Work Visa Rejections Spike Under Trump.

[ch33zw1z]

It *is* about talent, and the lack thereof. Youre lying to yourself if you think otherwise.

I'd argue that it's not always. I've seen a few IT departments outsourced and those new contractors are pretty terrible. In my xp, the displaced U.S. workers are sorely missed. Management doesn't care, just turns the screws until the remaining employees quit.

It's always about money.

 

[blackangst1]

I'd argue that it's not always. I've seen a few IT departments outsourced and those new contractors are pretty terrible. In my xp, the displaced U.S. workers are sorely missed. Management doesn't care, just turns the screws until the remaining employees quit.

It's always about money.

Nothing is ever always.

 

[Jhhnn]

It *is* about talent, and the lack thereof. Youre lying to yourself if you think otherwise.

So, you're claiming the American People lack talent? That we're dumber than the ROTW?

 

[ch33zw1z]

Nothing is ever always.

It's always about money.

 

[blackangst1]

So, you're claiming the American People lack talent? That we're dumber than the ROTW?

No. Is that in today's job market when there's more jobs than unemployed finding talent is tough. You either already know this or are incredibly stupid.

 

[blackangst1]

It's always about money.

So the many large companies that have been bringing IT back to the States are doing so because of money?

 

[Jhhnn]

No. Is that in today's job market when there's more jobs than unemployed finding talent is tough. You either already know this or are incredibly stupid.

Which is a failure of our education system to nurture & train the talent we have. Let the ROTW slog their way thru that & we'll pluck the talent off the top.

 

[blackangst1]

Which is a failure of our education system to nurture & train the talent we have. Let the ROTW slog their way thru that & we'll pluck the talent off the top.

No, its a failure of those looking for a degree that is in demand, but instead working towards what they "feel" is right. Its not that our colleges dont teach the skills, its that not enough people are taking them. I know personal responsibility is hard thing for you, and you'd rather blame the gubment or skool but the truth is the truth.

edit: even low skilled work has a worker shortage. WalMart, for example, raised its average pay for truck drivers to $90,000...because there arent enough drivers. But, who the fuck wants to be a truck driver, right?

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

So the many large companies that have been bringing IT back to the States are doing so because of money?

Actually, yes, they are. If they could accomplish the same tasks with the lower amount of money - they would. NO fucking question. No argument here. That is capitalism in a nutshell. It's the same thing when you login to the interwebz and say "I want to buy Widget XYZ. How much does it cost on Amazon? Now how much does it cost on Walmart? Now how much does it cost on Wayfair? Okay, Amazon is the cheapest, thus I will buy it from them. Same product. Lower price."

The fact is - they can't get the same product for lower abroad. The talent is overall retarded. Plenty of morons here will try to say otherwise - I guarantee they simply haven't had to work with resources abroad... That, and they probably haven't called their tech support often enough to be frustrated each time.

Many companies are simply too incompetent to analyze the costs of IT - because IT is overall just a cash drain. The reality is that the reason WHY you invest heavily in IT is so that you don't have major breaches in your security - hence losing Intellectual property, and hence losing data, and hence getting horribly bad PR when you get major database breaches (Target, Equifax, etc...)

 

[blackangst1]

Actually, yes, they are. If they could accomplish the same tasks with the lower amount of money - they would.

The fact is - they can't. The talent abroad is overall retarded.

Many companies are simply too incompetent to analyize the costs of IT - because IT is overall just a cash drain. The reality is that the reason WHY you invest heavily in IT is so that you don't have major breaches in your security - hence losing Intellectual property, and hence losing data, and hence getting horribly bad PR when you get major database breaches (Target, Equifax, etc...)

Which proves my point. Its not JUST about money. Its about talent and what you get for that money. If money was sole reason as ch33zw1z said, they wouldnt consider that.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Which proves my point. Its not JUST about money. Its about talent and what you get for that money. If money was sole reason as ch33zw1z said, they wouldnt consider that.

Fair enough, I guess the way I interpret it is getting the same thing for the least amount of money. You're just simply stating that when you do a request for IT operations, it doesn't mean that they offer the same talent regardless of the price they offer.

As someone that works in consulting for heavy software implementations - Yeah, that's definitely the truth. When companies do proposals and they go with the lowest bidder, we already know it's going to be an epic failure. Roughly 1/3 of all software implementations fail.

 

[Jhhnn]

No, its a failure of those looking for a degree that is in demand, but instead working towards what they "feel" is right. Its not that our colleges dont teach the skills, its that not enough people are taking them. I know personal responsibility is hard thing for you, and you'd rather blame the gubment or skool but the truth is the truth.

edit: even low skilled work has a worker shortage. WalMart, for example, raised its average pay for truck drivers to $90,000...because there arent enough drivers. But, who the fuck wants to be a truck driver, right?

