US killed Uday, Qusay to cover up past dealings

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
They had a chance to surrender - They didn't.
One was found still alive and incapacitated - helpless, but alive.
A burst of gunfire through the mouth into the brain was more convenient than waiting for medical assistance.

*yawn, stretch
Black helicopters, trilateral comission, Bush Nazi

Amazing how much vietnam f*ed you up. I'm sad for you...

 

[Burke55]

***K em,,, kill em.. all let allah sort the bastards out. If there are any good ones he will throw them back!

Uhrah ..Strength and Honor


Remember 9/11

 

[flavio]

Originally posted by: Burke55
***K em,,, kill em.. all let allah sort the bastards out. If there are any good ones he will throw them back!

...and hopefully the same for you and whoever raised you.

 

[elzmaddy]

This thread disgusts me :frown:

 

[CaptnKirk]

Those who never truly had do deal with combat, support service, logistics, etc
are too quick to want to kill anyone and anything that dosen't agree with thier macho psyche.
Insensitive c'boys who don't really have the guts to face reality.

Question - why does anyone get the impression that 'Nam messed me up ?
Because I'm not so 'Gung-Ho' that I want to run in to where people have been wounded and are dying
and shoot them in the mouth per 'Standard Procedure' to execute them in the field ?
If that is a 'Standard Policy' - it's dead wrong, not legal per International Law or Geneva Conventions.
Maybe it was looked upon as a 'Mercy Killing', but I doubt it. Battlefield Execution - that's what it was.

I learned more from my time in that country that you have obviously learned here in your sheltered lifetime.

 

[etech]

Originally posted by: etech

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
They had a chance to surrender - They didn't.
One was found still alive and incapacitated - helpless, but alive.
A burst of gunfire through the mouth into the brain was more convenient than waiting for medical assistance.

Where did you get the information that he was incapacitated?

I repeat, where did you get that information. Did you just make it up to make your little story sound better and the US military look worse?

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: etech
I repeat, where did you get that information. Did you just make it up to make your little story sound better and the US military look worse?

From Time.com - Hot on Saddam's Trail

In the meantime the U.S. needed another day to study aerial reconnaissance photographs of the neighborhood, cordon it off and get Task Force 20 in place. The savagery of the fight that followed matched the way the brothers had led their lives. Armed with little more than AK-47s, the brothers, Qusay's son Mustafa and a bodyguard repulsed U.S. assault troops four times before the order came to fire an anti-tank missile into each window of the house. According to a commander with the 101st Airborne Division, Uday was still alive when a Delta Force commando stormed the bathroom where the brothers had barricaded themselves. Following Delta Force's standard procedure, the soldier immediately pumped two bullets into Uday's mouth, to ensure his death. The resulting injuries prompted speculation that Uday had committed suicide. Mustafa, 14, was the last to fall, firing from under a bed until he was shot dead.

 

[etech]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey

Originally posted by: etech
I repeat, where did you get that information. Did you just make it up to make your little story sound better and the US military look worse?

From Time.com - Hot on Saddam's Trail

In the meantime the U.S. needed another day to study aerial reconnaissance photographs of the neighborhood, cordon it off and get Task Force 20 in place. The savagery of the fight that followed matched the way the brothers had led their lives. Armed with little more than AK-47s, the brothers, Qusay's son Mustafa and a bodyguard repulsed U.S. assault troops four times before the order came to fire an anti-tank missile into each window of the house. According to a commander with the 101st Airborne Division, Uday was still alive when a Delta Force commando stormed the bathroom where the brothers had barricaded themselves. Following Delta Force's standard procedure, the soldier immediately pumped two bullets into Uday's mouth, to ensure his death. The resulting injuries prompted speculation that Uday had committed suicide. Mustafa, 14, was the last to fall, firing from under a bed until he was shot dead.

I'm wondering where kirk found that information that one of them was incapacitated.

 

[LunarRay]

I assumed he was incapacitated too from the report of all the injuries he had but, he could have still posed a threat, I suppose. Your point is well taken.

