Elon Musk named 2021 Time person of the year

[MrSquished]

But are you angry at Musk for not paying more taxes?

It's funny, people will point out he is paying a lot of tax this year, without taking it into context what he's paid the last 10 years. Or what corporations pay in general. Or what billionaires pay in general.

As Warren Buffett pointed out, the ultra wealthy won the tax war big time

But some of them are in a cult. Especially when a billionaire makes them rich too, they could give two shits about the society around them.

 

[IronWing]

Elon paid a lot in taxes because he had high income. Had he paid his workers better, he would have paid less in taxes. This is why we should tax the wealthy; they have the money. The historic steep tax rates on the rich were designed, in part, to encourage the rich to pay their workers better or otherwise invest in their businesses as businesses. The current tax code encourages the rich to go Scrooge McDuck.

 

[HurleyBird]

This is a pretty dumb nation generally so it makes sense that a stupid person’s idea of a smart person would win this award. Donald Trump might as well finally get the award at this rate.

I don't know. Elon is obviously a smart cookie, but there's smart and then there's smart. Elon's public utterances and twitter feed regularly make him look just regular smart. For me, the best evidence of him being extremely intelligent is that I've only ever seen other highly intelligent people with first hand experience with Musk paint his intelligence in a positive light.

For example, Jim Keller had this to say: "I really liked the way he thought. Like, you think you have an understanding about what first principles of something is, and then you talk to Elon about it, and you didn't scratch the surface."

I feel that there are a lot of dumb people who put Musk on a pedestal for dumb reasons, so I get where you're coming from, but that doesn't actually make Musk less intelligent.

 

[cytg111]

It's funny, people will point out he is paying a lot of tax this year, without taking it into context what he's paid the last 10 years. Or what corporations pay in general. Or what billionaires pay in general.

As Warren Buffett pointed out, the ultra wealthy won the tax war big time

But some of them are in a cult. Especially when a billionaire makes them rich too, they could give two shits about the society around them.

But are you angry at Musk for not paying more taxes?

 

[Zorba]

But are you angry at Musk for not paying more taxes?

I'm angry at the system. I also don't believe the BS about how he doesn't care about money when he has a fleet of accounts and lawyers finding him every loop hole. It's not like he is filling out a 1040EZ and just paying Wyatt it says, he is doing heavy manipulation like all billionaires.

 

[MrSquished]

But are you angry at Musk for not paying more taxes?

I'm mad at the system that allows this, and as much at anyone in his position who lobbies to maintain the status quo. It's not specific to Elon.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Elon paid a lot in taxes because he had high income. Had he paid his workers better, he would have paid less in taxes. This is why we should tax the wealthy; they have the money. The historic steep tax rates on the rich were designed, in part, to encourage the rich to pay their workers better or otherwise invest in their businesses as businesses. The current tax code encourages the rich to go Scrooge McDuck.

The current tax system is not the Fault of Elon Musk. It seems like a lot of you are making him the scapegoat for this system that existed before he was even in the USA.

I agree the Tax System sucks, but that isn't a very good reason to be angry about Elon Musk or Time choosing him.

 

[cytg111]

I'm angry at the system. I also don't believe the BS about how he doesn't care about money when he has a fleet of accounts and lawyers finding him every loop hole. It's not like he is filling out a 1040EZ and just paying Wyatt it says, he is doing heavy manipulation like all billionaires.

System I get.
Loopholes sounds illegal but it probably is not, right..
I mean I get it if he cheated on his taxes like Trump did, undervalue for the tax return and overvalue when you need a loan… If you find that on Musk, then yea, I get it.
Otherwise it sounds irrational and misguided to me.

 

[Zorba]

The current tax system is not the Fault of Elon Musk. It seems like a lot of you are making him the scapegoat for this system that existed before he was even in the USA.

I agree the Tax System sucks, but that isn't a very good reason to be angry about Elon Musk or Time choosing him.

Yet he happily throws sexist bullshit at a senator trying to fix the system.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Yet he happy throw sexist bullshit at a senator trying to fix the system.

I have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[cytg111]

Yet he happy throw sexist bullshit at a senator trying to fix the system.

I did not get that.. did catch the Bernie one, you still alive?
It just rhymes specially well with Aspergers, missing the social queues and not hitting the beat… About Bernie you can almost be certain that he DID forget that Bernie is still in existence and the tweet was quite honest… He doesnt care enough about that stuff to keep it in rotation upstairs.

 

[Zorba]

System I get.
Loopholes sounds illegal but it probably is not, right..
I mean I get it if he cheated on his taxes like Trump did, undervalue for the tax return and overvalue when you need a loan… If you find that on Musk, then yea, I get it.
Otherwise it sounds irrational and misguided to me.

I never said it was illegal, but again he isn't doing a simple 1040 and getting this as a result. He is going way out of his way to reduce his taxes. So him paying more wouldn't be asking for a donation, it'd be asking to stop the bullshit games and pay taxes like someone living his lifestyle on income should be paying.

 

[Zorba]

I have no idea what you are talking about.

Elon Musk calls Elizabeth Warren 'Senator Karen' in fight over taxes

Senator Elizabeth Warren and Tesla CEO Elon Musk are in the middle of a full-scale Twitter war. Warren called the world's richest person a freeloader for paying $0 in income taxes in recent years. Musk responded with a series of personal attacks, calling Warren "Senator Karen" and claiming his...

www.cnn.com

 

[Zorba]

I did not get that.. did catch the Bernie one, you still alive?
It just rhymes specially well with Aspergers, missing the social queues and not hitting the beat… About Bernie you can almost be certain that he DID forget that Bernie is still in existence and the tweet was quite honest… He doesnt care enough about that stuff to keep it in rotation upstairs.

