"Science is liberal and anti-American." (Conservapedia)

[ivwshane]

I think we've had this conversation before, and ultimately you resort to

She's already done it again, just look at the post above yours.

Lol! What a tool!

 

[Darwin333]

Why can't God be both things?

If he's "God" he should be able to be everything all at the same time. That is what all powerful means, right?

 

[mect]

Support your assertions please.

To find yourself you must first lose yourself. To live you must die. Blessed are the last for they shall be the first. That's just a few examples off the top of my head from Christianity. The idea of an omnipotent god is itself a paradox. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnipotence_paradox)

People have written entire books on this subject.
http://www.amazon.com/The-Uses-Paradox-Religion-Self-Transformation/dp/0231140827

 

[buckshot24]

If he's "God" he should be able to be everything all at the same time. That is what all powerful means, right?

Where do you get this preposterous notion from?

All powerful means God can do anything that power can accomplish.

 

[Darwin333]

How can He?

Two concepts of God can be found in the Bible and the Koran.

In the Bible says that God cannot lie.

The Koran says God is the best deceiver. Quran 3:54

Obviously both cannot be true.

Say God is walking around on Earth right now pretending to be a man. Deception but not lying.

 

[realibrad]

Support your assertions please.

"And he (Judas) cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself. And the chief priests...bought with them the potter's field." (MAT 27:5)

"Now this man (Judas) purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out." (ACT 1:18)

 

[Darwin333]

Where do you get this preposterous notion from?

All powerful means God can do anything that power can accomplish.

From Church. And it's meant to say that there is nothing outside of the power of God. He can do ANYTHING that he so desires regardless if we view it, or even the laws of physics say its, as possible or not.

 

[Moonbeam]

But religion is a paradox. Have you ever read the bible? Paradox is a core attribute of most religions.

Paradox is the result of thought which is possible only with language, the power to invent and name things that do not exist, things like the ego, the self-story we tell ourselves. The purpose of religion to provide the bridge that collapses duality at a higher level of understanding. As one approaches paradox one approaches a truth that opens out to a third way. There are no opposites, there is only love. For the Lover, God is one thing, but for the rest of us, he can be a million different things. For the lover the question of whose idea of God is right does not exist. There is only love and love never doubts or questions.

 

[Moonbeam]

Where do you get this preposterous notion from?

All powerful means God can do anything that power can accomplish.

What power does love have?

 

[buckshot24]

To find yourself you must first lose yourself.

This is true and exactly what happened to me. This isn't a paradox. But can you find this exact quote in the bible?

To live you must die.

Citation please.

Blessed are the last for they shall be the first.

Citation please.

That's just a few examples off the top of my head from Christianity.

Would you mind going deeper than off the top of your head because those aren't accurate quotes. And they aren't self evidently paradoxes anyway.

The idea of an omnipotent god is itself a paradox. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnipotence_paradox)

No it isn't. You just don't understand it.

People have written entire books on this subject.
http://www.amazon.com/The-Uses-Paradox-Religion-Self-Transformation/dp/0231140827

http://www.amazon.com/Satellites-Ho...F8&qid=1449084060&sr=1-11&keywords=flat+earth

 

[buckshot24]

From Church. And it's meant to say that there is nothing outside of the power of God. He can do ANYTHING that he so desires regardless if we view it, or even the laws of physics say its, as possible or not.

No wonder you're an atheist. That isn't the message of the bible.

 

[buckshot24]

Say God is walking around on Earth right now pretending to be a man. Deception but not lying.

Jesus was a man, not pretending. Any other examples?

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

She's already done it again, just look at the post above yours.

Lol! What a tool!

careful, you might end up on....

The 'list'

 

[mect]

This is true and exactly what happened to me. This isn't a paradox. But can you find this exact quote in the bible?

Citation please.

Citation please.
Would you mind going deeper than off the top of your head because those aren't accurate quotes. And they aren't self evidently paradoxes anyway.
No it isn't. You just don't understand it.



http://www.amazon.com/Satellites-Ho...F8&qid=1449084060&sr=1-11&keywords=flat+earth

Define exact quote? In which translation?
Romans 6:8 8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him.
Matthew 16:25 For whoever would save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.
Matthew 20:16 So the last will be first, and the first last.

