Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes + WCL Discussion Threads

[Tigerick]

Wildcat Lake (WCL) Preliminary Specs

Intel Wildcat Lake (WCL) is upcoming mobile SoC replacing ADL-N. WCL consists of 2 tiles: compute tile and PCD tile. It is true single die consists of CPU, GPU and NPU that is fabbed by 18-A process. Last time I checked, PCD tile is fabbed by TSMC N6 process. They are connected through UCIe, not D2D; a first from Intel. Expecting launching in Q2/Computex 2026. In case people don't remember AlderLake-N, I have created a table below to compare the detail specs of ADL-N and WCL. Just for fun, I am throwing LNL and upcoming Mediatek D9500 SoC.

		Intel Alder Lake - N	Intel Wildcat Lake	Intel Lunar Lake		Mediatek D9500
Launch Date		Q1-2023	Q2-2026 ?	Q3-2024		Q3-2025
Model		Intel N300	?	Core Ultra 7 268V		Dimensity 9500 5G
Dies		2	2	2		1
Node		Intel 7 + ?	Intel 18-A + TSMC N6	TSMC N3B + N6		TSMC N3P
CPU		8 E-cores	2 P-core + 4 LP E-cores	4 P-core + 4 LP E-cores		C1 1+3+4
Threads		8	6	8		8
Max Clock		3.8 GHz	?	5 GHz
L3 Cache		6 MB	?	12 MB
TDP		7 W	Fanless ?	17 W		Fanless
Memory		64-bit LPDDR5-4800	64-bit LPDDR5-6800 ?	128-bit LPDDR5X-8533		64-bit LPDDR5X-10667
Size		16 GB	?	32 GB		24 GB ?
Bandwidth			~ 55 GB/s	136 GB/s		85.6 GB/s
GPU		UHD Graphics		Arc 140V		G1 Ultra
EU / Xe		32 EU	2 Xe	8 Xe		12
Max Clock		1.25 GHz		2 GHz
NPU		NA	18 TOPS	48 TOPS		100 TOPS ?

As Hot Chips 34 starting this week, Intel will unveil technical information of upcoming Meteor Lake (MTL) and Arrow Lake (ARL), new generation platform after Raptor Lake. Both MTL and ARL represent new direction which Intel will move to multiple chiplets and combine as one SoC platform.

MTL also represents new compute tile that based on Intel 4 process which is based on EUV lithography, a first from Intel. Intel expects to ship MTL mobile SoC in 2023.

ARL will come after MTL so Intel should be shipping it in 2024, that is what Intel roadmap is telling us. ARL compute tile will be manufactured by Intel 20A process, a first from Intel to use GAA transistors called RibbonFET.

 

[Hitman928]

 

[Josh128]

Fastest iGPU?
View attachment 108127View attachment 108128

Second fastest, loses to Strix at high and ultra, which are more GPU intensive. 258V winning at low indicates faster CPU ST perf.

 

[Hitman928]

This is just int, still waiting on fp. Need both to determine approx IPC.

SPECint has been the standard for IPC for quite a while here.

 

[Hitman928]

Battery life and GPU improvements seem to be the shining points, though we need a lot more samples to get a firm grasp on how good battery life really is. More GPU testing as well, it will be interesting to see if Intel was able to fix the areas were GPU performance choked previously.

 

[Josh128]

SPECint has been the standard for IPC for quite a while here.

SPECfp doesnt matter?

 

[Hitman928]

SPECfp doesnt matter?

Not much. It more or less gets ignored. It's actually not a great test for FP performance.

 

[poke01]

This leads be to believe that N3B was a bad node. Both for Apple and Intel

View attachment 108131

Battery life and GPU improvements seem to be the shining points, though we need a lot more samples to get a firm grasp on how good battery life really is. More GPU testing as well, it will be interesting to see if Intel was able to fix the areas were GPU performance choked previously.

how does it lose to a fanless Air? Talking MT obviously

 

[cebri1]

Second fastest, loses to Strix at high and ultra, which are more GPU intensive. 258V winning at low indicates faster CPU ST perf.

Keep in mind this GPU doesn’t boost to 2.1Ghz like the 140V in the 288V.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Do you expect IPC to be much higher for ARL? I'm not counting on a big uplift, it's the same core with some more LLC.

Might be neck and neck with Zen 5 in integer subtests or barely be better overall in INT but may lose in SpecFP.

 

[Hitman928]

Might be neck and neck with Zen 5 in integer subtests or barely be better overall in INT but may lose in SpecFP.

I agree with you, but the general reaction to Zen 5 was that it was a huge disappointment. . .

 

[511]

Which freq for which core?

