I just got back from seeing it. It wasn't as bad as I was expecting from reading a lot of comments about it online. As I think someone said earlier, it reminded me a lot of ROTJ. IMO the trilogy started going downhill as soon as Neo revived Trinity in reloaded. The battle scenes were pretty cool. Trinity's death scene kinda lingered and was cliched. The battles with all the squiddies reminded me of starship troopers ums map in Starcraft, anyone ever played that? lolz
I didn't enjoy any of the ZION stuff in reloaded or revolutions all that much. I dunno, there's just something about it. If they're not in the Matrix, I want them to be in a ship =). In Rev. the beginning action was amazing as well as the end.
My favorite part of The Matrix as a whole is when they're going into the matrix to carry out some mission.
My favorite part of The Matrix as a whole is when they're going into the matrix to carry out some mission.
only read the first few pages, but i thought i would put in a little comment.
The whole trilogy is supposed to draw a lot of things from christianity, and the ending is like the "end" of the bible. Neo dies and saves the human race from the wrath of God, and the humans are supposed to remember the sacrifice and act in accordance with God's will from that point on. I know there are some wierd points where it does not make sense (e.g. neo as jesus and the machines as god... there is no similar link in the movie as there is in the bible).
I feel that this is the "end" of the matrix trilogy. Much like how the major parts of the christianity focuses on the life of Jesus, this trilogy focuses on neo, from beginning to end. There will be other things--similar to the animatrix--but these will serve a purpose similar to the other books in the new testament (letters from John, Acts, etc).
I thought that the movie laid on the bible references A LOT. When the machines stopped fighting, that skinny kid (who released the counter lever in that mech) ran into the temple and shouted "NEO SAVED US!!" or something like that. He was like one of the followers of Jesus in the bible spreading news of his death/our forgiveness. Or the whole second coming of neo/second coming of christ deal.
Anyways thats just my input on this discussion... considering i only read 3 pages of this 7 page discussion i am pretty sure these statements have already been stated/dismissed
The whole trilogy is supposed to draw a lot of things from christianity, and the ending is like the "end" of the bible. Neo dies and saves the human race from the wrath of God, and the humans are supposed to remember the sacrifice and act in accordance with God's will from that point on. I know there are some wierd points where it does not make sense (e.g. neo as jesus and the machines as god... there is no similar link in the movie as there is in the bible).
I feel that this is the "end" of the matrix trilogy. Much like how the major parts of the christianity focuses on the life of Jesus, this trilogy focuses on neo, from beginning to end. There will be other things--similar to the animatrix--but these will serve a purpose similar to the other books in the new testament (letters from John, Acts, etc).
I thought that the movie laid on the bible references A LOT. When the machines stopped fighting, that skinny kid (who released the counter lever in that mech) ran into the temple and shouted "NEO SAVED US!!" or something like that. He was like one of the followers of Jesus in the bible spreading news of his death/our forgiveness. Or the whole second coming of neo/second coming of christ deal.
Anyways thats just my input on this discussion... considering i only read 3 pages of this 7 page discussion i am pretty sure these statements have already been stated/dismissed
They shoulda made it so that Neo was still winning the fight at the end with Smith, but he sacrificed himself because that's the only way he could truly "win." The way they did it, it wasn't much of a "choice" to allow himself to be infected, he was getting raped anyways.
I disagree...I think that final CGI-laden punch was to show that Neo could go on as long as Smith could...but he realised the only way to BEAT him was to give in and let Smith overwrite him.
thats what i got too; JimRaynor didn't you see how pissed off smith was getting after neo kept getting up--smith couldnt understand why/how. Also neo told the machines more information before he went back into the matrix, that the viewers didnt hear--that to beat smith Neo must be taken over by smith then be unplugged. The first movie neo was lost, the second neo seemed to know more, and the third neo knew more than anyone, even the machines.
Queasy
Moderator<br>Console Gaming
- Aug 24, 2001
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When Naiobi is explaining to Morpheus about what she was doing in the Matrix and then later explaining to the council about why she gave Neo her ship.
I haven't played Enter the Matrix I just know its basic plot. But it made little sense to me as to why you include a conversation about her talking with the Oracle in a way that expects the audience to understand what the conversation was about.
The end of the movie shows a freshly rebooted matrix. If Smith took over everyone, that would mean that the entire crop has been lost. So who is in the matrix now, other than the programs?
the people the agents took over survive it. they just lose orientation, cause they don't know where they are and how they got there. i guess the same happened with peopke took over by smith. so humans are still alive.
(look at the matrix-comics on the official site for evidence on this)
Originally posted by: Luagsch
These movies leave so much unsaid that any pet theory someone comes up with becomes law for them
Kanalua
Diamond Member
- Jun 14, 2001
- 4,860
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me and my wife saw the movie last night....we both liked it (I really liked it). I told my wife that some people here didn't like the movie because of plot holes, that the movie didn't answer all the questions, and she told me something very insightful. Chick flicks wrap everything up at the end of the movie because girls need all the loose ends tied, all the questions asked, etc.
