Best way to un-brainwash someone who just became "religious?"

[Stark]

this thread makes me sad.

i used to have a few "friends" like snatchface before I started going back to church. It's amazing how people who claim to be close to you all of a sudden stop inviting you around or wanting to hang out. And they think we're the messed up ones. <sigh>

Happy Palm Sunday anyways...

 

[Soybomb]

It is better for the poor to give little than the rich to give more.

Better for what? The poor giving away money they could use for food, clothes for their kids, etc is not better than a rich person who has extra money giving it away. Perhaps hardship makes their gift more valuable in your eyes. I really don't care as long as children don't suffer from their religious beliefs.

As for my experiences,my money is for my use,I'd prefer to blow it all on cocaine,booze and men before I gave one penny to any church.

I am a man open to having money blown on him!

 

[Geekbabe]

Originally posted by: Soybomb

It is better for the poor to give little than the rich to give more.

Better for what? The poor giving away money they could use for food, clothes for their kids, etc is not better than a rich person who has extra money giving it away. Perhaps hardship makes their gift more valuable in your eyes. I really don't care as long as children don't suffer from their religious beliefs.

As for my experiences,my money is for my use,I'd prefer to blow it all on cocaine,booze and men before I gave one penny to any church.

I am a man open to having money blown on him!

When I think back to my childhood memories of families with 7,8,9 kids struggling to put money in the church collection plate and going without to pay hefty tutition to catholic schools comes to mind.The wretched leech
priests brainwashed tens of thousands of families into producing fresh crops of children for them to abuse and basically conned them into footing the bill for it!

As for my other comments, /me bad, I give to private causes and people, my remarks were a bit of tasteless flamebait to try to goad millieum and I retract them.

 

[ShotgunSteven]

Originally posted by: AnyMal

Originally posted by: Triumph
I agree that she shouldn't throw her money at this church and ignore her financial troubles.

But who the f&ck are you to make decisions for her about something as personal as religion? Your post is insulting to everyone on this board who is remotely religious. Listen, a$$hole, free thinking and religious are NOT mutually exclusive. If you believe that, then you haven't bothered to talk to enough religious people, and you are living with your own ignorance.

I can't speak to her situation any more because you've described it through a very distorted lense. As far as I know, it could just as easily be a local church youth group as it could be the Branch Davidians or Raelians (sp?). You seem to classify them all as one and the same.

Why are you lashing out at him? What gives you the moral authority to tell him what to do and what not to do? If you are so religious, why are you insulting him? He's talking about someone he cares; you on the other hand couldn't care less about either of them, you just wanted to call someone a$$hole. If you want to see an "a$$hole", look in the mirror. Idiots like you give Christians a bad name.

All Triumph did was tell the original poster to back the fsck off, the originator of the thread is the one that apparently has a problem with people doing what they want with their life, and wants to make decisions for them and tell them what to do.

 

[The Sauce]

You aren't interpreting it correctly. Bi-polar isn't caused by hyperreligiosity,

I NEVER SAID IT WAS!!!! That's why you need to go back and read again. Sheeeessh! I said that hyperreligiosity was one of the defining criteria for diagnosing a manic episode, then I got misquoted and you got stuck on it.

 

[Tiger]

According to him it seems like she is being manipulated by these "Fund A Mental Cases"

Exactly. I think his hatred of religion is letting him see malevelance(sp?) that isn't there. Probably because he has no personal experience.
He's stuffed all religious people into the same pigeon hole as the wackos. Anybody with any intellectual honesty knows that's not true.
The definition of stereotype.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Stark
this thread makes me sad.

i used to have a few "friends" like snatchface before I started going back to church. It's amazing how people who claim to be close to you all of a sudden stop inviting you around or wanting to hang out. And they think we're the messed up ones. <sigh>

Happy Palm Sunday anyways...

Are you the type that when asked "How's it going" you say "It's going great because I found Jesus" or "I use to be messed up on drugs now I'm messed up on Jesus"?

 

[The Sauce]

Well so far there has been some useful information I have gleaned from this thread. For one thing the religious pundits with their frantic and aggressive defensiveness has served to solidify my need to get my friend help, and fast. And there have also been some thoughtful posts on how best to go about doing so. For those who actually gave thoughtful advice i thank you, as opposed to those who felt their tenuous and unsupportable religious principles threatened and lashed out.

 

[The Sauce]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Stark
this thread makes me sad.

i used to have a few "friends" like snatchface before I started going back to church. It's amazing how people who claim to be close to you all of a sudden stop inviting you around or wanting to hang out. And they think we're the messed up ones. <sigh>

Happy Palm Sunday anyways...

