Woodward/Costa book: Worried Trump could 'go rogue,' Milley took top-secret action to protect nuclear weapons

[Meghan54]

ill repeat. IT WAS NOT THE JOB OF THE JOINT CHIEF OF STAFF TO CALL THE CHINESE ON ANYTHING. especially if for some stupid reason we were going to attack the Chinese. how can you possibly defend a general doing such a thing? it is mind-boggling.

Then you have no experience with the upper chain of command in the military, if I read this right, correct? Sure sounds like it.

Hint: It happens way more than you envision.

 

[cytg111]

I was under the impression that is how the cold war functioned, officials talking to each other via backchannels to keep the balance, not rocking the boat more than it could handle.

 

[trenchfoot]

Well it seems the undercurrent for prosecuting Milley is actually one of defending Trump and definitely not one of defending the nation against the rash acts, real and very probable of a desperate panicked man-child willing to do anything to keep himself protected from prosecution by illegally keeping himself in office.

I'm sure it crossed Milley's mind of the threshold he was stepping over and yet he was more than willing to face the real and actual threat Trump was to the nation in his panicked self-preservation state of mind and had to stay ahead of what was a real and present danger to the nation: a rogue deranged president who proved beyond doubt that he couldn't be relied upon to peacefully hand over the presidency to his successor thus exposing himself to all manner of legal peril upon leaving the shelter his position gave him.

 

[JEDIYoda]

I think Milley’s actions are genuinely problematic as if they happened as described it undermines civilian control of the military.

My issue is that criticism ignores the fact that a criminal psychopath just attempted a coup. When you get into coup territory the rules go out the window because coups are inherently extralegal measures.

yOU ALL CAN LAUGH ALL YOU WANT.....but Civilians do not control the military!! It is only said to appease the pacifists of this country......think about....lolol

 

[NWRMidnight]

I dont come here much anymore because it is a liberal pool of shit and no matter what the democrats do you lackeys will defend them tooth and nail. what Milley did was treason and serious dereliction of duty. He is the real face of a coup, he took the civilian control of the military away from the government, he bypassed the chain of command and called the fucking Chinese and said if we attack you ill call you because we are buds. wtf?

Trump was not going to start a war with China, no president can just wake up and say "hey let's nuke somebody today" and launch missiles. there are procedures and safeguards in place that prevent that. The president is the last decision maker to launch nukes not the first.

Milley and every officer who was a part of this have to be removed from their position and investigated. The man is a threat to our country and the constitution.

WE just had 4 years of Trump as many members in congress turned a blind eye to his corruption and illegal actions. We just had an attempted coup/insurrection by Trump and his lackeys, to over turn a legal election, which had police, service members, and congress member's involved, as well as over 150 congress member's supporting the big lie. So tell us again that Trump couldn't have woke up one morning and decide to nuke China.. He's been at war with the US and the constitution since he took office.

 

[Muse]

Wasn't this known before Woodward's book release? I heard stuff months ago. Pelosi was worried about it publicly and I think I heard about back door general contacting China with assurances back then as well... IIRC. Prominently, like on network news broadcasts.

 

[woolfe9998]

Simple question. Assuming everything in the book is accurate, what laws, if any, did Milley break here?

I read what Vindman said. He didn't talk about broken laws. He talked about broken norms.

In an extreme situation where you're concerned about democracy being overthrown and even the possibility of a nuclear war, it seems to me that people in a position to prevent such things from happening ought to break norms if necessary. They should probably breaks laws too, if the situation is dire enough to warrant it, but in that case, they still have to be punished or the rule or law is out.

But norms? Come on. Look at the situation we were in.

 

[NWRMidnight]

Simple question. Assuming everything in the book is accurate, what laws, if any, did Milley break here?

I read what Vindman said. He didn't talk about broken laws. He talked about broken norms.

In an extreme situation where you're concerned about democracy being overthrown and even the possibility of a nuclear war, it seems to me that people in a position to prevent such things from happening ought to break norms if necessary. They should probably breaks laws too, if the situation is dire enough to warrant it, but in that case, they still have to be punished or the rule or law is out.

But norms? Come on. Look at the situation we were in.

