Israel / Gaza Thread

[ZzZGuy]

Let Israel clean house in gaza.
Pull out (they already have stated that they will).
Send in fatah to take over.
Send in Russian peace keepers NOT under UN control (The UN monitors in Lebanon did a wonderful job didn't they).
Expel the FUBAR settlers from Israel. (the ones who throw rocks at pali children on their way to school in Jerusalem, that sort of thing)

I'll bother explaining why the Russians if anyone actually takes me seriously.



IMHO it'll take 100+ years for the hatred on the pali side to die, the current generation needs to die of old age and the new one not given any reason to hate Israel. In the mean time, two state solution with international support for the gaza and west bank (I don't trust the arabs to be helpful). Arab support must be cut off and replaced 100% and more by the international community as the palis arab "brothers" use them as a tool to attack Israel.

 

[evident]

Originally posted by: SsupernovaE
I never agree with you; but, if I was in their position, I'd probably do the same.

:thumbsup:

 

[mrSHEiK124]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: poohbear
im just answering the OPs question as to what should israel do in the face "endless" rocket attacks..... pull out the illegal settlements. They're the ones bearing the brunt of rocket attacks, but they shouldnt even be there in the first place.

These jewish extremists that insist on making settlements on palestinian territory have the IDF to protect them, who do the palestinians have? before the PLO emerged, what was the fate of palestinians in the 50's and 60's? nada, they were complety ignored. they were bloody refugees. its an unfortunate fact that the world started paying attention when they took up terrorism, for better or worse. Israel would have never made any concessions to the palestinians if it was'nt for the intifadah. they had to fight for everything they were promised.

That is what they have been doing, albeit slowly. (which is what they should be doing) However, I find it kind of hard to believe that all the rockets are being shot at settlements instead of just the nearest target of convenience (i.e. city) in Israel. If the settlements just dissapeared overnight, do you really think the attacks would cease?

I'm going to have to disagree with you there. Israel withdrawing from Gaza settlements was comparatively easy, from a logistical standpoint. Gaza is about the size of my pinky-toenail, and all the settlements were very close to the Israel-proper/Gaza border. Withdrawing from there just gave them a nice buffer zone to the border.

Settlements in the West Bank, on the other hand, are far too entrenched into WB infrastructure. Text Everything that's blue on that map is Israeli controlled, dark blue means it's a settlement, light blue basically means DMZ. A two state solution would carve the West Bank up, providing Israel with extremely difficult borders to control, and leaving too many Palestinians further enraged over illegal theft of their land. Combine that with how well countries split by another country shoved in between them have done (Kashmir anyone?) and you've got a recipe for disaster.

The only solution is a one secular state solution. It's absurd to suggest that 5 million Jews who now live in the region or 4 million Arabs holding onto what's left or 1 million Jewish settlers in the West Bank or any large number of people should just pick up and leave at this point. Depose the corrupt leadership both in the PA and Israel, tell everybody to kiss and make up, and most importantly, give both the Arab and the Jew EQUAL HUMAN RIGHTS. That includes the right of return to any unused land lost by '48 or '67 refugees (Israel calls it "state land") and also includes the rights of everyone to peacefully stay where they are.

You'd be surprised, a one state solution is completely plausible to everyone but diehards like Hamas and warmongers like some of the Israeli leadership.

Actually, I do see your point there. However, why is Gaza the one reacting to rockets over settlements in the West Bank? Why isn't the West Bank the ones reacting? If we are going to have a multi-state solution, why do we keep insisting on having to link these two geographically separate areas?

I do agree that the best possible solution would be the 1-state solution that you mention, but hatreds and tensions are too high for me to expect to see it in my lifetime, unfortunately.

I pray that I can see the conflict resolved peacefully in my lifetime, and I'm young.

Consider the economic situations in Gaza and the West Bank. A significant amount of Palestinians in the West Bank work in Israel, Gazans don't. The standard of living there is significantly higher than that in Gaza. The West Bank is far more intertwined with Israel than Gaza is, especially after the withdrawal in 2005. Before the separation barrier and basically before the Al-Aqsa Intifada, many Arab cities neighboring Jewish settlements had their storefronts translated in Hebrew, because settlers and Palestinians mixed to a certain degree. Before Oslo, people living in the West Bank had near complete freedom of movement, I could get to Jerusalem and pray without running into any problems.

