Russia on brink of ... NOPE! Russia INVADES Ukraine!

[zinfamous]

Yeah, but they were up against Stallone then.

(don't forget that Stallone was actually training and fighting for the Taliban...GREAT MOVIE!)

 

[zinfamous]

LOL that was in the 80s and times have changed

Times have changed?

Then why is Russia fighting with 40 year-old equipment and 80 year old tactics against 15 year old equipment and 0 year-old military tactics?

Is being fucking stupid just how you live your life?

 

[you2]

Why doesn't this surprise me...

View attachment 88267

Source

Not sure why the Kremlin has declared war on Israel in this manner. Sure we know about possible Israeli equipment supplies going to Ukraine, but surely the gear wasn't that important or in volume to be significant to warrant these actions?

It is a tactic similar to what Hitler used in Nazi Germany. First Russia will paint Jews as vile, then eventually they will connect that to Ukraine and instead of Ukraine being run by Nazi it will be run by Jews....

 

[trenchfoot]

Times have changed?

Then why is Russia fighting with 40 year-old equipment and 80 year old tactics against 15 year old equipment and 0 year-old military tactics?

Is being fucking stupid just how you live your life?

YG has a big problem with exhorting the many advantages his Beloved Russia have over the democracies of the world simply because there aren't any, so he's forced to distract from that plain fact of life by attacking Russia's enemies with bullshit ghosts and nebulously vague agitprop mirages his and his country's propagandischeks have to dream up on a daily/hourly basis tagged as the "Firehose of Falsehood".

Russia's “Firehose of Falsehood” Propaganda Model

Russia's propaganda model is high-volume and multichannel, and it disseminates messages without regard for the truth. It is rapid, continuous, and repetitive, and it does not commit to consistency.

www.rand.org

 

[fskimospy]

YG has a big problem with exhorting the many advantages his Beloved Russia have over the democracies of the world simply because there aren't any, so he's forced to distract from that plain fact of life by attacking Russia's enemies with bullshit ghosts and nebulously vague agitprop mirages his and his country's propagandischeks have to dream up on a daily/hourly basis tagged as the "Firehose of Falsehood".

Russia's “Firehose of Falsehood” Propaganda Model

Russia's propaganda model is high-volume and multichannel, and it disseminates messages without regard for the truth. It is rapid, continuous, and repetitive, and it does not commit to consistency.

www.rand.org

While this is certainly true it is under-appreciated that this is true of all of Russian society as well. The entire culture is one of endemic lying at all times.

This is considered to be one of the main reasons why Putin got the invasion of Ukraine so wrong - from the bottom up everyone was lying to their superiors so Putin thought the Russian army was far more capable than its sorry state and he thought Ukrainians would welcome Russia as a liberator.

 

[zinfamous]

While this is certainly true it is under-appreciated that this is true of all of Russian society as well. The entire culture is one of endemic lying at all times.

This is considered to be one of the main reasons why Putin got the invasion of Ukraine so wrong - from the bottom up everyone was lying to their superiors so Putin thought the Russian army was far more capable than its sorry state and he thought Ukrainians would welcome Russia as a liberator.

Very true. Literally no Russian has ever been taught that WWII started before 1941. Any child born after that date, and history books published after (as all prior or with any contradictory information have been burned), understand that WWII began when Germany attacked them.

They absolutely do not know the truth of how Russia started WWII. They are never taught that Stalin funded and secretly trained, under cover, Hitler's tank corps within Russia for years, to avoid international sanctions and as part of their pact to divide eastern and northern Europe into their own respective spheres of influence. They absolutely are not exposed to the truth of the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact to divide Poland and "grant" the Baltic states to Russia.

I believe referring to Nazi Germany, truthfully, as allies of the Soviet Union is punishable by death.

Not a single occupying Russian living in these former occupied territories in Russia will ever argue from the truth that they began WWII with Hitler. That without the Soviet Union, Hitler would have never been able to invade Poland.

"Russia" is, has always been, and likely will forever remain a personality cult of impoverished serfs, slaves to the intended intellectual deprivations that they welcome, so long as the cheap vodka keeps flowing.

It's also important to remember that "Russia" has never actually existed. Moscow was an infant city of refugees fleeing Kiev when it was destroyed and occupied by the Khans for a century or so. It hasn't really changed. all that is considered the "Russian" Federation are simply non-slavic vassal states that, themselves, consider being occupied and not at all part of what "Russia" thinks is Russian.

 

[fskimospy]

Very true. Literally no Russian has ever been taught that WWII started before 1941. Any child born after that date, and history books published after (as all prior or with any contradictory information have been burned), understand that WWII began when Germany attacked them.

