Unarmed black 17 year old shot by Neighborhood watch captain in gated community...

[blankslate]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/08/us-crime-florida-neighborhoodwatch-idUSBRE82709M20120308

http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/ne...ch-in-gated-Fla-community-parents-want-arrest

http://www.drudge.com/news/154344/teen-killed-crime-watch-neighbor

The details in this article aren't complete but the fact that the police won't release the 911 phone call tapes and the fact that the teen was unarmed, while Zimmerman already called the police is very disturbing.

According to the reuters.com article the police would have told Mr. Zimmerman to not get involved and wait for the police. I seriously doubt a 17-year old kid would even think about arguing with someone when they have a gun. And if an argument began you'd bet that the person without the gun would just stfu.

The disturbing fact is be that the shooter wasn't arrested and the police have not released the tapes

edited 2 add

“Better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

attributed to Sir William Blackstone. It is a quote that the Founding Fathers have taken into consideration when deciding what rights the accused have when it came to criminal trials.

I haven't thought of it or remembered learning it in civics until this weekend.

Then it occurred to me that I may have been hoping for a guilty verdict for that "one innocent" in any case the verdict is in and some people have resorted to trolling in this thread... therefore as another poster requested

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=35260756&postcount=67365

I have to ask

can this thread be locked now?

thanks.

~Will

 

[Blackjack200]

This must be the "good riddance factor" monovillage was talking about.

 

[pauldun170]

17 year old kid walking on sidewalk a little after 7PM
26 year old "self appointed neighborhood watch captain" reports to police that 17 year old is suspicious (for walking on the sidewalk between the hours of 7PM and 8PM)
Cops tell him we are on the way and to backoff.
26 year old continues to follow 17 year old (Driving at 2-3mph at night behind a person walking on the sidewalk)
17 year old, after noticing some guy is following him (at night, behind him..lights on) asks "Whats you problem"
26 year stops and exits vehicle.....
fight ensues
26 shoots 17 year old.

No charges filed against 26 year old.

W
T
F
?

 

[PokerGuy]

Sucks that an innocent 17 year old lost his life I'm not going to roll out my "jump to conclusions" mat -- how about actually wait to see what the police investigation says? Nobody knows the details of what happened that night except for the kid and Zimmerman. Zimmerman probably gave the police a story of self defense, they have to investigate to see if the physical evidence at the scene supports his story. If his story is credible, what basis does the police have to arrest him at this point?

Geez people, let the police do their job. If they don't, THEN come out and make a big fuss about it.

 

[monovillage]

This must be the "good riddance factor" monovillage was talking about.

No, it's not what I was talking about you racist piece of garbage.





*edit* You also removed my quote from the body of the thread so it loses context.


No insults or personal attacks.

Administrator Idontcare

 

[steppinthrax]

When my wife and I were looking for a house last year we visited a gated community. My wife and I are not white. The homes were a little more, however I couldn't stand the stuck-up, conceded, uppity bitch attitude I was noticing from many of the owners.

Many people who choose to live in gated communites live there simply because they want to be away from certain groups and certain “real world” issues.

 

[Hugo Drax]

Sounds like we are becoming like East Germany.


(back in the days Germany was divided in two sections) Go and google East Germany.

 

[TheVrolok]

Looks like the white kid deserves some serious prison time.

 

[blankslate]

Sucks that an innocent 17 year old lost his life I'm not going to roll out my "jump to conclusions" mat -- how about actually wait to see what the police investigation says? Nobody knows the details of what happened that night except for the kid and Zimmerman. Zimmerman probably gave the police a story of self defense, they have to investigate to see if the physical evidence at the scene supports his story. If his story is credible, what basis does the police have to arrest him at this point?

Geez people, let the police do their job. If they don't, THEN come out and make a big fuss about it.

Yes we should let the police do their jobs. However, what do you think the police told Mr. Zimmerman to do. "Hang back let the police arrive and asses the situation." If the shooter followed their advice you can sure as hell bet the kid would most likely be alive.

If Mr. Zimmerman really thought the kid was a threat all he would really need to have done is have his gun out easily visible and tell the kid that he was armed.

Unless we learn that the kid was an irrational person with a history of violence and anger management issues with a propensity to fight in school this situation stinks to high heaven any way you slice it.

 

[soundforbjt]

There's no way to defend Zimmerman's actions. There is no apparent reason for him to have exited his car. Dude stays in car, nobody dies.

 

[PokerGuy]

Yes we should let the police do their jobs. However, what do you think the police told Mr. Zimmerman to do. "Hang back let the police arrive and asses the situation." If the shooter followed their advice you can sure as hell bet the kid would most likely be alive.

That may be true, but it's not relevant to question if the shooting was self defense.

If Mr. Zimmerman really thought the kid was a threat all he would really need to have done is have his gun out easily visible and tell the kid that he was armed.

How do you know he didn't? How do you know what happened there at all?

