What Daesh (ISIL/ISIS/IS) Really Wants (source: The Atlantic)

[blastingcap]

For the writer to say that those criminals are following Islam/prophet guide is a huge insult to us, as we have the proof from Quran, Hadith and the prophet's history against them and their believes.

I wonder, have you guys ever heard about one Hadith (prophet say) that state "For whom would kill a Muaa'hid (non-Muslim while being safely staying among them), he wouldn't smell the heaven, even it could be smelled from a 40-years walking distance", Narrated by Bukhari.
(من قتل نفسا معاهدا لم يرح رائحة الجنة, وإن ريحها ليوجد من مسيرة أربعين عام&#1575.

Every time a Muslim does something awful, the common refrain is that they "aren't Muslims." Yet would you agree that as long as they follow the five pillars of Islam, they are Muslims? Maybe not very good Muslims but technically still Muslims. There are some dark passages in the Quran and in hadiths and even in the sunnah, some of the things Muhammad did. Is it that difficult to at least accept that what used to be enlightened 1400 years ago (slavery, treatment of women, etc.) is perhaps not as enlightened today? Is it possible that Daesh really are genuine Muslims... born 1400 years too late?

The problem with citing hadiths in isolation is that they vary and contradict each other. You have some peaceful sounding ones and then others that aren't. You know which ones I'm talking about--I don't need to post them here.

 

[Abwx]

Thoses armed groups are a creation of the CIA, it seems that there are not enough of them, hence the decision by the US to train 5000+ more such mercenaries in Turkey...

https://translate.google.fr/transla...quiper-des-rebelles-syriens_4578429_3218.html

So it s clear, the US is THE sponsor of terrorism, along with the Saudi of course, the article doesnt state it but its likely that the money is coming from this kingdom, for the record the Saudis freed any inmate that would agree to go fight in Syria, that is , they sent their criminals, rapers, arsonists and any deviant performing terrorism in Syria..

 

[blastingcap]

Thoses armed groups are a creation of the CIA, it seems that there are not enough of them, hence the decision by the US to train 5000+ more such mercenaries in Turkey...

https://translate.google.fr/transla...quiper-des-rebelles-syriens_4578429_3218.html

So it s clear, the US is THE sponsor of terrorism, along with the Saudi of course, the article doesnt state it but its likely that the money is coming from this kingdom, for the record the Saudis freed any inmate that would agree to go fight in Syria, that is , they sent their criminals, rapers, arsonists and any deviant performing terrorism in Syria..

Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, etc. did most of the sponsoring. The CIA's involvement was pathetically small: http://www.wsj.com/articles/covert-cia-mission-to-arm-syrian-rebels-goes-awry-1422329582

"Some weapons shipments were so small that commanders had to ration ammunition. One of the U.S.’s favorite trusted commanders got the equivalent of 16 bullets a month per fighter. Rebel leaders were told they had to hand over old antitank missile launchers to get new ones—and couldn’t get shells for captured tanks. When they appealed last summer for ammo to battle fighters linked to al Qaeda, the U.S. said no."

"Officials defend the decision to keep the arms pipeline small and tightly controlled, citing concerns that weapons could fall into the wrong hands."

 

[Fern]

Jesus didn't teach to ignore the old testament.

Christ, he actually said: ""Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

The bold portion is your answer.

One could also quote him telling the mob that sought to enforce the Old Testament rule " let him without sin cast the first stone" (or however it actually goes).

Which is why it's very unlikely you'll find a New Testament without an Old Testament coming directly before it.

Uhh, no. They are extremely common.

Fern

 

[Fern]

I read European news sites (mostly British) and similar articles cite publications by ISIS as proof. Just saw one such article today and the name of the ISIS publication was mentioned. If I have time and get motivated maybe I can find that article and link it. Nobody should hold their breath though.

Fern

OK, I got motivated:

A key window into understanding ISIS is its English language "in-flight magazine" Dabiq. Last week the seventh issue of Dabiq was released, and a close reading of it helps explains ISIS' world view.

So, the name of ISIS publication I was referring to is "Dabiq".

http://www.cnn.com/2015/02/16/opinion/bergen-isis-enemies/index.html

Fern

 

[Victorian Gray]

No.

But when you stop defending, and standing up for ISIS, we'll stop calling you a sympathizer / supporter.

Show me one post where I have 'defended' or 'stood up for' Daesh.

Given that I despise those shits that will be an awfully long search for you.

 

[Victorian Gray]

Do you agree that Islam needs a reformation like Christianity had?

Which one? There are almost too many to count.

But, I take your point. I don't think it's a case of "need a reformation" so much as it is that reformations are a part of the evolution of (any) religion.

 

[schmuckley]

Which one? There are almost too many to count.

But, I take your point. I don't think it's a case of "need a reformation" so much as it is that reformations are a part of the evolution of (any) religion.

I have to give you +1 for persistence in the face of fail.
Seriously.
Doubling,even tripling down..
Have you even read the article yet? Because last time I checked..If you had;you did not comprehend it;or did not read it.
I'm thinking you didn't and just spout nonsense,personally.

 

[Fern]

While I have sympathy for your situation Omar, the label "Muslim" is not a label that you can claim ownership of. It is fed by all the people who claim to belong to it, including the people of ISIS. This is much the same as the label "Christian". There are many distinct large groups of Christians that represent differing beliefs yet in broad categories they are all lumped into one.
-snip-

Yes. And I find it particularly annoying when Obama and others refer to the Spanish/Italian Inquisitions as a "Christian thing".