They absolutely do not know the truth of how Russia started WWII. They are never taught that Stalin funded and secretly trained, under cover, Hitler's tank corps within Russia for years, to avoid international sanctions and as part of their pact to divide eastern and northern Europe into their own respective spheres of influence. They absolutely are not exposed to the truth of the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact to divide Poland and "grant" the Baltic states to Russia.

I believe referring to Nazi Germany, truthfully, as allies of the Soviet Union is punishable by death.

Not a single occupying Russian living in these former occupied territories in Russia will ever argue from the truth that they began WWII with Hitler. That without the Soviet Union, Hitler would have never been able to invade Poland.

"Russia" is, has always been, and likely will forever remain a personality cult of impoverished serfs, slaves to the intended intellectual deprivations that they welcome, so long as the cheap vodka keeps flowing.

It's also important to remember that "Russia" has never actually existed. Moscow was an infant city of refugees fleeing Kiev when it was destroyed and occupied by the Khans for a century or so. It hasn't really changed. all that is considered the "Russian" Federation are simply non-slavic vassal states that, themselves, consider being occupied and not at all part of what "Russia" thinks is Russian.

There’s even the fun term ‘vranyo’ that perfectly encapsulates Russian society where person A deliberately lies and person B knows they are lying, but they both pretend it’s the truth anyway. This is what I’m talking about when I say Russia is a degenerate culture. It’s defined by lies, grievance, aggression, and brutality.

“Vranyo”: a previously untranslatable Russian word … | Glossophilia

 

[RnR_au]

They absolutely do not know the truth of how Russia started WWII. They are never taught that Stalin funded and secretly trained, under cover, Hitler's tank corps within Russia for years, to avoid international sanctions and as part of their pact to divide eastern and northern Europe into their own respective spheres of influence. They absolutely are not exposed to the truth of the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact to divide Poland and "grant" the Baltic states to Russia.

They apparently are also not taught about the Lend-Lease act. They would have had a much harder time of it against the Germans if America hadn't helped out in the degree that they did back then. Maybe the Iron Curtain wouldn't have arisen, but then again maybe the allies on d-day would have had a harder time of it as well. Stalin was chosen as the lesser evil over Hitler. And with what we know today, I can't say that the leaders of the time were wrong.

Just on the Russian culture of 'lying' - as mentioned in the posts above. I believe there is 'kitchen table talk' where the real honest talk gets off loaded. But its only within a very small trusted circle.

Like I have mentioned before, I used to work with a Russian couple here in Australia. Early in the piece I asked the husband on his thoughts on Putin. He just shrugged his shoulders and smiled. I thought it was weird at the time. But now with hindsight, why should he have said anything to me? I was not part of his 'kitchen table talk circle'.

Same when reporters stick a microphone into face of a Russian and asks their opinions on various political matters - why would they say what they really think? Their friends and family could get issues if such honest talk got back home.

So just be aware that there are two'ish worlds going on. The 'public one' is not representative of their 'real' culture.

 

[fskimospy]

They apparently are also not taught about the Lend-Lease act. They would have had a much harder time of it against the Germans if America hadn't helped out in the degree that they did back then. Maybe the Iron Curtain wouldn't have arisen, but then again maybe the allies on d-day would have had a harder time of it as well. Stalin was chosen as the lesser evil over Hitler. And with what we know today, I can't say that the leaders of the time were wrong.

Just on the Russian culture of 'lying' - as mentioned in the posts above. I believe there is 'kitchen table talk' where the real honest talk gets off loaded. But its only within a very small trusted circle.

Like I have mentioned before, I used to work with a Russian couple here in Australia. Early in the piece I asked the husband on his thoughts on Putin. He just shrugged his shoulders and smiled. I thought it was weird at the time. But now with hindsight, why should he have said anything to me? I was not part of his 'kitchen table talk circle'.

Same when reporters stick a microphone into face of a Russian and asks their opinions on various political matters - why would they say what they really think? Their friends and family could get issues if such honest talk got back home.

So just be aware that there are two'ish worlds going on. The 'public one' is not representative of their 'real' culture.

When I was in Russia I was shocked at the level of grievance and paranoia among regular people. I repeatedly heard how the US and the west hated Russia and were conspiring against it, and was repeatedly told ‘see? We aren’t as evil as you’re told!’ (Lol, turns out they are!)

What I think was most interesting was their refusal to believe me when I told them the average American is barely aware Russia exists most of the time and we just don’t think about them. I think this is because they think about us a LOT and consider themselves our peers, so their logical conclusion is we would do the same.

I think they would prefer we hate them, so long as we think about them and consider them important. It really seemed to bother them that we don’t.

 

[K1052]

What I think was most interesting was their refusal to believe me when I told them the average American is barely aware Russia exists most of the time and we just don’t think about them. I think this is because they think about us a LOT and consider themselves our peers, so their logical conclusion is we would do the same.

