[alzan]

Even good guys do bad things. And this video certainly qualifies IMO.

The glorification of the military in this country is getting out of hand. Putting on a uniform doesn't automatically make you a saint.

Most servicemen and servicewomen are good, decent Americans -- just like most civilians. And some of them are not -- just like civilians.

Facts are not welcome in right wing or left wing circle jerk threads.

 

[umbrella39]

This thread has been /end since post #61

quoted again for the slow.

Still hasn't stopped the lying narcissist *crickets*

 

[airdata]

guys... Obama did it and then dumped the body to hide the evidence. Get it right.

 

[HomerJS]

This groups unwillingness to condemn leaking Valarie Plame just shows, even heros can be two faced.

 

[CitizenKain]

Sigh. Have you watched the video or even read through the OP?

This is not a Republican group. These guys are Democrats, Republicans and many of them are in the "I don't care for either" camps.

They ARE, however, the good guys, the guys on OUR side, that have been on the ground, in the air and in the water taking down bad guys. You know, the assholes that want to cut your head off right after they do the same to your family.

They do not want to see their friends and comrades die through leaks of classified information just because a slimy politician wants to keep his job for four more years.

They do not want to see our national security, what let's us sleep comfortably in our beds at night, suffer needlessly for the sake of some cheap politician's career.

We have many Obama butt buddies posting in this forum. They will spin like a top to justify their emotional attachment to Obama's posterior. To them, it smells like roses no matter what is coming out.

But, those who are not so enthralled - Democrat, Republican, whatever label they care to apply - are damn worried about what this White House is doing to paint themselves as doing something, anything as tough guys.

The spec operators in this OPSEC group are serious men for serious times.

What a giant load of shit. Again, why should anyone care what some liars and bought mouthpieces have to say about anything? They aren't on my side, they are in the side of people like you and other rightwing shills.

Do we have any proof the people in this video actually are, or ever were SEALs? I demand to see their records and birth certificate.

 

[blankslate]

This groups unwillingness to condemn leaking Valarie Plame just shows, even heros can be two faced.

Interesting point... I wonder if people in this new swiftboating operation felt that Scooter Libby should have gone to jail instead of having his sentence commuted?

Of course, if he didn't get his sentence commuted and a real prosecutor was able to work on him, who might he have flipped on?

 

[Caminetto]

What a giant load of shit. Again, why should anyone care what some liars and bought mouthpieces have to say about anything? They aren't on my side, they are in the side of people like you and other rightwing shills.

Do we have any proof the people in this video actually are, or ever were SEALs? I demand to see their records and birth certificate.

Yes, I watched this laughter, and you would need to be real stupid to think these morons were a part of the "operator/intelligence" community.

The tells about their real agenda: One spokesperson only gives interviews to Newsmax and Fox News, one spokesperson used to work for W, their president is a failed Republican congressional candidate, they are non-partisan strictly by their own claims, and they just recently found all this so-called evidence against Obama, now, right before the election. LOL.

 

[PJABBER]

What a giant load of shit. Again, why should anyone care what some liars and bought mouthpieces have to say about anything? They aren't on my side, they are in the side of people like you and other rightwing shills.

Do we have any proof the people in this video actually are, or ever were SEALs? I demand to see their records and birth certificate.

You are right to consider that there are fakers of all types claiming to be warriors when they are REMFs or have never been in the military at all.

You can find a good listing of scum and fakirs here - http://www.fakewarriors.org/names.htm

Maybe you can even ID some of the jokers here - http://www.fakewarriors.org/phonies/phonies528.htm

However, the individuals that appear in the video really are part of the special warfare community. Most of them are highly decorated and you can find out more by doing a simple Google search of their names. Why don't you do just that and let us all know what you find.

Some, of course, have their identities concealed. Based on those who appear openly, I am quite confident that they, too, are qualified to speak.

 

[PJABBER]

Yes, I watched this laughter, and you would need to be real stupid to think these morons were a part of the "operator/intelligence" community.