She's right...about the movie and about alot of people in here...
She's right...about the movie and about alot of people in here...
TheToOTaLL
Platinum Member
- Oct 7, 2001
- 2,246
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That was great! everyone see the MEATRIX!
Also, I saw the matrix last night and I read through about 4 pages here because I couldn't figure it all out.
Was I hearing things or did Smith say that "Thanks Mom" when the Oracle called him a bastard?
An what happens to the Merovingian? Does man get freed from the matrix?
Also, if Neo and Smith are opposites and can only exist with the other what do the machines care of Neo dies, if the machines kill Neo then according to the virus theory that many have brought up- Smith would've died anyways. That's why I think the virus theory is flawed... maybe we need a better analogy?
Queasy
Moderator<br>Console Gaming
- Aug 24, 2001
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Yep. The Oracle is sort of Smith's mom. She brought about Neo and Neo brought about the virus-like Agent Smith.
I imagine he lives happily ever after making orgasm cakes.
Smith was brought about to bring balance to the equation that Neo was a variable of. The Oracle said, "Everything has a beginning and an end." Smith repeated that in the crater. Neo realized nothing could be done about Smith until Smith's purpose was complete. When Smith infected Neo his purpose was at an end. Neo's sacrafice allowed the Matrix to delete Smith.
Or something like that.
Smith was brought about to bring balance to the equation that Neo was a variable of. The Oracle said, "Everything has a beginning and an end." Smith repeated that in the crater. Neo realized nothing could be done about Smith until Smith's purpose was complete. When Smith infected Neo his purpose was at an end. Neo's sacrafice allowed the Matrix to delete Smith.
Or something like that.
Ok so your answer to my question is that Neo had to let Smith take over him only in the Matrix world. Oh ok, so if Neo died in the REAL world then smith would win in the matrix world and thus destroy the Matrix, which would've killed all the machines in the Real world, after the machines killed all the humans in Zion. Thus total anhilation of humans and robots, which is why smith tried to kill Neo on Nyobi's ship.
So is Neo dead? I would think not since the Oracle was a Smith and she survived... but I could be wrong.
and why did the Oracle age?
Lastly what exactly is the source? The Sun? The Matrix Spirit? I don't know cause some people here talk about it as it it was a person (like god).
I don't know, but when Neo was blind it seemed like he got some type of wifi transmitter in his head that let him hack into the matrix without being plugged in. I kept thinking "Wireless Freedom baby!"
***SPOILERS***
ok. here we go.
First, I had large expectations coming into this movie, particularly after watching over and over the trailer. I expected a lot of answers and the development of the morevingian (how do u spell?), seraph, and agent smith. however, i think the movie left a lot to be unexplained or at least a lot that had to be inferred. so here's what i think.
the ARCHITECT. the architect is the one who created the matrix. he's in charge of the rules and boundaries. he thinks logically and mathematically.
the ORACLE. the oracle creates programs. that's how she knows how everything will turn out. in the second movie, the architect explains that she is the "mother". when she talks to neo on the bench and points out the birds and how there are programs running around that nobody thinks about, she's the one that made them. she made the sky, wind, heck even the birds. of course, it is these programs that confine to the rules created by the architect. she makes life acceptable to the human race. (of course, once smith has assimilated the oracle, he has her powers, and can then "see" into the future, and change the matrix as he sees fit).
SMITH. First, smith is a program, who is originally designed by the oracle. that's why he himself refers to her as "mother". his original duty is to maintain order in the matrix; to prevent people from jacking out. he first captures neo and attempts to make him a personal henchman and help track down rogues such as morpheus and trinity.
However, smith is not like most agents. in the first movie, when he is cracking into morpheus, he already seems "tired" and "disgusted" of being there. he has a desire for power. he somewhat feels, desires, and senses, like a human.
NEO. the purpose of the one was originally to make the choice of saving zion, pick his litter, and continue the ongoing cycle. but neo is different and it is something the architect cannot comprehend. neo thinks irrationally (not in a stupid manner), but in the way he lets his emotions affect his decision to first save trinity in the second movie.
after this, neo's purpose changes. his purpose becomes to destroy smith. and this is of course, the only reason the machines spare him of life. smith has evolved into a virus. one who has infected the entire matrix, has been able to infect a person in the human world (bain), and may likely corrupt the machine world. the machines need neo to destroy smith.
i believe the oracle, in a way, uses neo to meet her goals. remember, she is there to make a world acceptable for humans. with smith there, that world is now corrupt. so neo is sent to go destroy smith.
when smith starts talking about, "everything that has a beginning has an end", neo realizes how to destroy smith. similar to jesus giving up his life, neo sacrifices his life to save the world. by letting smith assimilate neo, smith no longer has a purpose. and of course, "without purpose, we would not exist". i agree with some other people who argue that the equation must balance itself out when neo is destroyed. but i also feel that once neo is assimilated by smith, the machines (who are hard-connected to neo) can irradicate the virus and clean up the matrix.
thus, order is restored and a (cheesy) shining sun emerges.