 

[alchemize]

Kirk has no sources, he pulled it out of his ass, or off the internet somewhere. Same difference.

 

[DealMonkey]

Hmmm, well I suppose if someone could walk up to you and place the barrel of their gun in your mouth, you're probably incapacitated. You don't think so?

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
They had a chance to surrender - They didn't.
One was found still alive and incapacitated - helpless, but alive.
A burst of gunfire through the mouth into the brain was more convenient than waiting for medical assistance.

*yawn, stretch
Black helicopters, trilateral comission, Bush Nazi

Amazing how much vietnam f*ed you up. I'm sad for you...

If what Capn indicates is true (incapacitated) I too find it immoral to just "finish" them off. This opinion comes from basic human feeling (as I see it) I don't think growing up in Brooklyn or Manhatten was much worse than Vietnam... given I'm a coward in either venue. It is just plain wrong from the arm chair I occupy..

 

[UltraQuiet]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Hmmm, well I suppose if someone could walk up to you and place the barrel of their gun in your mouth, you're probably incapacitated. You don't think so?

I seriously doubt anyone from TF 20 allows themselves to get within arm's reach of anyone who might be hostile.

 

[etech]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Hmmm, well I suppose if someone could walk up to you and place the barrel of their gun in your mouth, you're probably incapacitated. You don't think so?

No I don't. As noted above you don't calmly walk over and place the barrel of you gun in the mouth of someone who a few seconds ago was trying to kill you. It's very possible that they would take that oppurtunity to pull the pin on a grenade.

Try not to suppose so much. It's making you look rather foolish.

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: etech

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Hmmm, well I suppose if someone could walk up to you and place the barrel of their gun in your mouth, you're probably incapacitated. You don't think so?

No I don't. As noted above you don't calmly walk over and place the barrel of you gun in the mouth of someone who a few seconds ago was trying to kill you. It's very possible that they would take that oppurtunity to pull the pin on a grenade.

Try not to suppose so much. It's making you look rather foolish.

So, why would they walk over and do so if they were in such danger? Or are you suggesting that the account is wrong?

 

[flavio]

Originally posted by: etech

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Hmmm, well I suppose if someone could walk up to you and place the barrel of their gun in your mouth, you're probably incapacitated. You don't think so?

No I don't. As noted above you don't calmly walk over and place the barrel of you gun in the mouth of someone who a few seconds ago was trying to kill you. It's very possible that they would take that oppurtunity to pull the pin on a grenade.

Try not to suppose so much. It's making you look rather foolish.

You seem to be making a few foolish assumptions there yourself.

 

[UltraQuiet]

Originally posted by: flavio

Originally posted by: etech

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Hmmm, well I suppose if someone could walk up to you and place the barrel of their gun in your mouth, you're probably incapacitated. You don't think so?

No I don't. As noted above you don't calmly walk over and place the barrel of you gun in the mouth of someone who a few seconds ago was trying to kill you. It's very possible that they would take that oppurtunity to pull the pin on a grenade.

Try not to suppose so much. It's making you look rather foolish.

You seem to be making a few foolish assumptions there yourself.

I seriously doubt etech is making any "foolish assumptions". He was in the military, combat arms if I recall. He is making assumptions but they are deeply rooted in both training and experience. Who are you to say he is making "foolish assumptions"? What exactly is your base of knowledge in this area where you could label etech's post as you did? I'll go ahead and make an assumption here, one that is based on having to suffer through a majority of your 5000+ posts. You're talking out your ass. Again. In your usual flame bait, trolling, adding nothing to the discussion manner. Why don't you add something pertinent to the topic or STFU.

 

[etech]

Originally posted by: flavio

Originally posted by: etech

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Hmmm, well I suppose if someone could walk up to you and place the barrel of their gun in your mouth, you're probably incapacitated. You don't think so?

