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whm1974

Diamond Member
Jul 24, 2016
9,436
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But thanks for revealing to me you're a person of faith with an axe to grind regarding your immoral sexual beliefs. There's always that avoidance of the realization that one is morally wrong lurking behind all forms of denial.
And how am I anything close to being "a person of Faith" anyway? Did you even bothered to read the links I posted? You sure don't sound like you did. And how are my sexual beliefs immoral? Do I go around promoting rape or kidnapping young women to sell into sexually slavery?:mad::mad::mad: Is this what you think of me?
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,242
14,245
136
Normal sexuality is anything that involves consensual activity and doesn't directly contribute to clearly unhealthy behavior (say, abuse or self-harm).

Porn addiction is real, but the danger of it is also exaggerated by religious conservatives trying to shame people for, well, being sexual. There's more of a risk of buying into unrealistic expectations set by some porn than there is of being hooked on porn. But then again, religion has also set unhealthy expectations for sex for centuries, such as false claims about virginity.

I would add "and feminists" to "religious conservatives."
 

Commodus

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2004
9,215
6,821
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I would add "and feminists" to "religious conservatives."

Nah, that's too simplified. Many feminists are sex-positive and fine with porn on a basic level, they just don't like some of the representations of women (such as non-consensual fantasies) and industry practices.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,242
14,245
136
Nah, that's too simplified. Many feminists are sex-positive and fine with porn on a basic level, they just don't like some of the representations of women (such as non-consensual fantasies) and industry practices.

Yes, some are sex positive. Others do not like porn, period. I'm sure it's not all religious conservatives either. Bottom line is that those are the two groups who mainly attack porn, while some members of each group do not.
 

Bitek

Lifer
Aug 2, 2001
10,676
5,239
136
On the contrary, women are harmed more than men by porn. Explain to the wives of men addicted to porn, who now have husbands so desensitized to the most depraved sexual acts that she cannot and should not hope to match just to attract him, that there is no destructive aspect to porn.

Men at the very least get some cheap pleasure out of it. Women are the ones bearing all the cost.

Ok. You're white knighting for the women now.

Poor poor women, they need woke men to watch over them or Lord knows what trouble they'll get into...
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,960
6,799
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Ok. You're white knighting for the women now.

Poor poor women, they need woke men to watch over them or Lord knows what trouble they'll get into...

My experience has been that when someone does not understand the proper moral basis for a moral stance, they create a straw man to argue against instead. My opinion is that you are the one who invented white knighting here and introduced it into your argument. I find the notion that I could become mechanically aroused by watching somebody's grown up image of God offer herself to me as a stimulant, and one which I certainly don't feel that I need, having had a long life of wonderful sex, simply arouses in me not desire, but a sense of pity that the person in question does not experience the deep kind of loving sex that I have known. I think you would see things differently were you without need, either for fantasy sex or for justifying its acquisition by the use of visual stimulants. I find you porn supporting types not to be evil or morally backwards of bad in any way, but emotionally un-evolved and missing the real value of sex. I speak up on the chance somebody might hear. You can't speak truth in the world without causing enormous resentment. We hate ourselves and don't want to feel it.
 
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woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,242
14,245
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My experience has been that when someone does not understand the proper moral basis for a moral stance, they create a straw man to argue against instead. My opinion is that you are the one who invented white knighting here and introduced it into your argument. I find the notion that I could become mechanically aroused by watching somebody's grown up image of God offer herself to me as a stimulant, and one which I certainly don't feel that I need, having had a long life of wonderful sex, simply arouses in me not desire, but a sense of pity that the person in question does not experience the deep kind of loving sex that I have known. I think you would see things differently were you without need, either for fantasy sex or for justifying its acquisition by the use of visual stimulants. I find you porn supporting types not to be evil or morally backwards of bad in any way, but emotionally un-evolved and missing the real value of sex. I speak up on the chance somebody might hear. You can't speak truth in the world without causing enormous resentment. We hate ourselves and don't want to feel it.

