Unarmed black 17 year old shot by Neighborhood watch captain in gated community...

[Geosurface]

If it was him screaming, why did he stop the instant of the gunshot. And it did stop the instant of the gunshot, it's on the 911 call, so don't try to lie and say it didn't.

Why would you keep screaming past the moment of the gun shot if you fired it? It'd make more sense for the person who was shot to keep screaming after the shot, if they'd been screaming prior to it... unless they were killed instantly, which we know Trayvon was not. He wasn't screaming prior to the shot, and wasn't screaming after it either. Zimmerman stopped screaming because if shooting someone isn't an "oh shit" moment in life, I don't know what is. Plus, the attack ceased. Use your head.

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soundforbjt: The EMT described Zimmerman's head as being about half covered with blood upon his arrival. The photo taken with the iphone by the neighbor unfortunately doesn't show the front of his face. The black and white shot the police officer took unfortunately shows it after the EMT's cleaned him up. There was likely a substantial amount of blood on his face. In fact, this has been testified to by neighbors and EMT.

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airdata: there is no doubt that those are some dramatically worse beatings, and that people in the history of our world have endured even worse than that (far worse) and still survived. No doubt about it.

Please keep in mind though, those men you linked pictures of are paid to do those fights, and the brutality of it is a large part of why it's popular. They know, going into it, that their opponent's goal is not to kill them, and that there are medical personal on hand. They're being filmed in the brightest fluorescent lights, surrounded by "witnesses" It's a very different situation to being unexpectedly attacked by a stranger, who won't stop when you make no effort to hit him in return, and in fact scream for mercy. You also don't know how bad the broken nose is, you just know it hurts like a son of a bitch. You don't know what the condition of the back of your head is, you just know it's hit concrete multiple times and again, hurts like a son of a bitch.

GZ didn't have a third person camera floating over the scene, with the ability to pause and turn on 1,000,000 watts of light and examine his wounds before entering a Fallout 3 VATS style aiming mini-game on Trayvon's body where he could choose some non-fatal zone to hit, or take as much time as he desired to weigh his options or decide whether the wounds warranted the use of that gun...

You aren't being very honest with yourself or with me when you try to make these false equivalences. It would be a terrifying situation to have a big stranger sitting on your chest, and beating you. Even the tamest, most inept version of that is still going to be terrifying. It also still legally justifies self-defense.

Are you showing that now, in addition to the CSI effect investigators talk about, where juries expect to see amazing feats of scientific sleuthery... there's now the MMA effect too? Where the public expect massive, gaping wounds where you can see down to the skull before they find it acceptable to defend yourself? Get real.

 

[tashatexas]

His supporters cannot say the beating lasted less than a minute because the less time the beating happens the more unexplained time for Zimmermans whereabouts after the call ended. The thing is even if we got the one solid minute of beating theory that still leaves a minute and 30 secs unaccounted for. Everyone should take something and bang it on an immovable object for a minute and see if its more bruised and.scratched than Zimmermans head. It will be because whatever happened to his head took an instant not a full minute.

 

[lotus503]

When he actually was taken back out to the exact location this all happened, he indicated backing away southward from Trayvon and attempting to fend off subsequent attacks from Trayvon while doing so. He did this without being prompted to explain how they got so far south.

You are smart enough to know that someone going through something like that isn't going to remember every single little detail of who moved where, when, and exactly how it all went down. Especially the parts where they were seeing stars and had just taken what might've been the first punch to their nose of their life.

We have received imperfect accounts from GZ, they do indicate confusion on his part, he remembers some elements one time telling it, which he doesn't include other times. I find this all to be completely and entirely expected.

You should expect the most definitive version of what he can remember from racking his brain on multiple occasions and writing it all down, etc, having his memory jogged by being shown those distances, etc... to be presented by his lawyer Mark O'Mara.

I find it entirely unsurprising that the half-remembered, piecemeal, multiple stabs at a full recounting he's made so far have been imperfect in this fashion.

Not remembering every detail is one thing, claiming you were hit, fell to the ground, was mounted and beaten, yet the body is 30 feet from said location is another.

