What car should I buy?

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Feb 25, 2011
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Someone does. Let's see if that happens.


Yup - and automatic. I looked at the Mazdas, and they all looked too cramped. I was trying to avoid the 'everyone gets an Accord or Camry' thing. Several possibilities were mentioned such as Chrysler 300 and similar.

Yeah, except the 300 is basically a Camry, but worse.

Everybody gets an Accord/Camry because they are really good cars.

If you're reliant on your vehicle for daily-driver use, get an appliance and buy a "fun" car with disposable income, if you have any.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
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Does anyone enjoy driving a Camry though? As I recall if I drive a Lexus 430 (SC or LS), there's some enjoyment. Though the LS felt like an aircraft carrier.
 
Feb 25, 2011
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Does anyone enjoy driving a Camry though? As I recall if I drive a Lexus 430 (SC or LS), there's some enjoyment. Though the LS felt like an aircraft carrier.
Sure, why not? Everybody's looking for something different.

When you say "enjoy" what are you talking about?

Plenty of Crown Vic enthusiasts actually view "aircraft carrier" as a positive.
 

PricklyPete

Lifer
Sep 17, 2002
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Sure, why not? Everybody's looking for something different.

When you say "enjoy" what are you talking about?

Plenty of Crown Vic enthusiasts actually view "aircraft carrier" as a positive.

Exactly, my sister and her husband thoroughly enjoy driving their 4Runner. I loved our 4Runner for many reasons...but certainly did not enjoy driving it.

My Dad loves driving his Avalon. He wants something smooth and comfortable...and the Avalon does exactly that. I hate the driving position, suspension on the floaty side, and the steering vague.

I love driving my BMW...but someone who drives a Lotus would say my car is boring with crappy steering. Someone who drives a Buick would say my car is too taut and seats too narrow.

Plenty of people enjoy driving their Camry. Just depends on what you like in how a car drives.

OP, you seem to be all over the place. Saying things feel too big, then stating others feel too small. I think you need to just go out and actually drive a bunch of cars.
 

Torn Mind

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Nov 25, 2012
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Toyotas are not perfect vehicles, but they are very good at delivering the basics consistently for the first 100-140k of vehicles like the Camry or Corolla before the "renewal" of the vehicle is required, provided that maintenance is performed. By renewal, I mean replacing wear items such as struts, the starter, alternator, etc. My mom owned a Matrix for the past ten years, and at least against Maryland winters, Toyota's supplier metallurgy is rather good. While some bolts be might seized, the hammer, wrench, and penetrating oil will break most of them free. The brake rotors are very reslient and it would be madness to replace them at all unless they are worn below minimum thickness. Most servicing can be done with an assortment of 8,10, 12, and 14mm tools and screwdrivers, with maybe an impact driver for the fragile bolts.

Performing work by yourself on a Toyota is usually not too bad either, and there is a large of amount of resources to show how things are done.

As a general rule across practically all cars, the inline 4 engine is less of a pain than a V-engine when it comes to replacing spark plugs or accessing things obstructed by the engine.

Luxury European might not necessarily be hard to maintain, but the parts are still priced like luxury items. If the part also happens to be difficult to install, you're gonna be paying luxury labor rates to a mechanic to get that stuff fixed. You can check the price of aftermarket parts for whatever vehicle you're interested on RockAuto, and then weed out the "ultra cheap" economy lines and look at the "OEM supplier" brand or similar "Pro" level parts to get an idea of what money you'll need to fork over for various parts.

Chryslers are troublesome vehicles, generally speaking and repairs can be convoluted as well.

Generally speaking, once a vehicle approaches 100k, there are some maintenence items goes beyond just "change the oil'. Spark plugs might need to be changed, coolant might need a change. Once it approaches 140k, suspension parts might warrant a replacement or random problems of varying degrees might start cropping up. Could things be a motor mount, leaking radiator, starter failure, alternator failure, etc.
 

snoopy7548

Diamond Member
Jan 1, 2005
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Someone does. Let's see if that happens.


Yup - and automatic. I looked at the Mazdas, and they all looked too cramped. I was trying to avoid the 'everyone gets an Accord or Camry' thing. Several possibilities were mentioned such as Chrysler 300 and similar.

Looks can be deceiving. The Mazda 6 has nearly the same driver's interior dimensions as the Chrysler 300, only being smaller in shoulder room by <2.5".

Should we add "really fast" to your want-list? Seems like the cars you keep mentioning are >250hp.

I've just thought of the perfect car for you! How about a Subaru WRX?

Or a Subaru Legacy?
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
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Looks can be deceiving. The Mazda 6 has nearly the same driver's interior dimensions as the Chrysler 300, only being smaller in shoulder room by <2.5".

Should we add "really fast" to your want-list? Seems like the cars you keep mentioning are >250hp.

I've just thought of the perfect car for you! How about a Subaru WRX?

Or a Subaru Legacy?

I'll take another look. No, I don't need/want really fast - I just don't want 'underpowered' either. V6 is typically fine. Quiet is good.
 

Yuriman

Diamond Member
Jun 25, 2004
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Where do you draw the line of "underpowered" ? A Toyota Prius is faster than most cars made before maybe 1995. There aren't very many cars on the road that are slow in an absolute sense, the bar has just been moved up over time.
 
Feb 25, 2011
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I'll take another look. No, I don't need/want really fast - I just don't want 'underpowered' either. V6 is typically fine. Quiet is good.

You might want to reconsider that position. I-4 engines are producing pretty crazy HP numbers these days.

As a for instance: the 4-cylinder in a Honda CR-V puts out 185hp, which is on par with common V6 engines. And it's not even turbocharged.

