Are you a Hillary supporter? Why?

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werepossum

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
Knowing said:
I don't trust her because she started birtherism, as sec state presided over the destabilization of multiple nations, can't fake a genuine smile to save her life, and joked about getting an alleged child rapist off on charges.

As a reminder, that would make a white male a racist, warmonger, sociopath, literal rapist plotting a war on womyn (and children - please think of them when you're not dropping bombs on them).
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Not true - unless the white male were a conservative. If it's a proggie white male, that would mean that he is concerned about our nation, valiantly tried but was unable to overcome those dastardly Neo-Cons, feels your pain too much to smile when so many children go to bed hungry, and is concerned about the excesses of our racist, sexist, classist, nativist legal system.
 
Bitek

Bitek

Lifer
Aug 2, 2001
10,676
5,239
136
Jhhnn said:
Your lack of self awareness & circular arguments are tedious.

It all comes back around to you can't trust Hillary... because you can't trust Hillary. You just know that in your gut, the truthiness center that all conservatives have.

According to you, why, if Dems would just nominate Bernie he'd give Dems a magic carpet ride to majorities in both houses & everybody gets a unicorn.

But the Eeeevil Hillary will sell us out over all the issues Dems care about because... You can't trust Hillary about SS, or Medicare, or the ACA, or civil rights, or women's rights or financial regulation or the Iran deal or anything because What, exactly? Vince Foster? Ben-fucking-ghazi? Obama's birth certificate? Or just whatever FUD you're determined to spread?
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I literally lol'd.
It's dopey thoughts like this that conservatives broad brush all dems with.

This thread shows the split in the party between the idealists and the pragmatists.

I think there are far more of the latter but if Bernie wins the nom, I may have to concede to the point.

Ideologues have done wonders for the GOP...
 
Brainonska511

Brainonska511

Lifer
Dec 10, 2005
28,876
14,126
136
Bitek said:
I literally lol'd.
It's dopey thoughts like this that conservatives broad brush all dems with.

This thread shows the split in the party between the idealists and the pragmatists.

I think there are far more of the latter but if Bernie wins the nom, I may have to concede to the point.

Ideologues have done wonders for the GOP...
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It's great to have ideals, but it's important to not be blinded by naivety about how the government works and how policy moves forward. Pragmatism is useful in this case, especially in light of reality. I don't see anything inherently wrong with the president being a 'politician' and in fact being a politician could be an advantage. Politics is a dirty business - many of the most successful ones knew how to work the system to push some of their agenda forward.

Plus, if Sanders gets the nomination, the Republicans will have a much easier time campaigning. Sanders own words write his campaign's epitaph.
 
TheGardener

TheGardener

Golden Member
Jul 19, 2014
1,945
33
56
Brainonska511 said:
It's great to have ideals, but it's important to not be blinded by naivety about how the government works and how policy moves forward. Pragmatism is useful in this case, especially in light of reality. I don't see anything inherently wrong with the president being a 'politician' and in fact being a politician could be an advantage. Politics is a dirty business - many of the most successful ones knew how to work the system to push some of their agenda forward.

Plus, if Sanders gets the nomination, the Republicans will have a much easier time campaigning. Sanders own words write his campaign's epitaph.
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So let's see how this works. Politician X lambastes Big Banks, Big Oil, Big Military Industrial Complex, Big Medical Device companies, etc., etc., etc. But politician X is taking Big Money in campaign contributions from the lobbyists representing these these Big institutions. When elected, politician X has a symbiotic relationship of massive propaganda against the same, while continuing to take money and supporting their agenda on the slide. Problems get exacerbated and probably worse, through legislation or regulation that tries to satisfy everyone, and solves nothing.

Yes, politics is dirty. Politicians know how to lie and work the system. That's why people are angry.
 
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Sonikku

Sonikku

Lifer
Jun 23, 2005
15,902
4,927
136
If they're angry than they should vote for passionate penniless people eager to serve the public good. Not always line up behind the candidates with the most money. If politicians suck up to big donors it's only because those donations are a big, often deciding factor in victory.
 