I am smart enough to know it implys something else occurrd outside of the scope of zimmermans account.

 

[lotus503]

You understand right that MMA style beatings come from MMA strength fighters, who have MMA style technique? Jesus you guys are as desperate as the 'you didn't build that' spinners...

You understand that we all know this is a spidey alt account.

 

[tashatexas]

You understand right that MMA style beatings come from MMA strength fighters, who have MMA style technique? Jesus you guys are as desperate as the 'you didn't build that' spinners...

Exactly and a scrawny teenager could never do to a bigger grown man what was done in thise pics and Zimmerman knew that just like every grown man knows he can take a kid any day of the week point being Zimmermans scratches were not consistent with anyone trying to kill him and therefore he didn't get them how he said he did. If the MMA guys.can inflict that kind of damage with no intent to kill then Martin would have inflicted similar damage if he could overpower GZ and his intent was to kill as Zimmerman said.

 

[Geosurface]

I find the constant obsession here with speculation as to people being alt accounts, misrepresenting their gender, misrepresenting their beliefs, or being accused of being paid to post here to be a consistently disappointing indication of some very high, raw levels of stupidity and childishness on the part of several posters.

I would strongly encourage everyone who engages in it, to shut the fuck up about this inane distraction from the actual issues at hand, from now on.

 

[tashatexas]

As for Zimmerthugs memory, he remembers every detail of this so called beating except he doesn't remember how he got 30 plus feet from the T....

 

[tashatexas]

I find that Geosurface should stfu. Lol.

Another failed day on the job thanks to Team Trayvon.

 

[tashatexas]

How the fuck can you waddle your fat, greasy ass in here and tell people to stop kicking your ass in a debate? How about you just leave?

 

[Geosurface]

tashatexas, you are a brain dead dumb fuck of the most egregious order.

I stood up for someone ELSE, not me, being accused of being an alt of spidey.

You will note that you YOURSELF have been repeatedly accused of misrepresenting your gender, and being an alt of JKing106 or emperus. So, unfortunately I am defending you also when I ask people to drop that nonsense.

My god you are stupid. I'm not joking, I mean you are really, really dumb.

 

[WHAMPOM]

These aren't the highest quality images but if you enlarge them, and look closely you will see multiple scrapes and nicks, abbrasions and "burns" (like a rug burn or "Indian burn" type of effect) all around the front and sides of his head.

This is not the most horrific beating any man has ever sustained, by a very long shot. Nobody is denying that.

It does, however, prove a couple of things:

1.) It was George Zimmerman screaming.
2.) It was self-defense.

More hyperbole from Geo, pictures taken after EMTs cleaned up wounds that did not rate a bandage, next day bruises I cannot detect, B&W photo that looks like he has his nose pressed to a sheet of glass. B&W photo? Why? LOL!! Doesn't even look like GZ.
Does not prove your #1 or #2 by a long, long shot.

 

[Geosurface]

The photo in question is low quality and black and white because it was released in a packet of papers just like the recent (also B&W and super low quality) image of Trayvon laying dead.

It was sent through a fax machine, etc... that is why the photo is that way.

 

[chucky2]

You understand that we all know this is a spidey alt account.

Haha, whatever you need to say. Taking a break from your 'C level' duties? :biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

 

[chucky2]

Exactly and a scrawny teenager could never do to a bigger grown man what was done in thise pics and Zimmerman knew that just like every grown man knows he can take a kid any day of the week point being Zimmermans scratches were not consistent with anyone trying to kill him and therefore he didn't get them how he said he did. If the MMA guys.can inflict that kind of damage with no intent to kill then Martin would have inflicted similar damage if he could overpower GZ and his intent was to kill as Zimmerman said.

Your bipolar posting aside, the point is, those people are beat to sh1t because they just got glocked by an MMA fighter. MMA fighters are hitting you with the intent to greatly hurt you/incapacitate you. They're strong, highly fit, and know how to hit someone. The 17 year old thug was not an MMA fighter, we'd not expect the damage from each hit to be as severe (although it's certainly possible, anyone can get lucky). What we would expect a 17 year old man to be able to sneak hit someone and stun them enough to gain an upper hand. A 14 year old could do that. No MMA style damage needed.

