Yeah, these countries are really undermining their credibility in the defence industry. Germany mostly, but Switzerland and some others too.
K1052
Elite Member
- Aug 21, 2003
- 51,215
- 43,393
- 136
If GLSDB shows up on the battlefield with no warning its going to get really spicy really quick for every significant ammo/fuel dump, command post, repair yard, barracks site, etc within range. Just like with GMLRS earlier this year.
Ukraine MOD providing Germany with a bit of help. Video.
RnR_au
Platinum Member
- Jun 6, 2021
- 2,415
- 5,759
- 106
I have a feeling the South Koreans will be busy for a long while. I did a read of their K2's... wow (as a non-military lay person perhaps I'm easily impressed
). And Poland will have their own factory.So long as Germany didn’t require Rheinmetall to insert some restriction in the manufacturing license deal with SK (On the main gun).I have a feeling the South Koreans will be busy for a long while. I did a read of their K2's... wow (as a non-military lay person perhaps I'm easily impressed
K1052
Elite Member
- Aug 21, 2003
- 51,215
- 43,393
- 136
We should just start installing APUs on older M1A2s (some already have them IIRC) and start shipping them to Ukraine. Enough with this nonsense.
woolfe9998
Lifer
- Apr 8, 2013
- 16,227
- 14,220
- 136
Putin and Russia's military are so damn barbaric.
www.cnn.com
Article is discussing various Russian atrocities, mainly the targetting of shopping centers and apartment buildings with cruise missiles.
He's arguing that Biden needs to declare Russia a "state sponsor of terrorism" which would evidently tighten the sanctions noose even further as “they would extend further to any other companies around the world doing business with Russian entities.”
I'm inclined to agree at this point.
Opinion: Even by Russia's standards, this was a particularly repulsive attack | CNN
As Russia's invasion of Ukraine approaches the one year mark, the bombing of a residential building in Dnipro -- with a missile usually reserved for sinking ships -- should not be seen as simply another red line crossed by the Kremlin, writes Michael Bociurkiw.
Article is discussing various Russian atrocities, mainly the targetting of shopping centers and apartment buildings with cruise missiles.
He's arguing that Biden needs to declare Russia a "state sponsor of terrorism" which would evidently tighten the sanctions noose even further as “they would extend further to any other companies around the world doing business with Russian entities.”
I'm inclined to agree at this point.
RnR_au
Platinum Member
- Jun 6, 2021
- 2,415
- 5,759
- 106
I don't believe there is an issue with the main gun. Its a South Korean design;
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CN08_120_mm_gun
feralkid
Lifer
- Jan 28, 2002
- 16,798
- 4,890
- 136
so once again the brits are leading the way
i said it ages ago, as much as i dont like Boris , i felt he dragged france and germany kicking and screaming into arming Ukraine. Its never a good look when the country who left the EU puts more skin in the game for the EU then the key nations of the EU.
i said it ages ago, as much as i dont like Boris , i felt he dragged france and germany kicking and screaming into arming Ukraine. Its never a good look when the country who left the EU puts more skin in the game for the EU then the key nations of the EU.
Last edited:
leopards are perfectly good tanks, like all tanks alot of it can come down to how you use them. need mech inf support.Maybe the Leopards are not that good...
Lost_in_the_HTTP
Lifer
- Nov 17, 2019
- 13,165
- 7,834
- 136
Nobody talking about this?
Ukrainian interior minister, top officials killed in helicopter crash
The Washington Post|13 hours ago
KYIV, Ukraine — Ukrainian Interior Minister Denis Monastyrsky and other top ministry officials were killed Wednesday morning when their government helicopter crashed near a kindergarten just ...
.
Ukrainian interior minister, top officials killed in helicopter crash
KYIV, Ukraine — Ukrainian Interior Minister Denis Monastyrsky and other top ministry officials were killed Wednesday morning when their government helicopter crashed near a kindergarten just ...
.
Jaskalas
Lifer
- Jun 23, 2004
- 35,077
- 9,198
- 136
Our Abrams are deemed by the Pentagon as simply a bad fit for the Ukrainian army. Something about it being a logistical nightmare to support and maintain. They apparently have no other objection, but that is not something that is likely to be overcome in order for it to be sent over. This was public knowledge before Germany's boast.... making it completely hollow as they know we are not sending Abrams.
K1052
Elite Member
- Aug 21, 2003
- 51,215
- 43,393
- 136
The worst of it is likely fuel consumption. The M1s guzzle fuel even at idle which is why M1A2 SEPv3 adds an APU. The Army simply didn't use to care. Export customers have also made this modification.
M1s are more sophisticated than say a T-72 but they aren't alien technology that Ukrainians could not be taught to comprehend and operate competently.
It’s really the fuel requirements and consumption, runs on some grade of av gas and without the APU burns an absurd amount whether at full throttle or sitting.
The turbine in the M1 can run on many different fuels. The Army just uses the same fuel for many systems to simplify logistics.
Brovane
Diamond Member
- Dec 18, 2001
- 6,081
- 2,360
- 136
I am also sure it will not help that Ukraine would potentially have 3 different versions of western MBT to deal with to keep in service from a maintenance perspective, Challenger 2, Leopard 2 and Abrams. This would be in addition to all the Russian MBT's they have in service. Overall Germany isn't be real helpful right now. I am hoping that someone from the Biden administration has a frank but private conversation with them to stop being assholes and just send the MBT's. The Leopard 2 makes sense. The other thing to do would be to send the Abrams and tell Germany their Leopards are no longer needed.
I wonder what extent of political bullshit/cover Germany is looking for.
Meaning - are they looking for the US to send M1s to give them political cover to authorize a lot of Leopards or are they looking for excuses to not send them?
Brovane
Diamond Member
- Dec 18, 2001
- 6,081
- 2,360
- 136
I think at this point they are just looking for excuses not to send them. I think Germany is worried that Ukraine will use the MBT's to start seriously pushing Russia out of Ukraine including Donbas and Crimea and the Russians will go ape-shit nuclear and Berlin would be a target. Germany probably hopes that there can be negotiated settlement and they are willing to sacrifice chunks of Ukraine to keep the Russians happy.
Last edited:
Germany was perfectly happy with letting Russia steal Ukrainian land the last two times, as long as German companies and politicians could immediately get back to business as usual with Russia. If Russia had just grabbed a chunk of the Donbas and stopped there, the Germans would have done it a third time in 2022 as well ~ still to be seen if this time is really different now for Germany, but probably not. I fully expect Germany to push to immediately remove sanctions the second that Russia declares the invasion "complete" as long as the Russians agree to stop bombing Ukrainian civilians and civilian infrastructure - even if there still is an active line of conflict.
Last edited:
Indus
Lifer
- May 11, 2002
- 14,673
- 10,255
- 136
TRENDING THREADS
-
Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)- Started by DisEnchantment
- Replies: 24K
-
Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes Discussion Threads
- Started by Tigerick
- Replies: 20K
-
-
-
Facebook
Twitter