This is something peculiar with the Russians I have met who are convinced we're obsessed with them like they are us when it's really this:

 

[K1052]

Seems the AFU has received the Archers.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1720364662326186171

 

[Perknose]

There’s even the fun term ‘vranyo’ that perfectly encapsulates Russian society where person A deliberately lies and person B knows they are lying, but they both pretend it’s the truth anyway. This is what I’m talking about when I say Russia is a degenerate culture. It’s defined by lies, grievance, aggression, and brutality.

“Vranyo”: a previously untranslatable Russian word … | Glossophilia

In the former USSR employees at factories lived by the mantra, "You pretend to pay us a good wage and we pretend to work."

 

[Xcobra]

You guys need to start a 'Slapping YG Across the Face' thread. It's getting old to be engaging him in this thread. More Ukraine updates, less wiping the floor with a toolbag, pretty please O: )

 

[Jaskalas]

Got any dramatic examples?

Someone must have heard you.

This Russian Suicide Drone Is Blunting Ukraine’s Advance

Russia is catching up to Ukraine on battlefield drone use with the Lancet, as the U.S. sanctions its manufacturer​

 

[kage69]

Someone must have heard you.

This Russian Suicide Drone Is Blunting Ukraine’s Advance

Russia is catching up to Ukraine on battlefield drone use with the Lancet, as the U.S. sanctions its manufacturer​

Paywall boooo...

I wouldn't say the upgrades to Lancet's guidance and warhead were drastic, more incremental, but it still isn't on par with where Western drones are now. It works though, unlike many Russian weapons systems, Lancet has built a healthy respect among front line Ukrainians. No where near as noisy as a Shahed, but thankfully the warhead isn't as nasty either. Does seem like their use has increased since last spring though. They're only about 3m Rubles, or $35k a pop apparently, but then Russia is broke and it's economic prospects are kinda shitty. What numbers they have now I attribute to Chinese parts and a variety of illicit things from the West. I feel like one of those can be remedied touts suite if we have the political will and just knuckle up.

But for comparison, that kind of money for Ukraine is (roughly) a GLSDB rocket for a HIMARs, M270 or franken launcher. A 250lb class weapon with extreme accuracy, all aspect attack angles, and a range of 150km. It's not a great comparison I know, Lancet is a loiter weapon of course, but it carries a much smaller warhead and has half the range. USAF's cool lil HOG-J seeker can turn any SDB package into HARM for GPS jammers too, though I don't know if we supplied those come to think of it. I hope so!

 

[dainthomas]

LOL that was in the 80s and times have changed bud. BTW, Russia is one country. NATO is a coalition of 30. Big difference.

Secondly, NATO is about to lose another one in Ukraine.

And we know NATO doesn’t want war with Russia. Biden himself has said so several times.

Proxy wars/regime change only works in countries NATO can bully around like Iraq and Libya. They won’t dare try anything against a nuclear armed country. They’re too chickenshit regarding the consequences.

If they weren't being propped up by their (likely mostly not functional) nukes, even a few smallish European NATO countries could wipe out Russia's laughingtock army of conscripts and prisoners in a couple weeks.

 

[Pens1566]

If they weren't being propped up by their (likely mostly not functional) nukes, even a few smallish European NATO countries could wipe out Russia's laughingtock army of conscripts and prisoners in a couple weeks.

Poland alone would wipe the floor with them.

 

[trenchfoot]

While this is certainly true it is under-appreciated that this is true of all of Russian society as well. The entire culture is one of endemic lying at all times.

This is considered to be one of the main reasons why Putin got the invasion of Ukraine so wrong - from the bottom up everyone was lying to their superiors so Putin thought the Russian army was far more capable than its sorry state and he thought Ukrainians would welcome Russia as a liberator.

Agreed. Between that and the western democracies style of Ukraine's military doctrine that places emphasis on lower echelon commands down to squad level elements being able to make time sensitive decisions based on actual events as they unfold that are independent from their higher commands that's far away from the AO, the antiquated rigid top down structure of the Russian chain of command has shown how obsolete that style of conducting warfare is.

Add in how motivated the AFU personnel are against the Russians that are suffering from low morale along with the assistance NATO is providing and it seems that Ukraine has every essential element they need to retrieve every acre of land that got taken away from them.

 

[Young Grasshopper]

More bad news from Ukraine:

Ukraine's commanders refuse orders to advance as war effort on brink

Volodymyr Zelensky has said freezing the war is the same as losing it but some Ukrainian commanders are reportedly refusing to advance against Vladimir Putin's forces.

www.express.co.uk

Ukraine’s top commanders are refusing orders to advance against Vladimir Putin's forces on the frontlines as their troops suffer from a lack of equipment and manpower.

He claimed that some top Ukrainian commanders were refusing orders to advance, some of which came directly from Zelensky.

