Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)

[DisEnchantment]

Speculate at will

 

[A///]

For those who are lazy to open It. Of course once more many mistakes are there.

it isn't about laziness but principal of the matter of driving traffic towards toilet paper rags like this or hasan's website.

 

[TESKATLIPOKA]

it isn't about laziness but principal of the matter of driving traffic towards toilet paper rags like this or hasan's website.

Yet a lot of the debate we do on this forum is thanks to such rags.
BTW, I am visiting that toilet rag a lot.

 

[dr1337]

Yeah, because as they've been consistently saying on their earnings calls, they're undershipping. They don't want to sell to the client markets while they're as down in the dumps as they are.

Its not down in the dumps when 2020 and 2021 were a thing. Sure sales have been in a net trajectory down but this is true across the whole industry. Even Nvidia admitted in their earnings call that the huge quarter was almost entirely from increased margins and not shipping more units. Controlling prices per market segment is just the norm, and also why EPYC and Instinct cost so much more per mm^2 of silicon than Ryzen or Radeon.

Lisa Su had mentioned how they were planning Zen 2 and Zen 3 as if the competition was executing at full tilt; There's no way she or anyone else could have foreseen the pandemics massive client growth until early 2020. A time at which these current generations were underway at full speed. There's no way that each of these tech companies isn't selling more chips than they initially expected from the foundations of all of their currently executed roadmaps even with under-shipping demand.

AMD seems really happy to be Apple like and take a 20% market share across the board instead of being a global market leader in a particular segment. Maybe not the decision most of us would expect but if we're comparing Apples to AMDs it seems that investing in R&D instead of sheer economy of scale can pay off very well.

 

[adroc_thurston]

AMD seems really happy to be Apple like and take a 20% market share across the board instead

They'll get a lot more in server; in client it's gonna be a lot tougher given that Intel's an IDM and RPL-U 282 is just so cheap.

 

[eek2121]

Yet a lot of the debate we do on this forum is thanks to such rags.
BTW, I am visiting that toilet rag a lot.

Meh, VideoCardz does a way better job than wtftech. I don’t get why some people hate.

 

[A///]

Yet a lot of the debate we do on this forum is thanks to such rags.
BTW, I am visiting that toilet rag a lot.

There's a worse ibs inducing rag than those two. I can't remember the name but it was a green and gray website when I first found it. very wild claims.

 

[A///]

Meh, VideoCardz does a way better job than wtftech. I don’t get why some people hate.

they run nearly identical stories. they may do some due dilligence but their sources are the same crap hacks that postech uses.

 

[Saylick]

There's a worse ibs inducing rag than those two. I can't remember the name but it was a green and gray website when I first found it. very wild claims.

hardwaretimes

Basically a wannabe WTFTech. Started and run by a college dropout who uses the same playbook as WTFTech but is 3 days slower at regurgitating the same news.

they run nearly identical stories. they may do some due dilligence but their sources are the same crap hacks that postech uses.

Yeah, same sources, same stories. It doesn't take much to be a rumor mill site these days. You just need the following:
1) A Twitter account that follows all the major "leakers"
2) A non-existent sleep schedule that allows you to regurgitate the "news" as soon as it breaks
3) A good SEO strategy to drive traffic to your website (hardwaretimes spent a lot of time posting his own articles on all the popular PC hardware subreddits for a while)
4) A lack of an educational background or degree in journalism, electrical engineering, and/or software engineering

 

[A///]

hardwaretimes

Basically a wannabe WTFTech. Started and run by a college dropout who uses the same playbook as WTFTech but is 3 days slower at regurgitating the same news.

that's the one. I found it around the zen 3 launch or zen 2 launch. It's been a while.

 

[eek2121]

they run nearly identical stories. they may do some due dilligence but their sources are the same crap hacks that postech uses.

The owner of VideoCardz is a lot more careful with reporting, does not usually edit his stories to make them look factually correct, and tags rumor posts as rumors.

There is nothing wrong with reporting speculation and rumors. WTFTech just acts like MLID and the ilk. VideoCardz tries to sift through the garbage and report accurate stuff.

His site is the only reason I haven’t started my own. (I actually am working on putting together a quality combo hardware review/news site. Ian’s departure from AT has left it a shell, and I think there is a shortage of quality non-video review sites)

 

[A///]

The owner of VideoCardz is a lot more careful with reporting, does not usually edit his stories to make them look factually correct, and tags rumor posts as rumors.

There is nothing wrong with reporting speculation and rumors. WTFTech just acts like MLID and the ilk. VideoCardz tries to sift through the garbage and report accurate stuff.

His site is the only reason I haven’t started my own. (I actually am working on putting together a quality combo hardware review/news site. Ian’s departure from AT has left it a shell, and I think there is a shortage of quality non-video review sites)

While I agree with some of your points it's still a rumours website and shouldn't be relied upon as much as you say it should just because the owner is more "stringent" than the brainless moron who owns postech. postech has unfortunately been around for maybe 20 years now. idk who ian is.

eeknews.com would be a good domain.