Unless we learn that the kid was an irrational person with a history of violence and anger management issues with a propensity to fight in school this situation stinks to high heaven any way you slice it.

Talk about jumping to conclusions..... All we know is, an (apparently) innocent kid is dead. The circumstances need to be investigated, and appropriate action taken after that. If more information comes out that makes it look like the police don't take appropriate steps, then make a fuss, but people are making a fuss without knowing anything at all, just pure speculation.

 

[ichy]

I don't see how the races of the people involved are relevant.

 

[PokerGuy]

There's no way to defend Zimmerman's actions. There is no apparent reason for him to have exited his car. Dude stays in car, nobody dies.

Wow, nice crystal ball you have there. What if the kid ran to the car, reached in and a scuffle ensued? I don't think that's very likely, but I don't know because I wasn't there. That's why there such a thing as a *gasp* investigation.

 

[PokerGuy]

I don't see how the races of the people involved are relevant.

They aren't, but racists view everything through the lens of racism.

 

[spidey07]

Dude doesn't have a strong self defense case, sounds like a bad shoot if he instigated it. As long as he keeps repeating "I feared for my life, I feared for my life" he should be good though. He could simply say "he tried to enter my vehicle" and at that point he's golden. And if that is what happened then good shoot.

 

[Genx87]

Another option is the 911 dispatcher did the unthinkable and told him to get involved.
We wont know until those tapes are released.

 

[TheVrolok]

Wow, nice crystal ball you have there. What if the kid ran to the car, reached in and a scuffle ensued? I don't think that's very likely, but I don't know because I wasn't there. That's why there such a thing as a *gasp* investigation.

Why would you assume that a kid walking home from grabbing snacks would decide to turn and randomly attack a person in a car? Even in that unlikely event, the driver would have likely had his windows rolled up (this was a "suspicious" person after all) and could have simply driven away.

Bottom line, the white kid GOT OUT of his car with a loaded weapon. He escalated. Period.

 

[TheVrolok]

Dude doesn't have a strong self defense case, sounds like a bad shoot if he instigated it. As long as he keeps repeating "I feared for my life, I feared for my life" he should be good though. He could simply say "he tried to enter my vehicle" and at that point he's golden. And if that is what happened then good shoot.

I'm not so sure. One of the articles claims he was following the pedestrian in the car, creeping along at 2-3 mph. It's going to be tough to see this as self-defense. If he had shot from inside his car, he may have a slightly better case; but he actually got out of his vehicle, and shot the kid. Not looking good. It's not as if he "didn't retreat," he took action.

 

[blankslate]

They aren't, but racists view everything through the lens of racism.

The races of the victim and shooter shouldn't be a factor at all, but let me ask you this... if the shooter had been black and the victim was some scruffily dressed white kid on the way to his father and stepmother's home do you think the shooter would have been arrested?

Sadly, the answer is most likely yes.

 

[Blackjack200]

No, it's not what I was talking about you racist piece of garbage.

No, I gotcha, one less bla... uh, I mean, urban man to terrorize the whi... uhh, law abiding citizens. Good thing Zimmerman put that legally aquired hand gun to good use, right?

*edit* You also removed my quote from the body of the thread so it loses context.

Link fixed, the context changes nothing.

 

[spidey07]

Why would you assume that a kid walking home from grabbing snacks would decide to turn and randomly attack a person in a car? Even in that unlikely event, the driver would have likely had his windows rolled up (this was a "suspicious" person after all) and could have simply driven away.

Bottom line, the white kid GOT OUT of his car with a loaded weapon. He escalated. Period.

There is no duty to retreat. There are plenty of ways this could be legitimate shooting. Plenty of ways.

 

[soundforbjt]

It's already been a month, the tapes should've been releasedby now.

 

[TheVrolok]

There is no duty to retreat. There are plenty of ways this could be legitimate shooting. Plenty of ways.

He didn't "not retreat," he actively got out of his car and confronted the pedestrian. Being in a "safe" situation, then purposefully placing yourself in an unsafe one by being aggressive, then claiming self-defense is an absolutely terrible self-defense claim. You're knowledgeable about CC, a person carrying does not go looking for trouble - and that is exactly what this kid did. Carrying a gun should make you less inclined to get involved, not more.

 

[blankslate]

Another option is the 911 dispatcher did the unthinkable and told him to get involved.
We wont know until those tapes are released.

If that's the case the 911 dispatcher should be fired and possibly charged with instigating a fatal incident if there are any laws on the books regarding those situations. It's hard to imagine that happening unless the 911 dispatcher was too inexperienced or just stupid...

Ok, it's unfortunately rather easy to imagine...

 

[blankslate]

There is no duty to retreat. There are plenty of ways this could be legitimate shooting. Plenty of ways.

Yeah and those ways require the victim to be by nature a belligerent person or that the shooter didn't let the shooting victim know that he was armed and instigated an argument before pulling out his weapon and firing.