I really forgot where I was going with any of that, but Gaza is the one reacting because Gaza is currently in a far more dire humanitarian situation than the West Bank is. Gaza also currently happens to be run by Hamas, put two and two together.

 

[mrSHEiK124]

Originally posted by: ZzZGuy
Let Israel clean house in gaza.
Pull out (they already have stated that they will).
Send in fatah to take over.
Send in Russian peace keepers NOT under UN control (The UN monitors in Lebanon did a wonderful job didn't they).
Expel the FUBAR settlers from Israel. (the ones who throw rocks at pali children on their way to school in Jerusalem, that sort of thing)

I'll bother explaining why the Russians if anyone actually takes me seriously.



IMHO it'll take 100+ years for the hatred on the pali side to die, the current generation needs to die of old age and the new one not given any reason to hate Israel. In the mean time, two state solution with international support for the gaza and west bank (I don't trust the arabs to be helpful). Arab support must be cut off and replaced 100% and more by the international community as the palis arab "brothers" use them as a tool to attack Israel.

Recipe for disaster right there. My thread Text got locked, but in essence, they're guilty of stealing more than one billion dollars in money intended for humanitarian aid for the Palestinian people and putting it into the pockets of the corrupt like Erekat and Dahlan. Both Fatah and Hamas need to be disposed of entirely.

I'll take you seriously, explain the whole Russian thing.

 

[NoShangriLa]

Pull out (they already have stated that they will).

And, you believe the politicians that talks out both side of their lips?

 

[ZzZGuy]

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Originally posted by: ZzZGuy
Let Israel clean house in gaza.
Pull out (they already have stated that they will).
Send in fatah to take over.
Send in Russian peace keepers NOT under UN control (The UN monitors in Lebanon did a wonderful job didn't they).
Expel the FUBAR settlers from Israel. (the ones who throw rocks at pali children on their way to school in Jerusalem, that sort of thing)

I'll bother explaining why the Russians if anyone actually takes me seriously.



IMHO it'll take 100+ years for the hatred on the pali side to die, the current generation needs to die of old age and the new one not given any reason to hate Israel. In the mean time, two state solution with international support for the gaza and west bank (I don't trust the arabs to be helpful). Arab support must be cut off and replaced 100% and more by the international community as the palis arab "brothers" use them as a tool to attack Israel.

Recipe for disaster right there. My thread Text got locked, but in essence, they're guilty of stealing more than one billion dollars in money intended for humanitarian aid for the Palestinian people and putting it into the pockets of the corrupt like Erekat and Dahlan. Both Fatah and Hamas need to be disposed of entirely.

I'll take you seriously, explain the whole Russian thing.

As for fatah, it's better the devil you know then the devil you don't.

For the Russians, they are the only ones I can think of that the arab terrorists in gaza & the west bank won't shoot on sight & get the job done. In the past they supported the arabs, IIRC even threatened to retaliate if Israel didn't stop it's advance during the last major war. So hopefully some good will towards them on the arab side. They also have the balls and the hardware to not back down to Israel (there is no question that a Russian peace keeping force can not hold off a determined Israeli attack, but they are no push overs). Today, Russia does not seem to be hostile towards Israel anymore, in fact they are planning on buying UAV's from Israel as they where impressed by their performance in Georgia (used by Georgia).

Before any peace keeping force goes in, they need to learn from the Israelis how to operate in gaza/west bank without getting blown to hell.

I say not under UN control because I have lost all faith in the UN, any force they send will have its balls cut off by all the compromises that need to be made to send them in the first place.

Russia might even do it just to make the USA look bad, "look how we solved the Israeli/pali conflict when the feeble Americans failed so miserably." That is if they think they could do it.

I could be horribly wrong, but it doesn't have to be the Russians, just someone who can get the job done.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: Skyclad1uhm1

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
Ehh, If Canda or Mexico were lobbing rockets into the US, you guys would go apeshit if the government just stood by idly. If Palestine doesnt want to get pancaked, dont toss bombs at the big bully.

And Europe is 1. a bunch of wusses and 2. full of Muslims, of course they're going to try and not piss of the Muslims in their own countries.


edit: looks like Obama agrees with me, "If somebody was sending rockets into my house where my two daughters sleep at night, I'm going to do everything in my power to stop that," he said. "And I would expect Israelis to do the same thing."

