19 Year Old Girl Shot Looking for Help

[bshole]

Not that I believe everything I read since "facts" seem to change frequently in media reports, but that article also says Worthy mentioned there were no signs of forced entry to the home.

CNN says the door was open when the shot was fired but the screen door was closed and locked. According to CNN, the prosecutor said the evidence suggests the homeowner opened the door himself.

The screen door closed and locked.... if that is true, he has to be charged. You are not allowed to shoot people outside of your house. Seems pretty clear cut if that fact is true.

 

[PliotronX]

The least he could've done was wait for her to successfully break in before putting one in her face...? I think his claim of AD is going to fuck him. Difference between accidental and negligent discharge = location of finger relative to trigger.

 

[allisolm]

Charges may have been appropriate, and it may be appropriate for him to stand trial... but I can't help but feel bad for someone who is simply asleep in their home, someone who has dealt with previous burglaries, and who suddenly is awoken and scared shitless by what he believes is another break in... and his life effectively is over because he didn't handle it better.

I guess I missed it. Where did you read that he had dealt with previous burglaries?

 

[Geosurface]

Hopefully these high profile cases will sink in to a lot of people and if any of them end up in a situation like this, say *absolutely* nothing to the cops til you have a lawyer.

I guess I missed it. Where did you read that he had dealt with previous burglaries?

In one of the articles about the case from some days ago, and I wish I could remember where it was... I feel like it was CBSOnline but I'm not sure, they had interviewed a neighbor or neighbors of the shooter who said he was a nice guy and had moved there from Detroit proper, where he'd dealt with two previous break ins.

 

[classy]

Getting behind the wheel with the kind of BAC she had is an incredibly dangerous, selfish, and short-sighted decision. And it's apparently one she'd made before, given her track record of "tearing up" previous vehicles.

When you do that, there is a very good chance you will end up ruining/ending your own life and the lives of others. Which is exactly what happened here, because of her decision to get behind the wheel absolutely plastered. Wtf was her BAC at the time of the crash, I wonder? And she had an enabling family who kept helping her get more vehicles...

The way she ended up losing her life and ruining someone else's is a bit novel, but it's still a predictable result of that kind of enormously intoxicated driving.

Charges may have been appropriate, and it may be appropriate for him to stand trial... but I can't help but feel bad for someone who is simply asleep in their home, someone who has dealt with previous burglaries, and who suddenly is awoken and scared shitless by what he believes is another break in... and his life effectively is over because he didn't handle it better.

I really wish we could know what really went down exactly. Because there are in fact versions of his actions which would make me lose ALL sympathy for him. I just find it hard to believe that those versions are likely. It seems more likely he really was afraid.

Sucks for her and for him that she conducted herself in such a highly illegal way that night which resulted in her needing to be at his doorstep.

To read you and others here is just a new low. Truth be told, she didn't hurt anyone. And just because she was drunk is no excuse for someone to open the door and shoot her in the face. The nonsense you and many others are slinging here is just beyond grotesque.

 

[EagleKeeper]

I've always wondered if the homeowner left the inner door open and was allowing the home to air out (my parents used to do years ago, specially after cooking fish) that evening. I guess we'll have to wait for the actual evidence to be released/revealed, hopefully that will be included in the arrest affidavit. I still think unless the prosecution can prove the homeowner couldn't have had reasonable fear from someone trying to enter the house in the early morning hours this will end in an acquittal.

Not in mid November in Michigan.

 

[nehalem256]

To read you and others here is just a new low. Truth be told, she didn't hurt anyone. And just because she was drunk is no excuse for someone to open the door and shoot her in the face. The nonsense you and many others are slinging here is just beyond grotesque.

The woman broke at least 4 laws which resulted in her death

(1) Underage drinking
(2) Smoking pot
(3) Driving drunk
(4) Fleeing the scene of an accident

The homeowner didn't just "open the door and shoot her in the face". She was banging around on his porch at ungodly hours. Now given her state of intoxication and highness do you think she was maybe doing that in a way that would freak someone out inside?

Or do you think she was just politely knocking and screaming "help!"

 

[EagleKeeper]

The screen door closed and locked.... if that is true, he has to be charged. You are not allowed to shoot people outside of your house. Seems pretty clear cut if that fact is true.

What is interesting is that all the pictures that I recall seeing of the house via the media, there was no screen door visible.

A wooden from doo with a pitcher type handle. Based on the door jamb, it looked like it open inward.

 

[classy]

The woman broke at least 4 laws which resulted in her death

(1) Underage drinking
(2) Smoking pot
(3) Driving drunk
(4) Fleeing the scene of an accident

The homeowner didn't just "open the door and shoot her in the face". She was banging around on his porch at ungodly hours. Now given her state of intoxication and highness do you think she was maybe doing that in a way that would freak someone out inside?

Or do you think she was just politely knocking and screaming "help!"

None of this had anything to do with a person opening a door and shooting her in the face. You should be ashamed of yourself, but I guess this is how you were raised.

 

[spidey07]

The screen door closed and locked.... if that is true, he has to be charged. You are not allowed to shoot people outside of your house. Seems pretty clear cut if that fact is true.

You absolutely are allOwed to shoot people outside your door if they trying to enter illegally.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Not in mid November in Michigan.

I had friends that slept with windows open (screen closed) in northern states during the winter time.

 

[classy]

What is interesting is that all the pictures that I recall seeing of the house via the media, there was no screen door visible.

