** Official Star Craft 2 Multiplayer Thread **

[Glitchny]

Original, but not really doin' it for me...

How bout, Just cause you're in Diamond doesn't mean that you are good? There are many bad Diamond players. Get to #1 in your diamond league. Hit the top 200 in your region. Choose a different race and see if you stay in Diamond. Win 5 games only using Ravens and Marines.


Disclaimer: Not saying you're bad, but it might get you to play more

 

[SpicyCurry]

Not sure if it works but you need to micro like crazy while the rushers doesn't need to do much.
With your build you will have 1 zealot and 1 stalker vs.my at least 4 zealots or if I rush out earlier it's 3v1. I will just kill your nexus if you try to micro probes and stalker. You can't micro your nexus away and you have no chance getting back into the game if it falls.
If I don't succeed you still had to pull away your workers for almost 1 min to help kill the zealots.
(killing the nexus is actually a strategy from fastest maps on sc1)
Another option depending on your build is to kill the pylon supporting your gateways. You won't be able to produce anything ->gg

I won't say it's impossible to beat but it's way easier to just rush yourself than microing around like crazy. Because rushing needs no skill.

I can see targetting the Pylon as a viable strategy, but never the Nexus. Again, the goal of the fending off the assault is to build up about 3 or 4 Stalkers. Four Zealots would need a lot of time to take down a Nexus. Taking into account that you'd be harassing the Zealots with your own troops, then it'd be very tough to take it down (assuming a normal map, not fastest).

Zealots targetting Pylons is actually a problem. I definitely lost one of my earlier games since I didn't place my 2nd Pylon close to my first cluster of buildings. My current building placement in PvP makes the first Pylon more protected in case I scout a 2Gate.

I do agree with you that rushing is easier and less micro intensive. However, the tech advantage you gain from going Cyber Core can be enough to offset the economic damage you'll receive. Which then puts you in a nice spot for midgame.

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

put it at choke points and you won't be able to avoid it. also it stops people from sending stuff like observers in to peek on your base. go around the big circle? take time off their rush and die to the tanks you got out while they were going around.

meh... it's useful but not 150/150 useful.
i'd rather camp a unit or 2 at a watch tower.

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

Original, but not really doin' it for me...

yeah, i really didn't try hard on that one.

 

[Barfo]

I haven't even logged on in a week. I feel like getting to diamond was enough satisfaction and now I don't care.

Someone say something to bring me back.

Come back to SC2 or I'll hunt you down and kill you.

 

[linjy2]

Zealots targetting Pylons is actually a problem. I definitely lost one of my earlier games since I didn't place my 2nd Pylon close to my first cluster of buildings. My current building placement in PvP makes the first Pylon more protected in case I scout a 2Gate.

yea i learned this way back. so i tend to clump my pylons near my gateways. so if they take out one pylon, it is still powered. two pylon, still powered. etc..

 

[Ika]

lol I just did teh most fail Planetary Fortress rush on Kulas, on my friend's Bronze account. 9 assimilator, 10 bay, two scouts, barracks while in transit, landed freakin OUT OF RANGE of his Nexus (his CC was planted right where I would have landed), and nearly lost my SCVs before I could get marines up. The other guy was retarded though and kept building zealots when he had 500 minerals. If he had the sense to move out and drop a Nexus somewhere with a single probe he would've won, probably. Oh well, it was funny while it lasted 😛 and good APM exercise, 230 burst APM and 100 average.

 

[Kev]

lol I just did teh most fail Planetary Fortress rush on Kulas, on my friend's Bronze account. 9 assimilator, 10 bay, two scouts, barracks while in transit, landed freakin OUT OF RANGE of his Nexus (his CC was planted right where I would have landed), and nearly lost my SCVs before I could get marines up. The other guy was retarded though and kept building zealots when he had 500 minerals. If he had the sense to move out and drop a Nexus somewhere with a single probe he would've won, probably. Oh well, it was funny while it lasted 😛 and good APM exercise, 230 burst APM and 100 average.

do you have a replay of this? I want to try some of these cheese rushes, I want to see what its like to be on the other side of it.

 

[imaheadcase]

Well screw this, everyone is doing this now in bronze games. Its not even fun to play against humans.

FIVE losses in a row to just probe rushes.

The sad part is the second the game starts they say "GG thx for playing" sigh.

I doubt we will see any fix for it.

 

[Pia]

meh... it's useful but not 150/150 useful.
i'd rather camp a unit or 2 at a watch tower.