"He doesn't care about money, or taxes, or politics.." Yet, he takes the time to attack senators on Twitter who dare say he should pay more than 0 dollars in taxes. Yet, he engages in sophisticated tax schemes to lower his tax bill. Yet, he openly manipulates securities.

Yup, just an average Joe that dosn't care about money.

 

[MrSquished]

System I get.
Loopholes sounds illegal but it probably is not, right..
I mean I get it if he cheated on his taxes like Trump did, undervalue for the tax return and overvalue when you need a loan… If you find that on Musk, then yea, I get it.
Otherwise it sounds irrational and misguided to me.

I'm not sure what you don't get. He likes and strongly supports the tax system that Warren Buffett has described, and many economic studies have shown, is completely tilted to the very rich. I don't care if all his accounting is completely legal.

I also don't give a fuck about him being person of the year of a magazine and haven't commented on that once. It's not given to a person because they are good anyways

 

[Heartbreaker]

Elon Musk calls Elizabeth Warren 'Senator Karen' in fight over taxes

Senator Elizabeth Warren and Tesla CEO Elon Musk are in the middle of a full-scale Twitter war. Warren called the world's richest person a freeloader for paying $0 in income taxes in recent years. Musk responded with a series of personal attacks, calling Warren "Senator Karen" and claiming his...

www.cnn.com

You mean the name calling she started by calling him a Freeloader...

By your first post, I though you meant she was doing something constructive to fix things, and he had no response but insults.

Insulting Musk, is hardly what I call "Trying to fix the system".

 

[Zorba]

like Trump did, undervalue for the tax return and overvalue when you need a loan… If you find that on Musk, then yea, I get it.
Otherwise it sounds irrational and misguided to me.

Sort of like Elon did to SpaceX employees. "If you don't work over Thanksgiving we will go bankrupt." Then to investors "Oh that wasn't real."

You can simultaneously think the guy has driven massive positive advancements and think he is an asshole that only cares about himself.

 

[Zorba]

You mean the name calling she started by calling him a Freeloader...

By your first post, I though you meant she was doing something constructive to fix things, and he had no response but insults.

Insulting Musk, is hardly what I call "Trying to fix the system".

She proposed a wealth tax and he is a freeloader.

 

[MrSquished]

I also didn't hear Elon complaining about government subsidies to companies years ago when his company was smaller and a big beneficiary, including of a big loan program his company took advantage of.

But now that he got his and the company is so big, fuck everybody else. And I'm not talking about being against subsidies to huge oil and gas companies either.

He's a giant hypocrite.

 

[cytg111]

You can simultaneously think the guy has driven massive positive advancements and think he is an asshole that only cares about himself.

That’s about my take on it. I mean I wouldnt want to work for him…

 

[Zorba]

That’s about my take on it. I mean I wouldnt want to work for him…

Yeah, I had an offer at SpaceX in 2009 and even interviewed with Elon before anyone knew who he was. So glad I didn't take that job. Terrible environment, crazy hours for shit pay. Yeah would've been cool when hitting the major milestones, but that wouldn't have made up for the rest. There is a reason they have massive turnover.

I just really don't get the cult following, Bezos has done a lot of good too, but no one comes in with BS like "he doesn't care about money" when people bash him.

 

[Heartbreaker]

She proposed a wealth tax and he is a freeloader.

No she publicly insulted him, and he responded in kind.

He pays plenty of taxes. He last exercised options in 2016 for about $1 Billion dollars, of which he paid nearly half in taxes (about $450 million dollars). That wasn't zero, or some absurdly low percentage from complex schemes.

He will likewise be paying several billion in taxes this year for the stock he sold.

I'm all for tax reform, but you need to base it on something reasonable. Not Elizabeth Warrens childish name calling.

Maybe someone should start a "Tax Reform" thread.

 

[DisarmedDespot]

The current tax system is not the Fault of Elon Musk. It seems like a lot of you are making him the scapegoat for this system that existed before he was even in the USA.

I agree the Tax System sucks, but that isn't a very good reason to be angry about Elon Musk or Time choosing him.

Er, no offense, but, it should be painfully obvious why Musk is the primary target of this ire: he's the world richest person ever, coming out of a pandemic where billionaires reaped a windfall. Bezos would be the one getting called out most if he was ahead of Musk, but the fact that Musk isn't alone should be as obvious as why Musk is the one getting the most flak.

I agree his wealth is a symptom of a bigger issue, but you're being pedantic.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Er, no offense, but, it should be painfully obvious why Musk is the primary target of this ire: he's the world richest person ever, coming out of a pandemic where billionaires reaped a windfall. Bezos would be the one getting called out most if he was ahead of Musk, but the fact that Musk isn't alone should be as obvious as why Musk is the one getting the most flak.

It would be just as pointless to rant about Bezos.

Again, you have to fix the system, not rant, or get angry at a specific rich people.

 

[DisarmedDespot]

It would be just as pointless to rant about Bezos.

Again, you have to fix the system, not rant, or get angry at a specific rich people.

And the best example of the system being broken is...?

Again, you're being pedantic.