TPP Fast track

[norseamd]

Your analogy is terrible.

Not so sure it is that far off.

 

[fskimospy]

Would you join a game if you had to agree to allow your full house get bet but the dealers would not tell you how much to bet was actually going to be. Then they deal your hand out of view and then tell you what they say the results are. Without knowing how much if not everything you could lose and also not knowing how anything about the game works would you still agree to play?

I don't think you understand what fast track authority is. This is a bafflingly wrong analogy.

 

[norseamd]

I don't think you understand what fast track authority is. This is a bafflingly wrong analogy.

What does this have to ultimately do with fast track authority? That is just a tool for the real topic of the TPP. You more or less made the analogy yourself.

I personally very much doubt almost anyone on here has a good idea of the plausible impacts of TPP.

 

[Dulanic]

Much of the broadcast and cable news is owned by corporations... who have an interest in this passing... most people don't know because not many in the media were talking about it until the democratic members in Congress made efforts to stop it.

And yes we do have it coming in a sense because we (collectively speaking) believed the beautiful lies of trickle-down and free-trade.

...

The people in the US just don't give a crap. It's sad... and very frustrating. The corporations control what people "easily" see and hear and they will own us more and more as time goes on. People are too freaking lazy to give a crap what happens until it is too late and it directly impacts them.

 

[fskimospy]

What does this have to ultimately do with fast track authority? That is just a tool for the real topic of the TPP. You more or less made the analogy yourself.

I'm genuinely not sure what you're trying to argue.

 

[werepossum]

We have the WTO, NAFTA, GATT, CAFTA and now TPP is next to be passed.

Over twenty years time, Americans did little to nothing to stop the onslaught and know very little about one-sided trade agreements that actively allow multinationals to usurp US sovereignty. Mission accomplished.

Yep. Hey, that's the beauty of democracy, we get the government we deserve.

"They're the same" because they collaborate on terrible things. Dem President and GOP Congress should be too busy fighting each other, but they share vested interests. In this case, selling humanity out to shareholders.

Well said.

Time to put corporate logos on the U.S. flag....


.....

+1

Our new flag - a blank white background with "This space for rent" in bold red and blue letters. Buy now and get the special gold border free!

 

[waggy]

Far less worried about that than the potential massive increase in corporate power over humanity.

/this

Dislocation of US workers and industries.

can't much at this point. we have already shipped over a bunch.


though my main problem with TPP is not knowing what is in it before it's passed. NOTHING should be passed without knowing everything about it.

 

[fskimospy]

though my main problem with TPP is not knowing what is in it before it's passed. NOTHING should be passed without knowing everything about it.

Good news then, that hasn't happened!

 

[norseamd]

Good news then, that hasn't happened!

 

[fskimospy]

Confusing again!

You guys all know that the TPP hasn't been passed into law, right?

 

[michal1980]

2. Not that big a deal as far as trade agreements go anyway.

Wat?

What economic changes do you think will come from the enactment of this trade agreement, specifically?

Dislocation of US workers and industries.

How many?

So you read TPP to know it wont have a large impact?

Only proof I have its going to have a large impact is that the Dems felt the need to attach TAA to the package to get it passed.

If the agreement isnt going to have a large impact why does your side feel the need that american workers are going to need assistance because of its passage?

 

[fskimospy]

So you read TPP to know it wont have a large impact?

Only proof I have its going to have a large impact is that the Dems felt the need to attach TAA to the package to get it passed.

If the agreement isnt going to have a large impact why does your side feel the need that american workers are going to need assistance because of its passage?

Most of the provisions are about dispute resolution and IP protection, it's really not a trade pact in the same way that NAFTA was. I doubt it will have anywhere near the impact.

 

[norseamd]

Most of the provisions are about dispute resolution and IP protection, it's really not a trade pact in the same way that NAFTA was. I doubt it will have anywhere near the impact.

Lack of 404: Bullshit found

This is why TPP is terrible for America and humanity.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

I'm keeping it basic, the only industries I have heard of being excited for the TPP to pass so they can hire more Americans are the Hog/Pig industry and Fruit & vegetable growers. I'm not saying these are bad people however I find it hard to believe we will support a modern economy on farming.
I also think that us, Japan and Australia are the premier purchasers in this agreement smaller countries have huge benefits. You could say copyright protection will help pharmaceutical companies however when you are selling to somebody who makes $180 per month what percentage of that income do you really expect to capture 20%?

