Your entire party is a dumpster fire

[HomerJS]

Obama??? You are joking right? The worst role model I could think of, another politician. lol

I knew it. You are too much of a coward to answer the question.

 

[cytg111]

Well, both have been President, but Trump has done more to grow the economy and has the market at new highs and unemployment at 45 year lows and historic lows for blacks and Hispanics, and is a lot more successful as a businessman and is a great father, so I guess you know which would be more logical, I just hope I taught my kids that politicians and lawyers are NOT good role models.

This is where I have to believe we are different kind of apes you and I and when the grand purge is upon us it will be your kind that scorches the sky.

 

[woolfe9998]

Total incompetence? I think we'd have to define that. One can't easily deny that he's gotten some of his major priorities achieved.

Most of what he's accomplished is by executive order - easy.

Let's take a look at a tiny fraction of examples of his incompetence:

Failed healthcare legislation where he showed no leadership, no initiative and no knowledge of the subject matter.

Formed a task force on illegal voting after claiming he didn't lose the popular vote, and it went nowhere, only to be disbanded.

Trump's deplorable remarks during the campaign about wanting to ban all Muslims are why his first travel ban got blocked and why he had to water it down. Also the initial ban was implemented with little to no warning and caused chaos.

His White House leaks like a sieve, worse than any in recent memory.

He was told Michael Flynn was compromised because he lied to the public and the VP about his conversations with the Russian ambassador, but did nothing about it until the press reported it 2 weeks later. Also, he knew Flynn was lobbying for a foreign government and he allowed him to be NSA anyway.

He got peer pressured into green lighting a disastrous raid in Yemon which he clearly did not understand. And subsequently abdicated his role in military decision making.

Allowed Steve Bannon to be on the NSC because he signed an order that Bannon himself wrote, evidently without reading it.

Appointed his son-in-law to be in charge of about about 10 different issues that he knows little to nothing about.

Fired the director of the FBI in spite of the bulk of his advisers telling him not to because it could subject him to possible criminal charges. Then went on TV and admitted that the stated reason for the firing was bogus, and that the real reason was trying to stop the investigation into his campaign.

Gave Russian officials details of intel on ISIS which had been obtained by the Israelis.

OK, that about covers 1% of his incompetent acts. It's getting exhausting so I'll leave it at that.

 

[pmv]

Reminds me of when conservatives denounced Obama's re-election slogan "Forward" as parallel to communist ideas like The Great Leap Forward.

I'm sorry but I don't think Trump is giving covert nods to the KKK by his slogan. Trump is to subtlety what oil is to water. How many people even knew the historical use of "America First" before Trump adopted it? Do you think Trump himself did? I doubt it.

Seems a much stronger association than just the word 'forward'. In that latter case the objection would be more that it was trite and completely meaningless (would anyone ever adopt the slogan 'backward'?*). A party here once had the slogan 'forward not back' which as well as being grammatically questionable (surely it should be 'forward not backward'?) is so blandly generic I honestly can't remember which party it was that used it. Could have been any of them.

But even a non-American like me vaguely remembers there was something called the "America first movement" that had unsavory connotations (turns out was isolationist, anti-Semitic and against fighting the Nazis). Though looking it up it seems Woodrow Wilson used the same slogan in his day, so maybe Trump can just about maintain plausible deniability (though Wilson was himself pretty racist).

* edit - 'sideways!' doesn't seem very likely either

 

[Jhhnn]

Obama??? You are joking right? The worst role model I could think of, another politician. lol

Lyndon Johnson was right-

If you can convince the lowest white man he’s better than the best colored man, he won’t notice you’re picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he’ll empty his pockets for you.

 

[Younigue]

It's a natural mental progression... You see others with $thing, feel envy (despite never having a need for $thing in your life), create an enemy (preferably foreign from your own group, whatever group that might be) that you can blame for you not having $thing, then feel that you *would* have that $thing if it weren't for them. You DESERVE $thing, but those rat-bastards are keeping you from it.

Copypaste to billions of individuals, and scale vertically for every regressive political push in documented history.

Yes, and I despise these steps used in any form. The fact the the Trumpublican Era has embraced it with a strangle hold and is treating it like it's a brilliant political move is so weak minded and developmentally stunted. *sigh* I'm so frustrated that the followers are so willingly open to it and that the Representatives are so cruel and devious as to capitalize upon it regardless if it's what they truly believe. It's disgusting! Society will struggle with these things all on its own without the aid of politicians. A politician should never exacerbate these human failings.

