no, it isn't communism, it is a progressive taxation policy (which American already has, anyway). it makes sense to tax the wealthiest citizens at the highest rates. the majority of people accept this. George Bush has simply tweaked the balance, causing huge amounts of money to shift from the pockets of the middle class to the pockets of the mega-wealthy.
Of FFS, not this crap again. Go google or something because it simply isn't true. The middle class pays next to nothing in taxes. The poor pay NO TAXES WHATSOEVER
It's the same old crap that been spewn over and over again by people that won't better their life or themselves. "But the rich don't pay taxes!!!! They're sticking it to the little man!!!"
Do you know that I will pay over 50K in taxes this year? And I ain't rich.
MagnusTheBrewer
IN MEMORIAM
- Jun 19, 2004
- 24,122
- 1,594
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MagnusTheBrewer
IN MEMORIAM
- Jun 19, 2004
- 24,122
- 1,594
- 126
Guess that depends on who's paying the taxes. Are you volunteering?
See the difference between working poor, middle class and filthy rich is that only the filthy rich talk about taxes as a percentage of income. It's being short twenty bucks on Wednesday when you get paid on Friday that's the killer.
That kind of behavior can only result from poor choices in life. Sorry. If you want a good paying job then go to a factory and make 70-100K.
I've been dirt freakin' poor. Trying to live off of 4 dollars a day for food and paying 100 bucks for a crappy roof over my head. Lazy is no excuse.
Nah, the middle class isn't dying; far from it in fact. The middle class and the upper classes are actually getting richer. That's not to say the poor are getting any poorer though. The average real annual income of the lowest 20% has stayed roughly the same for the past 30 years or so. Their incomes peaked in the early 1970s when manufacturing was still high in the US.
People bitch about the inequality of wealth in the US but they ignore the fact that our poor are just as rich as those in Europe which has less inequality. The only difference is that the middle and upper classes in Europe aren't as rich. That doesn't make the poor better off.
People bitch about the inequality of wealth in the US but they ignore the fact that our poor are just as rich as those in Europe which has less inequality. The only difference is that the middle and upper classes in Europe aren't as rich. That doesn't make the poor better off.
MagnusTheBrewer
IN MEMORIAM
- Jun 19, 2004
- 24,122
- 1,594
- 126
Lets see, first I am a communist and now I'm lazy? Guess I'll retire and let you take care of me.
Tell me of these wonderous factories that pay 70 - 100k. You my friend should sit down with other pontiffs like Paris, Anna Marie and 'The Trump' and tell us 'Po' folk how to get off our lazy a$$.
waggy
No Lifer
- Dec 14, 2000
- 68,143
- 10
- 81
Originally posted by: MagnusTheBrewer
Lets see, first I am a communist and now I'm lazy? Guess I'll retire and let you take care of me.
Tell me of these wonderous factories that pay 70 - 100k. You my friend should sit down with other pontiffs like Paris, Anna Marie and 'The Trump' and tell us 'Po' folk how to get off our lazy a$$.
no. by lazy he is thinking you have the opturnity to go to college and get a degree in whatever makeing a lot.
did you? did you put 100% into it?
many of the rich have.
personally i don't care what others make. i have some very rich friends and some that are close to loseing there house.
This is not necessarily true. An upper class person can be just as incompetant as a poor person and will likely get a higher paying job. Poverty has become a cycle in this country and it is our responsibility to fix it. Its easy to blame it all on the individual but thats an incomplete explanation. Poor people are not inherently stupider than middle class or rich people, so there is clearly more at work than just stupidity and laziness. The problem stems from poor education and a destructive culture. Its clear that letting these problems fester is not helping.
Ultimately this is an issue for society to decide. I hope the majority will decide to come together and tax the living fvck out of the mega-rich. The money can be used to further lower the tax burden on the poor, fund universal health care, provide free university education for all, etc.
MagnusTheBrewer
IN MEMORIAM
- Jun 19, 2004
- 24,122
- 1,594
- 126
Originally posted by: waggy
Originally posted by: MagnusTheBrewer
Lets see, first I am a communist and now I'm lazy? Guess I'll retire and let you take care of me.