Oh, please. Lots of high school graduates are ill prepared to enter stem fields. Lots of people want to be truck drivers, too.

 

[blackangst1]

Oh, please. Lots of high school graduates are ill prepared to enter stem fields. Lots of people want to be truck drivers, too.

Obviously not enough to fill the positions. And no worthwhile job in STEM fields will take a high school graduate. Youre just being stupid.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

many of them are grad students and postdocs. they aren't "Stupid kids with no experience." I am sure that every single one of them is vastly smarter than you, in fact, and certainly provide far more benefit to society than you possibly ever could.

C'mon broceritops. I will at least respect you enough to not blast you with insults since you can manage to write half-decent replies unlike the majority of others here.

But you're absolutely in the wrong here. I work in the consulting world that revolves around this type of work. We literally have an office in Hyderabad. It's a Big 4 accounting firm - it really doesn't get anymore prestigious than that. Inyet the people I've worked with are (for the most part) some of the dumbest of the dumb I've ever worked with. There are exceptions - absolutely no doubt, I will admit that. And typically when that happens, the firm will work hard to actually get them a full Visa and push for them to get a green-card long term... So overall I can applaud the firm that I worked for.

Others? Absolutely not. Watch the PBS video to understand more of what I'm talking about. Companies like Accenture are just farms for indentured servitude to the core. They aren't the best and the brightest - nothing close in the slightest. I've had to work with them in projects, and it is a god damn nightmare how stupid they are.

so like I've said - I work in this realm. If you want to try to prove me otherwise that there is this vast sum of temporary doctors coming in, feel free to prove me otherwise.

 

[mindless1]

Can't say I agree with the concept of work visas. If these people are such a great talent, let them improve the quality of the country they wish to leave.

The rest of the world could be a great place to live if only people stood up for their own rights, in their own country instead of bailing.

I do recognize cases where people have to flee for their lives and do feel for them, but that is not the majority we're talking about.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Can't say I agree with the concept of work visas. If these people are such a great talent, let them improve the quality of the country they wish to leave.

The rest of the world could be a great place to live if only people stood up for their own rights, in their own country instead of bailing.

I do recognize cases where people have to flee for their lives and do feel for them, but that is not the majority we're talking about.

It's complicated because I see both sides.


One side: Leaving the talent where it is. Kinda hard for a 3rd world country to be a 1st world country when you take all their top talent. Simple fact.

Other side: If you want to improve your own country, it does make sense to bring in top talent from abroad.


HOWEVER, the H-1B visa program is neither of those. It is SPECIFICALLY for temporary work - NOT eventual citizenship. I would be much more in favor of it if it were for citizenship.

 

[theeedude]

Best and the brightest lol. Watch that PBS bit you halfwit. You fucking idiots keep making assertions over something that you have zero research or understanding of. I honestly hope you lose your job to an H-1B so you have half an ounce of understanding and compassion for actual Americans and actual immigrants. These aren't doctors, and they aren't qualified technicians with 10 years of experience. These are stupid kids straight out of college with 0 technical or industry knowledge.

You sit by the phone then, I am sure company recruiters will be calling you any time now, since their "stupid kid" H1B's have to leave, and you are so "qualified."

 

[Jhhnn]

Obviously not enough to fill the positions. And no worthwhile job in STEM fields will take a high school graduate. Youre just being stupid.

I apologize for being vague. I meant many high school graduates are ill prepared to engage in stem field studies in college.

It's complicated because I see both sides.


One side: Leaving the talent where it is. Kinda hard for a 3rd world country to be a 1st world country when you take all their top talent. Simple fact.

Other side: If you want to improve your own country, it does make sense to bring in top talent from abroad.


HOWEVER, the H-1B visa program is neither of those. It is SPECIFICALLY for temporary work - NOT eventual citizenship. I would be much more in favor of it if it were for citizenship.

Not quite true. H1B status provides a path to citizenship-

https://www.path2usa.com/h1b-to-green-card-process

The family in the OP was in that process until they were the recipient of the old random fuckover, an immigration specialty, particularly since Trump took over. There was no honest reason to do them like that.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Which proves my point. Its not JUST about money. Its about talent and what you get for that money. If money was sole reason as ch33zw1z said, they wouldnt consider that.

It's still about money. Even with your "proof", it comes down money. Like somehow willingness to pay more for a superior product isn't about money.

