Nvidia G71 (7900 Ultra) 90nm 750MHz

[Steelski]

Originally posted by: Cookie Monster

Originally posted by: Steelski

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: toyota

Originally posted by: Steelski
the unified hardware is in the Xbox360. and the chip is beyond most of the SM3.0
The G71 is probably the same as the RSX, but the RSX is not going to be built by Nvidia. that was sold to Sony.
Nvidia did state that they would have a more powerful graphics card than the RSX by the end of the year so that would be the GTX 512MB.
The 7900 series (dont call it ultra as there is no ultra in this gen let alone the next) will most probably have high clocks but i dont see how they will raise the memory clocks if they dont support GDDR4 at the moment (just a die shrink wont be enough IMO).
I think that in the end we all loose out as competition is at an altime high and prices are just not going to go sensible anytime soon.

sony doesnt make graphics cards. the rsx WILL be made by nvidia.

The RSX GPU design is from nvidia. Sony will actually be fabricating the PS3 RSX GPU using their own 90nm fabs. This was all over the web at one point, and unless anything has changed, this is how is was known to be.

So the rumour would suggest. I expect each company to tweak the design according to their needs. Thus making the G71 slightly different to the RSX. All i know is that the next round looks a lot more interesting than this one with the R580 being in theory able to process a lot more than the R520. it will mean that the architectures will almost certainly have a lot more comparable MHZ next time and it really will matter who has more per clock power. I just dont see how just a die shrink and higher clocks will compare to a card with probably similar clocks and 3 times the pass power of the R520. Even if they both have GDDR4 they will still be similarly clocked.

Are you saying the R580 will have 3 times more processing power compared to a R520? The R580 will have 3 times more power compared to the R530, which the R580 is based on.

I would like to belive that, but probably not. it depends on these fatter pipes..........and how they will implement them into actually using them. they could be like the pipes the R500 usues. three things per pass but less powerfull. could equate to around 2 times the power give or take a bit.
We can speculate how fast the G71 will be with an overclocked GTX(be it really hevily) but we cant with the R580 because it is roumured to be very different. who knows. Nvidia might bang out 32 pipes.......not unlikley as the RSX is going to be 24 piped and nvidia has artistic licence in their own hardware.

 

[toyota]

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: toyota

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: Cookie Monster

Originally posted by: Acanthus
G71 is not the RSX, G80 is, G71 is a refresh of the G70 design (die shrink).

G80 is the RSX core, based on a 80-90nm 48 pipe unified architecture.

link please. where did you get this from?

I know, and certain that G80 is DX10, 48 unified shader architecture plus GDD4 memory.

You dont need a link, theyve been using this naming scheme for a decade

1st number denotes generation, 2nd number denotes revision.

G7 = 7th gen 0 = rev 1, G7 = 7th gen 1 = rev 2/3/4 etc (they dont always do revisions in order)

G71 is the G70 architecture revised.
G80 is the unified RSX chip design going into the PS3. (or G71 could be if they scaled back the PS3 to no longer be a unified GPU)

Edit: If nvidia has stated that the RSX is the G71, that means the PS3 has been scaled back and will not use a unified pipe architecture, which is horribly disappointing.

"We managed to confirm that we can actually talk about RSX, as it's G71 and vice versa. Sony just wants millions of chips and it can get them at 90 nanometre. When it comes to graphic performance, the RSX can process 24 pixels with its 24 pipelines while an Xbox 360 powered with ATI's Xenos, R500 chip can do no more no less than double, 48 pixels per clock." http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=27463. i know its the inquirer but that info is all over the web.

That would confirm that RSX was scaled back to a quad architecture instead of unified. But the article is misleading in that it claims that Xenos can do 48 pixel ops per clock, it CAN do that if theres no vertex ops at all.

24+8 is 32 rendering pipes compared to RSXs 48+0 dynamic unified pipes that can do both.

It does appear that if G71 really is the RSX, ATis Xenos will be the more powerful chip in the console wars.

when the 7800gtx came out months ago even nvidia said that the rsx would be almost the same except it would be 90nm. that was even in the anandtech article when they tested the original 7800gtx. i dont know what you are talking about scaling back. here is an article saying that the rsx is based on a modified g70(g71) and this was months ago. http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2453&p=9

 

[crazydingo]

Originally posted by: Cookie Monster
Are you saying the R580 will have 3 times more processing power compared to a R520? The R580 will have 3 times more power compared to the R530, which the R580 is based on.

X1300 : 4-1-1-1
X1800 : 16-1-1-1

X1600 : 4-1-3-2
R580 : 16-1-3-2

So in effect R580 is 4 times more powerful than X1600.

Originally posted by: Acanthus
24+8 is 32 rendering pipes compared to RSXs 48+0 dynamic unified pipes that can do both.

RSX is not unified pipes and it does not have 48 of them. If that was the case, Sony would have hyped the hell out of it instead of just "Multi-way programmable shader pipelines".

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: Acanthus
You dont need a link, theyve been using this naming scheme for a decade

1st number denotes generation, 2nd number denotes revision.

G7 = 7th gen 0 = rev 1, G7 = 7th gen 1 = rev 2/3/4 etc (they dont always do revisions in order)

G71 is the G70 architecture revised.
G80 is the unified RSX chip design going into the PS3. (or G71 could be if they scaled back the PS3 to no longer be a unified GPU)

they just released this naming system. previously, they went 'nvxx.' in the case of the 7800, the original code name was NV45. that is, it is the refresh of the NV40, which was the 6800.

