Game of Thrones - TV Series (NO BOOK SPOILERS)

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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
107,541
23,426
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Is Loras a skilled swordsman other than the obvious double entendre of his dalliance with Renly? He's known as being an excellent jouster, but the only time I recall seeing him with a sword in hand he got his ass kicked by Brienne. The renowned sword fighters are Jaime, Barristan Selmy, Ned, Gregor, Sandor and it can be assumed Bronn is in that league. Loras is never mentioned alongside those guys.
Loras is always mentioned as a top swordsman. That is why Brienne became pimp, because apparently no one had defeated Loras before that.
 

dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
14,071
2,535
126
Is he on Arya's list?

I'm getting upset that everyone on Arya's list is getting killed by other means...
"Something wrong with your leg, boy?"

And it sounded like Rorge got added to the list at the last minute.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
107,541
23,426
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This was just to set up that the Mountain wasn't some oaf that was easily defeated and advance Bronn's character as someone who fancies himself and gold over Tyrion's friendship.
Yeah, but the description from Bronn vs what we saw was rather jarring. Yeah, I'd certainly run from that monster, but I'm no badass swordsman.

I lean towards the description, obviously, and just chalk it up to bad casting/bad directing in that scene. Instead of fast and terrifying, he really looked slow and clumsy...as he hacked at unarmed people cowering ont he ground, waiting to be hacked.

It's the same thing as talking up Vader to be the baddest badass in all the Galaxy, murdering all of the Jedis ever, then we see him in episode 3 murdering a bunch of unarmed children...while all the stormtroopers actually kill the Jedi. ...talk about let down. :D
 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,186
754
126
I can't see Oberyn winning unless he did use some poison tipped sword.
To note, in the preview,
Oberyn is seen using some sort of staff or spear. I didn't take a terribly close look at it, but they showed him twirling it around. The best part was when his woman (don't recall her exact relationship) says, "You have to fight THAT?"
 

JEDI

Lifer
Sep 25, 2001
27,833
1,600
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saw 1/2 the episode so far. a few things:

1) scene with the Mountain side by side with Cercei looked CHEESY!
omg horrible special effects.

since in real life the actor that plays the Mountain is actually 400+ lbs, why didn't they just show him next to her naturally w/o the gimmicks.
it still would have given the point of how big he is.

2) the new guy playing the Mountain cant act.
yeah, I understand he's not an actor but winner of the Strongman competition. but still... yeesh

3) the ex-head of the gold cloaks that was sent to the wall:
a) when tyrion banished him there, why did he actually go there? why not just go somewhere else? was he transported there under armed guard?

b) when tywin took Hand of the King back from tyrion, why didn't he bring that guy back?

4) Mother of Dragons dressing like Lady Flowers :thumbsup:

5) I wonder what Stannis's daughter role will be in the future? sacrificial lamb?
and does Stannis know this?

6) Why didn't they make Darios hair blue like in the books?
at least he'll stand out from the other secondary chars
 
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Pens1566

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 2005
8,056
1,355
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horseshit. Every episode this season was setting up for a big principles fight--not as much for some barely seen, hardly talked about, 3 times-cast man beast vs a newly-introduced secondary foil. Yes, that was setup, but the evidence for Jamie vs X was in equal abundance, if not more so. ANyone who ignores that is just being willfully stupid.

Again, no reason to buy he "wasn't ready" based on what was shown. If Rocky is shown to spend a gay day frolicking on the beach with Apollo Creed to prepare him to fight Clubber Lang, then we sure as shit got enough of Jamie learning how to fight to assume that he would be involved very soon. It's a very common trope.

I think the Mountain vs Oberyn is good drama, and yes it was setup (never so specifically to fight for Tyrion's defense; but to fight somehow), but Jamie vs Mountain or whomever is the better impact. It's "drama first," more than this situation.
The fact that you think the Mountain is "hardly talked about" pretty much cements that you haven't been paying attention to details the entire series.
 

irishScott

Lifer
Oct 10, 2006
21,568
3
0
I believe in Tyrion's first trial they did accuse Bronn of not fighting "honorably" and he replied with a "No, but he did." referring to the knight he just killed.
Yeah, and despite fighting dishonorably, and straight up admitting to such, they pronounced him the winner and let Tyrion go. They were also dancing around the entire antechamber, even mixing in with bystanders from time to time. So I'm thinking anything goes.
 