It's not 150/150, it's 125/100 (plus whatever SCV mines in 25 seconds). A very low price for virtually negating offensive warp prisms, drops and hidden nydus worms, pinpointing scouting overlords, giving you extra three seconds to position against any incoming attack or harass, and giving your siege tanks full range without having a vulnerable observer unit out in front. Just one extra shot from a couple siege tanks earns back the full price of the tower. Watch towers are generally neither in your base nor in your opponent's choke. Sensor towers don't take any supply away from your army, and they pressure the opponent not unlike creep pressures the opponent.

 

[Kev]

Well screw this, everyone is doing this now in bronze games. Its not even fun to play against humans.

FIVE losses in a row to just probe rushes.

The sad part is the second the game starts they say "GG thx for playing" sigh.

I doubt we will see any fix for it.

I'm in bronze and I haven't seen this yet.

 

[linjy2]

Well screw this, everyone is doing this now in bronze games. Its not even fun to play against humans.

FIVE losses in a row to just probe rushes.

The sad part is the second the game starts they say "GG thx for playing" sigh.

I doubt we will see any fix for it.

ouch... what race do you play?

when they come, make sure you group all your probes to attack back. i think maybe you should play the single player challenges some more to get more practice on your micro.

or play with a friend on custom map and have him worker rush you and you try to defend it.

 

[Udgnim]

people that worker rush are doing it for an achievement

 

[Barfo]

I had two players probe rush me in a 4v4 the other day. They were so bad at it I killed their probes with my hatchery at 10 or so hit points, lol.

 

[shortylickens]

Well screw this, everyone is doing this now in bronze games. Its not even fun to play against humans.

FIVE losses in a row to just probe rushes.

The sad part is the second the game starts they say "GG thx for playing" sigh.

I doubt we will see any fix for it.

More maps with rocks on the paths?
Changes to the current maps?

 

[eLiu]

I just tried it, but the only problem is that I wasn't keeping my build order close to similar as I would've preferred. But the thing that it showed me is that both builds are very similar resource-wise; however, they differ in the point in which you get your first combat unit....

RAX -> SD
18 SCVs, 5 Marines, 1 MULE ... 25/27 Food ... 5:04/20:55
spending: eco-1700 , tech-550, Army-300 ... 2550
resources: 85m, 216g

First marine at 2:34
walled off at 3:42

SD -> RAX
21 SCVs, 4 Marines ... 27/27 Food ... 5:00/17:57
spending: eco-1850 , Tech-300, Army-250 .. 2400
resources: 230m, 496g

First marine at 3:12
walled off at 3:24

It wasn't perfect science due to me not adhering to a specific build very well, but the biggest thing that I'm looking at is the time in which you can get your first marine. Rax to SD has a 40 second advantage on SD to Rax and the wall-off times were somewhat arbitrary as I could've built it earlier, but I think I avoided it since I was building a Comsat anyway.

EDIT:

Although, I have no idea how quick a 6pool gets Zerglings to your base 😱.

First, note that this wasn't a 'perfect' run by any measure. I never build just marines so I winged it a bit, but I think it's an OK demo of the gist of things. So I get, at the 5 minute mark:
19 SCVs (20th is <1sec away), 1 MULE, 7 (8th is 2 seconds away, 9th is 9s away) marines, 29/43 supply (oops too many depots)
I have 2 rax up + 1 factory on the way. Adding a 3rd rax & always producing out of those buildings constantly, I have enough to expand by ~7min or so, along w/having a engineering bay down + combat shields going.
Spending: 1875/550/450
Resources: 100/128

1st marine at 3:15: could've been a bit earlier: 1) I started orbital command after rax1 finishes (drains all money); 2) in earlier parts, I go for constant SCV production over starting buildings earlier. I'd estimate that in sacrificing at most 1 SCV, I could probably get that first marine out by 2:50 or so. Or by trading off starting the 2nd rax later, I could finish the wall off by around 2:45.
last depot in wall started at ~3, done by 3:30.

Anyway, in fastest case, my first marine is no more than 30s slower than yours; and at worst, closer to 1min slower. But I can finish the wall off quite early. And my economic situation is quite a bit stronger.

Maybe I haven't been fighting the most competent/aggressive rushers, but I've never had a problem. And if/when you survive the rush, you're all set to counter-attack & expand, exploiting your advantage.

 

[Aikouka]

Anyway, in fastest case, my first marine is no more than 30s slower than yours; and at worst, closer to 1min slower. But I can finish the wall off quite early. And my economic situation is quite a bit stronger.