The bad news just keeps piling up doesn’t it? It’s amazing how much the narrative in the mainstream media regarding how this is all going for Ukraine has changed.

 

[cytg111]

More bad news from Ukraine:

Ukraine's commanders refuse orders to advance as war effort on brink

Volodymyr Zelensky has said freezing the war is the same as losing it but some Ukrainian commanders are reportedly refusing to advance against Vladimir Putin's forces.

www.express.co.uk

The bad news just keeps piling up doesn’t it? It’s amazing how much the narrative in the mainstream media regarding how this is all going for Ukraine has changed.

Should probably just glass over Moscow and be done with it. There is no cure for a rabid dog. Gotta chance it.

Right?

 

[Young Grasshopper]

Times have changed?

Then why is Russia fighting with 40 year-old equipment and 80 year old tactics against 15 year old equipment and 0 year-old military tactics?

Is being fucking stupid just how you live your life?

No being stupid is believing Ukraine is winning this conflict, or thinking they would win it.

Being stupid is not being able to win a war against an army using ‘40 year old equipment’ and ‘80 year old tactics’.

 

[fskimospy]

Agreed. Between that and the western democracies style of Ukraine's military doctrine that places emphasis on lower echelon commands down to squad level elements being able to make time sensitive decisions based on actual events as they unfold that are independent from their higher commands that's far away from the AO, the antiquated rigid top down structure of the Russian chain of command has shown how obsolete that style of conducting warfare is.

Add in how motivated the AFU personnel are against the Russians that are suffering from low morale along with the assistance NATO is providing and it seems that Ukraine has every essential element they need to retrieve every acre of land that got taken away from them.

I guess it's not surprising that the Russian Army is as backwards as the rest of the country.

I remember reading something that explained why the Russians so frequently engage in repeated failed assaults for the same territory and it comes back to the degenerate culture of lying. Basically the people conducting the original failed assault will lie to their commander and say 'although we didn't take the position we killed huge numbers of the enemy', even if they didn't kill a single one. The commander then thinks another assault will finish them off so he sends a new group in. When that fails too, he lies to his commander and says victory is imminent, so his commander orders more troops there, and so on, and so forth.

It reminds me of that video from soon after the war broke out where the Ukrainian soldier was like 'we're very lucky they are so fucking stupid'.

 

[fskimospy]

No being stupid is believing Ukraine is winning this conflict, or thinking they would win it.

Being stupid is not being able to win a war against an army using ‘40 year old equipment’ and ‘80 year old tactics’.

Ukraine mostly uses the same old equipment and has fought a country three times its size to a standstill and inflicted massive casualties on the 'second best army in the world' (LOL).

Everyone thought Ukraine would lose very quickly when the war started and two years in Russia has lost half the territory it originally took. Russia's original goals were very clearly to decapitate the Ukrainian government and install a puppet, so in terms of the actual goals of the war Russia has already lost. Turns out when your country is run by a bunch of degenerate, lying shitbags your army isn't as good as you thought.

I don't think you've ever tried to explain why, as a lover of peace, that you support the people who started the war. Any insight there?

 

[Ajay]

I think they also lack people with the expertise to make the equipment and possibly lack all the component supplies necessary to fully build them out, which means they probably won't actually be useful.

This seems like them building stuff as a show of force. The problem is, we already know how full of shit Russia is.



I think Russia's game is to break the military aid by stirring up the Isreali situation. Stir up anti-Semitism which will make our support of Israel more critical, so we take funds from Ukraine and send it to Israel.

Republicans have basically been trying to make this case ever since the attacks.

Could be the case, or, it may be one area where China is helping them out. After ripping off Russian military designs for years, they least China could do would help them make drones.

 

[RnR_au]

Some gear news...

Ukraine's Armed Forces say they have implemented upgrades to the domestically produced Missile System Hrim-2 (Thunder) and have struck a target at a range of 700km (435 miles).

Source

Piranha AVD 360 electronic warfare complex, designed for protection of armoured vehicles and personnel against Russian UAVs, currently under development in Ukraine

“The complex creates a protective dome up to 600 meters around itself. Under the influence of the system, the copter or kamikaze drone cannot receive commands and transmit data. As a result, the "bird" either hangs in the air, makes an emergency landing, or falls uncontrollably.

Piranha also suppresses satellite navigation systems, for example, the Russian GLONASS. Now the system has successfully passed field tests and is ready for serial production.” - Minister of Digital Transformation of Ukraine, Mykhailo Fedorov.

Source

The down side of this EW complex is the sheer numbers that are required, It may only get fielded by infantry on the front lines at the start.

Edit:

The Ukrainian mud season is ending Russian Army logistics by Scooby Doo/Loaf/UAZ vans.

Is there anything available right now to replace them in sufficient numbers the next 90 days?

The answer is "_NO_!"

Source