J

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,685
136
Brainonska511 said:
Plus, if Sanders gets the nomination, the Republicans will have a much easier time campaigning. Sanders own words write his campaign's epitaph.
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Which explains the Right Wing trollin' for Bernie. Just trying to help him out by tearing down his rival & help the dirty rotten Commie Democrats pick a candidate who best reflects their Leftist! Leftist! OMFG! Leftist! desires.

The pretense of sincerity is nauseating.
 
TheGardener

TheGardener

Golden Member
Jul 19, 2014
1,945
33
56
Sonikku said:
If they're angry than they should vote for passionate penniless people eager to serve the public good. Not always line up behind the candidates with the most money. If politicians suck up to big donors it's only because those donations are a big, often deciding factor in victory.
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Public Service is an oxymoron.
 
mysticjbyrd

mysticjbyrd

Golden Member
Oct 6, 2015
1,363
3
0
Jhhnn said:
Which explains the Right Wing trollin' for Bernie. Just trying to help him out by tearing down his rival & help the dirty rotten Commie Democrats pick a candidate who best reflects their Leftist! Leftist! OMFG! Leftist! desires.

The pretense of sincerity is nauseating.
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You conservatives need to stop pretending to be democrats, never mind progressives.
 
mysticjbyrd

mysticjbyrd

Golden Member
Oct 6, 2015
1,363
3
0
Brainonska511 said:
It's great to have ideals, but it's important to not be blinded by naivety about how the government works and how policy moves forward. Pragmatism is useful in this case, especially in light of reality. I don't see anything inherently wrong with the president being a 'politician' and in fact being a politician could be an advantage. Politics is a dirty business - many of the most successful ones knew how to work the system to push some of their agenda forward.

Plus, if Sanders gets the nomination, the Republicans will have a much easier time campaigning. Sanders own words write his campaign's epitaph.
Click to expand...

You clueless conservatives realize that other countries exist, and many of those countries have working legislative branches, right?

What's your great plan? Vote Hillary, then let the status quo continue indefinitely? At what point in this great plan are we able to pass real liberal legislation, while you defend the status quo?
 
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ivwshane

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
33,558
17,083
136
mysticjbyrd said:
You conservatives need to stop pretending to be democrats, never mind progressives.
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Congrats on being the first true lefty on this forum! Righties on here are a dime a dozen and dumb as fuck! You now join them. They too, like you, complain about everyone but their guy being true to their ideology. They too, like you, prefer an all or nothing approach and shit on anyone that gets in their way, even those that used to be on their side.

Extreme ideology no matter what it is, is stupid.


Oh and I like bernie btw and I feel pretty lucky that the dems have three, good, and qualified people, which any one of them could be president and I'd be happy.
 
mysticjbyrd

mysticjbyrd

Golden Member
Oct 6, 2015
1,363
3
0
ivwshane said:
Congrats on being the first true lefty on this forum! Righties on here are a dime a dozen and dumb as fuck! You now join them. They too, like you, complain about everyone but their guy being true to their ideology. They too, like you, prefer an all or nothing approach and shit on anyone that gets in their way, even those that used to be on their side.

Extreme ideology no matter what it is, is stupid.


Oh and I like bernie btw and I feel pretty lucky that the dems have three, good, and qualified people, which any one of them could be president and I'd be happy.
Click to expand...


That's hilarious, because another twat just called me a trump supporter.
 
Brainonska511

Brainonska511

Lifer
Dec 10, 2005
28,876
14,126
136
mysticjbyrd said:
You clueless conservatives realize that other countries exist, and many of those countries have working legislative branches, right?

What's your great plan? Vote Hillary, then let the status quo continue indefinitely? At what point in this great plan are we able to pass real liberal legislation, while you defend the status quo?
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I'm a conservative? LOL. That's a first for that accusation.
 
