Does anybody have more than this?

[nageov3t]

having read Kerry's defense, it seems a lot more plausable than the Macacca defense.

In his remarks in California on Monday, Mr. Kerry said: ?You know, education, if you make the most of it, you study hard, you do your homework and you make an effort to be smart, you can do well. If you don?t, you get stuck in Iraq.?

Mr. Kerry said that he botched a joke that his aides said had been prepared as follows: ?Do you know where you end up if you don?t study, if you aren?t smart, if you?re intellectually lazy? You end up getting us stuck in a war in Iraq. Just ask President Bush.?

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/01/us/politics/01elect.html?pagewanted=2

 

[Craig234]

Now Bush is out lying about it - he knows damn well that he's lying, but he's trying to use the lie about Kerry to get some votes. The republicans deserve to lose even *more* votes for such dishonest campaigning.

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: senseamp

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Ahhh the GOP's secret weapon (Kerry) has reared his big mouth yet again. Like I said Dems, keep your mouths zipped until November 8th. Sheesh, is it that difficult?

Hey that is exactly what Rush said, were you listening to him today?

Rush's approval is 25% in a recent poll. But yeah, Kerry should have learned from Rush's recent foot in mouth issue and kept his mouth shut.

So Rush's approval number is about the same as Congress, good company he is keeping.

 

[theeedude]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: senseamp

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Ahhh the GOP's secret weapon (Kerry) has reared his big mouth yet again. Like I said Dems, keep your mouths zipped until November 8th. Sheesh, is it that difficult?

Hey that is exactly what Rush said, were you listening to him today?

Rush's approval is 25% in a recent poll. But yeah, Kerry should have learned from Rush's recent foot in mouth issue and kept his mouth shut.

So Rush's approval number is about the same as Congress, good company he is keeping.

Yep, that's why he isn't helping the GOP keep congress much.

 

[theeedude]

I think the anti-intellectual GOP streak will scare off college graduates and energize them for the other side. Everyday it's one thing or another to bash the educated people.

 

[ProfJohn]

Here is the real proof of the effect Kerry's comments will have. Link

Iowa A Democratic Congressional candidate from Iowa is canceling a campaign event later this week with Senator John Kerry.

and another link

The dueling rallies scheduled for Mankato today on behalf of Republican congressman Gil Gutknecht and Democratic challenger Tim Walz lost some of their pizzaz Tuesday night when Sen. John Kerry pulled out of the Democratic rally.

I read some where that Kerry had cleared his schedule of any appearances for a few days, but I can't find that story ugh. Either way this shows the real impact of what Kerry said, the fact that Democrats are running away from Kerry.

 

[theeedude]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Here is the real proof of the effect Kerry's comments will have. Link

Iowa A Democratic Congressional candidate from Iowa is canceling a campaign event later this week with Senator John Kerry.

and another link

The dueling rallies scheduled for Mankato today on behalf of Republican congressman Gil Gutknecht and Democratic challenger Tim Walz lost some of their pizzaz Tuesday night when Sen. John Kerry pulled out of the Democratic rally.

I read some where that Kerry had cleared his schedule of any appearances for a few days, but I can't find that story ugh. Either way this shows the real impact of what Kerry said, the fact that Democrats are running away from Kerry.

Yeah, but what's the negative impact for the Democrats? Kerry not coming to their rally doesn't seem like a negative thing, since Kerry is pretty much preaching to the choir anyways.

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: senseamp
Yeah, but what's the negative impact for the Democrats? Kerry not coming to their rally doesn't seem like a negative thing, since Kerry is pretty much preaching to the choir anyways.

You must own a 'Sit n' Spin' because that is all you have been doing for their entire thread.

These were two cases where Kerry was going to attend and now he is not. And you want to explain that by saying he is just preaching to the choir. Why the hell invite him in the first place then?
The Democrats are running from him, or at least some of them are, that is never a good thing. If they had confidence in his response they would not cancel his appearances. Obviously these two do not want an ad showing up on TV in the closing days with a picture of them standing next to Kerry while Kerry?s comments play.