 

[TESKATLIPOKA]

While I agree with some of your points it's still a rumours website and shouldn't be relied upon as much as you say it should just because the owner is more "stringent" than the brainless moron who owns postech. postech has unfortunately been around for maybe 20 years now. idk who ian is.

eeknews.com would be a good domain.

But If there were no rumours, then what would we discuss? What we had for dinner?
Let's be honest, the time until the next gen release is still a long way away. We have to do something until then.

 

[maddie]

But If there were no rumours, then what would we discuss? What we had for dinner?
Let's be honest, the time until the next gen release is still a long way away. We have to do something until then.

Nah, what we drank for dinner.

 

[Doug S]

AMD seems really happy to be Apple like and take a 20% market share across the board instead of being a global market leader in a particular segment. Maybe not the decision most of us would expect but if we're comparing Apples to AMDs it seems that investing in R&D instead of sheer economy of scale can pay off very well.

The difference is that Apple's share is at the high end of the market, so their revenue share is much larger than their market share. That's not the case for AMD.

 

[soresu]

The difference is that Apple's share is at the high end of the market, so their revenue share is much larger than their market share. That's not the case for AMD.

Apple isn't selling chips, they are selling whole computers - so you can't expect their revenue to be on par, much like Intel can sell chips for barely more than cost once the R&D of a new node is defrayed by sales due to owning their own fabs.

 

[A///]

can any of you digital rovers post that graphic jim keller made from early this year or last year?

 

[AAbattery]

It's on page 38 in this thread.

Post in thread 'Zen 5 Discussion (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 8000)' https://forums.anandtech.com/thread...ranite-ridge-ryzen-8000.2607350/post-40981580

 

[A///]

BREAKING: RISC-V Conference held by Tenstorrent accidentally leak Zen5 performance, also include NVIDIA Grace which is still being projected

View attachment 79037

 

[A///]

Thanks @Geddagod

this popped into my head whilst I was making soup today and only because I was thinking of those recent at large claims of zen 5 performance being the next big thing to dominate through 2024 and maybe 2025. either those were based on that chart or independent of it. mike clark otoh did go on a flowery description of wanting to go bed and waking up to zen 5 because it's simply that good and the team has been waiting a few years now for it to come out.

this all came to my head only because I was reading about how grace hopper out performs anything from epyc or xeon in single or dual configarations with a gpu and how the zen 5 on this was trending far past grace hopper. and it's jim keller he's not going to bs about a product.

 

[Doug S]

Apple isn't selling chips, they are selling whole computers - so you can't expect their revenue to be on par, much like Intel can sell chips for barely more than cost once the R&D of a new node is defrayed by sales due to owning their own fabs.

I was talking about the comparison between percentage market share and percentage revenue share where that point is irrelevant. Whether you are selling PCs or CPUs, you will have a higher percentage revenue shaer than your percentage market share if you sell to the higher end of the market, and a lower one if you sell to the lower end of the market.

There are plenty of PCs/laptops sold for "barely more than cost" on the market, and always has been. Just like both AMD and Intel have at various times sold for barely more than cost.

 

[Timorous]

While I agree with some of your points it's still a rumours website and shouldn't be relied upon as much as you say it should just because the owner is more "stringent" than the brainless moron who owns postech. postech has unfortunately been around for maybe 20 years now. idk who ian is.

eeknews.com would be a good domain.

Who relies on rumours? It makes interesting jumping off points to talk nonsense between releases and that is it. If people are making purchasing or delay decisions based on rumours that is on them not the rumour sites/channels.

 

[JustViewing]

mike clark otoh did go on a flowery description of wanting to go bed and waking up to zen 5 because it's simply that good and the team has been waiting a few years now for it to come out.

My belief is that, the reason for Mick Clark's excitement is because of new design approach for Zen5 rather than for outright performance. In addition, the question was a directed question about future Zen versions. Of course AMD had big expectations for Bulldozer and Original Phenom.
I Like to be pessimistic and get exited than optimistic and get disappointed .

 

[adroc_thurston]

Mick Clark's excitement is because of new design approach for Zen5 rather than for outright performance

There is no new design approach.
It's just a big core with big perf.

 

[igor_kavinski]

It's just a big core with big perf.

It's gotta bite AMD in the butt somehow. Nothing is perfect, unless they sacrificed the most nubile available virgins on Earth.

 

[A///]

My belief is that, the reason for Mick Clark's excitement is because of new design approach for Zen5 rather than for outright performance. In addition, the question was a directed question about future Zen versions. Of course AMD had big expectations for Bulldozer and Original Phenom.
I Like to be pessimistic and get exited than optimistic and get disappointed .

The issue with your theory is that Mike mentioned Zen 4 performance in the same response and how it's great, but that Zen 5 performance was something else. A new design approach would imply a large performance increase over zen 4. zen 4 while a nice bump from zen 3 wasn't exactly talk of the town. if zen 5 performance is a similar oe lesser bump intel may look like the better option provided your home owners insurance covers incidentals such as fire.