Attention Bernie Bros

[dank69]

So you're saying that the Democratic party has not effectively opposed the Republicans in 40 years?

I'm saying you haven't given them a chance yet.

 

[dank69]

The next president will obviously be the McConnell whisperer.

"Although there’s no evidence of a close personal friendship, McConnell and Biden were both known as proud guardians of the Senate’s powers and precedents during the 24 years they spent together in the chamber. All but four of those two dozen years were at times of divided government. The two were never really rivals because they weren’t on any of the same committees, and they honed their skills as legislative playmakers in mostly different policy areas. (They do both have international affairs expertise, though, Biden having chaired the Foreign Relations Committee and McConnell having run the Appropriations subcommittee that provides foreign aid.)

The poker-faced McConnell has been more openly positive about Biden than perhaps anyone else in the Obama administration. The senator invited the vice president to give a speech about the virtues of bipartisan legislating at the McConnell Center at the University of Louisville. The GOP leader’s staff famously leaked a moment in the fiscal cliff drama when he phoned Biden in the West Wing and asked, “Does anyone down there know how to make a deal?” When their bargaining started, McConnell cooed before the cameras that he’d finally found a worthy “dance partner.”

For his part, the vice president called to congratulate McConnell on his lopsided re-election soon after the polls closed in Kentucky on Nov. 4, while the president didn’t connect with the senator until the next day. And then there was Biden’s behavior when the congressional leadership went to the White House for lunch a few days later. When Republicans launched into a lengthy argument against Obama acting unilaterally on immigration, and the president made clear his patience was running thin, Biden sought to smooth over the friction by asking how much time the GOP needed to pass its own bill — and reportedly was angrily cut off by the president.

That anecdote from The Associated Press offers as good a reminder as any about why Obama might decide against dispatching his vice president to try to become an activist 101st senator. Encouraging Biden to be Biden in situations he finds comfortable has proven to be a high-risk, not-routinely-high-reward proposition for congressional Democrats. Many of them grumble he gave away too much in those three big deals he cut with McConnell. They suspect his old-school ways have caused him to underestimate the confrontational spine of so many Hill Republicans." - from some website

Sure, Biden will work with McConnell, and McConnell will work with Biden. I can tell you haven't been paying attention.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Hey sunshine, Clinton and Obama couldn't get anything done without Republican buy-in except for a narrow window between 2009 and 2009.

That is a very narrow window indeed

 

[Ajay]

Wow! Reading this hurts my brain. WTF. Wish I had a couple of drinks first.
Oh, and "- from some website", LOLZ!

 

[NostaSeronx]

Sure, Biden will work with McConnell, and McConnell will work with Biden. I can tell you haven't been paying attention.

You don't want the candidate that works with republicans to continue the "balanced budget" agenda. It is impossible, it simply doesn't work.

Biden did it throughout the Obama years, pretty much making it slightly better than Bush. However, Trump has exploded that out of the water, more wealth across the board, but more debts and deficits.

Survive paycheck to paycheck persons probably don't want Biden since the gap is only going to get bigger. Trump will atleast increase the paycheck where the economists/stock market won't even notice the recession that killed currency.

$6000+ 2017-2019
$1000+ 2009-2017
$500+ 2001-2009
Wealth growth has been the highest under Trump. By democratic standards that is enough, poverty has been solved under Ob-Trump!

Trump needs to only unleash his inner Bernie angel this coming months and he has the election in the bag.

 

[dank69]

You don't want the candidate that works with republicans to continue the "balanced budget" agenda. It is impossible, it simply doesn't work.

Biden did it throughout the Obama years, pretty much making it slightly better than Bush. However, Trump has exploded that out of the water, more wealth across the board, but more debts and deficits.

Hello? Even if Biden wanted to work with Republicans, *lifts megaphone and points it up your nostrils* REPUBLICANS WILL NEVER WORK WITH DEMOCRATS ON ANY LEGISLATION.

The entire Republican platform is and will continue to be to oppose any policy put forth by Democrats. Any Republican that does not follow this directive will result in being castigated as a filthy RINO.

 

[NostaSeronx]

Hello? Even if Biden wanted to work with Republicans, *lifts megaphone and points it up your nostrils* REPUBLICANS WILL NEVER WORK WITH DEMOCRATS ON ANY LEGISLATION.

Without Obama, how is Biden different than the Republican party? I'll do as the republicans say! They will have an epiphany and work with me, but it is actually me working with them! Like you know the last thingy time maybe?!

He has the blue no matter what vote, now he only needs to get the red most of time votes. Boom Repub in blue paint.