Are you the type that when asked "How's it going" you say "It's going great because I found Jesus" or "I use to be messed up on drugs now I'm messed up on Jesus"?

LOL - exactly what I was thinking. How can you be sad if you have Jesus? Everything's got to be all roses for you.

 

[Isla]

lalalalala...

Well, on one hand, I know people who truly are followers of Christ and make excellent witnesses for Christianity just in the way they live their lives. They don't even have to say anything about religion to make a statement.

Then there are the "I know the word and mind of God and I know what God wants for you in your life " kind of people who are on a total power trip and give Christianity a bad name.

I am sure the same is true for all religions and you just have to learn to discern who is who. It gets pretty easy after a while.

Back to the original point of the thread...

This is a learning experience for this girl... she will figure it out eventually. Let her.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Snatchface

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Stark
this thread makes me sad.

i used to have a few "friends" like snatchface before I started going back to church. It's amazing how people who claim to be close to you all of a sudden stop inviting you around or wanting to hang out. And they think we're the messed up ones. <sigh>

Happy Palm Sunday anyways...

Are you the type that when asked "How's it going" you say "It's going great because I found Jesus" or "I use to be messed up on drugs now I'm messed up on Jesus"?

LOL - exactly what I was thinking. How can you be sad if you have Jesus? Everything's got to be all roses for you.

Hey I'm not suggesting that Stark is one of those types though those are the ones people stop hanging around because they are mindless drool people that kill any conversation they enter when they spout that nonsense

 

[Ionizer86]

Now would be a good time to look into social psychology. There indeed exist normal groups that are "religions," but simultaneously, cults exist as well. These use many psychological methods to ensnare unwary ones by changing their thoughts, perceptions, and feelings.

Cults do exist and can be dangerous. They can change a person's entire way of thinking and make them believe that their cult is the only way to salvation. They may propagandize extensively and inculcate individuals with seemingly valid thoughts that contain gaping holes.

CSJ.org is a site that studies cults. See if your friend's group is listed. Many of these groups share similar techniques such as skewing logic and separating all people into two groups (one will get saved, one will get destroyed) etc. Very dangerous. Basically, read up on mind control and cults; they exist and they're powerful.

A group of veterans in Vietnam were brainwashed by people there. They were given small requests such as giving out their name, rank, and serial # at first. Gradually, they were asked to make videos showing that they were safe or showing that POWs were not mistreated. Eventually, step by step, they were willing to go to extremes, and they were tought that communism was right. Many veterans even stayed in Vietnam or other Asian areas after the war and refused to return to their homelands. That's brainwashing.

<--has been in a "cult" before and has since left after debunking its logic system.

 

[Ionizer86]

Oh, an important point is not to equate religion to cults. Many religions are mainstream indeed. It's one thing to be in a cult and another to serve God. For those that are criticizing you for challenging Christianity or giving it a bad name, I have to say that you're doing the right thing by helping your friend, but it takes time. Her cult most likely doesn't let her read works by people on the outside, but she needs to do so to see both sides.

Cults are sanctimonious groups that are seemingly valid groups but are merely using works such as the Bible to cause their members to believe that the cult is right, while they may be breaking many basic Biblical tenets such as mercy, compassion, equality, and love.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Originally posted by: Ionizer86
Oh, an important point is not to equate religion to cults. Many religions are mainstream indeed. It's one thing to be in a cult and another to serve God. For those that are criticizing you for challenging Christianity or giving it a bad name, I have to say that you're doing the right thing by helping your friend, but it takes time. Her cult most likely doesn't let her read works by people on the outside, but she needs to do so to see both sides.

Cults are sanctimonious groups that are seemingly valid groups but are merely using works such as the Bible to cause their members to believe that the cult is right, while they may be breaking many basic Biblical tenets such as mercy, compassion, equality, and love.

I still don't understand the difference between a religion and a cult.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

It is important to remember that this isnt any of your business. You are saying in effect "You are not thinking like me anymore, and I am right. Therefore you are wrong" Maybe she is right and you are wrong? Maybe she should attempt to convert you? No? Why? Because you dont want to be converted. Let her be. Don't like what she is doing? Too bad. What has she done to annoy you. Hurt someone? Commit a crime? You call it a cult. Your definition. Accept that people have different definitions of what that is, and move on.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Hayabusarider
It is important to remember that this isnt any of your business. You are saying in effect "You are not thinking like me anymore, and I am right. Therefore you are wrong" Maybe she is right and you are wrong? Maybe she should attempt to convert you? No? Why? Because you dont want to be converted. Let her be. Don't like what she is doing? Too bad. What has she done to annoy you. Hurt someone? Commit a crime? You call it a cult. Your definition. Accept that people have different definitions of what that is, and move on.

