Goodbye public option, we hardly knew ya

[TruePaige]

I thought British humor pretty much consisted of men dressing up as women?

And umm..umm...doors! You run in one chasing a guy and he runs out of another one!

 

[Fear No Evil]

And umm..umm...doors! You run in one chasing a guy and he runs out of another one!

I thought that was Scooby Do?

 

[TruePaige]

Hahahahahahaha! You don't look for debate either. We all just shout our own opinion, conservatives, "progressives", it's all the same.

He called me a hack because I support tort reform. All it is is signing a piece of paper and *guaranteed* that expenses are reduced. Seems simple enough to me. Everything about the rest of the reform, the public option, etc., the cost estimates & savings are all based on guesses. Why I would be called a hack by supporting the one guarantee out there, you tell me, since you seem to be so smart

*Yawn* Nothing is going anywhere in this country anyway, but if could ever get together and model a UHC plan after our good friends over the pond we have lengthy, well researched, factual evidence that it can cut costs drastically.

The point being argued to death for 30,000,000 threads kind of kills the interest in talking about it at length any more.

 

[TruePaige]

I thought that was Scooby Do?

...The British invasion begins.

 

[Zebo]

Please explain how the public option actually "cuts costs" and doesn't simply shift costs to "the rich" and middle class? (IE the 53% of us who actually pay taxes)

Do you understand that countries like France, Germany and Taiwan etc insure EVERYONE for half what we pay per capita?

100% public option.

I don't know about you but I look forward to my taxes whether private taxes or public taxes going down.

Again all for half price. Think about that.

Now why can't we get there.

Not to mention to human element it's just plain cheaper if done right.

 

[Sinsear]

No public option = victory for America

 

[Zorkorist]

Do you understand that countries like France, Germany and Taiwan etc insure EVERYONE for half what we pay per capita?

100% public option.

I don't know about you but I look forward to my taxes whether private taxes or public taxes going down.

Again all for half price. Think about that.

Now why can't we get there.

Not to mention to human element it's just plain cheaper if done right.

That's ridiculous, Z.

Here in America, most everyone that gets in health trouble, gets healthcare.

1sr class healthcare.

We have a bunch of leeches, on the Goverment tit, but who doesn't?

-John

 

[seemingly random]

Do you understand that countries like France, Germany and Taiwan etc insure EVERYONE for half what we pay per capita?

100% public option.

I don't know about you but I look forward to my taxes whether private taxes or public taxes going down.

Again all for half price. Think about that.

Now why can't we get there.

Not to mention to human element it's just plain cheaper if done right.

What the fuck is happening here? I'm agreeing more and more with you. Are you being serious?

 

[Genx87]

I already provided the citations. Go read em. There are plenty more out there. Type in public option cut costs into google.

I know how you fear citations and actual data... but you've reached a new level of stupidity if you don't even want to read linked information.

Took 2 more seconds on google-

"The public plan would likely have lower administrative costs, though, because insurance would be sold directly to individuals, and not through a broker.

But, the public plan could pay off in the long run. Although providing care may cost more initially, if the public option becomes a vehicle for a large number of currently uninsured people to gain coverage, it could save money — and lives. Its enrollees could avoid becoming chronically ill from a lack of medical attention. And instead of waiting until they’re sick and turning to costly emergency rooms for treatment, Americans insured through the public option could get preventive care to reduce their risk of developing serious diseases."

http://moneywatch.bnet.com/economic...ic-option-everything-you-need-to-know/364824/

Why do state public insurance program see their costs raise as fast or faster than private insurance? Shouldnt they be seeing similar cost savings? Why has Madicare and Medicaid far outpaced initial forecasts?

 

[Zorkorist]

When Zebo talks about health care being cheap, he's talking about Doctor's paid what UPS drivers are paid. He's talking about when you need new cars on your car, you go to the state run tire factory.

He will decide if you need or deserve health care. HE will decide if you need new tires.

-John

 

[fskimospy]

Why do state public insurance program see their costs raise as fast or faster than private insurance? Shouldnt they be seeing similar cost savings? Why has Madicare and Medicaid far outpaced initial forecasts?

Don't forget the other question of 'why is Medicare and Medicaid so much more cost efficient than private insurance'?

 

[GuitarDaddy]

Man all you guys seem to see or hear are the TV bullet points that suit your particular beliefs.

This is nothing more than a public option with a government controled private administrator, just like federal employees have now. You can hardly get anymore public than that! With the feds dictating coverage and price, and the only differece is a shell private administrator. Wether the number crunchers get paid by the government or a private administrator it's basically the same option.

I actually think this is a smart move by the dems, it shuts up the idiots that cry "the goboment can't run nuthin", and gives the free enterprisers and constitutionalist a faux victory for their sheeple.

As long as this privately administered plan is available to all and is portable then the dems have the competitive leverage against insurance companies that they desire. With a wink wink the blue dogs get to claim victory against the public option, while they aline with the party majority and pass the "private" public option

 

[OrByte]

real health system reform will come when the republicans are back in charge...


....