 

[dank69]

Without Obama, how is Biden different than the Republican party?

I'll do as the republicans say! They will have an epiphany and work with me, but it is actually me working with them!

It doesn't matter if Biden is a piece of shit because the Dems will not capture the Senate anyway. You need to get your fucking head out of your ass. Nothing will get done with a Biden presidency.

 

[NostaSeronx]

It doesn't matter if Biden is a piece of shit because the Dems will not capture the Senate anyway. You need to get your fucking head out of your ass.

The democrats won't capture the senate?! Oh we better not vote for Biden then... we definitely won't survive SARS-CoV-3!!
//thought everyone was onboard the McGrath train.

Nothing will get done with a Biden presidency.

He helped pass republican-hacked bills as vice-president, he will get plenty done. Especially, if he gets his woman republican vice president.

 

[Vic]

So you're saying that the Democratic party has not effectively opposed the Republicans in 40 years?

No, he's saying that the Republican party has been firmly in control of the govt in America during that time.

 

[Ajay]

No, he's saying that the Republican party has been firmly in control of the govt in America during that time.

Or at least firmly in a position to obstruct democratic initiatives. You know, like supreme courts nominees #MoscowMitchFTW.

 

[pmv]

Trump has been only a president for one-term. While Biden has been a president for two-terms, which lead to the first Trump term. At great dismay to the single politcal tribe that was owning the elections since forever.

Are you posting from the future? How did the pandemic turn out?

 

[NostaSeronx]

Are you posting from the future? How did the pandemic turn out?

It got worse, it evolved in China with all the censorship. Now the survivors have complete saturation of undying loyalty towards parties. VoteRedNoMatterWhat, VoteBlueNoMatterWhat, with quieting whispers of the candidates being sexual predators. As creepy 70+ year old senile men only get elected for like forever. The economy sets on fire, the poor are removed from statistics as the poverty solution is kicked off till next candidate. Words around the block say that they are making them into possible burgers. To feed the last remaining centrist republicans and democrats some leftist conspiracy nuts say, luckily they all disappeared after Bi-ump got elected in 2028. There are often rumors about a paradise across the ocean. If only I wasn't trapped here with these VoteBiden or VoteTrump people, maybe we could have changed.

 

[Blackjack200]

I'm saying you haven't given them a chance yet.

No, he's saying that the Republican party has been firmly in control of the govt in America during that time.

So... what exactly is the point of the Democratic party if the Republicans are firmly in control of the government when a Democrat is the president? You guys are not making a very compelling case for Biden!

 

[dank69]

So... what exactly is the point of the Democratic party if the Republicans are firmly in control of the government when a Democrat is the president? You guys are not making a very compelling case for Biden!

The point, sunshine, if for you to stop being ignorant and vote straight D until the GOP dies. Then maybe you can get the things you want. You will never get what you want when the GOP can shit all over you and never be punished because your reality is so bent you think Democrats are just as bad.

 

[eelw]

Yeah as important for the world to get rid of the orange menace. It’s probably more important to get rid of Moscow Mitch for the U.S. A lame duck Trump in a second term will do less damage than McConnell still around blocking Biden.

 

[pmv]

The point, sunshine, if for you to stop being ignorant and vote straight D until the GOP dies. Then maybe you can get the things you want. You will never get what you want when the GOP can shit all over you and never be punished because your reality is so bent you think Democrats are just as bad.

Not that it's a political system that I am personally very familiar with, but doesn't that require something to change with regard to how the Senate is elected? Surely it won't make any difference if Blackjack votes D, as long as 1/3 of the population elects 2/3s of the Senate?

(Perhaps you need a program for Dems to all move en-masse to the more rural states?)

 

[Bitek]

Not that it's a political system that I am personally very familiar with, but doesn't that require something to change with regard to how the Senate is elected? Surely it won't make any difference if Blackjack votes D, as long as 1/3 of the population elects 2/3s of the Senate?

(Perhaps you need a program for Dems to all move en-masse to the more rural states?)

Considering how many Democrats you would have to elect to change that, the point remains the same.
Nothing will change if Republicans are elected /thread

 

[pmv]

Considering how many Democrats you would have to elect to change that, the point remains the same.
Nothing will change if Republicans are elected /thread

Appears to me that falls under 'necessary but not sufficient' though.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Yeah as important for the world to get rid of the orange menace. It’s probably more important to get rid of Moscow Mitch for the U.S. A lame duck Trump in a second term will do less damage than McConnell still around blocking Biden.

i disagree. mcconnell would prevent legislation from happening, but coronavirus shows just how bad trump can fuck things up without any assistance from the senate.

the entire response to the pandemic would be different with a competent president at the helm, mcconnel or no.