 

[theeedude]

If you got platonic lady friends who want to settle down but have a hard time finding a good guy, you might want to introduce them to some of these H1B engineers who have to leave in 180 days. They are usually educated, responsible, and good providers with six+ figure income potential and might be interested in getting married fairly quickly 🙂

 

[Puffnstuff]

Last month a pile of people at the company I was working for were let go....and many H1B visa workers were brought in to replace them so go figure.

 

[ch33zw1z]

If you got platonic lady friends who want to settle down but have a hard time finding a good guy, you might want to introduce them to some of these H1B engineers who have to leave in 180 days. They are usually educated, responsible, and good providers with six+ figure income potential and might be interested in getting married fairly quickly 🙂

Dunno about all that:

https://www.immi-usa.com/h1b-visa/h1b-visa-benefits/

3 year, max of 6
Bachelors required
And iirc, minimum 60k salary.

 

[Jhhnn]

I def understand resentment towards the H1B program. OTOH, it's no excuse for fucking over long term visa holders just because you can.

"So, uhh you've been here 8 years? Followed all the rules? Homeowner? Striving for permanent residence? Americanized daughter? Fuck You anyway. You're getting deported!"

Given that there's a numerical limit to such visas that will be filled, it just means that somebody new gets a visa. After somebody else gets fucked, of course. The fuckitty-fuck-fuck-fuck is what the Trump immigration plan is all about. Fuck 'em all, even Citizens who have a south Texas midwife birth certificate. Old Vietnamese refugees who've been here 40 years. Salvadoran refugees who've been here nearly 2 decades. Dreamers. Fuck their American families & dependents. Don't even mention the illegals & the migrants they'd rather turn into dog food.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I def understand resentment towards the H1B program. OTOH, it's no excuse for fucking over long term visa holders just because you can.

"So, uhh you've been here 8 years? Followed all the rules? Homeowner? Striving for permanent residence? Americanized daughter? Fuck You anyway. You're getting deported!"

Given that there's a numerical limit to such visas that will be filled, it just means that somebody new gets a visa. After somebody else gets fucked, of course. The fuckitty-fuck-fuck-fuck is what the Trump immigration plan is all about. Fuck 'em all, even Citizens who have a south Texas midwife birth certificate. Old Vietnamese refugees who've been here 40 years. Salvadoran refugees who've been here nearly 2 decades. Dreamers. Fuck their American families & dependents. Don't even mention the illegals & the migrants they'd rather turn into dog food.

I totally understand. And myself (like MANY conservatives here and all over the US) are for LEGAL immigration. We are for LEGAL immigration of bringing talented folks here FULLTIME.

We are NOT in favor of a work visa that often times does not lead to citizenship that is often used to displace AMERICAN WORKERS with HIGHER PAY, that eventually lead to OUTSOURCING of the entire department. I'm serious when I say listen to that PBS documentary - while they may bring people in on an H-1B visa, they then train their consulting practice back at home in India. That doesn't sound like a win.

It sounds like reduced pay in the US - which means less tax revenue - AND converting an entire department to offshore.

Again, I work for a similar consulting firm. We have a Hyderabad office full of folks whose sole job is to do American work remotely for pennies on the dollar. You can bring them here and do a round of applause for paying taxes, etc... for a temporary amount of months but what about when they convert an entire department to an India department a year later?


Don't cherry pick long-term H-1B holders though, we know what the problem is as an overall whole. If someone is a long-term H-1B holder I am also in full favor of legalizing them as a citizen - and even moreso - legally ensuring that they are not bound by their employers through endentured servitude.

 

[Jhhnn]

I totally understand. And myself (like MANY conservatives here and all over the US) are for LEGAL immigration. We are for LEGAL immigration of bringing talented folks here FULLTIME.

We are NOT in favor of a work visa that often times does not lead to citizenship that is often used to displace AMERICAN WORKERS with HIGHER PAY, that eventually lead to OUTSOURCING of the entire department. I'm serious when I say listen to that PBS documentary - while they may bring people in on an H-1B visa, they then train their consulting practice back at home in India. That doesn't sound like a win.

It sounds like reduced pay in the US - which means less tax revenue - AND converting an entire department to offshore.

Again, I work for a similar consulting firm. We have a Hyderabad office full of folks whose sole job is to do American work remotely for pennies on the dollar. You can bring them here and do a round of applause for paying taxes, etc... for a temporary amount of months but what about when they convert an entire department to an india department a year later?

Fucking over the family in the OP won't change any of that. It's not what they're doing, either. Immigration just opened a slot for somebody who might.