Tell me of these wonderous factories that pay 70 - 100k. You my friend should sit down with other pontiffs like Paris, Anna Marie and 'The Trump' and tell us 'Po' folk how to get off our lazy a$$.
no. by lazy he is thinking you have the opturnity to go to college and get a degree in whatever makeing a lot.
did you? did you put 100% into it?
many of the rich have.
personally i don't care what others make. i have some very rich friends and some that are close to loseing there house.
Yes, I do have a degree and am working on a second. I also have several professional certifications.
The point that seems to elude a lot of well off folks is that, even with education, experience and, hard work, it is much more dificult to succeed now than it was when we were kids. I believe this is a result of the polarization of wealth in this country.
waggy
No Lifer
- Dec 14, 2000
- 68,143
- 10
- 81
Originally posted by: MagnusTheBrewer
Originally posted by: waggy
Originally posted by: MagnusTheBrewer
Lets see, first I am a communist and now I'm lazy? Guess I'll retire and let you take care of me.
Tell me of these wonderous factories that pay 70 - 100k. You my friend should sit down with other pontiffs like Paris, Anna Marie and 'The Trump' and tell us 'Po' folk how to get off our lazy a$$.
no. by lazy he is thinking you have the opturnity to go to college and get a degree in whatever makeing a lot.
did you? did you put 100% into it?
many of the rich have.
personally i don't care what others make. i have some very rich friends and some that are close to loseing there house.
Yes, I do have a degree and am working on a second. I also have several professional certifications.
The point that seems to elude a lot of well off folks is that, even with education, experience and, hard work, it is much more dificult to succeed now than it was when we were kids. I believe this is a result of the polarization of wealth in this country.
i feel its just as easy to succeed. just the definition of success has changed. people think its a 4k sqft house, new cars every year, top of the line crap in the house (replaced every few years) etc etc.
- Feb 1, 2003
- 3,190
- 6
- 81
Exactly - it's like I said in my previous post - hard work will only get you so far. For every successful entrepreneur are probably thousands who put everything they had into their companies and didn't see a fraction of the success that people like Bill Gates did.
For every CEO getting a multi-million dollar bouns there are a ton of upper level executives who will never become the next CEO no matter how hard they work at it.
Natural ability and luck are factors here. Some people are just not as good at it as others. If you are a religious person you can blame it on your deity of choice, or if not, just say that it amounts to that age-old saying "life isn't fair."
Hard work will only take you to the best of your own abilities, not to the best of anyone's.
Having said that, I would think that most people have what it takes to live comfortably (although not necessarily a millionaire) making a living in something.
MagnusTheBrewer
IN MEMORIAM
- Jun 19, 2004
- 24,122
- 1,594
- 126
Which brings us back to rampant consumerism.
I disagree that the definiton of success has changed but I do agree that expectations have changed and increased.
waggy
No Lifer
- Dec 14, 2000
- 68,143
- 10
- 81
hard work is one of the items you need.d you also need the education and intelligence to get it.
also capitalizing on the opportunity and even knowing when you have that opportunity helps.
will everyone be a millionaire? nope. but everyone has the opportunity to be one. millions will try. few will succede.
or look at someone like Richard Stallman, brilliant computer geek & hacker who practically founded the free software movement. He thinks it is a human rights violation to charge for software. Imagine if Richard Stallman had been a selfish pr1ck like Bill Gates, instead of creating the GPL and the GNU tools, he might have spent his life trying to overcharge suckers for emacs or other software or spent his life like Bill Gates stealing ideas and software from other people and remarketing it at outrageous prices. I believe that 50 years from now, the influence of Bill Gates will be forgotten, but the influence of Richard Stallman will live on through open source and free software which is rapidly becoming the accepted standard in business and is already the accepted standard in the sciences. Assessing people's worth to society by their pay check is just an incredibly stupid thing.
waggy
No Lifer
- Dec 14, 2000
- 68,143
- 10
- 81
agree 100% with you.
I know some very rich people. heck my father and his wife have a lot in the bank. but nobody would know it. they don't have a big house or fancy cars. they do go on vacations a few times a year and own a cabin in WI though. I also have friends that make 300+ a year.
i also have some friends that scrape by every month.
only time it matters is going out for dinner. gotta change where we go depending who i go out with heh
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