A wooden from doo with a pitcher type handle. Based on the door jamb, it looked like it open inward.

Me neither. Maybe they took the screen door as evidence maybe?

 

[Londo_Jowo]

None of this had anything to do with a person opening a door and shooting her in the face. You should be ashamed of yourself, but I guess this is how you were raised.

Please provide a link to this evidence (not what the family's lawyer is claiming).

 

[SpatiallyAware]

The screen door closed and locked.... if that is true, he has to be charged. You are not allowed to shoot people outside of your house. Seems pretty clear cut if that fact is true.

Completely false.

There all are sorts of situations where, in my state, you could even shoot through a CLOSED door in self defense.

 

[classy]

Please provide a link to this evidence (not what the family's lawyer is claiming).

Huh? The prosecutor said there was no signs of forced entry and that the screen door was locked.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

Huh? The prosecutor said there was no signs of forced entry and that the screen door was locked.

Well, it sounds like the screen was probably ripped.

If that's the case, he heard beating on his door, and opened the inside door to see some burglar looking person drunk and screaming to let them in.... and he felt in ANY way that his life was in danger = good shoot.

 

[Geosurface]

Just watched the press conference where they announced charges here

and the prosecutor does talk about a closed and locked screen door, and an open main door. Does she mean at the time Renisha got there, or after Wafer opened it? I'm not sure.

This was November 2nd, and yea I agree it is not completely out of the realm of possibility that he had the door open. That may be exactly what drew her to this house in particular.

If she was that wasted, that out of it, and possibly a head injury on TOP of being completely plastered, her normal sense of what was logical and safe to do may have been extremely compromised. If she saw a house that appeared to be open, with only a screen door between her and somewhere to pass out in relative warmth, she may have gone for it and tried to open the screen door. She may have gotten frustrated when she found that screen door locked, and may have gotten aggressive with the door trying to open it.

If the screen door had been unlocked, Wafer may have come down in the morning to find her passed out on his couch.

 

[allisolm]

What is interesting is that all the pictures that I recall seeing of the house via the media, there was no screen door visible.

A wooden from doo with a pitcher type handle. Based on the door jamb, it looked like it open inward.

This site shows pics of the house/door which look to me like an intact (not shot up) storm door, not a screen door and a solid front door, and it even says "However, the door to the home is solid, with no window, and a clear glass outer door. Both remain intact..."

Who knows which it is? Screen, storm? Intact or not? Not me.

 

[bshole]

You absolutely are allOwed to shoot people outside your door if they trying to enter illegally.

Well there isn't any evidence at all of attempted forced entry. You are not allowed to shoot people who knock on your door. This is what appears to have happened in this instance.

Wayne County Prosecutor Kym Worthy said that Theodore P. Wafer, 54, of Dearborn Heights faces charges of second-degree murder and manslaughter in the death of Renisha McBride on Nov. 2. She was shot in the face after police say they believe she was involved in a car accident nearby in Detroit and family members say she likely approached Wafer's home for help.

She said evidence showed McBride knocked on the locked screen door, and that there was no evidence of forced entry.

 

[Sunburn74]

I personally am happy to see the 2nd degree murder charge. If you own a gun, you have a responsibility to have high level knowledge of its safety features and high level knowledge on service and maintenance of the device. Shooting and killing someone accidentally who posed no real threat to you (especially when there were options such as calling the police for assistance) should always be at least manslaughter and probably 2nd degree murder if you purposely brought the weapon to the scene.

I'm not one to tell you how to defend your family and property, but I will support coming down extremely hard on individuals who don't know how to safely use and operate their choice of defense.

 

[classy]

Please provide a link to this evidence (not what the family's lawyer is claiming).

Here is a good write up on it.

http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/i...wner_charged_in_killing_o.html#incart_m-rpt-2

He awoke to someone banging on the front door. According to the prosecutor he opened the front door and shot the girl through the screen door, which was locked. This wasn't an accident.............................

 

[spidey07]

Her banging on the screen door can certainly be attempting illegal entry.

Still sounds like a good shoot.

 

[bshole]

Her banging on the screen door can certainly be attempting illegal entry.

Still sounds like a good shoot.

So basically, we can shoot anybody that knocks on our door. Thanks for clearing that up for us.

ROFLMFAO..... you are the real legal scholar. Good stuff!

Lemme guess..... card carrying member of NRA and the Tea Party?

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Huh? The prosecutor said there was no signs of forced entry and that the screen door was locked.

Just because there's no signs of forced entry doesn't mean she couldn't have been trying to open the door. The door could have already been open and she could have been shot through the screen door without the homeowner opening the door.

 

[EagleKeeper]

What is interesting is that all the pictures that I recall seeing of the house via the media, there was no screen door visible.

A wooden door with a pitcher type handle. Based on the door jamb, it looked like it open inward.

This site shows pics of the house/door which look to me like an intact (not shot up) storm door, not a screen door and a solid front door, and it even says "However, the door to the home is solid, with no window, and a clear glass outer door. Both remain intact..."

Who knows which it is? Screen, storm? Intact or not? Not me.

That is an entirely different house/orientation that what was being shown in the media over the past couple of days.

And if it was a storm door; that would indicate glass which would have shattered.
A screen front would have been torn up; this does not look torn up at all.

Would the homeowner be allowed to repair any damage or would it be considered to be evidence? I feel the latter and required to be left untouched.

So someone is again spinning a story to the media - prosecution?