The tells about their real agenda: One spokesperson only gives interviews to Newsmax and Fox News, one spokesperson used to work for W, their president is a failed Republican congressional candidate, they are non-partisan strictly by their own claims, and they just recently found all this so-called evidence against Obama, now, right before the election. LOL.

Why don't you also do a Google look up of their names and offer up a the detail of their military backgrounds and the kind of work they are in rather than just prattle on about their current political affiliations.

Just like we know that 90+% of college professors and journalists are "progressives" and liberals and support the Democrat Party, you might expect that those in the military and intel communities might have a predilection toward the Republican Party. I seem to recall reading that about 70% choose to be Rs. A surprising number, however, don't care for either flavor.

 

[blankslate]

C'mon now do you swiftboaters think you're fooling?

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/16/u...s-attack-obama-over-bin-laden-leaks.html?_r=1

The new group, called the Special Operations Opsec Education Fund, using shorthand for &#8220;operational security,&#8221; describes itself as nonpartisan, but some of its leaders have been involved in Republican campaigns and Tea Party groups.

Among the featured former members of the elite Navy special operations teams are Benjamin Smith, whose Facebook page identifies him as a model and actor who served in Iraq and later became a spokesman for the Tea Party Express and several Republican campaigns.

:hmm:

Another former SEAL member, Scott Taylor, is the group&#8217;s president and ran unsuccessfully as a Republican candidate for Congress in Virginia in 2010.

funny how they're also generally supportive of republicans... no bias there. nuh-uh none at all.

In an effort to portray Mr. Obama as a braggart taking credit for the accomplishments of special forces and intelligence operatives, the video omits some of his remarks in announcing Bin Laden&#8217;s killing. In that late-night televised address, Mr. Obama credited 10 years of &#8220;tireless and heroic work of our military and our counterterrorism professionals,&#8221; but that is edited out.

Sounds similar to that link that one of you posted that excerpted only a few minutes of the 7+ minute press conference in which the death of Bin Laden was announced.

Sure if you want to fool yourself into believing that there is no ulterior motive for this group go ahead...

 

[PJABBER]

Hmmm, the New York Times is saying they are former SEALs. Do you think they are lying?

 

[blankslate]

Hmmm, the New York Times is saying they are former SEALs. Do you think they are lying?

I think they are biased while believing what they are saying even if factually in error; and their biases are making it easy for republicans to use them as tools.

Something the republican party has no shame in doing whilst accusing their political adversaries of the very same thing.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/16/u...s-attack-obama-over-bin-laden-leaks.html?_r=1

The Opsec group shares an office suite in Alexandria, Va., with a Republican consulting firm, the Trailblazer Group. Christian Ferry, a partner in the firm, said that he had sublet space to Opsec because it included &#8220;people I know,&#8221; but that Trailblazer had no role in the project.

Interesting that this group is sharing the same office space as a republican consulting firm even if there is a convenient excuse... any reasonable person would question any claims of no connection with republicans given the above information.

 

[ky54]

Let's see - who would I take seriously... veterans who have laid their asses on the line or a bunch of addle-brained keyboard generals? Lol, puleeze.

 

[blankslate]

Let's see - who would I take seriously... veterans who have laid their asses on the line or a bunch of addle-brained keyboard generals? Lol, puleeze.

Let's see who should you take seriously... veterans who allow themselves to be used as political pawns or those who don't? puhleeze.

I take Representative West more seriously than these guys. While I do vehemently disagree with his views he has put himself out there in the political arena more than these guys hiding behind an "educational fund" probably ever will.

Of course I expect Representative West to actually use this attack against the current administration. For the above reason he should be taken seriously if (and when) he talks this point up.

 

[PJABBER]

I think they are biased while believing what they are saying even if factually in error; and their biases are making it easy for republicans to use them as tools.

Something the republican party has no shame in doing whilst accusing their political adversaries of the very same thing.