F

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
88,006
55,442
136
mysticjbyrd said:
You clueless conservatives realize that other countries exist, and many of those countries have working legislative branches, right?

What's your great plan? Vote Hillary, then let the status quo continue indefinitely? At what point in this great plan are we able to pass real liberal legislation, while you defend the status quo?
Click to expand...

What's your great plan? Spell it out specifically.
 
ivwshane

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
33,558
17,083
136
Paul98 said:
Seems to be a problem finding a real answer, something more than just talk.
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Well she certainly must not have any policies otherwise we'd have the repubs and any anti Hillary posters talking about them, now wouldn't we.

/s

We could post a top ten of hillarys policies and you idiots still wouldn't bother discussing them.
 
Bitek

Bitek

Lifer
Aug 2, 2001
10,676
5,239
136
mysticjbyrd said:
You clueless conservatives realize that other countries exist, and many of those countries have working legislative branches, right?

What's your great plan? Vote Hillary, then let the status quo continue indefinitely? At what point in this great plan are we able to pass real liberal legislation, while you defend the status quo?
Click to expand...

It begins with actually having majorities in Congress which is not going to happen this cycle, not the HOR by any means.

Dems need to be looking at the SCOTUS appts, especially in the era of Roberts and the activist RW judges.

2020 is also a critical year as that will determine statehouse majorities and redistricting after the 2020 census. Dems blew it in 2010, and we've been stuck with Tea Party gerrymandered districts which has led to the point at top. Dems have to do far better than 51% to actually win majorities in the HOR.

The stuff Bernie is pushing needs supermajorities and a wave election.

Can Bernie even make it to 2020? He's old already.

What he looks like is that he has a good chance to be is a feckless potus with no practical plans. Nothing will get done, and the dems will get blown out in 2020, setting up another GOP decade.

Any dem will struggle not to be a one termer after Obama (like Bush sr after Reagan.) Bernie is a lock on one.


eskimospy said:
What's your great plan? Spell it out specifically.
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Apparently go Cruz. Call everyone Dinos, cry and shutdown the govt when you don't get what you want.
 
Last edited:
mysticjbyrd

mysticjbyrd

Golden Member
Oct 6, 2015
1,363
3
0
Bitek said:
It begins with actually having majorities in Congress which is not going to happen this cycle, not the HOR by any means.

Dems need to be looking at the SCOTUS appts, especially in the era of Roberts and the activist RW judges.

2020 is also a critical year as that will determine statehouse majorities and redistricting after the 2020 census. Dems blew it in 2010, and we've been stuck with Tea Party gerrymandered districts which had led to the point above. Dems have to do far better than 51% to actually win majorities in the HOR.

The stuff Bernie is pushing needs supermajorities and a wave election.

Can Bernie even make it to 2020? He's old already.

What he looks like he has a good chance to be is a feckless potus with no practical plans. Nothing will get done, and the dems will get blown out in 2020, setting up another GOP decade.

Any dem will struggle not to be a one termer after Obama (like Bush sr after Reagan.) Bernie is a lock on one.




Apparently go Cruz. Call everyone Dinos, cry and shutdown the govt when you don't get what you want.
Click to expand...

Hillary would need a super majority to pass liberal legislation as well.... Except she has no interest in passing such legislation to start with.

Assuming a split congress, Bernie is just as likely as Hillary to pass mediocre amendments to education, and healthcare.

Bernie actually has a chance to get this majority, unlike Hillary.

What's more the scotus is what's most important, and you can't trust Hillary with that. 100% chance she picks corrupt puppets. So even if Bernie could never get any legislation passed, he would still be the best candidate.
 
M

Mxylplyx

Diamond Member
Mar 21, 2007
4,197
101
106
Jhhnn said:
You assume sincerity on his part. Only when you drop that assumption does it all make sense.
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Does come off as a very uninformed, likely young individual. I'm guessing some paid intern or campaign volunteer working for some college credits.
 
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