The only problem I have is that I believe I wasn't building SCVs enough in my Rax->SD attempt as it felt a lot more fluid in my SD->Rax. You might say, "Well, that's because you were delaying it too much", but that's not it... there were two periods in each build (ignoring building a comsat) where I could not build a SCV because of minerals and I don't have exact numbers, but I believe they're both about the same amount of time regardless of build. So, in theory, I should have the same number of SCVs in both.

In a perfect world, I could have ~23 SCVs by the time you hit 5 minutes (300 / 17s per SCV + 6 starting). Comsat build time is 35 seconds, or essentially 2 SCVs. With the two delays in SCVs, it shows why I had 19 in the one build and 21 in the other (since SD->Rax didn't even get a comsat in the first 5 minutes).

To get a Marine out at 2:50, you would have to start build it at 2:25. To do this, you'd need to start building your Barracks at 1:25.

 

[razor2025]

Had my first 1v1 placement tonight. Played mostly 2v2 with my friends, and few 3v3 and even a sprinkle of 4v4 mayhem. 4 win streak and 1 loss at beginning (maybe I'll get lucky and win my next one?) placed me on Gold. Went against 3 Protoss and 2 Terran players.

I went 9 rax, 10 SD build, just so I have fighting chance against any cheese, save for super fast proxy cannon. Then adjusted according to what I scouted and guessed their build. Watching those Day 9 videos helped a lot of gathering and deciphering intel.

1st game against Protoss - Lost due to my dumb decision not too attack him while he warped in 3 gates + his original 1. For about a minute I had 9 marines vs 1 zealot and 1 stalker. Could've done some economic damage. Second dumb mistake was building a expo and getting caught in middle of moving it out and mineral short on marines. Also forgot to bring back in 4-5 marines I had sent out to scout. Could've made a difference.

2nd game against Protoss - Scouted each other, and saw that he had 2 gas built, figured he'd go collosus or void. Built up a decent MMM ball with 3 tanks for support. Moved it in close to his base and about to hit it, when I saw his voids moving to mine. Tried rallying a quick viking + marine defense, but 5 Voids were just too OP. He was smart enough to snipe my production instead of going for my mineral lines with turrets. Since I lost the defense on base, I decided to just trade base with him. So I razed his base faster than his 5 voids, making sure to trap his probes so he can't sneak a building. He pulled out his 5 voids to stop my army from killing all of his building, but too late.

3rd game against Terran - Went slightly faster expo than the other guy. I guess he went mid-game Banshee+Cloak, but my nice turret+bunker combo took 2 of his 3 banshee out. Sent my MMM ball and dropped it inside his base, slaughtered half his marine, and he just dropped. Watched the replay, and saw that he had at least 20+ marines in his expo that might've stopped my attack.

4th game against Protoss - Went longer than should have. Few skirmish in middle with Stalker+Zealots+Collosus vs MMM+Tanks+Vikings. I pushed him hard, and he neglected to expand. I had 3 bases running by the time he filled his 2nd. Near the end where I was starting to raze his main, he had DTs, and I was totally unprepared. Had to pull my stuff back losing half my army to DTs, and most of my main. Managed to saved 2 starports and a barrack. Built ravens and refilled my MMMball. Just to slow his rebuild on his main, I dropped on to his 3rd, sniped his nexus before his DTs did too much damage. Once I got Ravens, dropped in his main, and razed most of it. Using my 2nd mass MM ball, I finished his desperate 4th base, and he dropped.

5th game against Terran - Hillarious end. Scouted and saw 2 gas again. Figured he'd drop or banshee. So I went 3 rax build + mass marines. Since the map was scrap station, I decided to blast through the 2 rocks. By the time I was at his gates, I had 20 marines with 6 in route, another 6 queded. Comsat the front, saw it barely defended, busted right in. He had a lone marines on the watch tower, but I bet he never guessed I'd blow through the rocks so fast.

 

[Glitchny]

ok, so I just won a game that I had NO BUSINESS winning. I really don't know how it happened other than my opponent was very bad or he was just playing cocky. Platinum ZvT (I just made plat recently) and I've been playing poorly so far.

I knew he was going baneling/muta when I scouted the double gas early but I kinda went all stupid and forgot what to do. Not really sure why I made a BC at all, I was all over the place, didn't make Thors until way late etc etc. SO he harasses with Muta's and I fend it off and then he comes back and I've got pretty much nothing, my macro was terrible I really don't know what I was doing.