3.7 for 258V and 3.3 for 5C

 

[cebri1]

View attachment 108131

Battery life and GPU improvements seem to be the shining points, though we need a lot more samples to get a firm grasp on how good battery life really is. More GPU testing as well, it will be interesting to see if Intel was able to fix the areas were GPU performance choked previously.

Notebook check get 120 points in ST, which puts it 6% ahead of Strix. That’s another shinning point in my book.

 

[Hitman928]

This leads be to believe that N3B was a bad node. Both for Apple and Intel

how does it lose to a fanless Air? Talking MT obviously

Apple cores are still king in terms of efficiency.

 

[511]

Notebook check get 120 points in ST, which puts it 6% ahead of Strix. That’s another shinning point in my book.

While consuming way less power lol

 

[cebri1]

:O

 

[tsamolotoff]

Some results from Gordon Ung

 

[511]

Second fastest, loses to Strix at high and ultra, which are more GPU intensive. 258V winning at low indicates faster CPU ST perf.

We need higher power limits for both lol

 

[igor_kavinski]

I agree with you, but the general reaction to Zen 5 was that it was a huge disappointment. . .

Arrow Lake would be a better disappointment than degrading Raptor Lakes

At least users won't have to worry anymore. TSMC doesn't have a history of bad process issues. Yet.

 

[Josh128]

The ST efficiency beats the hell out of Strix, but this is a 4.8 vs 5.1 scenario, keep that in mind. Downclocking Strix to 4.8 may boost its efficiency a decent amount. What I find more intriguing is that the Lion Cove R23 ST is 7% behind Strix (4.8 vs 5.1), and is even about 0.75% behind when clock normalized. Just going off of this, Lion Cove is essentially identical to Zen 5 in R23 IPC. That doesnt bode well for those predicting 2500+ R23 ST for the 285K. Unless this Zenbook S14 is not holding its ST boost well during the test. In R15 and R20 ST, its behind 18% and 23% respectively. Ironically, Lunar Lake beats Strix in R24 ST by around 12 to 13% clock normalized. Wonder why such a huge the role reversal vs R15, 20, and 23?

 

[cebri1]

The ST efficiency beats the hell out of Strix, but this is a 4.8 vs 5.1 scenario, keep that in mind. Downclocking Strix to 4.8 may boost its efficiency a decent amount. What I find more intriguing is that the Lion Cove R23 ST is 7% behind Strix (4.8 vs 5.1), and is even about 0.75% behind when clock normalized. Just going off of this, Lion Cove is essentially identical to Zen 5 in R23 IPC. That doesnt bode well for those predicting 2500+ R23 ST for the 285K. Unless this Zenbook S14 is not holding its ST boost well during the test. In R15 and R20 ST, its behind 18% and 23% respectively. Ironically, Lunar Lake beats Strix in R24 ST by around 12 to 13% clock normalized. Wonder why such a huge the role reversal vs R15, 20, and 23?


View attachment 108134

In CB24 beats it by 6% even with the clock advantage, as you say 13% normalized. So I would wait for ARL and see.

 

[Hitman928]

The ST efficiency beats the hell out of Strix, but this is a 4.8 vs 5.1 scenario, keep that in mind. Downclocking Strix to 4.8 may boost its efficiency a decent amount. What I find more intriguing is that the Lion Cove R23 ST is 7% behind Strix (4.8 vs 5.1), and is even about 0.75% behind when clock normalized. Just going off of this, Lion Cove is essentially identical to Zen 5 in R23 IPC. That doesnt bode well for those predicting 2500+ R23 ST for the 285K. Unless this Zenbook S14 is not holding its ST boost well during the test. In R15 and R20 ST, its behind 18% and 23% respectively. Ironically, Lunar Lake beats Strix in R24 ST by around 12 to 13% clock normalized. Wonder why such a huge the role reversal vs R15, 20, and 23?


View attachment 108134

CB24 has some sensitivity to memory bandwidth where the previous versions didn’t.

 

[Hitman928]

View attachment 108135

In CB24 beats it by 6% even with the clock advantage, as you say 13% normalized. So I would wait for ARL and see.

HX370 at proper boost and high speed memory scores about 120 in CB24 ST, so LNL has about a 5% advantage there.

 

[9949asd]

HX370 at proper boost and high speed memory scores about 120 in CB24 ST, so LNL has about a 5% advantage there.

how about max out 288v st will be 130？

 

[cebri1]

pretty impressive generational jump. Arc team must be very pleased.

 

[Josh128]

Interestingly, for battery life, the Strix HX 370 based Vivobook S 14 still beats everything, including this Lunar Lake Zenbook S14. Display obviously has a tremendous amount of influence on battery life, as the lower resolution seems to suck much less power at the same screen size than the UX5406.

Would be very interesting to see how a Vivobook version of Lunar Lake with same display compares.