[UPDATED 3/2!!!] Getting counteroffer'd to DEATH...

[rh71]

I don't really see this as being different than having a clingy gf with issues... you want to help her but in the end she was just a gf and you'd be MUCH HAPPIER without her in your life. Move on.

 

[gsellis]

Originally posted by: jbourne77

Originally posted by: gsellis
BTW, the correct order is a) find a new job, b) quit

That's the procedure I followed.

Phuh.... I thought so, but reading the first part of the thread, I was doubting my memory.

Your new job wins. You can 'contract' to your old place if they need extra time. $150/hr off hours. $200 on the weekend.

Edit - you might get the statisfaction of knowing that you quitting might actually fix what is broken at the old job. There is about a 20% chance.

 

[sygyzy]

I am not sure how to really interpret or gauge the type of worker you are but based on your post alone, I would not think too favorably. You speak very highly of yourself and consider yourself an integral part to the success of the company. That makes me think either you really are that good, or your company is extremely incompetent and cannot attract talent. I am inclined to think the latter, especially since you noted that half of your co-workers should "go to hell."

I don't have much respect for people who play the "threaten to quit, and get counter offers" game. And guess what - neither do companies. I read a statistic last year that said something like 75% of people who accept counteroffers and stay, leave within 6 months. Like others have said, you will forever be considered unloyal though you probably already are since you admitted to quitting THREE times on the same person.

I know you keep repeating that you made it very clear you are leaving, but I think your words and your actions aren't exactly the same. Where is the debate here? Stand by your word and quit. Don't be rude about it, just leave. If you wanted change, you should have made it clear and since you claim you did and they haven't fixed it, you leave. End of story.

The only reason I can think of that these people are so called "begging" you to stay is that the alternative of finding and training a replacement is less attractive. If you do stay, I guarantee they'll be looking for someone to take over if, nay *when*, you quit for the FOURTH time.

Edited: I meant to say "aren't the same."

 

[FoBoT]

Originally posted by: jbourne77
HOWEVER, he has asked me to give him an additional week (three week's notice)... I told him I'd do everything in my power to make that happen, but I can't guarantee it since I've already committed to starting my new position Monday, March 12th, not Monday, March 19th.

don't do it

you feel that tickle in your throat?

that is SARS , you HAVE SARS!!! you can't go back to that HELL HOLE even one more day

tomorrow morning you call him and tell him you are sorry, but you have THE SARS and can't come to work and to have a nice life

 

[iroast]

Originally posted by: jbourne77
Well, I just got out of his office... must have been the 4th or 5th discussion in all of this... it's a done deal: he has accepted my resignation.

HOWEVER, he has asked me to give him an additional week (three week's notice)... I told him I'd do everything in my power to make that happen, but I can't guarantee it since I've already committed to starting my new position Monday, March 12th, not Monday, March 19th.

I'll talk to him Friday and say I tried my best, but I'm not saying a word to my future boss. I'm all about doing all I can to help, but I'm not throwing my new job on the sword of sacrifice before I've even started there. I've offered my services to my current boss on a consulting basis (nights, weekends) once I've left, and he's free to take advantage of that if he truly needs more time out of me.

Originally posted by: gsellis
BTW, the correct order is a) find a new job, b) quit

That's the procedure I followed.

Congrats.

 

[HomeBrewerDude]

Originally posted by: jbourne77
Well, I just got out of his office... must have been the 4th or 5th discussion in all of this... it's a done deal: he has accepted my resignation.

HOWEVER, he has asked me to give him an additional week (three week's notice)... I told him I'd do everything in my power to make that happen, but I can't guarantee it since I've already committed to starting my new position Monday, March 12th, not Monday, March 19th.

I'll talk to him Friday and say I tried my best, but I'm not saying a word to my future boss. I'm all about doing all I can to help, but I'm not throwing my new job on the sword of sacrifice before I've even started there. I've offered my services to my current boss on a consulting basis (nights, weekends) once I've left, and he's free to take advantage of that if he truly needs more time out of me.

Originally posted by: gsellis
BTW, the correct order is a) find a new job, b) quit

That's the procedure I followed.

:thumbsup: good, though you made a slight tactical error agreeing to the extension even though I know you're not going to consider it. You old bosses really need to get a grip.

 

[aidanjm]

sounds like you might be happier if you chose to move on.

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: sygyzy
I am not sure how to really interpret or gauge the type of worker you are but based on your post alone, I would not think too favorably. You speak very highly of yourself and consider yourself an integral part to the success of the company. That makes me think either you really are that good, or your company is extremely incompetent and cannot attract talent. I am inclined to think the latter, especially since you noted that half of your co-workers should "go to hell."