IMO they are louder, though.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
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Where do you draw the line of "underpowered" ? A Toyota Prius is faster than most cars made before maybe 1995. There aren't very many cars on the road that are slow in an absolute sense, the bar has just been moved up over time.

Fair point. I don't think I've done a test drive in quite a few years, and the only ones I remember feeling were underpowered were four cylinder.

So it was just a general statement without any specific example. I've seen some reviews critical of cars as underpowered, with quite long 0-60.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
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Sat in a few more today. Miata and Fiat 124 too small for comfort. Mazda 6 it turns out is 'ok' as are Toyotas (Camry, Avalon). Main thing is they feel just a little less than spacey - mostly modern cars seem to put the left door into where your leg wants to go - but 'not bad'. They had a used 2017 Avalon where the woman returned it after 200 miles and 3 weeks because it's too low, for $5,000 off new.
 

Topweasel

Diamond Member
Oct 19, 2000
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Sat in a few more today. Miata and Fiat 124 too small for comfort. Mazda 6 it turns out is 'ok' as are Toyotas (Camry, Avalon). Main thing is they feel just a little less than spacey - mostly modern cars seem to put the left door into where your leg wants to go - but 'not bad'. They had a used 2017 Avalon where the woman returned it after 200 miles and 3 weeks because it's too low, for $5,000 off new.

How about something like a CPO SHO? Large comfy ride, decent power, maybe not the easiest thing to work on but it's parts in tons of things including F150's so work on it should still be pretty cheap.
 
Feb 25, 2011
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Thanks. I guess the CPO SHO is the current Taurus? Have to agree alexmckay.
Yes; current Taurus. Very nice looking cars, IMO, but I've never driven one myself.

Do NOT get a former cab or cop car, though.

The problem with buying a used "performance"-ey car is that it was very likely driven in a "spirited" manner. Which one has to do carefully, lest one break things. (And even the careful drivers might not keep up an accelerated maintenance schedule to match their driving.) So you have to be picky, or you'll get a car that's beat to crap. This applies to anything "sporty".

That goes double for former cabs and "Police Interceptors." They are DEFINITELY driven aggressively, and they are DEFINITELY only getting minimum acceptable maintenance.
 

XavierMace

Diamond Member
Apr 20, 2013
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The problem with buying a used "performance"-ey car is that it was very likely driven in a "spirited" manner. Which one has to do carefully, lest one break things. (And even the careful drivers might not keep up an accelerated maintenance schedule to match their driving.) So you have to be picky, or you'll get a car that's beat to crap. This applies to anything "sporty".

That's quite a bit of a generalization and exaggeration. Yes, you can certainly find a car that's been beat to crap and not maintained, but you can find that in any car. A bit of spirited driving isn't going to break a reasonably designed car. It's more about the owner and some cars attract a different group of owners than others.
 
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That's quite a bit of a generalization and exaggeration. Yes, you can certainly find a car that's been beat to crap and not maintained, but you can find that in any car. A bit of spirited driving isn't going to break a reasonably designed car. It's more about the owner and some cars attract a different group of owners than others.

That's my point.

I'm not even saying it's fair or necessary - you want to be careful regardless - but I'd be more on edge about buying a used Mustang than a used Sienna. I guess I'm just a bad person.
 

XavierMace

Diamond Member
Apr 20, 2013
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That's my point.

I'm not even saying it's fair or necessary - you want to be careful regardless - but I'd be more on edge about buying a used Mustang than a used Sienna. I guess I'm just a bad person.

But I don't think you understood my point. Mustang's in general attract a certain crowd as does most of the import stuff. Despite being faster, a CTS-V or M5 usually doesn't attract that crowd. I'd be less concerned with a CTS-V or Corvette than a Mazdaspeed 3/6, Maxima, Altima, or G35/G37. Why? Because their price alone generally dictates an older owner who's more likely to take care of the car. Or at least beat on it less. That doesn't mean not to do your due diligence. You can get 1st Gen CTS-V's (2004, 400hp LS1) for $12k around here. A 2007 Mustang GT (300hp) is around $16k. The CTS-V would smoke it. But it doesn't really appeal to the same market.
 
Feb 25, 2011
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But I don't think you understood my point. Mustang's in general attract a certain crowd as does most of the import stuff. Despite being faster, a CTS-V or M5 usually doesn't attract that crowd. I'd be less concerned with a CTS-V or Corvette than a Mazdaspeed 3/6, Maxima, Altima, or G35/G37. Why? Because their price alone generally dictates an older owner who's more likely to take care of the car. Or at least beat on it less. That doesn't mean not to do your due diligence. You can get 1st Gen CTS-V's (2004, 400hp LS1) for $12k around here. A 2007 Mustang GT (300hp) is around $16k. The CTS-V would smoke it. But it doesn't really appeal to the same market.

Hmmm... perhaps. My "car guy" friends in high school were driving around Crown Vics and Impalas, drooling over the Mercury Marauder, etc. The CTS-V would have been right up their alley.

Then there were the S-10 guys. I guess you can hoon around in anything.

So I may just have a skewed perspective.
 

XavierMace

Diamond Member
Apr 20, 2013
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How long ago was that?

I don't say that to be mean. When I was in high school there was maybe 1 Crown Vic for every 20 Civic's, Eclipse's, or Integra's. Even if looks/performance wise the CTS-V was up their alley, it would have been out of their price range.
 
Feb 25, 2011
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How long ago was that?

I don't say that to be mean. When I was in high school there was maybe 1 Crown Vic for every 20 Civic's, Eclipse's, or Integra's. Even if looks/performance wise the CTS-V was up their alley, it would have been out of their price range.

'90s.

It was Michigan, before the first Fast and Furious movies dropped. Imports didn't get a lot of "traction."

So yeah, I may be "kids these days"-ing.