You should note that these particular guys, former officers, are not wet behind the ears newbies. Most have spent many years in very active service, serving in every armed conflict the United States has been involved in the course of their careers. The Teams and other services equivalent units are strategic assets and usually briefed in on why they are going in by theater commanders, commanders of the Unified Combatant Commands and often enough, the National Command Authority. Their situational awareness is acute.

Once they left active military service many of them remained engaged in other aspects of the game. This experience, including engagement in politics, too, is valuable.

Bias is a strange word to use. They are not posing braggarts. They speak of risks and exposures. These are things they know very well. They have opinions, but those opinions are based on personal and institutional experience.

No, they are not sitting next to Obama every night while he decides whom the drones strikes will kill next. But they are the guys who have to know where to be and then they are often the ones who are aiming the laser designator or pulling a trigger and they want to be sure their friends and comrades are not exposed by political charlatans.

Do you really think these guys are going to blindly be "used as tools?" Or that they are actors like Alec Baldwin or George Clooney, themselves willing pawns for left wing causes?

Interesting that this group is sharing the same office space as a republican consulting firm even if there is a convenient excuse... any reasonable person would question any claims of no connection with republicans given the above information.

The article states that the office space was offered up because the individuals knew each other or of each other. Why do you find this offensive?If they agree on politics or even have the same interests might be a given.

 

[blankslate]

The article states that the office space was offered up because the individuals knew each other or of each other. Why do you find this offensive?If they agree on politics or even have the same interests might be a given.

Don't pretend you wouldn't question a group slamming a republican for "leaks" if they set themselves up as and "education fund" and then put their head quarters in the same offices as a say Firedoglake for example.

You should note that these particular guys, former officers, are not wet behind the ears newbies. Most have spent many years in very active service, serving in every armed conflict the United States has been involved in the course of their careers.

They're being very naive in they way they are being used however. I seriously doubt they would join an "educational fund" smearing a republican administration

Bias is a strange word to use. They are not posing braggarts. They speak of risks and exposures.

Is it really? As for braggarts who was being a braggart? remember that humble libertarian link you posted which chose a small segment out of the press conference on Bin Laden's death? Yeah, the longer clip available on youtube
www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/05/02/transcript-obama-announces-killing-bin-laden/

and the transcript from Fox News shows what a distortion that was.
www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/05/02/transcript-obama-announces-killing-bin-laden/

notice that in the youtube clip that the president was much less animated than he is during political campaigns because he realizes that it's a serious press conference. Plus transcript also dashes the claim that the language of a braggart was used.

 

[PJABBER]

Don't pretend you wouldn't question a group slamming a republican for "leaks" if they set themselves up as and "education fund" and then put their head quarters in the same offices as a say Firedoglake for example.

LOL, I highly doubt that any mainstream Republican consulting group will be as batshit crazy as FDL!

They're being very naive in they way they are being used however. I seriously doubt they would join an "educational fund" smearing a republican administration

Why can't you come to grips that they are speaking their own minds? And that they truly represent the great majority of other service people in that community? There are no Bradley Mannings in the demographic this organization represents. I am ex-military and they are saying what everyone I know in the military or has been in the military is saying.

Just because OPSEC are speaking to truth rather than playing back Media Matters talking points doesn't mean they are being programmed by someone else. I know that is what Media Matters has put out, but Media Matters is no arbiter of truth, it is just a left wing propaganda organization, so there is no real need for you or anyone else to keep regurgitating their daily talking points if you start to think for yourself!

 

[PJABBER]

Navy SEAL responds after Media Matters staffer says Obama-critical SEALs ‘don’t have guts’

Media Matters senior fellow Eric Boehlert said on Thursday that a group of former Navy SEALS “don’t have guts” after the special forces operators launched a media campaign condemning the Obama administration’s national security leaks.

“#kindalame former Navy SEALs don’t have guts to admit they’re running a GOP, anti-Obama campaign; http://nyti.ms/N2nYYj ” Boehlert wrote on Twitter Thursday morning.