No I don't. As noted above you don't calmly walk over and place the barrel of you gun in the mouth of someone who a few seconds ago was trying to kill you. It's very possible that they would take that oppurtunity to pull the pin on a grenade.

Try not to suppose so much. It's making you look rather foolish.

You seem to be making a few foolish assumptions there yourself.

Ok, I'll play your silly little game. Exactly what are the "few foolish assumptions" that you think I made.

C'mon, you wanted to start this, so follow through. Explain yourself completely if you can.

Ultra Quiet
Not quite combat arms. FTG in the Navy. Stood many a security watch carrying a .45 and qualifed with it and the M-14 but I do not claim in any way to be combat arms qualified.

My post was based on common sense. If you are in a combat situation and suddenly come into a room you take out the opposition as quickly and efficiently as possible. In this case there was still firing coming from the area. You don't leave someone alive to shoot you or your buddy as you deal with another threat.

 

[flavio]

Originally posted by: Ultra Quiet

Originally posted by: flavio

Originally posted by: etech

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Hmmm, well I suppose if someone could walk up to you and place the barrel of their gun in your mouth, you're probably incapacitated. You don't think so?

No I don't. As noted above you don't calmly walk over and place the barrel of you gun in the mouth of someone who a few seconds ago was trying to kill you. It's very possible that they would take that oppurtunity to pull the pin on a grenade.

Try not to suppose so much. It's making you look rather foolish.

You seem to be making a few foolish assumptions there yourself.

I seriously doubt etech is making any "foolish assumptions". He was in the military, combat arms if I recall. He is making assumptions but they are deeply rooted in both training and experience. Who are you to say he is making "foolish assumptions"? What exactly is your base of knowledge in this area where you could label etech's post as you did? I'll go ahead and make an assumption here, one that is based on having to suffer through a majority of your 5000+ posts. You're talking out your ass. Again. In your usual flame bait, trolling, adding nothing to the discussion manner. Why don't you add something pertinent to the topic or STFU.

Interesting, since you're wrong about etech apparently your talking out of your ass yet again. As usual you have added nothing to the thread but pathetic insults and absolutely nothing relevant.

etech accused dealmonket of "supposing" too much, and then made his own assumption which had no roots in the facts of this particular scenario...very hypocritical.

 

[etech]

Originally posted by: flavio

Originally posted by: Ultra Quiet

Originally posted by: flavio

Originally posted by: etech

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Hmmm, well I suppose if someone could walk up to you and place the barrel of their gun in your mouth, you're probably incapacitated. You don't think so?

No I don't. As noted above you don't calmly walk over and place the barrel of you gun in the mouth of someone who a few seconds ago was trying to kill you. It's very possible that they would take that oppurtunity to pull the pin on a grenade.

Try not to suppose so much. It's making you look rather foolish.

You seem to be making a few foolish assumptions there yourself.

I seriously doubt etech is making any "foolish assumptions". He was in the military, combat arms if I recall. He is making assumptions but they are deeply rooted in both training and experience. Who are you to say he is making "foolish assumptions"? What exactly is your base of knowledge in this area where you could label etech's post as you did? I'll go ahead and make an assumption here, one that is based on having to suffer through a majority of your 5000+ posts. You're talking out your ass. Again. In your usual flame bait, trolling, adding nothing to the discussion manner. Why don't you add something pertinent to the topic or STFU.

Interesting, since you're wrong about etech apparently your talking out of your ass yet again. As usual you have added nothing to the thread but pathetic insults and absolutely nothing relevant.

etech accused dealmonket of "supposing" too much, and then made his own assumption which had no roots in the facts of this particular scenario...very hypocritical.

Would you like to detail the "assumptions" that I made. Please list each one.

Wow we are at it UQ was correct. I was in the military, he qualified what he thought he remembered my specialty as. You are making yourself look like an ass by misquoting and doing exactly what you are accusing him of.

Would you like to say what your military background is?

 

[Moonbeam]

Anybody an eye witness to the killings will make some assumptions.