Obama rocks


The full quote

[Obama on the campaign trail]: "The first job of any nation state is to protect its citizens. And so I can assure you that if -- I don't even care if I was a politician -- if somebody was sending rockets into my house where my two daughters sleep at night, I'm going to do everything in my power to stop that. And I would expect Israelis to do the same thing."

Good to hear that Obama agrees that the Palestinians have the right to defend themselves against those http://www.belfasttelegraph.co...ir-sleep-14123166.html">bloody childmurderers</a>.

Tragic, hopefully this conflict is resolved soon and Hamas can be eliminated with minimal bloodshed so that both countries can be safe.

 

[mrSHEiK124]

Originally posted by: ZzZGuy

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Originally posted by: ZzZGuy
Let Israel clean house in gaza.
Pull out (they already have stated that they will).
Send in fatah to take over.
Send in Russian peace keepers NOT under UN control (The UN monitors in Lebanon did a wonderful job didn't they).
Expel the FUBAR settlers from Israel. (the ones who throw rocks at pali children on their way to school in Jerusalem, that sort of thing)

I'll bother explaining why the Russians if anyone actually takes me seriously.



IMHO it'll take 100+ years for the hatred on the pali side to die, the current generation needs to die of old age and the new one not given any reason to hate Israel. In the mean time, two state solution with international support for the gaza and west bank (I don't trust the arabs to be helpful). Arab support must be cut off and replaced 100% and more by the international community as the palis arab "brothers" use them as a tool to attack Israel.

Recipe for disaster right there. My thread Text got locked, but in essence, they're guilty of stealing more than one billion dollars in money intended for humanitarian aid for the Palestinian people and putting it into the pockets of the corrupt like Erekat and Dahlan. Both Fatah and Hamas need to be disposed of entirely.

I'll take you seriously, explain the whole Russian thing.

As for fatah, it's better the devil you know then the devil you don't.

For the Russians, they are the only ones I can think of that the arab terrorists in gaza & the west bank won't shoot on sight & get the job done. In the past they supported the arabs, IIRC even threatened to retaliate if Israel didn't stop it's advance during the last major war. So hopefully some good will towards them on the arab side. They also have the balls and the hardware to not back down to Israel (there is no question that a Russian peace keeping force can not hold off a determined Israeli attack, but they are no push overs). Today, Russia does not seem to be hostile towards Israel anymore, in fact they are planning on buying UAV's from Israel as they where impressed by their performance in Georgia (used by Georgia).

Before any peace keeping force goes in, they need to learn from the Israelis how to operate in gaza/west bank without getting blown to hell.

I say not under UN control because I have lost all faith in the UN, any force they send will have its balls cut off by all the compromises that need to be made to send them in the first place.

Russia might even do it just to make the USA look bad, "look how we solved the Israeli/pali conflict when the feeble Americans failed so miserably." That is if they think they could do it.

I could be horribly wrong, but it doesn't have to be the Russians, just someone who can get the job done.

Interesting. Not trying to piss all over your parade here, but while it is an interesting solution, I doubt the Kremlin even care (and you certainly can't expect them to).

 

[ZzZGuy]

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Interesting. Not trying to piss all over your parade here, but while it is an interesting solution, I doubt the Kremlin even care (and you certainly can't expect them to).

True, but you'll never know 100% until you ask them. They have begun to try and flex their mussels and regain lost pride, they will get a LOT of respect from the rest of the world (beyond might is right) if they pull it off.

You are probably right, too bad China is only just starting to come out of their shell when it comes to international affairs.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
Adhering to the original terms of the ceasefire which included lifting the blockade on diesel, electricity, and medicine would have been a great start. Hamas resumed firing rockets after talks to renew the ceasefire fell through. One and a half million are still without basic necessities of life.

Your idea lacks logic.

Israel cuts of the supplies because Hamas won't stop the rocket attacks. So Hamas responds by taking a course of action that will ensure Israel ends all aid to Gaza. It makes no sense.

BTW Gaza has a boarder with Egypt, why don't the Egyptians help them with fuel, electricity and medicine?

I believe this question of yours was about 100% as honest as the Israeli commitment was to withdraw settlements from the Gaza strip.