If the Republican's played by the rules and followed the norms, we wouldn't be here talking about this, as Trump would have never been elected. If he was still elected (people and their star struck voting for tv personalities) he would have been sent packing at the first impeachment trial. But rules/norms/what's right is not in the Republican vocabulary, which is why they have an issue with what Miley did.

 

[woolfe9998]

If the Republican's played by the rules and followed the norms, we wouldn't be here talking about this, as Trump would have never been elected. If he was still elected (people and their star struck voting for tv personalities) he would have been sent packing at the first impeachment trial. But rules/norms/what's right is not in the Republican vocabulary, which is why they have an issue with what Miley did.

Yep, absolutely. Trump broke every norm in the book while POTUS, and likely many laws as well, in order to break democracy. I think we can give a pass to Milley for breaking a few right at the end to prevent that from happening.

 

[PlanetJosh]

He did the right thing to protect America from a mentally unstable commander in chief. So what if Trump's tax policies made money for me and many others in the stock market. I admitted that on this forum over two years ago. Economics and stock market performance is a different endeavor in this situation.

Edit: The situation in this thread topic deals with national defense, And it's good to have a sane general to help in that regard. I've said before I personally may hope for a global war because humanity deserves it but that's just me. And not to forget if some think I'm the insane one for saying that well let me take it further:

The overall bad behavior as in evil of the human race in all countries is a more important issue than a U.S./China war. And the bad behavior may justifiably trigger a global nuclear war which will end most life with radiation poisoning and partly from the blasts. I'll simply be an observer to it if it happens in my lifetime.

 

[MrSquished]

If I was Biden I'd give Milley the fucking Medal of Honor. Though after Trump giving it to the filth that was Rush Limbaugh the award is forever tainted, but maybe it will bring some integrity back to the Medal itself, until the next MAGAT that becomes president destroys everything again.

 

[PlanetJosh]

At the Sept 28 hearing I hope the general implies or says Trump was behaving in an unstable manner. The Republicans can then waste their energy with backlash to it. Within two week after it something else will replace it as a leading news item.

 

[IronWing]

Trump has behaved in an unstable manner his entire adult life.

 

[Jhhnn]

Since when does the US military engage in an act of war w/o Congressional approval? If Milley wanted to reassure his Chinese counterparts that it wouldn't happen that way, good for him. And if Milley wanted the Chinese to know, then he could have just refused & exposed the plot in the Media.

 

[woolfe9998]

LOL that Paul Ryan at some point decided that Trump had "narcissistic personality disorder" and spent weeks studying the disorder so that he could get a handle on how to deal with him.

Analysis: Paul Ryan was convinced Donald Trump had narcissistic personality disorder

Paul Ryan knew that he had a problem. Donald Trump had been elected president and now Ryan, as the Republican Speaker of the House, had to find ways to work with him -- despite the two men's totally opposite approaches to life and politics.

www.cnn.com

I thought Ryan was supposed to be some kind of genius. My clear recollection is that practically everyone not a hardcore supporter of his was saying it by early 2016 at the latest.

 

[MrSquished]

LOL that Paul Ryan at some point decided that Trump had "narcissistic personality disorder" and spent weeks studying the disorder so that he could get a handle on how to deal with him.

Analysis: Paul Ryan was convinced Donald Trump had narcissistic personality disorder

Paul Ryan knew that he had a problem. Donald Trump had been elected president and now Ryan, as the Republican Speaker of the House, had to find ways to work with him -- despite the two men's totally opposite approaches to life and politics.

www.cnn.com

I thought Ryan was supposed to be some kind of genius. My clear recollection is that practically everyone not a hardcore supporter of his was saying it by early 2016 at the latest.

So basically Paul Ryan was like, how do I study and utilize this insane schtick to implement horrific policies like the piece of shit I already am, but haven't quit figured out how to pull off being a gigantic piece of shit so openly yet

 

[ch33zw1z]

So basically Paul Ryan was like, how do I study and utilize this insane schtick to implement horrific policies like the piece of shit I already am, but haven't quit figured out how to pull off being a gigantic piece of shit so openly yet

Umm, yes, he and Moscow Mitch did exactly that.