Who says sex must involve love? Can't sex be for love, procreation, or just plain recreation? Indeed, a given person could have sex for all of those reasons, at different times in their life and with different partners. The one is not mutually exclusive of the others.
 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,936
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Who says sex must involve love? Can't sex be for love, procreation, or just plain recreation? Indeed, a given person could have sex for all of those reasons, at different times in their life and with different partners. The one is not mutually exclusive of the others.
^^^ This, Moonie, this. Climb down off your impossibly high horse; get a shovel, and go clean up all the streaming road apples of prissy cloister virtue you left in your wake.

I'm no fan of the pornography business, but my (female) friend is a house aid to a guy with ALS who is grateful for the pleasure and release free internet fucky-fuck affords him. Why don't you pay him a visit and lecture him on how he's "missing the real value of sex?"

Our "virtuous" country tried to outlaw alcohol, which has caused many much pain. How did that work out? Our "virtuous" country launched a "war on drugs." It jumped started the private prison industry. Sex for money, in all its forms, is the second oldest profession. Think about why as you climb down off your shining WHITE steed and mix in with the rest of us down here in the mud and spent condoms. ;)

At least viewing pornography doesn't spread venereal disease.

WOMEN sex workers have organized unions for the RIGHT to ply their profession.

To them, the only thing worse than a fatuous lecturing prig is a scab.

;)

And Merry Christmas to 'ya, my high-minded friend.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,960
6,799
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^^^ This, Moonie, this. Climb down off your impossibly high horse; get a shovel, and go clean up all the streaming road apples of prissy cloister virtue you left in your wake.

I'm no fan of the pornography business, but my (female) friend is a house aid to a guy with ALS who is grateful for the pleasure and release free internet fucky-fuck affords him. Why don't you pay him a visit and lecture him on how he's "missing the real value of sex?"

Our "virtuous" country tried to outlaw alcohol, which has caused many much pain. How did that work out? Our "virtuous" country launched a "war on drugs." It jumped started the private prison industry. Sex for money, in all its forms, is the second oldest profession. Think about why as you climb down off your shining WHITE steed and mix in with the rest of us down here in the mud and spent condoms. ;)

At least viewing pornography doesn't spread venereal disease.

WOMEN sex workers have organized unions for the RIGHT to ply their profession.

To them, the only thing worse than a fatuous lecturing prig is a scab.

;)

And Merry Christmas to 'ya, my high-minded friend.
I like apple pie. I hate to be a lecturing prig but anybody who has never had a really good apple pie should try one. Thanks for YOUR lecture. I'm sorry but I'm really really very comfortable with my position on this even if I am the only one who understands what it is. And the Best of New Years!
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,242
14,245
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I like apple pie. I hate to be a lecturing prig but anybody who has never had a really good apple pie should try one. Thanks for YOUR lecture. I'm sorry but I'm really really very comfortable with my position on this even if I am the only one who understands what it is. And the Best of New Years!

Yet that is the problem. You don't know that the guy eating the cheese whiz hasn't also had the apple pie. He might just prefer cheese whiz sometimes.
 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,936
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I hate to be a lecturing prig
Then get off your horse and mingle.

but anybody who has never had a really good apple pie should try one.
The guy with ALS can't . . . get any. Would you let him starve? Would you deny his hot little slices of porno pie?

I'm sorry but I'm really really very comfortable with my position on this even if I am the only one who understands what it is.

That's on you, you know.

And the Best of New Years!
Right back at 'ya, Mr. Moon!
 
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Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,960
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Who says sex must involve love? Can't sex be for love, procreation, or just plain recreation? Indeed, a given person could have sex for all of those reasons, at different times in their life and with different partners. The one is not mutually exclusive of the others.
Why do you want to pigeon hole me with this notion of 'must'. Are you looking for me to show you in a book? I think what I have said that as far as I am concerned the evolution of one's understanding of love equates to the realization that sex with love is the best sex. This is an experience of a feeling state the value of which is self evident when experienced. You know or you don't. So, who says is me but it is also me who knows it. I have also discovered that if you fall it can hurt. I am really very very sure. And if I'm attributing reality to a dream state, I really don't care. It's satisfies all me needs for certainty. Sex can be for whatever you want it to be. I want it to be for what it is best to be. It's a kind of self respect to go with the best you can. Everyone else, if the feel the same way, can choose to do what they have evolved to see as the best. They can't do otherwise unless they decide they really don't care about self respect. There is no looking down on lesser evolved people, but there is looking back and recognizing where people are on their journey. Of course, there is no looking forward because that experience has yet to be had.

