- Jun 10, 2004
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Most of you are making the mistake that there are many different groups with different viewpoints represented in your catch-all label of "Creationists"
On one extreme end are the highly-ridiculed kind that believe God created all the species as they are today, there is no evolution, Earth is 6000 years old type. They believe the Bible is the perfect original word of God, not written by human hands. They are rightly called narrow-minded and literalists.
*insert spectrum of variation here*
On the other hand you have the kind who believe God created the earth, some species, mechanisms for evolution, etc. The Bible was written by human hands and is a collection of authoritative documents, not an authoritative collection of documents. These people have no problem with science.
On one extreme end are the highly-ridiculed kind that believe God created all the species as they are today, there is no evolution, Earth is 6000 years old type. They believe the Bible is the perfect original word of God, not written by human hands. They are rightly called narrow-minded and literalists.
*insert spectrum of variation here*
On the other hand you have the kind who believe God created the earth, some species, mechanisms for evolution, etc. The Bible was written by human hands and is a collection of authoritative documents, not an authoritative collection of documents. These people have no problem with science.
again, a very superficial view on the nature of God
most serious evolutionists won't use such arguments because they know they're dishonest
GagHalfrunt
Lifer
- Apr 19, 2001
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my point is that it is a substantial enough issue that Stephen Jay Gould and others have pushed the 'hopeful monster' hypothesis to counter it
to say, 'well duh, macro is just a lot of micro' is missing some key points
certainly some argue for that, but the issue is far more complex than portrayed here
GagHalfrunt
Lifer
- Apr 19, 2001
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No, a completely rational, intelligent and historically accurate view on the nature of god. Gods have always been invented to cover mankinds ignorance and assuage his fears. That's how gods have changed over the years and how we've gone from mostly polytheist beliefs to mostly monotheist religions. At first mankind knew NOTHING. So there were gods of weather, gods of fertility, gods of agriculture, gods of war, gods of nature, gods of insects, gods of trees, gods of fire etc etc etc. Then science started coming up with answers. With fertilizer, proper irrigation and crop rotation it was easy to see how and why some crops succeeded and others failed, so the god of agriculture went *poof*. And science grew to where could predict weather and understand flooding, winds, blizzards, droughts, etc and the god of weather went *poof*. And medicine then was able to explain why some couples have 15 kids and others have none and the god of fertility had to go bye-bye too. And mankind harnessed fire, understood volcanoes, saw wildfires started by llightning and they axed the god of fire because they didn't need him either. And one by one the millions of invented gods disappeared in puffs of logic as mankind outgrew them. But there's always the one catch, death. That's the one area where science can't give an answer that people WANT TO HEAR. So like the old pagans that invented gods for whatever reason they needed one, the more modern societies invented their god to cover that one area. They want to live forever, so they made up a god that allows it. That's how religions evolve, that's how they are created, that's how they die. Men want answers, men don't have answers, men invent invisible magical men in the sky that can make whatever they want possible.
- Oct 10, 1999
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wow. just wow.
I know what each side believes.
Creationists = God made everything
Evolution = life forms change over the course of millions of years due to various factors like environment, mutation, etc...
Notice how evolution has nothing whatsoever to do with how life started.
- Oct 10, 1999
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you gotta love Creation Scientists. I have never seen people try so hard to bend science to fit into their religious beliefs.
Intelligent design is just stupid.
- Oct 10, 1999
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that's their positions
but do you understand their arguments?
what do creationists think of fossils? do you know?
what do evolutions think of the gap between micro and macro evolution?
Certainly some have believed that, just like some on this board believe that creationists ignore fossils.
But others have have held and do hold more sophisticated views on the nature of God, and to say that increasing our understanding of the universe somehow eliminates God is pure foolishness.
- Oct 10, 1999
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are you being serious?
I know all about Creationists views from a personal perspective. I have grown up since then.
I know way more about evolution than most people on this board. I have studied biology, chemistry, physics and genetics. Evolution is something I have been fascinated with since I was 14 years old. I won't get into a pissing contest about it either.
Suffice it to say, I support evolution and I will refrain from attacking Creationism, regardless of how ridiculous Creation Scientists arguments become.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hopeful_Monster
anyways, my point is not whether or not micro leads to macro, but that there is enough substance there to lead to a healthy debate
to simply say 'of course it does' ignores many problems
perhaps those problems can be overcome, but it is not as obvious as some here seem to think
- Aug 23, 2003
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It's a gap invented by creationists and rejected by mainstream science.
Nonetheless, when a scientist finds a gap, they try to fill that gap using the scientific method. When a creationist finds a gap, they fill that gap with God (at least until a real scientist comes along).
As I mentioned earlier, God is truly a "God of the gaps". Real scientists also realize that human scientific capability is constantly advancing, and that today's unsolvable mysteries will become clearer as time goes on. 2000 years ago, we didn't have electron microscopes, Hubble telescopes, or computers that could do billions of calculations per second. Who knows what advances in technology and science we'll have in another 100 years? All a creationist brings to the table is their "God of gaps", and no real science whatsoever.
Throughout human history, religion has continuously been discredited by science as human technology and scientific capability has advanced. Science has never been discredited by religion.
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