Why is an "Assault Weapons" Ban even on the table?

Discussion in 'Politics and News' started by schneiderguy, Dec 20, 2012.

  1. StinkyPinky

    StinkyPinky Diamond Member

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    Yeah, that's a totally unbiased site :thumbsdown:

    Why not just quote directly from the NRA and be done with it.

    Meawnhile, with real facts

     
  2. Cerb

    Cerb Elite Member

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    Nor yours. How do you create a causal correlation between the firearms and the deaths?

    I already linked this in another thread, but it's an awfully good read on the subject:
    http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/orgs/jlpp/Vol30_No2_KatesMauseronline.pdf

    Socio-economic factors significantly affect crime. There just is not any cause and effect, when it comes to firearms, except that non-suicidal career criminals prefer non-confrontational crimes in the presence of an armed population. There is not substantial causal correlation. Not pro-gun, not anti-gun.

    Gun control is a nice red herring, but that's mostly what it is. In the absence of guns, we wouldn't need them (the U.K., FI, which had little in the way of guns and gun crime, prior to gun control).

    In their abundance, I'd prefer law-abiding citizens to be armed v. not. That is the U.S.' situation: outlaw guns, and outlaws will have easier access to them than regular folks, which would only serve to leave regular folks more vulnerable. If you want to get rid of them, you're 300 years too late. The best you can do is be selective about what ones law-abiding citizens can get their hands on.
     
    #152 Cerb, Dec 22, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2012
  3. RampantAndroid

    RampantAndroid Diamond Member

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    I found those stats. They don't include robberies, vandalism, assault, rape and so forth. Rape is interesting in the UK - it's trending downwards in the US, and upwards in the UK.

    The whole picture: you're either not looking for it, or avoiding it.
     
  4. TallBill

    TallBill Lifer

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    http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/United-Kingdom/United-States/Crime

    Like I said (in my corrected post) the murder rates by percentage between the UK and US have stayed the same when compared to each other for a long long time. But violent crimes in general in the UK have had a huge spike.
     
  5. Farmer

    Farmer Diamond Member

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  6. TallBill

    TallBill Lifer

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  7. xj0hnx

    xj0hnx Diamond Member

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  8. Brigandier

    Brigandier Diamond Member

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    Good commentary. I, however disagree with parts of his opinion on the "gun culture."

    Gun culture, as it promotes a safe and educational environment is great. That is not, however, the gun culture that we have. Our gun culture glorifies the gun as a tool of death and to an extent, vengeance and justice. People can be downright scary with guns, even so called "experienced" shooters. I rarely shoot with anyone but a select group of friends and family for that reason. Fingers left on triggers, weapons swinging around without thought, etc.

    To me, we really do need to change how guns are portrayed in our media. Show some stupid training montage, drop lines reiterating proper gun safety, etc.
     
  9. davmat787

    davmat787 Diamond Member

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    Interesting piece, thanks for passing it along. From the article:

     
  10. xj0hnx

    xj0hnx Diamond Member

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    No, it's not, that's just the image that the ignorant anti-gun zealots want it to have. The ignorant, and the fools are not our gun culture.
     
  11. ericlp

    ericlp Diamond Member

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    I'll take a shotgun over any stupid assault riffle so let the ban begin... I could care less...

    Now if they wanted to take me shotgun than I might have some issues with that.
     
  12. TallBill

    TallBill Lifer

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    Once this ban doesn't work because it won't... what's next? I wouldn't personally use an AR15 to defend my current residence because there are plenty of other units around mine.
     
  13. Firebot

    Firebot Golden Member

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    The fact that you are using stats from the 1920's of all things to try and make a point about gun control is hillarious in itself.
     
  14. TallBill

    TallBill Lifer

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    Erm, obviously these are handpicked numbers, but the point is that Canada has always had lower murder rates compared to ours. Gun registration started in canada in 1934 so it isn't crazy to go beyond that as a baseline.
     
  15. Gerle

    Gerle Senior member

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    Who are your stalkers? Most anyone I know can hit what they aim for at 500 m. All day, every day.
     
  16. OverVolt

    OverVolt Lifer

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    And rape is double!!! Hooray!!!

    As is assault doubled, hooray!!!

    Guns are an equalizer. Girls, and the elderly can defend themselves.

    Besides the UK is an island (literally) in the middle of no-murders-Europe. Different countries are different. Considering the rate of incarceration in the USA I'm surprised we don't have more murders related to arrests and whatnot.

    We have municipalities that try to ban guns and the murder rate skyrockets. Because everywhere else has guns and it just makes it a defenseless victim mecca.

    The USA is much, much larger and has hotzones of crime. The UK is a tiny little island.
     
  17. Farmer

    Farmer Diamond Member

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    Meanwhile, with totally cherry picked statistics. If you want to trade a 14% lower homicide rate for 100% higher violent crime rates, please move out of my country (or maybe you're a Canadian, in that case please stay in Canada).

    Regardless of how you like sugar coating this, the UK is the most dangerous, crime-infested nation in western Europe, and they achieved this amazing status by practically disarming the entire populace and putting a government surveillance camera on every corner.

    But, obviously, the UK should the a role model for the US.
     
    #167 Farmer, Dec 23, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2012
  18. *kjm

    *kjm Platinum Member

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    She lost almost everything she had and you come back and post that BS.... I put 8yrs into the military for my country and its beliefs and now expect them to be upheld and not regulated by a bunch of self serving non educated people. Half the people calling for this have never loaded a gun, shot a gun, reloaded a shell or taken any training at all.
     
  19. TallBill

    TallBill Lifer

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    People that I know who are anti gun are not only completely uneducated but largely unwilling to even listen.
     
  20. *kjm

    *kjm Platinum Member

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    Same.....
     
  21. Farmer

    Farmer Diamond Member

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  22. MooseNSquirrel

    MooseNSquirrel Golden Member

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    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_hoc_ergo_propter_hoc
     
  23. Tom

    Tom Lifer

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    Owning a gun increases the chances of dying by homicide or suicide. Pretty simple.

    Are you willing to listen ?

    http://aje.oxfordjournals.org/content/160/10/929.full
     
  24. BladeVenom

    BladeVenom Lifer

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    Owning a pool increases the risk of drowning. Should we ban pools?
     
  25. Tom

    Tom Lifer

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    First of all you're quite likely wrong. People who own pools probably are better swimmers and are less likely to drown.

    Here's the point about the gun statistics. There are people who think owning a gun makes them safer.

    The statistics show that isn't the case. Having a gun around significantly increases the chances a person will die by suicide or homicide.

    If guns made people safer that wouldn't be true.