I failed to post this earlier, sorry.
 

Ottonomous

Senior member
May 15, 2014
559
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Ok guys and gals, is masturbation detrimental? Does is it exhaust your zinc reserves and coincidentally cause all the symptoms of that mineral deficiency, like high hedonic thresheld, intractable anxiety, dandruff, skin dryness, blurriness of vision and constipation?
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,960
6,799
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Ok guys and gals, is masturbation detrimental? Does is it exhaust your zinc reserves and coincidentally cause all the symptoms of that mineral deficiency, like high hedonic thresheld, intractable anxiety, dandruff, skin dryness, blurriness of vision and constipation?
No idea. Never been interested in all the anxiety stuff surrounding food and nutrition. Don't take vitamins and try to eat some of this and some of that. But I do know I would rather have sex with someone I'm in love with, not that I don't love my hand or my rubber ducky, but not in that way.
 
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Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,960
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And how am I anything close to being "a person of Faith" anyway? Did you even bothered to read the links I posted? You sure don't sound like you did. And how are my sexual beliefs immoral? Do I go around promoting rape or kidnapping young women to sell into sexually slavery?:mad::mad::mad: Is this what you think of me?
You mentioned two "isms" Isms are sacred cows, abstractions and formulations one buys into as a matter of faith, faith even in your own reason, which is exactly what I question. I don't believe in the things I am saying. I am telling you what I know from experience. I mentioned several times now, I am pretty sure, that whenever somebody says something that challenges unconscious assumptions people have they get defensive and that, as I have suggested to you numerous times, is because we hate ourselves and any questioning of the ego identifications we make that make us feel better, threaten to kick the stool out from under phony self acclimation and throw us into potential self confrontation. You aren't bad. You are self protective as you had to be to survive your childhood conditioning. I don't know why I destroyed all those comforting ego identifications as I grew up. I blame my Mother who told me to always be honest. Perhaps I had experienced more pain than most so the identifications failed to hold, or I was luck enough not to have so much bad stuff I need to deny and were thus easier for me to cut through. I suspect the former. I don't know but for whatever reason I was forced to confront my inner despair and the death of everything I held dear by way of naive and quieting notions about reality. All of that ended in a single moment of realization, an experience that is hard, impossible, to explain.
 
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Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,936
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I blame my Mother
I blame her, too . . . perpetuating that whole "hairy palms" myth!
7G3zITG.png

BLOW5do.png

jnHWXN4.gif
 

DarthKyrie

Golden Member
Jul 11, 2016
1,617
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^^^ This, Moonie, this. Climb down off your impossibly high horse; get a shovel, and go clean up all the streaming road apples of prissy cloister virtue you left in your wake.

I'm no fan of the pornography business, but my (female) friend is a house aid to a guy with ALS who is grateful for the pleasure and release free internet fucky-fuck affords him. Why don't you pay him a visit and lecture him on how he's "missing the real value of sex?"

Our "virtuous" country tried to outlaw alcohol, which has caused many much pain. How did that work out? Our "virtuous" country launched a "war on drugs." It jumped started the private prison industry. Sex for money, in all its forms, is the second oldest profession. Think about why as you climb down off your shining WHITE steed and mix in with the rest of us down here in the mud and spent condoms. ;)

At least viewing pornography doesn't spread venereal disease.

WOMEN sex workers have organized unions for the RIGHT to ply their profession.

To them, the only thing worse than a fatuous lecturing prig is a scab.

;)

And Merry Christmas to 'ya, my high-minded friend.

I wonder how being a scab works in these fields of work?