Regardless of the timetable, that is how the system works. G71 would not be a new architecture.

Right, it's just supposed to be a die-shrunk low-k G70 AFAIK, which would effectively make it what an RSX already is? Except with much higher clocks of course.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: crazydingo

Originally posted by: Cookie Monster
Are you saying the R580 will have 3 times more processing power compared to a R520? The R580 will have 3 times more power compared to the R530, which the R580 is based on.

X1300 : 4-1-1-1
X1800 : 16-1-1-1

X1600 : 4-1-3-2
R580 : 16-1-3-2

So in effect R580 is 4 times more powerful than X1600.

Originally posted by: Acanthus
24+8 is 32 rendering pipes compared to RSXs 48+0 dynamic unified pipes that can do both.

RSX is not unified pipes and it does not have 48 of them. If that was the case, Sony would have hyped the hell out of it instead of just "Multi-way programmable shader pipelines".

typo fixed, just for you.

I meant Xenos, not RSX.

 

[Cookie Monster]

I thought the R580 was 16-1-3-1.

R530 is the X1600 series. As you see the R580 will be the more beefier version of the X1600XT. however, the X1600XT performs pretty weak compared to its competitor the 6800GS. As the 7800GTX512mb is about three times faster than the 6800GS, the G71 will possibly be 4 times as fast.

This is telling me that R580, and the G71 will perform pretty close to each other.
But this is just good for us consumers in the end.

Anyway, no one knows what the RSX is. All we know is that its based on the 7 series. We dont know how diffferent G71 to G70 is, so we cant really say what the RSX is apart from it being on 90nm. 550mhz core is highly likely, but until sony releases the final PS3 specs, the 550mhz is just specualation.

I think its the cell processor that will differentiate itself from the XBox360. Not sure though.

I wouldnt mind the G71 to be 32pipe beast though. Competition is good.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Cookie Monster


R530 is the X1600 series.

Ahhh, tank u very much. I thought the 1300 and 1600 were RV515 and RV530 respectively. LOL losing track of all the model numbers these past 2 gens.

Cheers

 

[Matt2]

I didnt read the entire thread, but...

I think this is why the 7800 512MB was a limited release card. The 7800 512 represents Nvidia's "milking" of the 7800 architecture. Enough to say they have the performance crown this generation and then back that up with a nerw 90nm chip that will be more readily available.

 

[destrekor]

yea i agree Matt, I really dont think the GTX512 will ever reach out to a large crowd nor will it be manufactured on such a grand scale. I mean the previous GeForce7 series cards were all put in distributers hands, in large numbers, the day of release. This card is still playing hard to get, if even possible at the moment.
I am praying the G71 is available before the end of February. I want it for my stepup, if not it will be the GTX512 I guess.

 

[Cookie Monster]

Originally posted by: Matt2
I didnt read the entire thread, but...

I think this is why the 7800 512MB was a limited release card. The 7800 512 represents Nvidia's "milking" of the 7800 architecture. Enough to say they have the performance crown this generation and then back that up with a nerw 90nm chip that will be more readily available.

QFT. Is it me, or it seems that all the 7 series so far are all based on the G70 core. I mean, the GT, GTX, GS, the 512mb GTX(tweaked a little) . All of them use the same core. So pretty much NV wants to get rid of the G70 core, using even the cores which failed to meet the GT specs and hence the creation of the 7800GS. This is based on the fact the G70 core is infact NV47, a refresh of the NV40/45. What if the "true" G70 is the G71/72/73 which havent been released.

With this in mind, i thought that NV used the NV47 as their next "gen" product instead of refreshing the 6800 lineup. It sort of makes sense because firstly the 7800GTXs GPU die/riva tuner state it is a NV47, plus Sli wouldve made NO sense what so ever if the refresh of the 6800 series was released, hence a 24 pipe 6900 ultra or something similiar (i guess the yields were bad during those times, hence these 110nm NV47 were stockpiled til later on for a newer purpose). This means that NV had lots of time, preparing for their real 7 series product hence G71/72/73 (7900/7600/7200). Even more time for their NV50 project(G80).

But really, the question is, what if the G71/72/73 NV cards support better features compared to the G70 lineup? such as tweaked Ansio filtering, AA algorithms or even maybe HDR+AA etc? more efficent than the G70?

 

[destrekor]

it could be tweaked but it will still be a g70 core but retooled. So in essence, still a refresh of a refresh.

 

[Munky]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Cookie Monster


R530 is the X1600 series.

Ahhh, tank u very much. I thought the 1300 and 1600 were RV515 and RV530 respectively. LOL losing track of all the model numbers these past 2 gens.

Cheers

Theay are RV515 and RV530. Dont forget the V.

Originally posted by: crazydingo
X1300 : 4-1-1-1
X1800 : 16-1-1-1

X1600 : 4-1-3-2
R580 : 16-1-3-2

So in effect R580 is 4 times more powerful than X1600.

Last I heard the r580 is a 16-1-3-1 architecture. But the math is not so simple. If you look at some benches of the x1k cards http://www.techreport.com/reviews/2005q4/radeon-x1000/index.x?pg=1 you can see the x1800xt is already roughly 3x as fast as the x1600xt. And the r580 will suposedly have 3x as many pixel shaders as the r520. So, depending on the game, the r580 can turn out either slightly faster or a lot faster than the r520, depending on the shaders/textures ops ratio.