 

[werepossum]

I'm keeping it basic, the only industries I have heard of being excited for the TPP to pass so they can hire more Americans are the Hog/Pig industry and Fruit & vegetable growers. I'm not saying these are bad people however I find it hard to believe we will support a modern economy on farming.
I also think that us, Japan and Australia are the premier purchasers in this agreement smaller countries have huge benefits. You could say copyright protection will help pharmaceutical companies however when you are selling to somebody who makes $180 per month what percentage of that income do you really expect to capture 20%?

We're in a bizarre place where the world's industrial leader AND the world's largest and most lucrative market have largely transitioned to become the world's (especially China's) colony, exporting the traditional colonial exports of food and raw materials.

 

[First]

Would you join a game if you had to agree to allow your full house get bet but the dealers would not tell you how much to bet was actually going to be. Then they deal your hand out of view and then tell you what they say the results are. Without knowing how much if not everything you could lose and also not knowing how anything about the game works would you still agree to play?

lol

 

[Black Octagon]

Most of the provisions are about dispute resolution and IP protection, it's really not a trade pact in the same way that NAFTA was. I doubt it will have anywhere near the impact.

Have you seen the text, or at least a breakdown of the chapters? I haven't, as I don't believe it exists in the public domain. What I do understand, however, is that dispute resolution and IP protection are individual topics among many, and will probably get a chapter each devoted to them, tops. Ditto for TTIP.

 

[fskimospy]

Have you seen the text, or at least a breakdown of the chapters? I haven't, as I don't believe it exists in the public domain. What I do understand, however, is that dispute resolution and IP protection are individual topics among many, and will probably get a chapter each devoted to them, tops. Ditto for TTIP.

The length of the sections isn't important, what they do is what matters. I've read some analysis of documents that have leaked that I can try and dig up, but from my understanding the removal of trade barriers that will come from this is modest, but the increased IP protections would be quite large.

 

[norseamd]

but the increased IP protections would be quite large.

But hear hear the effects of TPP would not be that much apparently.

 

[Black Octagon]

The length of the sections isn't important, what they do is what matters. I've read some analysis of documents that have leaked that I can try and dig up, but from my understanding the removal of trade barriers that will come from this is modest, but the increased IP protections would be quite large.

Thanks for the clarification. So most of the provisions are not, in fact, about investor dispute or IP protection.

 

[Mai72]

A HUGE day for Obama.

First, TPP passes and the Supreme Court upholds ObamaCare. In regard to TPP, the House of Representatives passed legislation that will provide financial aid and training for those who were displaced by global trade.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/25/politics/trade-bill-barack-obama-taa/index.html

 

[blankslate]

Confusing again!

You guys all know that the TPP hasn't been passed into law, right?

We do know this... you, I will assume (but that may be a bit of a stretch) for the sake of argument, know that the TPA makes it much easier to pass the TPP without giving the Congress much chance to look it over or amend it than if the Trade Promotional authority wasn't passed.

Basically Senators who constantly talked about President Obama having too much power actually did give him more power where the TPP was concerned... talk about hypocrites... they gave him the ability to gut American Sovereignty if a corporation feels that U.S. laws will be a barrier to increased profits.

Australia is being sued by other countries over cigarette labels under similar trade agreements.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UsHHOCH4q8&t=8m31s

And the democratic members who helped it pass? Traitors to the middle class.


....

 

[werepossum]

A HUGE day for Obama.

First, TPP passes and the Supreme Court upholds ObamaCare. In regard to TPP, the House of Representatives passed legislation that will provide financial aid and training for those who were displaced by global trade.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/25/politics/trade-bill-barack-obama-taa/index.html

Hamburger University for everyone!

We do know this... you, I will assume (but that may be a bit of a stretch) for the sake of argument, know that the TPA makes it much easier to pass the TPP without giving the Congress much chance to look it over or amend it than if the Trade Promotional authority wasn't passed.

Basically Senators who constantly talked about President Obama having too much power actually did give him more power where the TPP was concerned... talk about hypocrites... they gave him the ability to gut American Sovereignty if a corporation feels that U.S. laws will be a barrier to increased profits.

Australia is being sued by other countries over cigarette labels under similar trade agreements.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UsHHOCH4q8&t=8m31s

And the democratic members who helped it pass? Traitors to the middle class.

....

Agreed. Unfortunately they pretty much all want the same things, and this gives them the ability to allow the President to get those things while they pretend outrage at what they "only now discovered."

One correction though - they are ALL traitors to the middle class.

 

[TheSlamma]

And the democratic members who helped it pass? Traitors to the middle class.

Don't you have to first be on the side of the middle class to be a traitor?

Neither party cares for us bud, we've been on our own for a LONG time. The job of the middle class is to not only take care of the poor but also the rich too.

 

[norseamd]

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...-same-with-europe/+&cd=11&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us