But somehow while he is attacking my main I manage to get up 20+ turrets in about 45sec at my expansion(No Joke, my base goes from 0 turrets to 20 before I finish a Factory). So with me cornered he still doesn't expand and take map control. So I build up within my turret turtle and push out to the gold expo with 1BC, 4 tanks, 4 thors and about 16 marines, and I win... I damn near shat when he said GG, I figured he was just playing with me.

EPIC TURTLE

at about 20min in you can see my supa fast turtle, and also watch me failing repeatedly in the beginning of the game. I'm still amazed that I won, he could have had the entire map! :ninja:

 

[eLiu]

The only problem I have is that I believe I wasn't building SCVs enough in my Rax->SD attempt as it felt a lot more fluid in my SD->Rax. You might say, "Well, that's because you were delaying it too much", but that's not it... there were two periods in each build (ignoring building a comsat) where I could not build a SCV because of minerals and I don't have exact numbers, but I believe they're both about the same amount of time regardless of build. So, in theory, I should have the same number of SCVs in both.

In a perfect world, I could have ~23 SCVs by the time you hit 5 minutes (300 / 17s per s, or essentially 2 SCVs. With the two delays in SCVs, it shows why I had 19 in the one build and 21 iSCV + 6 starting). Comsat build time is 35 seconds, or essentially 2 SCVs. With the two delays in SCVs, it shows why I had 19 in the one build and 21 in the other (since SD->Rax didn't even get a comsat in the first 5 minutes).

To get a Marine out at 2:50, you would have to start build it at 2:25. To do this, you'd need to start building your Barracks at 1:25.

Might be worth going back and seeing if you can get that squared away (building more SCVs in the rax->depot build). I still don't see how it could work out to build the exact same # of SCVs as the sd->rax path, but maybe the early rax isn't as costly as I think it is. But at the 5min mark, there's about a 300 resource deficit btwn the 2 plans, which is pretty substantial this early in the game. It would benefit your game a bit (in addition to proving me wrong 😛) to fix that. Anyway, if you post more details about your build I'd be curious to play w/it.

I might've/probably epic-failed on that 2:50 estimate--possibly I just counted minerals & forgot to see when the rax was done... :/ I'll take a look tomorrow. And I should also see where the hell that 23rd SCV went. I didn't think I did so poorly as to be short an SCV 🙁

Also another thing I forgot to mention--your builds seem to build up a good amt of gas in the beginning--there's no reason to stockpile gas like that. Since your econ spending is an even#, I think that means you have 2 refineries. So consider delaying the 2nd one till a time closer to when you need it.

 

[AznAnarchy99]

Got moved up to Gold 1v1. Guess the easy games are over now

 

[imaheadcase]

ouch... what race do you play?

when they come, make sure you group all your probes to attack back. i think maybe you should play the single player challenges some more to get more practice on your micro.

or play with a friend on custom map and have him worker rush you and you try to defend it.

Yah i tried every possible way. Its not really fun microing for 5 min just drones.

I'm just going to stop playing multiplayer 1v1 till they fix it. Brother was just telling me same thing today he quit 1vs1 because of worker rushes.

 

[Yeem]

So how come we've got like -4 placement matches remaining in 3v3? We've played 9 games and haven't been ranked yet. This was yesterday. And we still aren't ranked today when I checked.

Played with another team today as well. Played 6 games and we're not "placed".

Glitch? Normal? We're new to this game ^_^

 

[linjy2]

Yah i tried every possible way. Its not really fun microing for 5 min just drones.

I'm just going to stop playing multiplayer 1v1 till they fix it. Brother was just telling me same thing today he quit 1vs1 because of worker rushes.

i played a 2v2 ranked where both allies probe/scv rushed me. and still failed. i was rofling so bad. i think the reason for their fail is they didnt gather 10 before hitting me. they took the initial 5 workers so = 10 for both of them and came and hit me. by that time i had 11 scvs and just out microed them.

So how come we've got like -4 placement matches remaining in 3v3? We've played 9 games and haven't been ranked yet. This was yesterday. And we still aren't ranked today when I checked.

Played with another team today as well. Played 6 games and we're not "placed".

Glitch? Normal? We're new to this game ^_^

if u change teams, u have to work your way up each time for a different team. but for ur case maybe the ranking system was down when you played. it should say when you log in if the ranking is being updated or not.

 

[Ika]

do you have a replay of this? I want to try some of these cheese rushes, I want to see what its like to be on the other side of it.

This is the vid I was trying to follow with my rush.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5NgS7UPsjc

Start watching at around 4 minutes. I was significantly slower than this guy, I forgot to put three SCVs on my gas at first, and Kulas is a much bigger map. I don't have the replay because it's on my friend's account, though.