 

[mrSHEiK124]

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
Adhering to the original terms of the ceasefire which included lifting the blockade on diesel, electricity, and medicine would have been a great start. Hamas resumed firing rockets after talks to renew the ceasefire fell through. One and a half million are still without basic necessities of life.

Your idea lacks logic.

Israel cuts of the supplies because Hamas won't stop the rocket attacks. So Hamas responds by taking a course of action that will ensure Israel ends all aid to Gaza. It makes no sense.

BTW Gaza has a boarder with Egypt, why don't the Egyptians help them with fuel, electricity and medicine?

I believe this question of yours was about 100% honest as the Israeli commitment was to withdraw settlements from the Gaza strip.

TBH, ISRAEL cares more about the plight of the Palestinians than Hosni Mubarak does. And it's not saying much.

 

[kylebisme]

I can't say I am surprised Obama failed to acknowledge that the Palestinians' 'house' is being colonized by Israeli civilians under force of military occupation.

Not that it gives anyone the right to attack civilians, but acknowledging the root of the conflict is a necessary step in ending it.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
Adhering to the original terms of the ceasefire which included lifting the blockade on diesel, electricity, and medicine would have been a great start. Hamas resumed firing rockets after talks to renew the ceasefire fell through. One and a half million are still without basic necessities of life.

Your idea lacks logic.

Israel cuts of the supplies because Hamas won't stop the rocket attacks. So Hamas responds by taking a course of action that will ensure Israel ends all aid to Gaza. It makes no sense.

BTW Gaza has a boarder with Egypt, why don't the Egyptians help them with fuel, electricity and medicine?

I believe this question of yours was about 100% honest as the Israeli commitment was to withdraw settlements from the Gaza strip.

TBH, ISRAEL cares more about the plight of the Palestinians than Hosni Mubarak does. And it's not saying much.

It would be very convenient to pawn the issue off onto Egypt. Then again who controls the borders in Gaza?

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
Adhering to the original terms of the ceasefire which included lifting the blockade on diesel, electricity, and medicine would have been a great start. Hamas resumed firing rockets after talks to renew the ceasefire fell through. One and a half million are still without basic necessities of life.

Your idea lacks logic.

Israel cuts of the supplies because Hamas won't stop the rocket attacks. So Hamas responds by taking a course of action that will ensure Israel ends all aid to Gaza. It makes no sense.

BTW Gaza has a boarder with Egypt, why don't the Egyptians help them with fuel, electricity and medicine?

I believe this question of yours was about 100% honest as the Israeli commitment was to withdraw settlements from the Gaza strip.

TBH, ISRAEL cares more about the plight of the Palestinians than Hosni Mubarak does. And it's not saying much.

It would be very convenient to pawn the issue off onto Egypt. Then again who controls the borders in Gaza?

Which answers what statement?

You completely ignore what PJ says in order to put your own opinion of something completely different across?

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
Adhering to the original terms of the ceasefire which included lifting the blockade on diesel, electricity, and medicine would have been a great start. Hamas resumed firing rockets after talks to renew the ceasefire fell through. One and a half million are still without basic necessities of life.

Your idea lacks logic.

Israel cuts of the supplies because Hamas won't stop the rocket attacks. So Hamas responds by taking a course of action that will ensure Israel ends all aid to Gaza. It makes no sense.

BTW Gaza has a boarder with Egypt, why don't the Egyptians help them with fuel, electricity and medicine?

I believe this question of yours was about 100% honest as the Israeli commitment was to withdraw settlements from the Gaza strip.

TBH, ISRAEL cares more about the plight of the Palestinians than Hosni Mubarak does. And it's not saying much.

It would be very convenient to pawn the issue off onto Egypt. Then again who controls the borders in Gaza?

Which answers what statement?

You completely ignore what PJ says in order to put your own opinion of something completely different across?

So tell me why is it Egypt's responsibility to provide for the Palestinians? Why should Egypt put itself in a position where it could be held responsible for the actions of others who they have no control over in a area they have no territorial claim over? It's nice to try to pass the buck onto other nations in the region but it does nothing to prove a point or solve the ongoing territorial dispute between the two interested ( Palestinians and Israelis) parties.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
Adhering to the original terms of the ceasefire which included lifting the blockade on diesel, electricity, and medicine would have been a great start. Hamas resumed firing rockets after talks to renew the ceasefire fell through. One and a half million are still without basic necessities of life.