This is like 1st grader logic, even Dav, er, Firs, er, lotu, er, lets just stick with 'C level' could likely understand this (it's not a sure thing they mentally can, but, it's likely).


How you translate this into any of your crazy conclusions is just too much to try and work through.

Seriously: Seek professional help. (I don't mean this as a posting 'tactic', it's clear from your posts and your posting style, you need some professional help)

Chuck

 

[JKing106]

tashatexas, you are a brain dead dumb fuck of the most egregious order.

I stood up for someone ELSE, not me, being accused of being an alt of spidey.

You will note that you YOURSELF have been repeatedly accused of misrepresenting your gender, and being an alt of JKing106 or emperus. So, unfortunately I am defending you also when I ask people to drop that nonsense.

My god you are stupid. I'm not joking, I mean you are really, really dumb.

And it's really, really obvious you're a paid shill. You still haven't told us when you decided to flush your conscience down the toilet and defend a murderer for money. Is that paycheck really that good?

 

[Agent11]

You understand right that MMA style beatings come from MMA strength fighters, who have MMA style technique? Jesus you guys are as desperate as the 'you didn't build that' spinners...

And they are wearing gloves. Bare fisted you cause a lot more damage a lot faster. One hit bare fisted can leave a goose egg, split lip or swell an eye shut. Zimmerman looks like he fell backward and hit his head on the concrete or was scratched some how.

I had a friend who got in a fight that involved a bbq thrown at his head. Both his eyes were swollen shut, his jaw was wired together his nose was broken and his entire face was black and blue and swollen. No one was shot.

 

[chucky2]

And they are wearing gloves. Bare fisted you cause a lot more damage a lot faster. One hit bare fisted can leave a goose egg, split lip or swell an eye shut. Zimmerman looks like he fell backward and hit his head on the concrete.

True, but standing up facing each other prepared, would you rather get hit by Trayvon bare knuckled or the MMA fighter that did the damage in those picks wearing his gloves?

I'll pick the 17 year old bare knuckled thug for $1000 Alex...

 

[Geosurface]

Trayvon also may have been less than at his best due to intoxication on whatever he had in his system. Still waiting on that full tox report. We know he at least had some THC in him, who knows what else. He was disoriented and wobbly in the 7-11 video.

Combine that with the very real possibility that Zimmerman not fighting back, but rather just trying to fend off attacks, and screaming for mercy and help, may have in fact made Trayvon less certain about what he was doing, made him hesitate a bit. The important thing is he was still committed to his actions enough to continue the assault.

He also may not have had a lot of experience with assaulting people, it may have been a new experience and he may have been more used to a more even fight.

We don't know.

What we do know is that Zimmerman had injuries, and that the injuries are consistent with what he describes. Could they be worse? Of course. But they fit what he describes happening to him. We also know that Zimmerman was screaming for help for a prolonged period of time, and that no help came. He says he felt Trayvon was making a grab for the gun. Maybe that's true, maybe it's not, but I'm inclined to believe he at least thought Trayvon was doing so at that time, because if he really had just wanted to off this kid... for no good reason, or after a beating so light and pitiful that no reasonable person would fear for themselves... he wouldn't have bothered to draw witnesses with his screams, or if you are a fucking retard and prefer... by allowing Trayvon to scream... before shooting.

He would've just shot him.

And Trayvon had only 2 wounds: The bullet hole, and an offensive wound to his finger.

MY GOD, I cannot believe I am even typing this shit... Jesus H. Christ are you people really stupid enough to require this even be pointed out?

The man was on his fucking back screaming for help.

OF FUCKING COURSE IT WAS SELF-DEFENSE.

I'm honestly flabbergasted at how stupid, and how DURABLY stupid some of you can be.

 

[JKing106]

True, but standing up facing each other prepared, would you rather get hit by Trayvon bare knuckled or the MMA fighter that did the damage in those picks wearing his gloves?

I'll pick the 17 year old bare knuckled thug for $1000 Alex...