BTW: how come no one has called you a shill, or party hack, or paid poster since all you have done this thread is defend Kerry and repeat every talk point Kerry has put out there?

 

[theeedude]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: senseamp
Yeah, but what's the negative impact for the Democrats? Kerry not coming to their rally doesn't seem like a negative thing, since Kerry is pretty much preaching to the choir anyways.

You must own a 'Sit n' Spin' because that is all you have been doing for their entire thread.

These were two cases where Kerry was going to attend and now he is not. And you want to explain that by saying he is just preaching to the choir. Why the hell invite him in the first place then?
The Democrats are running from him, or at least some of them are, that is never a good thing. If they had confidence in his response they would not cancel his appearances. Obviously these two do not want an ad showing up on TV in the closing days with a picture of them standing next to Kerry while Kerry?s comments play.

Well, I don't blame them for not taking a chance on Kerry if these are their prospects right now. If it aint broken, don't fix it.
http://www.pollster.com/house.php
The question is how is Kerry not attending going to help GOP turn around this deficit?

BTW: how come no one has called you a shill, or party hack, or paid poster since all you have done this thread is defend Kerry and repeat every talk point Kerry has put out there?

I don't know, why don't you call me "a shill, or party hack, or paid poster" and get it over with?

 

[daniel49]

I use to just think he was a brain dead moron, now I think he is an arrogant a$$.
And I don't care how he tries to spin it what he meant was obvious.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: Craig234

Kerry is just an ass with as history of bad mouthing the military.

That's a completely false statement that only makes you look bad, John. Kerry is neither an 'ass' nor someone with a history of *badmouthing* the military - rather, you are on the side of covering up the truth about Viet Nam, and Kerry was *helping* the soldiers to get to tell the truth.

:laugh:

 

[flavio]

Imagine if we took every Bush quote and assumed he meant it the way it sounded.

"I've reminded the prime minister?the American people, Mr. Prime Minister, over the past months that it was not always a given that the United States and America would have a close relationship."?Bush. Washington, D.C., June 29, 2006

Of course he meant that exactly the way it sounds

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: flavio
Imagine if we took every Bush quote and assumed he meant it the way it sounded.

"I've reminded the prime minister?the American people, Mr. Prime Minister, over the past months that it was not always a given that the United States and America would have a close relationship."?Bush. Washington, D.C., June 29, 2006

Of course he meant that exactly the way it sounds

Best argument I?ve heard. Really comes down to who you believe, but the issue with Kerry isn?t intended for singing to his own choir, the question is what effect does this debacle have on undecided voters in less than a week?

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: Jaskalas

Originally posted by: flavio
Imagine if we took every Bush quote and assumed he meant it the way it sounded.

"I've reminded the prime minister?the American people, Mr. Prime Minister, over the past months that it was not always a given that the United States and America would have a close relationship."?Bush. Washington, D.C., June 29, 2006

Of course he meant that exactly the way it sounds

Best argument I?ve heard. Really comes down to who you believe, but the issue with Kerry isn?t intended for singing to his own choir, the question is what effect does this debacle have on undecided voters in less than a week?

I agree with both of you... but the argument over what Kerry really meant is academic. Look at how the press is playing it up. It's damage control time. Arguing over what he meant to say is stupid at this point.

 

[theeedude]

I guess we'll have to wait and see if this hurts the next generic ballot for dems.

 

[Painman]

Yawn. Everyone in the country knows who John Kerry is, and what they think about him. This kerfuffle doesn't change any of that.

'Pubs seem to want to re-fight 2004 and turn this into a narrative on Kerry (and Dems in general) punking our troops. That's a very risky gambit, seeing as the country's mood towards the war doesn't exactly favor the GOP, and the ball's already been shot back into the GOP court (by Kerry) as a reprisal of the Dem narrative on the GOP's handling of it.