It was a Catholic thing. Protestants (and others), who are Christian, were also persecuted in the Inquisitions.

Fern

 

[schmuckley]

Yes. And I find it particularly annoying when Obama and others refer to the Spanish/Italian Inquisitions as a "Christian thing".

It was a Catholic thing. Protestants (and others), who are Christian, were also persecuted in the Inquisitions.

Fern

Good point, Mr.Fern.
Why was Martin Luther burned at the stake?
Oh yeah,because he made sure the common man could have The Bible..
The Catholic church didn't like that very much..
And if Mr. Victorian Gray cares to debate The Reformation..Now you're talkin' buddy!

 

[blastingcap]

Much talk, little in the way of concrete proposals so far; will a summit really change anything?: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-31528528

 

[MongGrel]

Good point, Mr.Fern.
Why was Martin Luther burned at the stake?
Oh yeah,because he made sure the common man could have The Bible..
The Catholic church didn't like that very much..
And if Mr. Victorian Gray cares to debate The Reformation..Now you're talkin' buddy!

Burned at the stake ?

Figuratively, I guess.

 

[DCal430]

Islam is no different than the other Abrahamic faiths, all a plague on humanity. Whose followers are diseased and spread destruction where ever they go. The day we cleanse the world of this plague, the better we will be.

 

[DCal430]

Omar what you are doing is no different than the Christians who deny Hitler was Christian, and those Nazi running the gas chambers where Christians.

Truth is ISIS is what Islam is all about, and the Nazi where the most faithful of Christians.

This is why we must rid the world of this plague.

 

[Abwx]

Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, etc. did most of the sponsoring. The CIA's involvement was pathetically small: http://www.wsj.com/articles/covert-cia-mission-to-arm-syrian-rebels-goes-awry-1422329582

"Some weapons shipments were so small that commanders had to ration ammunition. One of the U.S.’s favorite trusted commanders got the equivalent of 16 bullets a month per fighter. Rebel leaders were told they had to hand over old antitank missile launchers to get new ones—and couldn’t get shells for captured tanks. When they appealed last summer for ammo to battle fighters linked to al Qaeda, the U.S. said no."

"Officials defend the decision to keep the arms pipeline small and tightly controlled, citing concerns that weapons could fall into the wrong hands."

You dont get that thoses countries are US protectorates and that they would do nothing if not expressely given permission by the US wich use them as convenient proxies, not that it s only the US, there s other western countries involved but they are also no more than protectorates.

 

[Ns1]

You dont get that thoses countries are US protectorates and that they would do nothing if not expressely given permission by the US wich use them as convenient proxies, not that it s only the US, there s other western countries involved but they are also no more than protectorates.

lol

 

[blastingcap]

You dont get that thoses countries are US protectorates and that they would do nothing if not expressely given permission by the US wich use them as convenient proxies, not that it s only the US, there s other western countries involved but they are also no more than protectorates.

Please provide citations for your allegations that those are not sovereign nations but are instead "protectorates" of the USA. I especially want to hear about how Turkey is a protectorate given how antagonistic and uncooperative they've been.

This ought to be good.

 

[Blanky]

Truth is ISIS is what Islam is all about, and the Nazi where the most faithful of Christians.

Honestly where do you people come up with this shit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_of_Adolf_Hitler

Goebbels wrote in 1941 that Hitler "hates Christianity, because it has crippled all that is noble in humanity."[7] Many historians have come to the conclusion that Hitler's long term aim was the eradication of Christianity in Germany

 

[Victorian Gray]

Good point, Mr.Fern.
Why was Martin Luther burned at the stake?
Oh yeah,because he made sure the common man could have The Bible..
The Catholic church didn't like that very much..
And if Mr. Victorian Gray cares to debate The Reformation..Now you're talkin' buddy!

Luther was burned at the stake? ROFLMAO!

Willfully ignorant not only about Islam but also your own religion. Priceless.

 

[thraashman]

Luther was burned at the stake? ROFLMAO!

Willfully ignorant not only about Islam but also your own religion. Priceless.

I think ignorant would be the kindest thing you could call schmuckley.

 

[Abwx]

Please provide citations for your allegations that those are not sovereign nations but are instead "protectorates" of the USA. I especially want to hear about how Turkey is a protectorate given how antagonistic and uncooperative they've been.

This ought to be good.

Also all NATO members are protectorates, you think that Germany or Japan are really sovereign nations.?.

Thay are still held by WW2 victors rules, FYI there s no peace treaty that has been signed between Germany and the US, Russia and England, thoses three latter countries have the legal right to invade Germany without ultimatum if they feel that their security is threatened, only France signed a peace treaty with Germany in 1962 under the rules of German Chancellor Konrad Adenauer and French president De Gaulle.

As for Turkey, they are hard to deal with for the US but ultimately thoses latter will always prevail on geostrategical issues of importance, they let the protectorates rule on the details while they are ruling the global things.

 

[schmuckley]

Burned at the stake ?

Figuratively, I guess.

oops..That was his friend.

 

[Victorian Gray]

oops..That was his friend.

Which friend was that?

 

[schmuckley]

Which friend was that?

His main influence;John Huss.

He could not have been a friend because he died before Luther was born..

I know you're looking to pounce on Minutia..
after your self-ownage.

 

[Victorian Gray]

His main influence;John Huss.

He could not have been a friend because he died before Luther was born..

I know you're looking to pounce on Minutia..
after your self-ownage.

So you continue to get *everything* wrong. Is it the American education system?