Feb 6, 2007
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3) the ex-head of the gold cloaks that was sent to the wall:
a) when tyrion banished him there, why did he actually go there? why not just go somewhere else? was he transported there under armed guard?

b) when tywin took Hand of the King back from tyrion, why didn't he bring that guy back?
I imagine when he was sent to the Wall, it was done under lock and key, similar to how we've seen everyone else sent to the Wall, given that they are frequently outlaws who don't really want to go and need to be "persuaded." That said, after he's taken the Black, that's a lifetime commitment; he can't be excused from it just because the power structure has shifted in King's Landing again.
 
Feb 6, 2007
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The fact that you think the Mountain is "hardly talked about" pretty much cements that you haven't been paying attention to details the entire series.
The Mountain is hardly talked about. Ned Stark talked about him shortly before being imprisoned and beheaded; Oberyn talks about him and a quest for revenge; and Arya says his name as part of her bedside prayers. Apart from that, he doesn't get discussed with any frequency. And he's only been in a total of six episodes, including last night (before that, we haven't seen him since midway through Season 2); Meryn Trant has been in nearly double. The Mountain may be a major character in the books, but he's barely in the periphery on the TV show (at least, until now).
 

irishScott

Lifer
Oct 10, 2006
21,568
3
0
Yeah, but the description from Bronn vs what we saw was rather jarring. Yeah, I'd certainly run from that monster, but I'm no badass swordsman.

I lean towards the description, obviously, and just chalk it up to bad casting/bad directing in that scene. Instead of fast and terrifying, he really looked slow and clumsy...as he hacked at unarmed people cowering ont he ground, waiting to be hacked.

It's the same thing as talking up Vader to be the baddest badass in all the Galaxy, murdering all of the Jedis ever, then we see him in episode 3 murdering a bunch of unarmed children...while all the stormtroopers actually kill the Jedi. ...talk about let down. :D
I didn't find it that jarring. He had no need to be fast given his opponents, maybe he was practicing his kill strokes/form. :p I agree they could have presented him better, perhaps with some training dummies on rollers or something. It seems like they wanted to showcase his size and brutality more than his fighting skill; but remember he went toe-to-toe with the hound.
 

Pens1566

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 2005
8,056
1,355
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The Mountain is hardly talked about. Ned Stark talked about him shortly before being imprisoned and beheaded; Oberyn talks about him and a quest for revenge; and Arya says his name as part of her bedside prayers. Apart from that, he doesn't get discussed with any frequency. And he's only been in a total of six episodes, including last night (before that, we haven't seen him since midway through Season 2); Meryn Trant has been in nearly double. The Mountain may be a major character in the books, but he's barely in the periphery on the TV show (at least, until now).
He's central to a major plot line this season and the back story for one of the main characters in the show.
 
Feb 6, 2007
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He's central to a major plot line this season and the back story for one of the main characters in the show.
Yes, he's become a more central figure this season, and specifically this last episode, but before that, he was a peripheral character at best. And what does it matter if he's the back story for one of the main characters in the show? Aerys Targaryen is a back story for basically everything that's happening on the show, but I wouldn't call him a major character.
 

JEDI

Lifer
Sep 25, 2001
27,833
1,600
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Agree. That scene with Oberyn yesterday was amazing. He did a lot by doing very little. Impressive scene.

KT
meh.. I knew he was going to grab the torch b4 announcing he's going to be tyrions champion. Dramatic fashion and all that.

and the angle of the camera when announced it... sheesh..

who directed this episode?
Capt Cheese?
 

sactoking

Diamond Member
Sep 24, 2007
7,182
2,073
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b) when tywin took Hand of the King back from tyrion, why didn't he bring that guy back?
Janos Slynt wasn't valuable to Tywin. He's not a renowned fighter or a renowned lord. He was Cersei's stooge, nothing more.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
107,541
23,426
146
The fact that you think the Mountain is "hardly talked about" pretty much cements that you haven't been paying attention to details the entire series.
He gets a breath of mention every other episode or so and again, we rarely see him. So rarely, that he's been cast 3 times? lol

the most plentiful references to him are through The Hound, obviously, but that's more along the lines of "I hate my wise and beautiful woman of a brother" and not "I am afraid of this badass warrior-killing beast of a thing."