Your idea lacks logic.

Israel cuts of the supplies because Hamas won't stop the rocket attacks. So Hamas responds by taking a course of action that will ensure Israel ends all aid to Gaza. It makes no sense.

BTW Gaza has a boarder with Egypt, why don't the Egyptians help them with fuel, electricity and medicine?

I believe this question of yours was about 100% honest as the Israeli commitment was to withdraw settlements from the Gaza strip.

TBH, ISRAEL cares more about the plight of the Palestinians than Hosni Mubarak does. And it's not saying much.

It would be very convenient to pawn the issue off onto Egypt. Then again who controls the borders in Gaza?

Which answers what statement?

You completely ignore what PJ says in order to put your own opinion of something completely different across?

So tell me why is it Egypt's responsibility to provide for the Palestinians? Why should Egypt put itself in a position where it could be held responsible for the actions of others who they have no control over in a area they have no territorial claim over? It's nice to try to pass the buck onto other nations in the region but it does nothing to prove a point or solve the ongoing territorial dispute between the two interested ( Palestinians and Israelis) parties.

No reason, just as Israel has no responsibility over a nation that has a democratically elected government. No country has any true say, hopefully they will back off and let Israel deal with it.

 

[mrSHEiK124]

Originally posted by: RichardE
No reason, just as Israel has no responsibility over a nation that has a democratically elected government. No country has any true say, hopefully they will back off and let Israel deal with it.

Except for the fact that it's not a nation and that Israel still largely controls it. They control the airspace, one border, and their ports. To believe otherwise is ignorant. If they [Gaza] were a belligerent sovereign nation, then we'd have a different story, but they're not.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Originally posted by: RichardE
No reason, just as Israel has no responsibility over a nation that has a democratically elected government. No country has any true say, hopefully they will back off and let Israel deal with it.

Except for the fact that it's not a nation and that Israel still largely controls it. They control the airspace, one border, and their ports. To believe otherwise is ignorant. If they [Gaza] were a belligerent sovereign nation, then we'd have a different story, but they're not.

It is a people controlled by a central government. Israel has offered to give back all those once the attacks stop, which they haven't. Since the inception of Israel the only thing keeping the Palestinians from there own nations is there reluctance to have peace, from going after a "war solution" in 48, to the modern day launching of thousands of rockets, it is all that stands.

They are still a people with an elected government that follows its own laws that is currently in a state of declared war with Israel.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
Adhering to the original terms of the ceasefire which included lifting the blockade on diesel, electricity, and medicine would have been a great start. Hamas resumed firing rockets after talks to renew the ceasefire fell through. One and a half million are still without basic necessities of life.

Your idea lacks logic.

Israel cuts of the supplies because Hamas won't stop the rocket attacks. So Hamas responds by taking a course of action that will ensure Israel ends all aid to Gaza. It makes no sense.

BTW Gaza has a boarder with Egypt, why don't the Egyptians help them with fuel, electricity and medicine?

I believe this question of yours was about 100% honest as the Israeli commitment was to withdraw settlements from the Gaza strip.

TBH, ISRAEL cares more about the plight of the Palestinians than Hosni Mubarak does. And it's not saying much.

It would be very convenient to pawn the issue off onto Egypt. Then again who controls the borders in Gaza?

Which answers what statement?

You completely ignore what PJ says in order to put your own opinion of something completely different across?

So tell me why is it Egypt's responsibility to provide for the Palestinians? Why should Egypt put itself in a position where it could be held responsible for the actions of others who they have no control over in a area they have no territorial claim over? It's nice to try to pass the buck onto other nations in the region but it does nothing to prove a point or solve the ongoing territorial dispute between the two interested ( Palestinians and Israelis) parties.

No reason, just as Israel has no responsibility over a nation that has a democratically elected government. No country has any true say, hopefully they will back off and let Israel deal with it.

Actually Israel has a responsibility because they are involved in the problem. They are the ones restricting the borders, air space, local waters of Gaza. They are the ones restricting trade, collecting taxes, etc. The issue is an issue the Israelis cannot pawn off onto a 3rd party because of their direct involvement and control of the Gaza Strip.

 

[kylebisme]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: poohbear
im just answering the OPs question as to what should israel do in the face "endless" rocket attacks..... pull out the illegal settlements. They're the ones bearing the brunt of rocket attacks, but they shouldnt even be there in the first place.
...