<sniker>

 

[Sacrilege]

When Zebo talks about health care being cheap, he's talking about Doctor's paid what UPS drivers are paid. He's talking about when you need new cars on your car, you go to the state run tire factory.

He will decide if you need or deserve health care. HE will decide if you need new tires.

-John

Right.... because the standard of care and standard of living in the US is so much higher than in industrialized nations with nationalized health care. And there's rationing going on in those far away socialist places as well.

 

[Genx87]

Don't forget the other question of 'why is Medicare and Medicaid so much more cost efficient than private insurance'?

You going to fall back on the lame brain argument of administrative costs?????
That one is tough to debunk. Shifting costs onto providers and paying out an avg higher cost per capita for the same administrative fee equals lower % overhead.

 

[Patranus]

After reading up on the purposed legislation, the "compromise" is a joke and Senators are not doing their job.

The legislation cuts the public option but greatly expands the roles of Medicare and Medicaid.

Now, how do you cut some 650 billion dollars from Medicare and greatly expand its rolls?

The only thing expanding Medicaid accomplishes is that is pushes the cost onto the state. If you live in a bankrupt state such as California or New York which is essentially bankrupt, well, this is a bad thing. I am sure deals have been cut to redistribute wealth from other non bankrupt state to states that cannot afford this expansion similar to the 300 million that bought the Senator from Louisianian. This expansion of Medicaid is NOT good for that state and it is the duty of the Senate (as the representation of the state government on the legislative branch) to vote this down.

 

[woodie1]

No matter what the Senate passes the bill still has to be reconciled with the House version.

 

[Sacrilege]

Remember, many Republicans are morally opposed to poor people receiving health care.

They believe poor people have some sort of fault: drug addiction, sloth, lack of faith in the Capitalist system, wrong color skin, or are just being punished by God.

It is wrong for the government and society as a whole to help these people. They should pull themselves up by their bootstraps and embrace Conservative Morals and Free Market Capitalism.

 

[Zorkorist]

Right.... because the standard of care and standard of living in the US is so much higher than in industrialized nations with nationalized health care. And there's rationing going on in those far away socialist places as well.

You do understand that we have the highest standing of living in the world. And why is that? Because we are socialist?

No.

It's because we believe in an ideal called the American Way.

That one man has an opportunity to succeed, buy a white fenced gabled house, find a wife, and etc.

He sure didn't know that his purpose in life was making sure some crack-head in Harlem got health insurance.

 

[seemingly random]

This really has the cons stirred up. It must be right as rain.

 

[Zebo]

When Zebo talks about health care being cheap, he's talking about Doctor's paid what UPS drivers are paid. He's talking about when you need new cars on your car, you go to the state run tire factory.

He will decide if you need or deserve health care. HE will decide if you need new tires.

-John

That's bullshit. You have CEO's making billions sitting here denying treatments every day. Why not have a gs-9 who makes 75k do it? Guess what even third world costa rica has NHC. I was surprised they can afford it after all the right rhetoric I've heard. And even more surprised to learn doctors make plenty of cash in those countries. (otherwise how do they get people to do it? they don't have slavery)

 

[TechAZ]

I don't know if a public option would be a good thing or bad thing, and I really don't believe anyone really has that good of an idea to reshape such a huge part of the economy, only people who want to score political points or actually profit somehow.

What does piss me off are all those who talk about Canada, the UK, France, etc talk about how they do it so effeciently and &#37;GDP bullshit.....

This is not some tiny, non-diverse, simplistic country. NONE of those countries compare to what we are and have in the US. None of these countries come even close to the wide variety and extremely populated ethnic groups that we have here. None of those countries compare to the cultural issues and ways of life we live and face here in the US.

JoS simply doesn't know what the fuck he is talking about. Real surprise, considering he is a grunt and not in the healthcare field. This is the internet though, so he might reply that both his parents are neurosurgeons.

 

[Patranus]

That's bullshit. You have CEO's making billions sitting here denying treatments every day. Why not have a gs-9 who makes 75k do it? Guess what even third world costa rica has NHC. I was surprised they can afford it after all the right rhetoric I've heard. And even more surprised to learn doctors make plenty of cash in those countries. (otherwise how do they get people to do it? they don't have slavery)

If health care is so great in all of these other countries why do world leaders and those who can afford to travel to the United State come here for their treatment?

 

[Zorkorist]

Remember, many Republicans are morally opposed to poor people receiving health care.

They believe poor people have some sort of fault: drug addiction, sloth, lack of faith in the Capitalist system, wrong color skin, or are just being punished by God.

It is wrong for the government and society as a whole to help these people. They should pull themselves up by their bootstraps and embrace Conservative Morals and Free Market Capitalism.

Since we know that there is no utopia, where poor people are automatically happy, proud, and as rich as all of us (Socialism/Communism), why don't you just shut the fuck up?

There will always be poor people, and we will do what we can for them, but to design a state around poor people, is ludicrous.

 

[cubby1223]

That's bullshit. You have CEO's making billions sitting here

Name one CEO that is making billions.