 

[flavio]

Originally posted by: etech

Originally posted by: flavio

Originally posted by: Ultra Quiet

Originally posted by: flavio

Originally posted by: etech

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Hmmm, well I suppose if someone could walk up to you and place the barrel of their gun in your mouth, you're probably incapacitated. You don't think so?

No I don't. As noted above you don't calmly walk over and place the barrel of you gun in the mouth of someone who a few seconds ago was trying to kill you. It's very possible that they would take that oppurtunity to pull the pin on a grenade.

Try not to suppose so much. It's making you look rather foolish.

You seem to be making a few foolish assumptions there yourself.

I seriously doubt etech is making any "foolish assumptions". He was in the military, combat arms if I recall. He is making assumptions but they are deeply rooted in both training and experience. Who are you to say he is making "foolish assumptions"? What exactly is your base of knowledge in this area where you could label etech's post as you did? I'll go ahead and make an assumption here, one that is based on having to suffer through a majority of your 5000+ posts. You're talking out your ass. Again. In your usual flame bait, trolling, adding nothing to the discussion manner. Why don't you add something pertinent to the topic or STFU.

Interesting, since you're wrong about etech apparently your talking out of your ass yet again. As usual you have added nothing to the thread but pathetic insults and absolutely nothing relevant.

etech accused dealmonket of "supposing" too much, and then made his own assumption which had no roots in the facts of this particular scenario...very hypocritical.

Would you like to detail the "assumptions" that I made. Please list each one.

Wow we are at it UQ was correct. I was in the military, he qualified what he thought he remembered my specialty as. You are making yourself look like an ass by misquoting and doing exactly what you are accusing him of.

Would you like to say what your military background is?

Would you like to detail the "misquotes" I made. Please list each one.

UQ was incorrect, but yes when he starts this crap I do what he does.

Your assumption "you don't calmly walk over and place the barrel of you gun in the mouth of someone who a few seconds ago was trying to kill you". YOU may not others might.

...and if there is evidence that he was incapacitated when he was "finished off" then it should certainly qualify as a tremendous blunder.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: LunarRay

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
They had a chance to surrender - They didn't.
One was found still alive and incapacitated - helpless, but alive.
A burst of gunfire through the mouth into the brain was more convenient than waiting for medical assistance.

*yawn, stretch
Black helicopters, trilateral comission, Bush Nazi

Amazing how much vietnam f*ed you up. I'm sad for you...

If what Capn indicates is true (incapacitated) I too find it immoral to just "finish" them off. This opinion comes from basic human feeling (as I see it) I don't think growing up in Brooklyn or Manhatten was much worse than Vietnam... given I'm a coward in either venue. It is just plain wrong from the arm chair I occupy..

It would be plain wrong, IF THERE WAS A F*CKING SHRED OF EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT IT. Kirk just throws crap out there, then wanders away and giggles. Not even worth discussing.

 

[LunarRay]

The folks in the operation followed the SOP for this situation. No argument. It is sad that they could not have been captured somehow instead.

Difference between me and the folks doing this operation is pulse rate... mine would be about 180 their's probably near 130 or less. They were under control, I'd have blasted everything and anything... but then I'd have been scared to death..

 

[etech]

Would you like to detail the "misquotes" I made. Please list each one.

UQ was incorrect, but yes when he starts this crap I do what he does.

Your assumption "you don't calmly walk over and place the barrel of you gun in the mouth of someone who a few seconds ago was trying to kill you". YOU may not others might.

...and if there is evidence that he was incapacitated when he was "finished off" then it should certainly qualify as a tremendous blunder.

Ok, I'll make one more assumption based on your post.

You don't have a fvcking clue about the military, their training or how soliders would feel in a combat situation.

You would be correct in assuming that I don't have first hand experience either. I am basing my information from friends who have been there including a former Navy Seal.

LunarRay, based on what my friends have told me you would be wrong about their pulse rate. The pucker factor is always high in a firefight. You have no idea what little surprises they may have prepared for you.