On an Internet forum where you don't know me, why should I beat around the bush? Surely in a professional environment where appearances are half the battle, I would not be so frank... but I can't make my point here if I'm not totally forthcoming with total strangers such as yourself. I am an integral part of the company and I have a an excellent work ethic. My work pulled in the bulk of our revenue in 2006. Had I not been here, that revenue would not exist. That's simply a fact. I've been doing this too long to care about giving myself "warm fuzzies". All forms of flattery wore thin on me long ago.

Half the coworkers that should "go to hell" are people who are no-talent backstabbing nitwits who were grandfathered into their current positions, and I assure you that the majority of them will be laid off come this Friday.

I may sound egotistical to you, but you need to put my intent on this forum in the proper perspective. I'm not here to blow smoke up your ass and be all modest... I'm here to paint an accurate picture so you don't have to trudge through sugarcoated bullshit to make heads or tails of the situation.

 

[spidey07]

You gave two weeks. You've already figured out it isn't about the money if you are unhappy/burntout. You gave two weeks.

You're done there. As long as you can maintain good professional relationships and contact with them you're golden. Who knows, 5 years from now one of these guys might be somewhere else and call you up for a VP position. That's when your negotiating skills will come in handy.

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: HomeBrewerDude
you made a slight tactical error agreeing to the extension even though I know you're not going to consider it. You old bosses really need to get a grip.

Yeah, he really caught me off guard with that... I guess the way he sees it is that he spent three days trying to retain me... three days where neither of us were even remotely productive. I assume he's bitter about that time investment and he now wants it back in the form of an extended resignation notice.

Honestly, I'm rather worn down at this point and I wanted nothing more than to simply get back to my desk and get some work done. Come Friday, going to him to say "sorry, they said no" will feel like a walk in the park compared to Monday, Tuesday and today.

I've told him several times that I will consult after hours and on weekends, and I will reiterate that again when I reaffirm my last day as March 9th. If it's truly critical that he gets another 40 hours out of me, he is more than welcome to get them through my consulting firm.

 

[Phokus]

If you're going to do consulting for your old boss, get that in writing. You don't want to get screwed.

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: Phokus
If you're going to do consulting for your old boss, get that in writing. You don't want to get screwed.

I'm pretty close to the owner of a firm here in town (they're not the ones who placed me though), and I owe them a solid. What I'll do is go through them since I'm not Inc'ed or LLC'ed. They get some bucks and my ass is covered.

 

[PClark99]

I made the mistake of taking a counter offer once.

3 months later I was employee of the quarter,

6 months later I was laid off.

GTF outta there now.

 

[sixone]

Sounds like the most difficult part is over, I hope. Good luck!!

 

[postmortemIA]

Originally posted by: PClark99
I made the mistake of taking a counter offer once.

3 months later I was employee of the quarter,

6 months later I was laid off.

GTF outta there now.

That sound like when you start to date new girl, old one seems interested, just to screw your happiness.

 

[kranky]

You already know the answer but I'll throw this in anyway...It's time to go.

Is there any point to elaborating?

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: kranky
You already know the answer but I'll throw this in anyway...It's time to go.

Is there any point to elaborating?

Nope. In fact, here's how I came to my final conclusion yesterday:

[Boss], we've been going round and round on this for three days. But you know what? I came in here Monday morning, resigned, and respectfully requested that my decision be honored. I had no desire to entertain a counteroffer and I tried to make that as clear as possible. But for the last three days, I've spent the majority of my time in your office and in [President]'s office getting tag teamed. Even by mid-Tuesday, I was still firm in my decision, but at some point along the way, you managed to get me to second guess myself, and that's when I lost my ability to reason or further defend my position.

So here's how I see it: I'm really tired and I couldn't add two-and-two right now, but I DO know that I went into this past weekend 110% confident in my decision, and I went into your office Monday morning 110% confident in my decision. I may not be able to articulate my reasons at this moment in time, but I have to be confident enough in myself to know that if they were good enough Friday, good enough Monday, and good enough yesterday, then they're good enough today.

So my decision stands, and I ask of you - just as I did Monday - that you respect my decision and allow me to focus on transfer of knowledge to [most qualified subordinate].

His response:

Well I really find it unfortunate that you are choosing this other "opportunity" [intense sarcasm] over our relationship. I'm going to ask that you give me an extra week; I think it's only fair.

I was flabbergasted by the request, but I had enough yesterday... I'm fully prepared to head that off today.

 

[SmoochyTX]

Originally posted by: jbourne77

Originally posted by: kranky
You already know the answer but I'll throw this in anyway...It's time to go.

Is there any point to elaborating?