Again, I'm not saying that it's unusual for him to be picked here--yes, it's fairly obvious, which is pretty much my point. It's obvious, and therefore lacks the drama of the Jamie choice that the show was suggesting quite strongly. Not that the Mountain is an unkown, but that he is a barely-known to the audience. He primarily exists as reference through others and far, far, far from a principle. Oberyn is established only this season--it's just kind of odd to build up such a pivotal moment of the story and use it to showcase a grudge that occurred between a secondary and background foil, decades before the main action of the show.

What I see is that the only people who are outright ignoring the volumes of suggestion that Jamie would be fighting for Tyrion, are those that already knew the outcome, so they flat out ignore all of it and focus on the far fewer scenes regarding Oberyn (the ones where he isn't fucking some whores) that lead towards the conclusion that is already known. Confirmation bias.

I imagine that anyone who thinks The Mountain is anywhere close to a principle in this show is clouded by the book treatment of him--as I assume he has been far more involved at this point in the story?
 

Phoenix86

Lifer
May 21, 2003
14,643
9
81
OK so we get two weeks to chew over Obery vs. Mountain. I don't think he'll stoop to poisons, he's already a skilled fighter. He's doing this in public, legal, etc. Why go through all that just to cheat.

I think Oberyn will win straight up in a classic finesse vs. power fight. The preview of the fight looked very interesting. :D
 

MagickMan

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2008
7,537
3
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I'm sure the spoiler police will be pissed, but valyrian steel was supposed to be made using dragon fire and only a few people knew the secrets of reworking it. Most of the valyrian swords are ancient, and new ones can no longer be made. Only reworked.
Well, they can be made now, since there are dragons around again.

Maybe to rework it it had to be cast in a certain way, and not forged and folded. Maybe traditional swordsmithing destroys its enchantment? :confused:
 

MagickMan

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2008
7,537
3
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Yeah... and? That would be what the training was supposed to fix. They subsequently showed his skills improving as he trained with Bronn. We didn't know until this episode that the training had been ineffective.
Ineffective? I don't believe so. He was embellishing when he said that he couldn't "defeat a stable boy", but there's no way he could defeat Gregor. Back in his prime, Jaime would have peeled the big fool out of his armor and served him his entrails.

Not talking about the actual acress, but I thought Sansa was 15 or 16 in the show. While Baelish is like 45-50?

You dont call that pedophilia?! o_O
Nope, she has 100% bona fide adult woman parts now.
 

VulgarDisplay

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2009
6,193
2
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The thing that makes the mountain so dangerous was alluded to by the hound. He has armor and a big fucking sword. The added benefit of being 8ft tall and 350lbs of pure muscle is that you can carry armor that would make a lesser man fall down wearing it. The mountain can wear serious plate, still be fast, and carry a great sword that would be as long as a spear for a normal person. Jamie in his prime would get destroyed by the mountain.
 

Phoenix86

Lifer
May 21, 2003
14,643
9
81
Okay Okay--how's about Nightwatch sit up on their wall and watch the wildlings and zombies fight it out, all the while torching the whole area with pitch and fire arrows?
"The first builders need 100 barrels of pitch on top of the wall" ~Ser Alliser

So, if you wanted to know who you were in Game of Thrones...
 

cubby1223

Lifer
May 24, 2004
13,518
42
86
What I see is that the only people who are outright ignoring the volumes of suggestion that Jamie would be fighting for Tyrion, are those that already knew the outcome, so they flat out ignore all of it and focus on the far fewer scenes regarding Oberyn (the ones where he isn't fucking some whores) that lead towards the conclusion that is already known. Confirmation bias.
It's like I saw the red wedding scene before I started watching the series. You can see it coming a mile away when you know it's coming.

I imagine that anyone who thinks The Mountain is anywhere close to a principle in this show is clouded by the book treatment of him--as I assume he has been far more involved at this point in the story?
The Mountain is a nobody in the tv series. Heck, the youngest Stark child who was never a part of any storyline got tons more air-time than the Mountain.
 

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