 

[Puffnstuff]

You have to read the book to get the proper context of what Milley said and did which is what good leaders do in times of crisis.

 

[VRAMdemon]

Miley did the right thing. If he did the completely legal thing is something I’ll leave to others to decide. Again, the entire nuclear-launch system and who can lawfully do what in regard to it needs to be gone over and more clearly laid out.

The main thing and the wonder of it all is the speed with which a supposedly mainstream respectable political party voted in and embraced as their leader an obvious venal, scandalous, repellant, infantile swamp-creature. Given that they did, it’s not a surprise that they would move on to cynically attempting to vilify Milley, who clearly was not acting for personal gain, but for the good and safety of the country.

Here's the kind of dumb moronic shit Milley and his colleagues had to deal with on a day to day basis

Trump was fixated on the Navy's new supercarrier and ranted to military leaders that the ship 'just doesn't look right': book

"I have an eye for aesthetics," President Donald Trump said while ruffling his hair, according to Woodward and Costa's new book. "Can't you tell?"

www.businessinsider.com

Trump was fixated on the first-in-class aircraft carrier Gerald R. Ford and regularly expressed dissatisfaction with the ship’s high cost of more than $13 billion, the weapons elevators, the catapults, and the placement of the flight command center, known as the ship’s “island,” on the flight deck.

“The generals and admirals were horrible businessmen, Trump complained repeatedly, and particularly terrible at acquisition and deal making on ships, ensuring the military was always being ripped off,”

In one meeting with military leaders, Trump was said to have reminded them that he had been in the construction business. “I know about elevators,” he told them, the book said. “If water gets on them,” elevators on the ship could malfunction,

He was particularly upset about the placement of the ship’s island. “It doesn’t look right. I have an eye for aesthetics,” the president was said to have told Gen. Mark Milley, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, at a dinner.

The common theme of each and every anecdote in each and EVERY book about Trump: The Man is a fucking moron. I seem to see a pattern here. Sometimes they change it up a little with “the man is a greedy moron” or “the man is an indecent and immoral moron” or “the man is a startlingly irresponsible moron” …but the overall theme remains the same.

 

[HomerJS]

From what I've read the last few days the President does have sole authority to launch a nuke. He doesn't do it with a single button push. There are many people involved in the decision including the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs. Anyone in the group could say to POTUS don't launch a nuke but he could ignore them and do it anyway.

Milley did nothing more then ensure people followed that protocol.

 

[dillhole]

Recap of the Milley stuff...

- US intel report on 10/30/20 indicated China thought Trump, in a desperate bid to win reelection, would manufacture a crisis, use it as justification to attack them, and paint himself as some sort of savior figure
- Milley was "certain" Trump was increasingly manic and living in his own alternate reality
- Milley didn't believe Trump wanted war, but was willing to launch military strikes (see: Iran, Yemen, Syria)
- Milley was concerned China would pull a Pearl Harbor and referenced their increasing aggression (e.g. public reveal of their hypersonic missile, saying they'd blow up Taiwan if necessary, the Chinese navy playing chicken with US ships in the South China Sea)
- After 1/6 (which Milley believed was a "planned, coordinated, synchronized" coup), Milley was further concerned Trump was going to attempt to seize power in his own "Reichstag moment"
- Milley said only one person in the US - the president - could order the use of nuclear weapons, but several (other) people would have to work in tandem to launch them
- In 1974, then-Defense Secretary James Schlesinger sent an edict out to military leaders, telling them to contact him and his JCS chairman before acting upon any orders coming directly from Nixon. Schlesinger and the chairman feared Nixon, also increasingly desperate in the final days of his term, might bypass the chain of command and independently order military officers or units to launch an attack. Seeing the obvious parallels, Milley convened a meeting with military top brass and essentially pulled his own "Schlesinger" - he told them that any calls for military action and/or use of nuclear weapons was to follow procedure. That is, Milley was to be directly involved, and any orders would be discussed in a mandatory conference call involving himself and the defense secretary (among others) before any action was to be taken
- Milley believed Trump was "unstable" and had "engaged in a treasonous violation of his oath." His actions might be construed as him usurping power for himself, but he believed his actions were made in "good faith precaution" to maintain democracy as well as prevent a "great powers war" (which he believed was his "central mission" as JCS chairman)

