Trump to end DACA program today reportedly

[K1052]

Petty Petty Princess can't even deliver his own program execution. Has to wheel out Klu Klux Keebler to do the dirty work for him. How beta of him.

There is some talk on reporter twitter that Trump actually doesn't know what he just did or at least doesn't fully appreciate the potential consequences. Given his near total lack of knowledge on pivotal issues like healthcare I find this entirely possible.

 

[K1052]

I'm of the mind that most of those folks who feel that Sessions has the right idea about immigrants are the ones who feel they have been cheated and wronged by "the system", are less educated than most and feel that they are entitled and deserving to be at the front of the line when it comes to being presented with opportunities for a better quality of life despite also having the attitude that this is the great land of "equal opportunity" and having a sense of "personal responsibility" is what brings success and prosperity to those who are hard working and diligent about their work ethic.

This is the view the Breitbarts of the world have been selling Republicans on for years.

 

[fskimospy]

I heard Sessions say multiple times "rule of law" This is about placating that white base.

Remember we had an old white man found guilty of violating the rights of brown people, in violation of the "rule of law"

That guy gets a pardon from Trump

Yeah, after pardoning Arpaio they have lost all right to talk about the rule of law.

 

[theeedude]

Sessions' rule of law us only for his opponents. This is a guy who abused his prosecutorial power to target people registering blacks to vote. Not much we can do except nullify his department's prosecutions if called to serve on a jury.

 

[UNCjigga]

This is nuts. On principle, ending DACA is the right thing to do. The first two letters stand for "Deferred Action"...it really couldn't survive a constitutional challenge if it became a long term policy. Trump could almost be commended for taking action where all Obama did was pass the buck.

For any Republican President other than Trump, this would be a no-brainer: You have the majority in both houses--tell Republicans and Democrats in Congress to put up or shut up and pass the DREAM Act on your terms. Congress has been tiptoeing around immigration reform for 3 decades and hasn't done shit. Now when 800,000 "Americans'" lives are at stake, suddenly it gets real and shit can get done. Any other President with half a fucking brain could own this as a major victory for their legacy. This isn't amnesty for millions of illegals, take that off the table. You could make it a one-time thing and pass tougher immigration laws in one fell swoop.

The problem with Trump is that he isn't any other President. He's a spineless, senile old fart who can't even stand up in front of a camera to deliver his decision. But the biggest problem is that he has no long term immigration strategy--he wants a wall. He will bitch and whine about funding the wall being tied to the DREAM Act. And there is no way that will pass.

 

[woolfe9998]

This administration is like a wet dream for the far right. It's government of the sociopaths, by the sociopaths, and for the sociopaths. Yet these policies are not broadly popular. If this goes through, it will only hurt their chances in 2018 and 2020. I realize that is little solace for those whose lives will be turned upside down, but there isn't anything we can do about it while the loonies are still running the asylum.

 

[Jhhnn]

This is nuts. On principle, ending DACA is the right thing to do. The first two letters stand for "Deferred Action"...it really couldn't survive a constitutional challenge if it became a long term policy. Trump could almost be commended for taking action where all Obama did was pass the buck.

For any Republican President other than Trump, this would be a no-brainer: You have the majority in both houses--tell Republicans and Democrats in Congress to put up or shut up and pass the DREAM Act on your terms. Congress has been tiptoeing around immigration reform for 3 decades and hasn't done shit. Now when 800,000 "Americans'" lives are at stake, suddenly it gets real and shit can get done. Any other President with half a fucking brain could own this as a major victory for their legacy. This isn't amnesty for millions of illegals, take that off the table. You could make it a one-time thing and pass tougher immigration laws in one fell swoop.

The problem with Trump is that he isn't any other President. He's a spineless, senile old fart who can't even stand up in front of a camera to deliver his decision. But the biggest problem is that he has no long term immigration strategy--he wants a wall. He will bitch and whine about funding the wall being tied to the DREAM Act. And there is no way that will pass.

That's not exactly fair or honest. Repubs made it clear that they'd rather pander to the worst elements in their base rather than deal with immigration reform when the HOR refused to act on a comprehensive reform bill passed by the Senate back in 2013. The DACA was never intended to be permanent but rather to do the right thing in hopes that Congress would come to their senses in the near future.

Instead of that happening we have the Donald pandering even harder to racist sentiment & a Repub Congress wringing their hands in mock horror at the upcoming fuckover of 800K young adults who've been raised American & are as eager as anybody to actually MAGA by working to make it that way.