Ok guys and gals, is masturbation detrimental? Does is it exhaust your zinc reserves and coincidentally cause all the symptoms of that mineral deficiency, like high hedonic thresheld, intractable anxiety, dandruff, skin dryness, blurriness of vision and constipation?

The only thing detrimental from what I know is if you don't use lube you end up with a chafed dick and maybe low blood pressure depending on how often you spank one out.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,960
6,799
126
I blame her, too . . . perpetuating that whole "hairy palms" myth!
7G3zITG.png

BLOW5do.png

jnHWXN4.gif
I blame her, too . . . perpetuating that whole "hairy palms" myth!
7G3zITG.png

BLOW5do.png

jnHWXN4.gif
With the best honesty she taught me to cultivate, I don't believe this is true. And while you may not be ready to concede to my sense of this, I won the argument with you when you said: "Why don't you pay him a visit and lecture him on how he's "missing the real value of sex?" How could you have made that charge to me were it not for the fact that you compare the value of things and projected that onto me?

Think about it. And remember too that as far as I can see, winning the argument is irrelevant to me. Informing you of my sense of what good pie is, is. It is the nature of love it would seem to want for all the very best, not to take from them what little they may have left.

(Back to having won the argument:) The point is somewhat subtle. (Refering back to projection) How would you see in me something you are not capable of? My aim was to suggest that we step back and examine our assumptions about sex because, as I see it, sex is one of the first areas of conscious understanding that self hate fucks up. I give little credence here to the notion that the origin of my opinions here are ism morally based. In short, you brought your own moral sense of valuation into the discussion and unconsciously projected it onto me. I don't believe that what I am saying here is coming from that place. I believe that I have left that moral nonsense behind and found in it's place the source from which moral wisdom springs the Alpha and Omega of things. And if there is anything to the notion that one knows what one knows and what one knows in nothing at all, it will be difficult to convince me of things I suffered deeply from abandoning and no longer believe, especially considering what I call Grace. In the absence of thought the beauty of the world is revealed.

I am saying that when and if the doors in ones heart have experienced an opening to the oneness of love, it plays havoc with turning women into objects of lust. The sexual orgasm is about all people have left that reminds or connects them with oneness.

Boughs of Holly for you!
 

whm1974

Diamond Member
Jul 24, 2016
9,436
1,572
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No idea. Never been interested in all the anxiety stuff surrounding food and nutrition. Don't take vitamins and try to eat some of this and some of that. But I do know I would rather have sex with someone I'm in love with, not that I don't love my hand or my rubber ducky, but not in that way.
What about sex for pleasure, my dear Moonie? Both Men and Women do willing engage in coitus for other reasons besides love and procreation. You aware of this, right?
You mentioned two "isms" Isms are sacred cows, abstractions and formulations one buys into as a matter of faith, faith even in your own reason, which is exactly what I question. I don't believe in the things I am saying. I am telling you what I know from experience.
Let me tell you about the two "ISMs" I posted links to for you to read. Again you don't sound like you actually read either one of them. If you had, then you would be aware that both of them are not dogmatic at all and do not in anyway require any form of faith.

They are based on Human Reason, experience, and what Humans have learned over the course of their existence, what works best for people and the societies they live in.
 

Ottonomous

Senior member
May 15, 2014
559
293
136
No idea. Never been interested in all the anxiety stuff surrounding food and nutrition. Don't take vitamins and try to eat some of this and some of that. But I do know I would rather have sex with someone I'm in love with, not that I don't love my hand or my rubber ducky, but not in that way.
I wonder how being a scab works in these fields of work?



The only thing detrimental from what I know is if you don't use lube you end up with a chafed dick and maybe low blood pressure depending on how often you spank one out.
As a 30 year old virgin I honestly don't know if I'll ever have sex. I am autistic and I don't think I have that natural 'congeniality' to be intimate with someone and just go the full stretch. I am just going to go on a holiday from my country and sleep with an escort and then pay her to tell me about what she thinks about intimacy, relationships and what women value in their partners. Particularly things like male psychological attributes and the intersection of female sexual liberation, monogamy and escorting as a profession
 
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