...
That is what they have been doing, albeit slowly.
...

...
You'd be surprised, a one state solution is completely plausible to everyone but diehards like Hamas and warmongers like some of the Israeli leadership.

...

Actually, I do see your point there. However, why is Gaza the one reacting to rockets over settlements in the West Bank? Why isn't the West Bank the ones reacting?

The settlements don't get attacked, and settlements are expanding, and settlements are in the West Bank while the rockets come from Gaza. In the West Bank, Israeli military checkpoints, roadblocks and patrols divide the territory to restrict Palestinian movement, while expressways give Israelis freedom of travel to all the settlements in Palestinian territory. Gaza on the other hand is the only portion of Palestine which Israel allows Palestinian the freedom of movement to attack Israel from, so the Israelis around Gaza suffer the rockets while the settlers in the West Bank are kept safe though Israel's military occupation of the territory.

And no, a one state solution isn't possible. Israel was formed on the grounds of being an ethnic nationalist state, and while I don't condone such ideologies be they for Jews or Aryans or whatever, I know Israel isn't ready to give it up. The only reasonable solution is to stop Israel's ongoing colonization of the West Bank. Only then can there be any hope of ending this conflict.

 

[kylebisme]

Originally posted by: Drift3r
... building settlements in Gaza.

Settlements in the West Bank that is. Israel withdrew their settlements in Gaza and their military along side it, only to go on expanding their settlements in the West Bank, and hence leaving Gaza destined to descend into the chaos which exists there now.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: TheSnowman

Originally posted by: Drift3r
... building settlements in Gaza.

Settlements in the West Bank that is. Israel withdrew their settlements in Gaza and their military along side it only to go on expanding their settlements in the West Bank, leaving Gaza destined to descend into the chaos which exists there now.

Thanks for the correction there. Will fix it.

 

[shrumpage]

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
Adhering to the original terms of the ceasefire which included lifting the blockade on diesel, electricity, and medicine would have been a great start. Hamas resumed firing rockets after talks to renew the ceasefire fell through. One and a half million are still without basic necessities of life.

Your idea lacks logic.

Israel cuts of the supplies because Hamas won't stop the rocket attacks. So Hamas responds by taking a course of action that will ensure Israel ends all aid to Gaza. It makes no sense.

BTW Gaza has a boarder with Egypt, why don't the Egyptians help them with fuel, electricity and medicine?

I believe this question of yours was about 100% as honest as the Israeli commitment was to withdraw settlements from the Gaza strip.

Um they did. Israel forced the settlers out and withdrew the army from gaza back in 2005.

 

[kylebisme]

Originally posted by: shrumpage
Um they did. Israel forced the settlers out and withdrew the army from gaza back in 2005.

...and they did so unilaterally without any coronation with the Palestinian Authority, leaving chaos as they left, while refocusing their efforts on their continuing colonization of the West Bank.

Here is a good article about that withdraw written shortly before it started, it is by an Israel peace activist, former Kinset member, and a solder in Israel's war of independence prior to that:

http://zope.gush-shalom.org/ho...nels/avnery/1112091472

 

[shrumpage]

Originally posted by: TheSnowman

Originally posted by: shrumpage
Um they did. Israel forced the settlers out and withdrew the army from gaza back in 2005.

...and they did so unilaterally without any coronation with the Palestinian Authority, leaving chaos as they left, while refocusing their efforts on their continuing colonization of the West Bank.

Here is a good article about that withdraw written shortly before it started, it is by an Israel peace activist, former Kinset member, and a solder in Israel's war of independence prior to that:

http://zope.gush-shalom.org/ho...nels/avnery/1112091472

The Palestinian Authority wanted Israel out, and they got it. They even had time to burn down the synagogue the Israelis left behind. Couldn't even bother to convert the buildings to schools or community center - had to destroy them.

The PA wanted absolutely NOTHING to do with Israel - and they got what they wanted. Now the billions of dollars they've received over the years has not been used to fix their country. The people in control are convinced that the only way to better themselves is to destroy Israel.

Firing rockets at your neighbor isn't going to fix your internal problems. In till Palestinians can figure that out their situation will NEVER improve.

The only thing they have done is set a precedent of what will happen when/if Israel pulls out of the West Bank.