-----

Some of this stuff would be hilarious if it weren't for the fact that we're dealing with the leader of the fuckin' free world. Saying the USN was led by a bunch of "horrible businessmen" who sucked at "deal making on big ships" and always got "ripped off"; bitching about the elevators on the newest USN carrier, saying "I was in the construction business. I know about elevators. If water gets on them, they could malfunction"; whinging about the placement of the carrier's island ("It doesn't look right. I have an eye for aesthetics").

Or Bill Barr borderline infantilizing him, saying he pulled 2016 off because he "behaved [himself] for about one month" after the "grab 'em by the pussy" tape and telling him that the "main problem [for 2020] is you think you're a fucking genius, politically. You think you're a genius and so you're not going to listen to anybody. You think you know what they want. And I think you're wrong."

 

[iRONic]

More book quotes.

Bill Barr to Trump: ‘No one gives a sh*t about your grievances’

“In my opinion, this is not a base election. Your base is critical, and you’ll get it out,” Barr told Trump during a tense Oval Office meeting, according to the book. “And there are a lot of people out there, independents and Republicans in the suburbs of the critical states that think you’re an a**hole. They think you act like an a**hole and you got to, you got to start taking that into account.”

 

[kage69]

A great way to sum this up.

 

[imported_tajmahal]

This has to do with how much you can trust Gen. Milley.

U.S. Drone Killed 10 Afghans, Including Aid Worker & 7 Kids, After Water Jugs Were Mistaken as Bombs

We speak with reporter Matthieu Aikins about how his investigation for The New York Times found an August 29 U.S. drone strike, which the Pentagon claimed targeted a facilitator with the militant group ISIS-K, actually killed 10 Afghan civilians, including seven children and Zemari Ahmadi, an...

www.democracynow.org

"GEN. MARK MILLEY: We know that there were secondary explosions. Because there were secondary explosions, there is a reasonable conclusion to be made that there was explosives in that vehicle. The third thing is, we know from a variety of other means that at least one of those people that were killed was an ISIS facilitator. So, were there others killed? Yes, there are others killed. Who they are, we don’t know. We’ll try to sort through all that. But we believe that the procedures, at this point — I don’t want to influence the outcome of an investigation — but, at this point, we think that the procedures were correctly followed and it was a righteous strike. "


A righteous strike on an aid worker and 7 children.


Foam on hypocrites, foam on.

 

[NWRMidnight]

This has to do with how much you can trust Gen. Milley.

U.S. Drone Killed 10 Afghans, Including Aid Worker & 7 Kids, After Water Jugs Were Mistaken as Bombs

We speak with reporter Matthieu Aikins about how his investigation for The New York Times found an August 29 U.S. drone strike, which the Pentagon claimed targeted a facilitator with the militant group ISIS-K, actually killed 10 Afghan civilians, including seven children and Zemari Ahmadi, an...

www.democracynow.org

"GEN. MARK MILLEY: We know that there were secondary explosions. Because there were secondary explosions, there is a reasonable conclusion to be made that there was explosives in that vehicle. The third thing is, we know from a variety of other means that at least one of those people that were killed was an ISIS facilitator. So, were there others killed? Yes, there are others killed. Who they are, we don’t know. We’ll try to sort through all that. But we believe that the procedures, at this point — I don’t want to influence the outcome of an investigation — but, at this point, we think that the procedures were correctly followed and it was a righteous strike. "


A righteous strike on an aid worker and 7 children.


Foam on hypocrites, foam on.

Did you even comprehend what he said there, which was on Sept 1, (2 1/2 weeks ago)? What's changed since then? Has what he said taken place, you know sorting thru it all and allowing the investigation to take place without him influencing it? Has he denied anything we have learned, after they sorted thru it all, and the investigation he didn't want to influence has taking place? Per the norm, you jumped on your bullshit, "I'm a dumbass", manipulation cycle and started peddling down the street. And you wonder why you have zero credibility.