ENDING. a lot of people think neo's purpose was ultimately pointless. the humans are still being used as batteries and those not are still living in a stink-hole. but hey, at least the war is over. and i think that perhaps is what the wachowski brothers were getting at (even though, yes, i think the ending did stink).
war is bad, any way u look at it. there are no winners from war. the only way war can be solved is through peace.
now, some loose ends. serious and not serious. u figure it out.
morevingian:had to infer on this one, but i think that he can make programs, similar to but nowhere close to being as powerful as the oracle.
persephone: there simply to salivate my tongue and yes i probably missed out on some key conversation by the morevingian because i was too busy staring at her breasts. (!!!)
little indian girl: can make programs (ex: sun at the end). did seraph seem to pay a lot of attention to her because she was special? oracle 3.0??? who knows.
oracle: loving mom who cares about her children.
architect: dad who never cared and was hoping smith would grow up to be like him.
morpheus: martin luther king, jr in disguise.
trinity: the reason neo chose irrationally.
neo: the savior of course. come on, they had him lying in a cross figure at the end.
now what exactly were those things that could stand up-side down?
ok. here we go.
First, I had large expectations coming into this movie, particularly after watching over and over the trailer. I expected a lot of answers and the development of the morevingian (how do u spell?), seraph, and agent smith. however, i think the movie left a lot to be unexplained or at least a lot that had to be inferred. so here's what i think.
the ARCHITECT. the architect is the one who created the matrix. he's in charge of the rules and boundaries. he thinks logically and mathematically.
the ORACLE. the oracle creates programs. that's how she knows how everything will turn out. in the second movie, the architect explains that she is the "mother". when she talks to neo on the bench and points out the birds and how there are programs running around that nobody thinks about, she's the one that made them. she made the sky, wind, heck even the birds. of course, it is these programs that confine to the rules created by the architect. she makes life acceptable to the human race. (of course, once smith has assimilated the oracle, he has her powers, and can then "see" into the future, and change the matrix as he sees fit).
SMITH. First, smith is a program, who is originally designed by the oracle. that's why he himself refers to her as "mother". his original duty is to maintain order in the matrix; to prevent people from jacking out. he first captures neo and attempts to make him a personal henchman and help track down rogues such as morpheus and trinity.
However, smith is not like most agents. in the first movie, when he is cracking into morpheus, he already seems "tired" and "disgusted" of being there. he has a desire for power. he somewhat feels, desires, and senses, like a human.
NEO. the purpose of the one was originally to make the choice of saving zion, pick his litter, and continue the ongoing cycle. but neo is different and it is something the architect cannot comprehend. neo thinks irrationally (not in a stupid manner), but in the way he lets his emotions affect his decision to first save trinity in the second movie.
after this, neo's purpose changes. his purpose becomes to destroy smith. and this is of course, the only reason the machines spare him of life. smith has evolved into a virus. one who has infected the entire matrix, has been able to infect a person in the human world (bain), and may likely corrupt the machine world. the machines need neo to destroy smith.
i believe the oracle, in a way, uses neo to meet her goals. remember, she is there to make a world acceptable for humans. with smith there, that world is now corrupt. so neo is sent to go destroy smith.
when smith starts talking about, "everything that has a beginning has an end", neo realizes how to destroy smith. similar to jesus giving up his life, neo sacrifices his life to save the world. by letting smith assimilate neo, smith no longer has a purpose. and of course, "without purpose, we would not exist". i agree with some other people who argue that the equation must balance itself out when neo is destroyed. but i also feel that once neo is assimilated by smith, the machines (who are hard-connected to neo) can irradicate the virus and clean up the matrix.
thus, order is restored and a (cheesy) shining sun emerges.
ENDING. a lot of people think neo's purpose was ultimately pointless. the humans are still being used as batteries and those not are still living in a stink-hole. but hey, at least the war is over. and i think that perhaps is what the wachowski brothers were getting at (even though, yes, i think the ending did stink).
war is bad, any way u look at it. there are no winners from war. the only way war can be solved is through peace.
now, some loose ends. serious and not serious. u figure it out.
morevingian:had to infer on this one, but i think that he can make programs, similar to but nowhere close to being as powerful as the oracle.
persephone: there simply to salivate my tongue and yes i probably missed out on some key conversation by the morevingian because i was too busy staring at her breasts. (!!!)
little indian girl: can make programs (ex: sun at the end). did seraph seem to pay a lot of attention to her because she was special? oracle 3.0??? who knows.
oracle: loving mom who cares about her children.
architect: dad who never cared and was hoping smith would grow up to be like him.
morpheus: martin luther king, jr in disguise.
trinity: the reason neo chose irrationally.
neo: the savior of course. come on, they had him lying in a cross figure at the end.
now what exactly were those things that could stand up-side down?
zion is built in the center of the earth. the center of the earth is the hottest place on the planet. molten lava churns and works better than your gas stove. several minerals and metals (like iron) are located in the core.
Earth's Layers
as far as food is concerned, who knows. this is the future. maybe they can convert crap into food.
and as far as clothing is concerned, i think it would have been better if there was none to begin with. j/k.
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