Amnesty for millions of illegals is also the right thing to do when we look at it squarely even if it needs to be a separate bill. According to Pew, 2/3 of all illegals have been here for more than 10 years. They often have American spouses & children. They have become an integral part of America. Nobody is arguing against increased border security & even that is over stated given that the number of illegals in this country has actually gone down since 2007 indicating that current methods are adequate under the circumstances.

 

[Ajay]

Imagine this was 1845-1855 and we did this to the Irish.

Slave owners would have gone crazy. Why risk a slave you paid for when one could cheaply hire Irish immigrants to do the same work with less risk on their investment.

 

[UNCjigga]

That's not exactly fair or honest. Repubs made it clear that they'd rather pander to the worst elements in their base rather than deal with immigration reform when the HOR refused to act on a comprehensive reform bill passed by the Senate back in 2013. The DACA was never intended to be permanent but rather to do the right thing in hopes that Congress would come to their senses in the near future.

Instead of that happening we have the Donald pandering even harder to racist sentiment & a Repub Congress wringing their hands in mock horror at the upcoming fuckover of 800K young adults who've been raised American & are as eager as anybody to actually MAGA by working to make it that way.

Amnesty for millions of illegals is also the right thing to do when we look at it squarely even if it needs to be a separate bill. According to Pew, 2/3 of all illegals have been here for more than 10 years. They often have American spouses & children. They have become an integral part of America. Nobody is arguing against increased border security & even that is over stated given that the number of illegals in this country has actually gone down since 2007 indicating that current methods are adequate under the circumstances.

I do not disagree with a single thing you said. Not one thing. I was merely coming at this from what a somewhat sane Republican President *should* be capable of, and the talking points they might use.

 

[Blackjack200]

For any Republican President other than Trump, this would be a no-brainer: You have the majority in both houses--tell Republicans and Democrats in Congress to put up or shut up and pass the DREAM Act on your terms. Congress has been tiptoeing around immigration reform for 3 decades and hasn't done shit. Now when 800,000 "Americans'" lives are at stake, suddenly it gets real and shit can get done. Any other President with half a fucking brain could own this as a major victory for their legacy. This isn't amnesty for millions of illegals, take that off the table. You could make it a one-time thing and pass tougher immigration laws in one fell swoop.

Bush and Obama both tried to pass immigration reform, hard liners prevented it in both cases. You think Trump would have succeeded where they failed?

Now, he has told congress to get something done and thinks leverage is holding a gun to the heads of immigrants. What do you think the chances are that that's going to work? Do you understand the country we're living in right now?

 

[woolfe9998]

In furtherance of my above point, 78% support either allowing dreamers to stay or allowing them to become citizens. This includes 86% of democrats, 76% of independents, and 72% of republicans. Half of republicans think they should be given citizenship.

https://morningconsult.com/2017/06/16/poll-trumps-decision-dreamers-popular-one-even-among-base/

Less than a quarter of the country wants this. Ending DACA is pandering to a fringe.

 

[Blackjack200]

In furtherance of my above point, 78% support either allowing dreamers to stay or allowing them to become citizens. This includes 86% of democrats, 76% of independents, and 72% of republicans. Half of republicans think they should be given citizenship.

https://morningconsult.com/2017/06/16/poll-trumps-decision-dreamers-popular-one-even-among-base/

Less than a quarter of the country wants this. Ending DACA is pandering to a fringe.

The fringe that controls the country.

 

[theeedude]

This is going to hurt lower income Americans too, because Dreamers will now be more afraid of their employer calling immigration, and easier to abuse and underpay labor pool, making them more attractive relative to their American counterparts.

 

[K1052]

In furtherance of my above point, 78% support either allowing dreamers to stay or allowing them to become citizens. This includes 86% of democrats, 76% of independents, and 72% of republicans. Half of republicans think they should be given citizenship.

https://morningconsult.com/2017/06/16/poll-trumps-decision-dreamers-popular-one-even-among-base/

Less than a quarter of the country wants this. Ending DACA is pandering to a fringe.

That fringe is what votes in the GOP primary next year. The reckoning for purple state and establishment Republicans draws nigh.

 

[zinfamous]

Renewals will processed for 6 months then nothing. Since the government knows who and where all these people are, and going by the guidance the DOJ released, they will be forcibly expelled from the United States should congress fail to act. Given history I think congress will fail to act and the US will probably perpetrate one of the most morally heinous domestic actions in generations.

The new trail of tears! Trump does get a raging stiffy for Jackson (when people remind him who Jackson is)

 

[woolfe9998]

The fringe that controls the country.