That is the point of religion. Paradoxes are able to exist in religion without issue (at least for me). You don't have to understand it. It is what makes religion special. It is able to be more than one thing, sometimes in a contradictory manner. I'm not saying this as a fault of religion. On the contrary, it is in my opinion one of the greatest strengths of religion.

Obviously people try to provide explanations for the paradox. That is how they find meaning in them. That is how the paradox can provide different meaning for different people. That is how god can be one thing to one person and something else to another at the same time. It is why we have so many different versions of god which I consider all to be true.

And if an omnipotent god isn't a paradox, and I just don't understand it, please enlighten me. Can god create a prison so secure that he cannot escape from it?

 

[Cozarkian]

Jesus was a man, not pretending. Any other examples?

A politician truthfully identifies a problem and truthfully states he has ideas that would fix it, deceiving voters into incorrectly thinking the politician, if elected, intends to introduce his ideas as proposed law.

Alternatively, go watch a magic show or learn some card tricks, or maybe watch somebody pump fake in a basketball game.

 

[buckshot24]

And if an omnipotent god isn't a paradox, and I just don't understand it, please enlighten me. Can god create a prison so secure that he cannot escape from it?

Can power accomplish the task of capturing and keeping God from escaping? No. So this has nothing to do with omnipotence.

 

[Darwin333]

No wonder you're an atheist. That isn't the message of the bible.

It sure as hell is the message the priests and Catholic school taught me.

You really want to argue that an entity that you believe created the entire universe, Earth and every living creature isn't powerful enough to be whatever you are arguing he isn't powerful enough to do? So exactly what can God do and what is beyond his ability to do? Are there laws of physics for God that even he can't break? A God even more powerful than him that keeps him in check?

 

[Darwin333]

Can power accomplish the task of capturing and keeping God from escaping? No. So this has nothing to do with omnipotence.

Define "power" in the context that you are using it please.

 

[buckshot24]

A politician truthfully identifies a problem and truthfully states he has ideas that would fix it, deceiving voters into incorrectly thinking the politician, if elected, intends to introduce his ideas as proposed law.

So he's lying.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/lie

Alternatively, go watch a magic show or learn some card tricks, or maybe watch somebody pump fake in a basketball game.

Not sure how that is relevant.

 

[Darwin333]

Jesus was a man, not pretending. Any other examples?

I didn't say Jesus, I said God. You know, the Father and not the son. I gave you a perfectly legit answer as to how he could deceive without lying. I didn't say he was or did or anything like that, you asked for an example and I gave you a valid one.

 

[Darwin333]

Not sure how that is relevant.

It's an example of deception without lying, at least in a lot of cases like Penn & Teller... Something that you asked people to give an example of.

 

[Darwin333]

To find yourself you must first lose yourself. To live you must die. Blessed are the last for they shall be the first. That's just a few examples off the top of my head from Christianity. The idea of an omnipotent god is itself a paradox. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnipotence_paradox)

People have written entire books on this subject.
http://www.amazon.com/The-Uses-Paradox-Religion-Self-Transformation/dp/0231140827

Well he is currently arguing that god is not omnipotent since he is arguing there are things that are outside of his abilities. If there are things outside of his abilities he isn't omnipotent. I'm not sure if that is what he intended on arguing but it is.

 

[buckshot24]

It sure as hell is the message the priests and Catholic school taught me.

Sorry you had to go through that. They were wrong.

You really want to argue that an entity that you believe created the entire universe, Earth and every living creature isn't powerful enough to be whatever you are arguing he isn't powerful enough to do?

I'm not saying God doesn't have enough power to do anything. I'm saying power itself can't accomplish certain things even if there is an unlimited supply of it.

 

[dank69]

So your argument is that in the context of the link you posted, lying is a subset there for popcorn?

Sick moves dank.

Did you want to actually attempt to refute my claim, admit you were wrong, or just continue to be the clown you seem to be intent on being?

 

[fskimospy]

Well he is currently arguing that god is not omnipotent since he is arguing there are things that are outside of his abilities. If there are things outside of his abilities he isn't omnipotent. I'm not sure if that is what he intended on arguing but it is.

Pretty sure he's already tipped his hand on this one. He will simply declare certain things to not be subject to 'power' (based on nothing) and then say that god not being able to do them does not infringe on his omnipotence.

It's a transparently stupid argument, but I think that's what he's going with.