 

[UNCjigga]

Let's get back on topic.

The GOP is a dumpster fire. In light of recent events, I'd call it a trainwreck in slow motion.

Exhibit A: The Nunes Memo

The amount of hype and grandstanding on this memo leading up to today has been epic. Nunes convinced Paul Ryan to get onboard, and Ryan is now in jeopardy if this whole thing blows up.

So...Trump gets caught on a hot mic saying "we'll release it...100%" after SOTU. But his own FBI director has grave concerns. Nunes edited the information to water it down, but it's emerging now that some of what remained is still Top Secret and Nunes wasn't even aware of it.

Well, apparently now some at the WH fear the Nunes memo is a dud, and are trying to walk it back. All while Dems are demanding answers from social media on how the Russians got on board #releasethememo.

This is the definition of dumpster fire.

 

[Jhhnn]

Yes, and I despise these steps used in any form. The fact the the Trumpublican Era has embraced it with a strangle hold and is treating it like it's a brilliant political move is so weak minded and developmentally stunted. *sigh* I'm so frustrated that the followers are so willingly open to it and that the Representatives are so cruel and devious as to capitalize upon it regardless if it's what they truly believe. It's disgusting! Society will struggle with these things all on its own without the aid of politicians. A politician should never exacerbate these human failings.

Hint- begin from the premise that Trump & the GOP believe none of it but that they'll say anything to keep that good old trickle down working for themselves & their uber wealthy donors. Whatever moral compass they had was smashed with the Gingrich revolution.

 

[Victorian Gray]

The same was said of Bush. And Reagan. And Obama. This is neglect of history. Every president is Hitler until the next one comes who is also Hitler. The moment for true outrage is always the present.

Trump is different in that he's a boorish cad and that's about it.

‘There are none so blind as those who will not see. The most deluded people are those who choose to ignore what they already know’

 

[Atreus21]

Most of what he's accomplished is by executive order - easy.

So they don't count because they fall strictly within his sole power? In that case, you probably shouldn't give Obama credit for DACA, the Paris Climate Accord, the Iran Nuclear deal, or the transgender bathrooms in public schools issue. The whole problem with Obama's legacy "being undone brick by brick" was that so much of it, excluding the ACA, was done by executive order.

Failed healthcare legislation where he showed no leadership, no initiative and no knowledge of the subject matter.

Formed a task force on illegal voting after claiming he didn't lose the popular vote, and it went nowhere, only to be disbanded.

Trump's deplorable remarks during the campaign about wanting to ban all Muslims are why his first travel ban got blocked and why he had to water it down. Also the initial ban was implemented with little to no warning and caused chaos.

Yeah, that was very shoddily done. But the revised one still has much of the same teeth and remains in place.

His White House leaks like a sieve, worse than any in recent memory.

Well, that's one side of the coin. We know about leaks because of a press chomping at the bit to release them, owing to the present occupant of the oval office.

He was told Michael Flynn was compromised because he lied to the public and the VP about his conversations with the Russian ambassador, but did nothing about it until the press reported it 2 weeks later. Also, he knew Flynn was lobbying for a foreign government and he allowed him to be NSA anyway.

He got peer pressured into green lighting a disastrous raid in Yemen which he clearly did not understand. And subsequently abdicated his role in military decision making.

Allowed Steve Bannon to be on the NSC because he signed an order that Bannon himself wrote, evidently without reading it.

Appointed his son-in-law to be in charge of about about 10 different issues that he knows little to nothing about.

Fired the director of the FBI in spite of the bulk of his advisers telling him not to because it could subject him to possible criminal charges. Then went on TV and admitted that the stated reason for the firing was bogus, and that the real reason was trying to stop the investigation into his campaign.

Gave Russian officials details of intel on ISIS which had been obtained by the Israelis.

OK, that about covers 1% of his incompetent acts. It's getting exhausting so I'll leave it at that.

I'd agree that most of this is due to Trump's incompetence.

On the other hand, despite his bumbling foolishness, he got substantial tax reform through, and got Gorsuch to the SCOTUS. Obama, in his first year, also got a single major piece of legislation through in the Recovery and Reinvestment act, and got Sotomayor to the SCOTUS.