Yes, but that is exactly the point. If they continue to pursue unpopular policies, they won't be controlling it much longer. Ending DACA is wildly unpopular even among self-described republicans. It certainly won't play well with swing voters. Nor will their healthcare bill, or their upcoming attempts to slash taxes for the rich. They're going to get hammered over this stuff in 2018 and 2020. That's the thing about electing fringe candidates. Their fringe policies may just not keep them in power.

 

[K1052]

The new trail of tears! Trump does get a raging stiffy for Jackson (when people remind him who Jackson is)

Volunteering to own a possibly very ugly chapter in US history is an intersting approach to one's legacy. Usually people want to avoid infamy.

 

[woolfe9998]

It's hard for me to imagine how the Republicans would pass this. First, there's no time in the legislative calendar. Second, do you think the ultra right conservatives in the House are going to let something like this pass? By far I think the most likely answer is that nothing happens and they either reverse the decision last minute or let these people get screwed.

Trump caved to a demand that likely was an empty threat and kicked the can down the road on a road that was already filled with traffic. Total, total incompetence.

What Trump and Sessions are doing is to frame this as a "Constitutional" issue having to do with executive power, claiming it's a matter for Congress. His message is that he doesn't personally oppose allowing the dreamers to stay, but that it's an issue for Congress. Then when Congress predictably fails to act, he'll be "forced" to deport them all, but it won't be his fault. He'll blame it on Congress instead. Just like he did with healthcare. It's classic Trump bullshit.

 

[K1052]

Apparently SHS is dumping all the responsibility for basically everything onto Congress.

So much for the "I alone can fix it" candidate.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

I'll say Trump or I mean Mr. Kelly handled this well. I understand the point that Obama essentially passed a law without Congress, I don't completely agree but I understand the point.
Trump err Mr. Kelly has thrown it back to Congress whom the majority want to keep it or something similar but simply don't want to get primaried over voting yes.
I like how this forces Congress to do what it's supposed to do and it all gets recorded. No back room trickery, no avoiding job responsibility.

 

[Blackjack200]

Yes, but that is exactly the point. If they continue to pursue unpopular policies, they won't be controlling it much longer. Ending DACA is wildly unpopular even among self-described republicans. It certainly won't play well with swing voters. Nor will their healthcare bill, or their upcoming attempts to slash taxes for the rich. They're going to get hammered over this stuff in 2018 and 2020. That's the thing about electing fringe candidates. Their fringe policies may just not keep them in power.

I don't think you're drawing the right conclusions from the data. DACA's 72% support among Republicans doesn't mean it's "wildly" popular. It means it's broadly popular.

I propose that the 28% of Republicans that don't support DACA care an awful lot more about the issue than the other 72%.

The same is true for climate change, guns, abortion, etc. etc. You have a small minority that are passionate about driving their shitty policies, and a broader Republican party that doesn't care enough to oppose them, because they have their own shitty pet policies. That's how the R party works.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

This is going to hurt lower income Americans too, because Dreamers will now be more afraid of their employer calling immigration, and easier to abuse and underpay labor pool, making them more attractive relative to their American counterparts.

Aren't you the guy who didn't mind that non-American workers were exploited and abused...as long as you got cheap vegetables?

https://forums.anandtech.com/thread...ax-cuts-extended.2124242/page-7#post-30858236

 

[fskimospy]

What Trump and Sessions are doing is to frame this as a "Constitutional" issue having to do with executive power, claiming it's a matter for Congress. His message is that he doesn't personally oppose allowing the dreamers to stay, but that it's an issue for Congress. Then when Congress predictably fails to act, he'll be "forced" to deport them all, but it won't be his fault. He'll blame it on Congress instead. Just like he did with healthcare. It's classic Trump bullshit.

Sure, but does anyone really think that's going to work? I'm sure the news and voters are totally going to buy that Trump loves illegal immigrants but the Constitution and Congress made him deport them even though they were just fine under Obama.

If he thinks this is going to work he's stupider than I thought, and I think he's really, really stupid.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Pen and phone...so easily undone.

 

[theeedude]

Aren't you the guy who didn't mind that non-American workers were exploited and abused as long as you got cheap vegetables?

https://forums.anandtech.com/thread...ax-cuts-extended.2124242/page-7#post-30858236

I have since evolved, and now want Trump Supporting Americans like you working in those fields.
You wanted to pick lettuce, it's all yours:

Next time I drive through the central valley, I want to see nothing but MAGA hats bent over picking produce.