Honestly, if I were a high level GOP strategist, I'd tell my operatives to STFU about Kerry already and talk about issues that the GOP looks good with. Kerry/Dems = Brer Rabbit, GOP = Brer Fox, Iraq = Briar Patch.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: Painman
Yawn. Everyone in the country knows who John Kerry is, and what they think about him. This kerfuffle doesn't change any of that.

'Pubs seem to want to re-fight 2004 and turn this into a narrative on Kerry (and Dems in general) punking our troops. That's a very risky gambit, seeing as the country's mood towards the war doesn't exactly favor the GOP, and the ball's already been shot back into the GOP court (by Kerry) as a reprisal of the Dem narrative on the GOP's handling of it.

Honestly, if I were a high level GOP strategist, I'd tell my operatives to STFU about Kerry already and talk about issues that the GOP looks good with. Kerry/Dems = Brer Rabbit, GOP = Brer Fox, Iraq = Briar Patch.

See my comments a couple of pages earlier... Playing this up is exactly what the Rs should do.

Kerry called our soldiers stupid!
Kerry called our soldiers stupid!
Kerry called our soldiers stupid!
Kerry called our soldiers stupid!

It's all they have.

My take from earlier...

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: senseamp
I am not so sure, because the Kerry story also keeps Bush and Iraq in the spotlight for this election. Dems want this to be a referendum on Bush and Iraq, and the Kerry controversy is helping nationalize this election. I don't think they should simply cower away from controversy. They need to figure out a way to use this publicity to turn in on the Republicans. Maybe Kerry should do an "apology"/ Bush bashing news conference tomorrow.
I gotta give you credit though, you nailed it in the Webb-Allen thread.

Yeah.... but it has the spotlight pointed in the wrong direction. Ideally the Dems would want this issue to point toward the total ineptitude this administration has shown in regards to Iraq. (The intent of Kerry's mangled joke) I think this will actually focus the light (if it gets off Kerry) on the troops. And at worst that's a push for Rs. At best it's a spotlight that leans in favor of Republicans.

Call me crazy... here is what I think the Dems should do.

Don't fight the media. They are going to want to repeat Kerry's line forever. It's ONE Dem's words... not the party line. Don't waste your time defending him.

Go in front of the camera and accept the spin. Bash Kerry with the Rs. "What a terrible thing to say... even if he didn't mean it the way he said it, he should have chosen his words more carefully. And the worst part is now we're focused on Kerry instead of the real issue concerning Iraq and that is the complete lack of competence displayed by this administration.... *bash* *bash* *bash*"

My guess is that the Ds will fall into the "what he really meant to say was..." trap and lose the opportunity to change the focus off Kerry and on to a winning issue for them.

You're falling into that trap

 

[Painman]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: Painman
Yawn. Everyone in the country knows who John Kerry is, and what they think about him. This kerfuffle doesn't change any of that.

'Pubs seem to want to re-fight 2004 and turn this into a narrative on Kerry (and Dems in general) punking our troops. That's a very risky gambit, seeing as the country's mood towards the war doesn't exactly favor the GOP, and the ball's already been shot back into the GOP court (by Kerry) as a reprisal of the Dem narrative on the GOP's handling of it.

Honestly, if I were a high level GOP strategist, I'd tell my operatives to STFU about Kerry already and talk about issues that the GOP looks good with. Kerry/Dems = Brer Rabbit, GOP = Brer Fox, Iraq = Briar Patch.

See my comments a couple of pages earlier... Playing this up is exactly what the Rs should do.

Kerry called our soldiers stupid!
Kerry called our soldiers stupid!
Kerry called our soldiers stupid!
Kerry called our soldiers stupid!

It's all they have.

My take from earlier...

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: senseamp
I am not so sure, because the Kerry story also keeps Bush and Iraq in the spotlight for this election. Dems want this to be a referendum on Bush and Iraq, and the Kerry controversy is helping nationalize this election. I don't think they should simply cower away from controversy. They need to figure out a way to use this publicity to turn in on the Republicans. Maybe Kerry should do an "apology"/ Bush bashing news conference tomorrow.
I gotta give you credit though, you nailed it in the Webb-Allen thread.