The group Boehlert lashed out at is called the Special Operations OPSEC Education Fund and it’s composed of former U.S. intelligence and specials forces operators. They describe themselves as non-partisan and finger the current president as an example of a politician who uses national security secrets for political gain.

“STOP the politicians, President Obama and others, from politically capitalizing on US national security operations and secrets!” reads the organization’s website.

Scott Taylor is a former Navy SEAL of eight and a half years, and was a 2010 GOP candidate for Congress. He is now a member of the Special Operations OPSEC Education Fund.

Taylor responded to Boehlert’s tweet in a phone interview with The Daily Caller and said that his group of special forces operators is “clearly not gutless.”

“We’re clearly not gutless. We’re in the public right now, completely out there,” Taylor said.

“Everything’s out there. It’s interesting how the left is trying to frame this as a partisan issue. I don’t care what party people are from within our group,” Taylor said. “This issue is about national security leaks.”

“I wonder how many of this guy’s close friends he’s buried,” he added, referring to Boehlert.

Taylor told TheDC that his group also contains liberal members who are concerned with national security leaks, one of whom is preparing to speak out in public. “The reason why we’re standing up right now is to ensure the protection of future operations and our brothers and sisters who are forward right now.”

Taylor also responded to a claim by an anonymous Obama campaign spokesman who said Wednesday, “No one in this group is in a position to speak with any authority on these issues and on what impact these leaks might have.”

“This is the group, the very group that would have the most authority and knowledge about the impact of leaks,” Taylor told TheDC. “I can tell you, the vast majority [of active special forces operators] support this message.”

Boehlert accusing Navy SEALs of being gutless has inflamed conservatives online, who view Boehlert as the face of liberal smears emanating from Media Matters for America.

“Boehlert is such a straight up Obama boot licker that he actually smears former Navy SEALs who don’t like the fact that President Obama’s administration is leaking sensitive information that could put current SEALs in danger,” reads a reaction post on The Right Sphere, a conservative blog.

Sonny Bunch, managing editor for the Washington Free Beacon, wrote on Twitter, ”Dear God: All I ask before I die is that you let me witness Eric Boehlert call a Navy SEAL a coward to his face.”

There is some irony in Boehlert accusing a political group of hiding its affinity for, or opposition to, a particular candidate.

Media Matters, as a tax-exempt 501(c)(3) organization, is forbidden from explicitly endorsing or opposing a candidate for elected office. But as TheDC has previously reported, the group has steadily expanded its support of Obama as he mounts up his 2012 re-election campaign.

A spokeswoman for Media Matters did not respond to a request for comment for this report.

 

[blankslate]

Just because OPSEC are speaking to truth rather than playing back Media Matters talking points doesn't mean they are being programmed by someone else. I know that is what Media Matters has put out, but Media Matters is no arbiter of truth, it is just a left wing propaganda organization, so there is no real need for you or anyone else to keep regurgitating their daily talking points if you start to think for yourself!

Sorry I haven't visited the Media Matters site in over a month and I've never really spent more than 10 minutes at the site when I did.

This is because I prefer to get my as much as my sources as possible from news sites affiliated with print newspapers or video that is unedited (or least edited) as much as possible.

I am ex-military and they are saying what everyone I know in the military or has been in the military is saying.

Why do you think this is only exclusive to supporters of conservative candidates? People will of course flock to those who have similar positions. And yes many if not most service members do skew conservative on a majority of their views... but not all.

 

[OrByte]

Navy SEAL responds after Media Matters staffer says Obama-critical SEALs &#8216;don&#8217;t have guts&#8217;

I dont see where anyone said that Navy Seals don't have guts.

where does it say that?

Are you making stuff up again??? tsk tsk

 

[Charles Kozierok]

Why can't you come to grips that they are speaking their own minds?

Why can't they, and their supporters, drop the "non-partisan" bullshit and be honest about what they are doing and why?