I agree completely.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Hayabusarider
It is important to remember that this isnt any of your business. You are saying in effect "You are not thinking like me anymore, and I am right. Therefore you are wrong" Maybe she is right and you are wrong? Maybe she should attempt to convert you? No? Why? Because you dont want to be converted. Let her be. Don't like what she is doing? Too bad. What has she done to annoy you. Hurt someone? Commit a crime? You call it a cult. Your definition. Accept that people have different definitions of what that is, and move on.

Yeah move on and forget she was a friend, nevermind that these people are taking advantage of her because she is vunerable. You think it's your business because you are her friend?

That said, if she is just becoming a Christian and isn't acting weird like a Brain Washed Fund A Mental Case then you really shouldn't bother her. On the other hand if she is and you are her friend do all you can to dissuade her from becoming another one of their pawns.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Hayabusarider
It is important to remember that this isnt any of your business. You are saying in effect "You are not thinking like me anymore, and I am right. Therefore you are wrong" Maybe she is right and you are wrong? Maybe she should attempt to convert you? No? Why? Because you dont want to be converted. Let her be. Don't like what she is doing? Too bad. What has she done to annoy you. Hurt someone? Commit a crime? You call it a cult. Your definition. Accept that people have different definitions of what that is, and move on.

Yeah move on and forget she was a friend, nevermind that these people are taking advantage of her because she is vunerable. You think it's your business because you are her friend?

That said, if she is just becoming a Christian and isn't acting weird like a Brain Washed Fund A Mental Case then you really shouldn't bother her. On the other hand if she is and you are her friend do all you can to dissuade her from becoming another one of their pawns.

Red, this is where I have to take issue with you. I know many "brain washed taken advantaged of" people who are more principled and dedicated than just about anyone I know. In fact while there may be agnostics and athiests who are just as good, in a humanitarian sense, I know of none better. Many of these people were troubled, and came to religion and were the better for it as they see it. Who am I to take away what makes them happy? Why? To liberate them with misery? No thank you. I havent the right. Yeah, there are the Falwells and all, but then I can bring up the Stalins and Maos. If he wants to be her friend, he has NO business in this, unless we are talking about where they lock themselves in compounds and drink cyanide. Otherwise, if he interferes, he is NOT her friend.

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: Geekbabe

Originally posted by: Soybomb

It is better for the poor to give little than the rich to give more.

Better for what? The poor giving away money they could use for food, clothes for their kids, etc is not better than a rich person who has extra money giving it away. Perhaps hardship makes their gift more valuable in your eyes. I really don't care as long as children don't suffer from their religious beliefs.

As for my experiences,my money is for my use,I'd prefer to blow it all on cocaine,booze and men before I gave one penny to any church.

I am a man open to having money blown on him!

When I think back to my childhood memories of families with 7,8,9 kids struggling to put money in the church collection plate and going without to pay hefty tutition to catholic schools comes to mind.The wretched leech
priests brainwashed tens of thousands of families into producing fresh crops of children for them to abuse and basically conned them into footing the bill for it!

As for my other comments, /me bad, I give to private causes and people, my remarks were a bit of tasteless flamebait to try to goad millieum and I retract them.

No its ok, I was try to goad you as well. I just think there is people who have bad experiences. The Catholic church is not exactly a church that people have had GOOD experiences with. For the most part it is not as forgiving and a little more close-minded than how I was raised(even though I no longer attend church).

There are definitely Churches that prey on the weak, but it is not indicative of all.

 

[Geekbabe]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Hayabusarider
It is important to remember that this isnt any of your business. You are saying in effect "You are not thinking like me anymore, and I am right. Therefore you are wrong" Maybe she is right and you are wrong? Maybe she should attempt to convert you? No? Why? Because you dont want to be converted. Let her be. Don't like what she is doing? Too bad. What has she done to annoy you. Hurt someone? Commit a crime? You call it a cult. Your definition. Accept that people have different definitions of what that is, and move on.

Yeah move on and forget she was a friend, nevermind that these people are taking advantage of her because she is vunerable. You think it's your business because you are her friend?