Ok, let me get this straight. Zimmerman was supposedly in fear of being beaten to death by a 17 year old boy. Every Zimmerman defender has used this angle to defend him. Now you're going to suggest the reason Zimmerman looks like he just fell of his bike is because Martin wasn't a good fighter, or strong enough to do any damage?

Which is it? Was Martin an MMA killing machine who was about to kill Zimmerman? Or was he just a weak, inexperienced kid who wasn't strong enough to do MMA damage?

 

[JKing106]

Trayvon also may have been less than at his best due to intoxication on whatever he had in his system. Still waiting on that full tox report. We know he at least had some THC in him, who knows what else. He was disoriented and wobbly in the 7-11 video.

Combine that with the very real possibility that Zimmerman not fighting back, but rather just trying to fend off attacks, and screaming for mercy and help, may have in fact made Trayvon less certain about what he was doing, made him hesitate a bit. The important thing is he was still committed to his actions enough to continue the assault.

He also may not have had a lot of experience with assaulting people, it may have been a new experience and he may have been more used to a more even fight.

We don't know.

What we do know is that Zimmerman had injuries, and that the injuries are consistent with what he describes. Could they be worse? Of course. But they fit what he describes happening to him. We also know that Zimmerman was screaming for help for a prolonged period of time, and that no help came. He says he felt Trayvon was making a grab for the gun. Maybe that's true, maybe it's not, but I'm inclined to believe he at least thought Trayvon was doing so at that time, because if he really had just wanted to off this kid... for no good reason, or after a beating so light and pitiful that no reasonable person would fear for themselves... he wouldn't have bothered to draw witnesses with his screams, or if you are a fucking retard and prefer... by allowing Trayvon to scream... before shooting.

He would've just shot him.

And Trayvon had only 2 wounds: The bullet hole, and an offensive wound to his finger.

MY GOD, I cannot believe I am even typing this shit... Jesus H. Christ are you people really stupid enough to require this even be pointed out?

The man was on his fucking back screaming for help.

OF FUCKING COURSE IT WAS SELF-DEFENSE.

I'm honestly flabbergasted at how stupid, and how DURABLY stupid some of you can be.

We're astounded by your clear lack of conscience. The constant lying, shifting of positions. Now you're accusing Martin of being a crazed drug addict. No arrests on record for drugs. No charges for drugs. Man, that marijuana just turns kids into killing machines. Every old, white baby boomers knows this! They're the ones who vote!

How much are you going to be paid for today's work on the forum?

 

[chucky2]

Ok, let me get this straight. Zimmerman was supposedly in fear of being beaten to death by a 17 year old boy.

Zimmerman didn't have the luxury of doing an age check on the young man that just sucker punched him. He was likely confused, disorientated, and stunned. Depending on how the fight progressed, he may have not even seen and registered Trayvon until hit 3, 4, whatever. Maybe he saw and registered him even before the hit, and is lying. No one will ever know except Zimmerman and Trayvon.

Every Zimmerman defender has used this angle to defend him. Now you're going to suggest the reason Zimmerman looks like he just fell of his bike is because Martin wasn't a good fighter, or strong enough to do any damage?

How could you possibly have got from my comments, in respect to the MMA damage pictures posted, that I feel Trayvon couldn't have done any damage??? I said he likely couldn't have done MMA type damage. Meaning, a hit from TM bare knuckled probably isn't going to do the damage seen in those pictures. He's not strong or talented enough to do that likely. Could he get lucky and have GZ be at an angle when he throws a punch a certain way to have it connect at an angle and force that does MMA type damage? Sure. Likely? No.

Which is it? Was Martin an MMA killing machine who was about to kill Zimmerman? Or was he just a weak, inexperienced kid who wasn't strong enough to do MMA damage?

Neither of those in all likelihood. He's not an MMA killing machine who's going to destroy you for real, nor is he a weak and inexperienced kid who isn't strong enough to do damage. He's a - young - man, getting the jump on someone in the dark, in the rain, hitting a non-MMA fighter schmoe who's expecting the cops to be there any minute, and not expecting to get into an altercation. He's a 17 year old thug who instead of doing a hit and run, turned his sucker punch into what looks like a running ground and pound.