I also can't help but wonder how Obama would be regarded if he faced a press as hostile as Trump does. What do you suppose would happen if Trump did something like this?

At any rate, I can call him many unflattering things, but I can't disparage Trump as totally incompetent in light of the things he managed to do in his first year.

 

[Atreus21]

Seems a much stronger association than just the word 'forward'. In that latter case the objection would be more that it was trite and completely meaningless (would anyone ever adopt the slogan 'backward'?*). A party here once had the slogan 'forward not back' which as well as being grammatically questionable (surely it should be 'forward not backward'?) is so blandly generic I honestly can't remember which party it was that used it. Could have been any of them.

But even a non-American like me vaguely remembers there was something called the "America first movement" that had unsavory connotations (turns out was isolationist, anti-Semitic and against fighting the Nazis). Though looking it up it seems Woodrow Wilson used the same slogan in his day, so maybe Trump can just about maintain plausible deniability (though Wilson was himself pretty racist).

* edit - 'sideways!' doesn't seem very likely either

Trump himself disavowed the association. But I suppose he'd say that both if he were telling the truth and if he were not.

 

[woolfe9998]

So they don't count because they fall strictly within his sole power? In that case, you probably shouldn't give Obama credit for DACA, the Paris Climate Accord, the Iran Nuclear deal, or the transgender bathrooms in public schools issue. The whole problem with Obama's legacy "being undone brick by brick" was that so much of it, excluding the ACA, was done by executive order.

If Trump negotiates a major treaty, or even a major trade agreement, I would give him credit for that. It's different from an executive order because it requires some diplomatic skill.

I don't give Obama "credit" for DACA except for that fact that I agree with it. He'd have deserved much more if he had gotten a DACA bill through Congress because that is hard.

I'd agree that most of this is due to Trump's incompetence.

On the other hand, despite his bumbling foolishness, he got substantial tax reform through, and got Gorsuch to the SCOTUS. Obama, in his first year, also got a single major piece of legislation through in the Recovery and Reinvestment act, and got Sotomayor to the SCOTUS.

I also can't help but wonder how Obama would be regarded if he faced a press as hostile as Trump does. What do you suppose would happen if Trump did something like this?

I've got a better one for you. How much better would Obama have been regarded had he inherited a great economy instead of the next closest thing to the Great Depression?

IMO Trump's poor standing with the media is primarily because of his behavior. but even if he is facing media bias, he's better off with that coupled with the economy he inherited than not having it and facing the situation Obama faced when he took office.

At any rate, I can call him many unflattering things, but I can't disparage Trump as totally incompetent in light of the things he managed to do in his first year.

Fair enough. But he is.

 

[Jhhnn]

I don't give Obama "credit" for DACA except for that fact that I agree with it. He'd have deserved much more if he had gotten a DACA bill through Congress because that is hard.

Hard? The term you want is "impossible" after the 2010 election. The GOP's whole reason for living was to deny Obama any victories.

A better strategy for Obama might have been to propose exactly the opposite of what he wanted & let GOP spite do the rest for him.

 

[HomerJS]

I also can't help but wonder how Obama would be regarded if he faced a press as hostile as Trump does.

Better question to ask could Obama have even gotten elected acting like Trump?

 

[Victorian Gray]

Better question to ask could Obama have even gotten elected acting like Trump?

Not sure that Obama could have pulled off the appeal to white supremacists and your garden variety fascists, nazis and assorted other alt-assholes.

 

[Greenman]

If Trump is a president not worth watching that is absolutely a valid argument as to how and why these poll numbers (especially in this) can not be meaningful. Sure sure, it's important to you to take the poll numbers at face value but all you have to do is look around you. The Plague is hated and for good reason. Oh and let's not forget that Trump spews nothing but ugliness and can not be trusted in any way for any reason ever.

How are you not completely exhausted by defending someone so completely unworthy of defense? He keeps putting all y'all's feet to the fire and none of you will even ask for burn cream. You just up your game and put your own damn feet in the fire because why? Hate, corruption and greed MUST WIN THE DAY. Disgusting!