Yeah.... but it has the spotlight pointed in the wrong direction. Ideally the Dems would want this issue to point toward the total ineptitude this administration has shown in regards to Iraq. (The intent of Kerry's mangled joke) I think this will actually focus the light (if it gets off Kerry) on the troops. And at worst that's a push for Rs. At best it's a spotlight that leans in favor of Republicans.

Call me crazy... here is what I think the Dems should do.

Don't fight the media. They are going to want to repeat Kerry's line forever. It's ONE Dem's words... not the party line. Don't waste your time defending him.

Go in front of the camera and accept the spin. Bash Kerry with the Rs. "What a terrible thing to say... even if he didn't mean it the way he said it, he should have chosen his words more carefully. And the worst part is now we're focused on Kerry instead of the real issue concerning Iraq and that is the complete lack of competence displayed by this administration.... *bash* *bash* *bash*"

My guess is that the Ds will fall into the "what he really meant to say was..." trap and lose the opportunity to change the focus off Kerry and on to a winning issue for them.

Well, the Dems might yet prove to be stupid enough to fall into that trap. They don't have the same kind of message control apparatus that the GOP does. However, the media isn't doing a lot to help the GOP - MSNBC (Matthews) tonight didn't take the GOP bait, and CNN segued it into a discussion of the Iraq situation which was quite unflattering of Bush and the GOP. We'll see, but I don't think the Republicans are really going to want this to take up too many more precious news cycles the way it's panning out so far.

 

[theeedude]

The problem for Republicans is that Dems have too many outs on this. Kerry can come out and apologize, they can distance themselves from Kerry, this thing can just run out of gas and clear up like the Webb novel thing.
GOP has to bridge a huge gap they are trailing by, and they have very few outs left to do that. Dems have a pretty healthy margin at this point, so GOP will need more than just Kerry.

 

[theeedude]

Ouch, bad timing for GOP.
Media is going to be focused on this guy for next few days. Kerry story will sink like Gary Condit on 9/11.

 

[Red Dawn]

Wow you mean this is what the Republ;icans are going to ru n on instead of the real issues? Sounds very Rovian to me.

 

[FuzzyBee]

Originally posted by: DonVito

Originally posted by: FuzzyBee

Originally posted by: senseamp
Kerry not running in this election. Bush is

Really? In which district?

In a real sense, he's running in every district. Them's the breaks when you have a very unpopular President.

Hmmm - I'll check my ballot for his name next Tuesday.

 

[steppinthrax]

That is correct. The armed forces is a significantly smaller group compared to the general population. You are taking a group of people who are very disciplined and people easily give them a job because the preception of a military person. People feel he/she will automatically do a good job. Comparing the US military to the population is like 100000:1 it is crazy to compare this way. Now if you take everyone who has H.S. diploma in this country and compare to the military or everyone who has a B.S. degree and compare to the military then you will find diferences.

 

[steppinthrax]

Originally posted by: Lothar
Joining the military in Iraq to get free education doesn't make sense...
You might as well fill out a FASFA form and take the subsidized loans to go with it.

It really dosen't. It's like I put my life on the line to get my degree type of thinking. There are thousands of ways to get a free education that dosen't include joining the military. Most of which are from state/local governement. You just have to be willing to apply yourself which takes a little hard work.

 

[steppinthrax]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: steppinthrax
Well I guess when someone is under pressure they can start making up all kinds of fake degrees. The degree(s) this person says he has fortunatley dosen't go with the person based on the logic at hand.

lol.. ya, when in doubt or for lack of any decent rebuttal, go with the "Question Integrity Approach."

It fits your Elitist mentality to the letter. GG!

I'm sorry for this OT post folks, but this guy seriously needs a wakeup call.. The arrogance in his posts is smelling up my screen! Then he went and called all of our enlisted troops "stupid" to boot!

bah... whatever... /ignore.

I guess since you are from the military it is easy to see where your position is (biased). But if it makes you angry you know you can stop reading it... No one forces you... LOL