And this is where TM yet again made another bad choice that night. Rather than have run home far far far ahead of GZ and be safe eating Skittles watching the game, rather than getting in a sucker punch and then running home, he instead - for whatever reason he chose - waited around and chose ground and pound.

That's what all the evidence shows. TM could have been the weakest @ss puncher in the history of humankind, and GZ still would have been OK to shoot in the situation he says, and was observed, in. I'm sorry "whitey" didn't submit to the black guy so you can jizz all over yourself at that thought, but thems the facts. Bummer...

Chuck

 

[Geosurface]

Amen chuck

 

[Londo_Jowo]

How about it's a 17 year old kid who realized that the person he attacked had pistol and decided he would like said pistol. At the very end this became a struggle for a pistol and the person who won out on the struggle killed the other person. No one in their right mind would allow anyone that was beating them to take control of their pistol. At the point the struggle for the gun began GZ could have reasonably feared for his life and exercised his right to self defense. I find it hard to believe a jury would not agree that they would reasonably fear for their life if they were in the same situation.

 

[JKing106]

How about it's a 17 year old kid who realized that the person he attacked had pistol and decided he would like said pistol. At the very end this became a struggle for a pistol and the person who won out on the struggle killed the other person. No one in their right mind would allow anyone that was beating them to take control of their pistol. At the point the struggle for the gun began GZ could have reasonably feared for his life and exercised his right to self defense. I find it hard to believe a jury would not agree that they would reasonably fear for their life if they were in the same situation.

The "situation" wouldn't have happened if a coward cop wannabe hadn't had the pistol on him in the first place and stayed in his vehicle like any sane person would have done. But no, Super Zim had to show the incompetent police who always let those fucking punks get away how it's done. That's the whole point of charging Zimmerman. None of this had to happen. He escalated the situation to the point of someone getting killed. And that's why he's going to prison, whether you and your NRA comrades think it's right, or not. Bye bye, Georgie. Have fun with the real "thugs" in your new home.

 

[JKing106]

Zimmerman didn't have the luxury of doing an age check on the young man that just sucker punched him. He was likely confused, disorientated, and stunned. Depending on how the fight progressed, he may have not even seen and registered Trayvon until hit 3, 4, whatever. Maybe he saw and registered him even before the hit, and is lying. No one will ever know except Zimmerman and Trayvon.



How could you possibly have got from my comments, in respect to the MMA damage pictures posted, that I feel Trayvon couldn't have done any damage??? I said he likely couldn't have done MMA type damage. Meaning, a hit from TM bare knuckled probably isn't going to do the damage seen in those pictures. He's not strong or talented enough to do that likely. Could he get lucky and have GZ be at an angle when he throws a punch a certain way to have it connect at an angle and force that does MMA type damage? Sure. Likely? No.



Neither of those in all likelihood. He's not an MMA killing machine who's going to destroy you for real, nor is he a weak and inexperienced kid who isn't strong enough to do damage. He's a - young - man, getting the jump on someone in the dark, in the rain, hitting a non-MMA fighter schmoe who's expecting the cops to be there any minute, and not expecting to get into an altercation. He's a 17 year old thug who instead of doing a hit and run, turned his sucker punch into what looks like a running ground and pound.

And this is where TM yet again made another bad choice that night. Rather than have run home far far far ahead of GZ and be safe eating Skittles watching the game, rather than getting in a sucker punch and then running home, he instead - for whatever reason he chose - waited around and chose ground and pound.

That's what all the evidence shows. TM could have been the weakest @ss puncher in the history of humankind, and GZ still would have been OK to shoot in the situation he says, and was observed, in. I'm sorry "whitey" didn't submit to the black guy so you can jizz all over yourself at that thought, but thems the facts. Bummer...

Chuck

You have no proof of Zimmerman being jumped, sucker punched, or ambushed. Only his word. And we know his word is worth shit, because he's a lying coward. Oh, and I think Zimmerman is the one who will be getting the jizz when he starts his long vacation with the real "thugs." If they don't kill him first.