What do you think of the office I'm sitting in right now? Does it suit your taste? What don't you like about it? You can't possibly know if I'm sitting in the south wing of an eight million dollar mansion, or under a freeway overpass in a cardboard box. The exact same logic apply's to Trumps speech.
The other point you missed is that I'm not defending Trump, I didn't vote for him, and I don't like him, but I don't hate him. I don't believe he's a fundamentally evil person.
What I actually debate with people is taking speculation and beliefs as fact, of using feelings instead of logic. I don't accept anything political at face value. Everyone has an agenda, and a lot of people don't have an issue with pushing that agenda by using phrases out of context, by omitting pertinent facts, or by outright lies. The Russian scandal is a perfect example. I know people that want Trump sent to prison because he's somehow involved with the Russians. They don't care about a trial or evidence, they know he's guilty based on nothing more than rumor and personal desires. I need more than that. I'm not ruled by anger and the desire for vengeance against someone because I don't agree with them.

 

[dank69]

What do you think of the office I'm sitting in right now? Does it suit your taste? What don't you like about it? You can't possibly know if I'm sitting in the south wing of an eight million dollar mansion, or under a freeway overpass in a cardboard box. The exact same logic apply's to Trumps speech.
The other point you missed is that I'm not defending Trump, I didn't vote for him, and I don't like him, but I don't hate him. I don't believe he's a fundamentally evil person.
What I actually debate with people is taking speculation and beliefs as fact, of using feelings instead of logic. I don't accept anything political at face value. Everyone has an agenda, and a lot of people don't have an issue with pushing that agenda by using phrases out of context, by omitting pertinent facts, or by outright lies. The Russian scandal is a perfect example. I know people that want Trump sent to prison because he's somehow involved with the Russians. They don't care about a trial or evidence, they know he's guilty based on nothing more than rumor and personal desires. I need more than that. I'm not ruled by anger and the desire for vengeance against someone because I don't agree with them.

Tell us how you feel about Hillary Clinton.

 

[Jhhnn]

What do you think of the office I'm sitting in right now? Does it suit your taste? What don't you like about it? You can't possibly know if I'm sitting in the south wing of an eight million dollar mansion, or under a freeway overpass in a cardboard box. The exact same logic apply's to Trumps speech.
The other point you missed is that I'm not defending Trump, I didn't vote for him, and I don't like him, but I don't hate him. I don't believe he's a fundamentally evil person.
What I actually debate with people is taking speculation and beliefs as fact, of using feelings instead of logic. I don't accept anything political at face value. Everyone has an agenda, and a lot of people don't have an issue with pushing that agenda by using phrases out of context, by omitting pertinent facts, or by outright lies. The Russian scandal is a perfect example. I know people that want Trump sent to prison because he's somehow involved with the Russians. They don't care about a trial or evidence, they know he's guilty based on nothing more than rumor and personal desires. I need more than that. I'm not ruled by anger and the desire for vengeance against someone because I don't agree with them.

Pardon me, but my distaste for Trump stems from the fact that he's a psychopathic con man & charlatan, the most spellbinding bullshit artist imaginable. We're all just marks to him. We'll rue the day he was elected President.

So far as Mueller's investigation is concerned, I'm content to let him & the FBI sort it out. That's apparently not what Trump, Nunes et al are trying to do at all & never has been.

The Russians? Their efforts on Trump's behalf were a brilliant & audacious triumph in the art of propaganda, a new synthesis of cyber warfare & exploitation of social media, a tour de force in messing with our collective consciousness.

Why they did it doesn't really matter other than I'm sure no MAGA was intended. Trump voters need to take a long hard look at that & at themselves, as well.

 

[Younigue]

What do you think of the office I'm sitting in right now? Does it suit your taste? What don't you like about it? You can't possibly know if I'm sitting in the south wing of an eight million dollar mansion, or under a freeway overpass in a cardboard box. The exact same logic apply's to Trumps speech.
The other point you missed is that I'm not defending Trump, I didn't vote for him, and I don't like him, but I don't hate him. I don't believe he's a fundamentally evil person.
What I actually debate with people is taking speculation and beliefs as fact, of using feelings instead of logic. I don't accept anything political at face value. Everyone has an agenda, and a lot of people don't have an issue with pushing that agenda by using phrases out of context, by omitting pertinent facts, or by outright lies. The Russian scandal is a perfect example. I know people that want Trump sent to prison because he's somehow involved with the Russians. They don't care about a trial or evidence, they know he's guilty based on nothing more than rumor and personal desires. I need more than that. I'm not ruled by anger and the desire for vengeance against someone because I don't agree with them.