That said, if she is just becoming a Christian and isn't acting weird like a Brain Washed Fund A Mental Case then you really shouldn't bother her. On the other hand if she is and you are her friend do all you can to dissuade her from becoming another one of their pawns.

Word!

If your friends don't try to help you when they think you're being played you might as well not have any friends!


Btw,when my friends bring stuff to me and open the conversation,they've made whatever is being discussed my business until they tell me that the subject is closed.

 

[The Sauce]

Originally posted by: Hayabusarider
It is important to remember that this isnt any of your business. You are saying in effect "You are not thinking like me anymore, and I am right. Therefore you are wrong" Maybe she is right and you are wrong? Maybe she should attempt to convert you? No? Why? Because you dont want to be converted. Let her be. Don't like what she is doing? Too bad. What has she done to annoy you. Hurt someone? Commit a crime? You call it a cult. Your definition. Accept that people have different definitions of what that is, and move on.

If she started taking crack and spending all hr money on that, should I also "mind my own business?"

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: Snatchface
Well so far there has been some useful information I have gleaned from this thread. For one thing the religious pundits with their frantic and aggressive defensiveness has served to solidify my need to get my friend help, and fast. And there have also been some thoughtful posts on how best to go about doing so. For those who actually gave thoughtful advice i thank you, as opposed to those who felt their tenuous and unsupportable religious principles threatened and lashed out.

The whole PROBLEM was you misread edx21 when he said his relative had never heard of that being a byproduct of bipolar. Then you go on to say that I cannot read because it is. I was just letting YOU know that YOU misread his post.

Jesus, doctors are such arrogant tools 99% of the time. You have to have pharmacists and nurses to keep you straight.

 

[The Sauce]

Originally posted by: dparker

Originally posted by: Ionizer86
Oh, an important point is not to equate religion to cults. Many religions are mainstream indeed. It's one thing to be in a cult and another to serve God. For those that are criticizing you for challenging Christianity or giving it a bad name, I have to say that you're doing the right thing by helping your friend, but it takes time. Her cult most likely doesn't let her read works by people on the outside, but she needs to do so to see both sides.

Cults are sanctimonious groups that are seemingly valid groups but are merely using works such as the Bible to cause their members to believe that the cult is right, while they may be breaking many basic Biblical tenets such as mercy, compassion, equality, and love.

I still don't understand the difference between a religion and a cult.

Exactly, someone explain the difference to me. Excepting that religions are generally more socially excepted and widespread. But they indoctrinate and brainwash same as any cult. My friends "cult" is called fundamentalist Christianity.

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: Snatchface

Originally posted by: Hayabusarider
It is important to remember that this isnt any of your business. You are saying in effect "You are not thinking like me anymore, and I am right. Therefore you are wrong" Maybe she is right and you are wrong? Maybe she should attempt to convert you? No? Why? Because you dont want to be converted. Let her be. Don't like what she is doing? Too bad. What has she done to annoy you. Hurt someone? Commit a crime? You call it a cult. Your definition. Accept that people have different definitions of what that is, and move on.

If she started taking crack and spending all hr money on that, should I also "mind my own business?"

Apples to Oranges. Drugs are hardly anything like Religon. Hell, you don't even have a clue what real addiction is. Nonetheless, than you for reinforcing my belief that doctors are idiots. Sure there are exceptions like BaliBabyDoc, but that seems to be rare.

It seems Med Students go from being bright and quite capable to being a douche like you.

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: Snatchface

Originally posted by: dparker

Originally posted by: Ionizer86
Oh, an important point is not to equate religion to cults. Many religions are mainstream indeed. It's one thing to be in a cult and another to serve God. For those that are criticizing you for challenging Christianity or giving it a bad name, I have to say that you're doing the right thing by helping your friend, but it takes time. Her cult most likely doesn't let her read works by people on the outside, but she needs to do so to see both sides.

Cults are sanctimonious groups that are seemingly valid groups but are merely using works such as the Bible to cause their members to believe that the cult is right, while they may be breaking many basic Biblical tenets such as mercy, compassion, equality, and love.

I still don't understand the difference between a religion and a cult.

Exactly, someone explain the difference to me. Excepting that religions are generally more socially excepted and widespread. But they indoctrinate and brainwash same as any cult. My friends "cult" is called fundamentalist Christianity.

The thing is your BLIND and unfounded hate makes you unable to see the difference in the two. Add in the fact that you HAVE to push your beliefs on someone(your friend or other people on this board). That makes you 10x worse than ANY Christians I have encountered. You are the one with the Cult-like mentality. FWIW, I am NOT a Christian.