 

[dank69]

Not that it's a political system that I am personally very familiar with, but doesn't that require something to change with regard to how the Senate is elected? Surely it won't make any difference if Blackjack votes D, as long as 1/3 of the population elects 2/3s of the Senate?

(Perhaps you need a program for Dems to all move en-masse to the more rural states?)

Casting the actual votes is far less important than every single person's attitude over the next 7 months during any interaction with other people that involves any political discussion.

You want to talk about what a piece of shit Biden is? Go right ahead! I agree. I HATE that I have to vote for him in November. But I know that even if I took every single accusation against him for any reason, credible or complete make believe included, and looked at all of it as a whole, and assumed all of it was true, I know that it is orders of magnitude better than the very BEST Republican politician anywhere in the country.

That is how you frame your complaints in a way that actually makes your life better by both expressing your disappointment with any Democrat and not helping Republicans at the same time. Talk about the faults of Dems all you want, just make sure you make it abundantly clear at the same time that Republicans are worse in every way.

This is how Republicans win. Every time you point out a Republican fault, once they can't deny it anymore they immediately switch to whataboutisms because they believe Democrats HAVE to be worse. We need to do the same. At least we have the benefit of evidence backing our claims that Republicans are actually worse and don't have to resort to lies.

 

[pmv]

Casting the actual votes is far less important than every single person's attitude over the next 7 months during any interaction with other people that involves any political discussion.

You want to talk about what a piece of shit Bidrn is? Go right ahead! I agree. I HATE that I have to vote for him in November. But I know that even if I took every single accusation against him for any reason, credible or complete make believe included, and looked at all of it as a whole, and assumed all of it was true, I know that it is orders of magnitude better than the very BEST Republican politician anywhere in the country.

That is how you frame your complaints in a way that actually makes your life better by both expressing your disappointment with any Democrat and not helping Republicans at the same time. Talk about the faults of Dems all you want, just make sure you make it abundantly clear at the same time that Republicans are worse in every way.

I don't know how it is in the US system, but here the limitations of a leader are only part of the story - the party they are part of and embedded in is just as important. Biden is not the entirety of the Democrats, and it seems obvious there is no equivalence between the parties taken as a whole.

(For all the annoying smug complacency I see among the 'Democrat establishment', I don't see anything equivalent to the swivel-eyed madness that seems a massive part of the Republican party)

 

[dank69]

I don't know how it is in the US system, but here the limitations of a leader are only part of the story - the party they are part of and embedded in is just as important. Biden is not the entirety of the Democrats, and it seems obvious there is no equivalence between the parties taken as a whole.

(For all the annoying smug complacency I see among the 'Democrat establishment', I don't see anything equivalent to the swivel-eyed madness that seems a massive part of the Republican party)

This is exactly how you discuss contemporary politics without doing damage. It isn't difficult and it requires no lies and no compromise of anyone's principles.

 

[Blackjack200]

I don't know how it is in the US system, but here the limitations of a leader are only part of the story - the party they are part of and embedded in is just as important. Biden is not the entirety of the Democrats, and it seems obvious there is no equivalence between the parties taken as a whole.

(For all the annoying smug complacency I see among the 'Democrat establishment', I don't see anything equivalent to the swivel-eyed madness that seems a massive part of the Republican party)

A few years ago I read that if you stop thinking about the Democratic party in traditional terms (a party that seeks to gain and exercise power), and think of it instead as a party that only exists as a nominal opposition party, providing a fig leaf of an alternative from the unapologetic party of monstrous capitalism, their behavior makes much more sense. Voting for a democrat allows people to feel virtuous and sneer at the Republicans while they do nothing to change the system or challenge corporate power at all.

 

[Vic]

A few years ago I read that if you stop thinking about the Democratic party in traditional terms (a party that seeks to gain and exercise power), and think of it instead as a party that only exists as a nominal opposition party, providing a fig leaf of an alternative from the unapologetic party of monstrous capitalism, their behavior makes much more sense. Voting for a democrat allows people to feel virtuous and sneer at the Republicans while they do nothing to change the system or challenge corporate power at all.

How successful do you suppose progressives will be at changing the system without even that "nominal opposition?"

And have you considered the possibility that your own tactic of marginalizing your own movement by constantly attacking your only potential allies, instead of working to persuade them to your cause, is your own virtuous way of pretending to be doing something while ensuring nothing is done to change the system?

Think about it, while you keep doing everything you can to help Trump get re-elected.