This is what I know about any space you occupy. I would find it tiresome due to your presence.

I personally don't care if he goes to prison. I want him out of office because I [emotionally] know he is no good for the country. Hate is not a common emotion for me but I do hate Trump and I hate what his role in the world is doing to the country. I do think he's evil but understand, I don't believe in Hell so my belief does not come from some imagined demon wreaking havoc on a devine planet. No, I believe (I don't give a shit if it's emotional because I do not doubt my instincts) when presented with many options, all of them good and kind and helpful but for one Trump would choose the one. I do not think his mind is even capable of considering the good things or even the right things. When/if it has occurred in his life it has been a fluke or to serve a dastardly purpose. I don't know if the Russian shit is true but I do know that I completely believe him capable of selling his country out and hurting its people. His moral compass is skewed to such an extent that no one can or will benefit from it unless corruption is at its core. I also believe that even his followers know this about him but their agenda's stand a chance with a soulless piece of filth at the top. What they want and what he's willing to promote stems from a sickness in their souls (or if you rather, minds). So yes, you may choose to be fair and balanced but in the face of such true corruption it is complicity that you are confusing with a sense of unwillingness to pile on. In this, I'll pile it all on to him because he is a danger. In this I am willing to let history sort it out because no matter what he needs to removed and history can not and will not be kind.

I won't say he's responsible for the Plague that is HIS party but he has given them a voice and a power they should never have acquired. The Republican party by too great a number has become sell outs to the country, to humanity, to the environment and possibly to the benefit of Russia.

So you keep being the voice of reason in an era where reason and decency is becoming the enemy and I will keep sounding the alarm that Trump and party are destroying democracy, decency, the country (water, air, land, health and so on), diplomacy, economy. There is little to no humanity within them and it's stinking up the planet.

I'm gonna pat you on the head at this point and say... good boy?

 

[HomerJS]

Not sure that Obama could have pulled off the appeal to white supremacists and your garden variety fascists, nazis and assorted other alt-assholes.

Why not? Oh yeah, I forgot

 

[Muse]

Does a president have to achieve every single priority within his first year or be considered totally incompetent?

Well, no. But presidents always (AFAIK), get a lot more done in that first year than the others. The curve is down all the way after the first year. This so called president got close to nothing done in the first year. And the little he did was reprehensible.

 

[Alpha One Seven]

Idiot. Because of why they chose not to watch. Your Great Reality TV Star is damn near unwatchable. It would be bad enough if he were only a bumbling idiot but nah, he's also a corrupt, traitorous, greedy, gluttonous, slovenly piece of shit. All that dick has left to "show" us worth watching is when he is removed or resigns. Back to the point, why people didn't watch is in fact more important than what his salivating masses thought of his speech. That you don't get that... well, why is it that you wish to make being a dumbass trendy? It's as dumb if not dumber than the Tide Pod challenge.

I doubt your bigoted, prejudiced opinion is important in any way.

 

[Alpha One Seven]

"That location" being "the United States." lol indeed.

I don't know anyone that was polled, do you? Yet I live in America, maybe it wasn't a nation wide poll of every man woman and child living there, suppose?

 

[jackstar7]

I doubt your bigoted, prejudiced opinion is important in any way.

Projection.

I don't know anyone that was polled, do you? Yet I live in America, maybe it wasn't a nation wide poll of every man woman and child living there, suppose?

Ignorance.

 

[Alpha One Seven]

Looks like I don't have to. I doubt my taxes will be lower and besides, I don't vote my pocket book, you do, though don't you? That's the Republican way. Me first, to hell with the rest of you. You couldn't give a shit if other people suffer. Hypocrisy is trump's long suit. If you go along with him, you are rubber stamping policy steeped in hypocrisy, it's as simple as that.

You call what the Republicans are doing as cutting government spending and cutting taxes? The tax cuts are for the wealthy and the deficit is expanding to pay for them and their lavish life styles. And Trump is golfing on YOUR dime, fella.

Well, I'm going to skip reading all your posts, you are obviously a hopeless case, at least presently unless some miracle happens and you come to your senses.

Actually it's what is best for the nation that matters to me. Why would a person care if someone else is getting something too if they are getting something, why the fuck would it matter at all, are you that envious of others?
"You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wife or his male servant or his female servant or his ox or his donkey or anything that belongs to your neighbor."