Nope. In fact, here's how I came to my final conclusion yesterday:

[Boss], we've been going round and round on this for three days. But you know what? I came in here Monday morning, resigned, and respectfully requested that my decision be honored. I had no desire to entertain a counteroffer and I tried to make that as clear as possible. But for the last three days, I've spent the majority of my time in your office and in [President]'s office getting tag teamed. Even by mid-Tuesday, I was still firm in my decision, but at some point along the way, you managed to get me to second guess myself, and that's when I lost my ability to reason or further defend my position.

So here's how I see it: I'm really tired and I couldn't add two-and-two right now, but I DO know that I went into this past weekend 110% confident in my decision, and I went into your office Monday morning 110% confident in my decision. I may not be able to articulate my reasons at this moment in time, but I have to be confident enough in myself to know that if they were good enough Friday, good enough Monday, and good enough yesterday, then they're good enough today.

So my decision stands, and I ask of you - just as I did Monday - that you respect my decision and allow me to focus on transfer of knowledge to [most qualified subordinate].

His response:

Well I really find it unfortunate that you are choosing this other "opportunity" [intense sarcasm] over our relationship. I'm going to ask that you give me an extra week; I think it's only fair.

I was flabbergasted by the request, but I had enough yesterday... I'm fully prepared to head that off today.

Them playing the 'guilt card' is incredible. Personally, if they kept that up with me I'd just walk out with my box of stuff and enjoy a week off before starting my new job.

 

[dbk]

Wow, what do you do?

 

[gsellis]

NC is a right-to-work state like GA, right? They should feel lucky you gave them two weeks as I am sure you do not have a contract that says otherwise. You DEFINITELY made the right choice. What a dweeb (the boss).

 

[Stuxnet]

I haven't even scratched the surface, really. At one point my future opportunity was mocked by the President (both in my presence and in my absence): "You want to go work for who? Are you nuts? There's no job security there!"

My boss's first reaction to my resignation was to ask where I was going and then try to counterpoint the decision.

Me: [Boss], I don't want to say much, but I'm going to work for [Company] in the same capacity.

Boss: You know jbourne77, if I thought this was the right opportunity for you, I'd be the first person to tell you to take advantage of it and wish you luck. But this just doesn't seem like that opportunity.

Me: What? How could you possibly conclude that this opportunity is good or bad? I haven't told you anything about it. You know the company, the job title, and that I'm getting a 20% raise. On what basis could you possibly tell me this is a bad opportunity?

Boss: Life isn't always about money, jbourne77....

Me: [Interrupted] I never thought it was. I didn't even ask for that salary. I told them my current salary, told them I would like a modest increase, but explained that money had absolutely nothing to do with my decision. While it's true that I make enough money here to live comfortably, the fact is you don't pay me market value. It's not why I'm leaving, but it sure doesn't help your case, either. The raise I got was simply the result of their pay band. I'm right in line with their company and the rest of the market here. To me, that raise is just an added bonus that I wasn't expecting when I first decided to look outside this company for other opportunities.


This is where he turned me over to the President.

This went on for three days folks. I'm leaving because I don't respect the management here, and all they've done over the past three days is reaffirm my position. Perhaps I should thank them for that. I'll churn out these stories as I have time today... they're actually pretty entertaining (if only for the fact they're so shocking).

 

[gsellis]

Just the fact that he calls you jbourne77 is enough reason

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: gsellis
Just the fact that he calls you jbourne77 is enough reason

I think he does that to prove he screen-scrapes my Internet usage.

 

[Stuxnet]

Here's another snippet from yesterday when it became obvious to him that he had worn me down to the point where I was doubting myself:

Boss: You know, you can't analyze this situation the way you analyze the challenges in your job. You just need to strip the nuts and bolts away from this and go with your gut.

Me: My gut has been telling me that the right decision is to take this other position.

Boss: Some people advance their careers through building and cultivating important relationships such as the one you and I have; others build their careers by changing jobs every few years. If you want to be the latter and that works for you, then I guess that's okay.

Me = PISSED

Me: I'm 29 years old and have worked for TWO COMPANIES in my 9 year professional career. EIGHT of those years I was working for you!!! I'm not a "job hopper" and if I DIDN'T value relationships such as the one you and I have, I wouldn't have allowed this to continue for 3 days! Ironically, if you valued our relationship as much as you claim, I don't think YOU would have allowed this to continue for 3 days just out of simple professionalism and respect.

All hell kind of broke loose at that point and we parted ways for lunch.

 

[skyking]

Never tell somebody you are quitting where you are going. Keep that to yourself. You gave them both ammo to continue a moot point, an additional club for beating on the dead horse.