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The NRA

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Sunburn74 said:
Not all rights are true human rights.
For much of history, certain people fought viciously and brutally for the right to own slaves. Or to beat their wives and children. Or to steal or unfairly tax. Or to do all sorts of horrible things they felt were natural, god given rights.
I would say the right to own certain weapons and blow your neighbors brains out is probably one of the more questionable human rights proposed.
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I'd argue that this IS a basic human right, the right to defend your self. The government is armed, so citizens can be armed. That is what the forefathers wanted, the NRA helps protect that. Do I have the right to own a bow and arrow to pierce my neighbor's head? Do I have the right to own car to run over my neighbors head? Do I have the right to own a sword so I can chop my neighbor's head off? My neighbor has the same rights I have, btw.
 
Pipeline 1010 said:
Small correction. Guns are made for shooting bullets. That is ACTUALLY what they do. Where that bullet goes, what that bullet does is up to the user. Guns can certainly be used very effectively to kill. But that isn't what their purpose is, and it isn't what almost every gun in private ownership has ever been used for. It is such an extreme opinion that guns are made for killing when the percentage of them that have ever killed is a rounding error away from zero. How can you say "killing is what they do" will killing is what they almost never do?
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I get it but I will argue semantics though, guns dont kill people, people kill people. Reminds me of Oppenheimer "I am become death, destroyer of worlds" - OR we can make powerplants for cleanish energy and interstellar spaceship drives with it...
 
Sunburn74 said:
Not all rights are true human rights.
For much of history, certain people fought viciously and brutally for the right to own slaves. Or to beat their wives and children. Or to steal or unfairly tax. Or to do all sorts of horrible things they felt were natural, god given rights.
I would say the right to own certain weapons and blow your neighbors brains out is probably one of the more questionable human rights proposed.
Click to expand...

We are not blowing out our neighbor's brains on a whim. On this point I would agree that murder is reprehensible.

I am supporting the right to own & carry guns for the purposes of self defense. Justifiable homicide committed in self defense is not a crime.
 
Pipeline 1010 said:
Small correction. Guns are made for shooting bullets. That is ACTUALLY what they do. Where that bullet goes, what that bullet does is up to the user. Guns can certainly be used very effectively to kill. But that isn't what their purpose is, and it isn't what almost every gun in private ownership has ever been used for. It is such an extreme opinion that guns are made for killing when the percentage of them that have ever killed is a rounding error away from zero. How can you say "killing is what they do" will killing is what they almost never do?
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The technology of the gun was designed for the purpose of shooting at trees. Yeah, that makes sense. Killing is what they were absolutely meant to do, and do so effectively. They simply would not exist otherwise, or you are just being silly with yourself.
 
J.Wilkins said:
You are such an incredible idiot... You could argue the same point about nukes, they are safer than firearms since they have killed less people so why not let everyone have one of those?

Why do you own guns? Target practice? An air rifle will do that just fine so no problem relinquishing your firearms in exchange for an air rifle?
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I'm gonna guess you've never shot in a sanctioned target match. Here's a SHORT list of what you can't shoot with an air pistol or rifle. And yes I own an olympic quality air pistol, Steyr brand if you're curious.

Skeet
Trap
Sporting Clays
High Power Rifle
F Class Rifle 600/1000 yard
Bullseye 2700
3 Gun
IPSC
Bianchi Cup

What can you shoot with air rifles and pistols, 10 meter precision is about it.

Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
 
J.Wilkins said:
You won't be hearing from him again in this thread... guys like him are scurry away from fact as fast as they can.

Still, at 6.2 with our weather, we are a resilient fucking kinda people, aren't we... I'd have thought it would be higher.
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A pickled liver merely preserves the husk, so if it isn't really dead, it's not considered a suicide.
 
J.Wilkins said:
You are such an incredible idiot...
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Likely true. But I am an idiot savant so you would be wise to carefully consider my words.

J.Wilkins said:
You could argue the same point about nukes, they are safer than firearms since they have killed less people so why not let everyone have one of those?
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Got it: nukes = guns so if guns then nukes. I feel less idiotic after learning your lesson.

J.Wilkins said:
Why do you own guns? Target practice?
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YES! That is why I, Pipeline the idiot, owns guns. That is what I do with them. It is super fun. I have never killed anyone. I don't bother anybody or hurt anybody. I don't think I should have to choose between giving them up and getting assfucked in prison. You think I should. Careful: you are starting to sound like the idiot.

J.Wilkins said:
An air rifle will do that just fine
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Now that you mention it, I also have an air rifle. I don't kill people with my air rifle, either. Although I suppose that it could be used for that purpose, I am uninterested in using any of my possessions to do so. It does a fine job at target practice. Just like my rifles do. Thank you for noticing and commenting on the internet about it.

J.Wilkins said:
so no problem relinquishing your firearms in exchange for an air rifle?
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I don't wish to relinquish anything that will never be used to hurt anybody. You shouldn't wish me to either. I don't wish it for you.

In conclusion, please allow me to give you some advice. You are incredibly abrasive and you come across as angry and possibly drunk. Give people the benefit of the doubt. They might disagree with you and it might be for non-idiotic and non-evil reasons.
 
cytg111 said:
I get it but I will argue semantics though, guns dont kill people, people kill people. Reminds me of Oppenheimer "I am become death, destroyer of worlds" - OR we can make powerplants for cleanish energy and interstellar spaceship drives with it...
Click to expand...

You're right, we are arguing semantics. We probably agree on a couple of things: (1) Guns are very effective at killing people (2) The percentage of guns in private ownership used to kill people is within a rounding error of none. (3) Saying that something was intended to do something that it is almost never used to do (and that it is used to other things far far more often), is probably illogical.
 
vi edit said:
I'm not even sure what you are trying to argue at this point. Do you?
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Do I what? Know what I'm arguing? Yes I do. Mostly the same point I made before.

Since the US' gun deaths are mostly due to suicides, Europe should consider that it has a comparable suicide rate despite having a tiny fraction of the gun ownership that the US does before criticizing the US for Nonsensical Rifle Addiction.

Relative to gun ownership per capita, the US has less suicides than many European nations do. Denmark has a tenth of the gun ownership but three quarters of the suicide rate. Is Denmark also addicted to guns?
 
NetWareHead said:
An air rifle is not an acceptable substitute for a real firearm. Can you hunt with an air rifle?
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Yup, I got a highpowered 4.5mm, its qualified for birds hares squirrels, that sort of thing... Never had though, just for practise in the backyard and not scaring the neighbors to death.
 
vi edit said:
Small game sure. My Dad and I hunted squirrels and rabbits all the time with .22 air rifles. You aren't taking down anything bigger than a raccoon though.
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cytg111 said:
Yup, I got a highpowered 4.5mm, its qualified for birds hares squirrels, that sort of thing... Never had though, just for practise in the backyard and not scaring the neighbors to death.
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point taken about air rifles/pistols. Never knew you could hunt with air but makes sense that they work for small critters.
 
Pipeline 1010 said:
You're right, we are arguing semantics. We probably agree on a couple of things: (1) Guns are very effective at killing people (2) The percentage of guns in private ownership used to kill people is within a rounding error of none. (3) Saying that something was intended to do something that it is almost never used to do (and that it is used to other things far far more often), is probably illogical.
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Yea and plus, in the case of nuclear, since little boy and fat man you could argue that the a bomb is in fact a peace keeping bomb.. Shit gets confusing like this.
 
Atreus21 said:
Do I what? Know what I'm arguing? Yes I do. Mostly the same point I made before.

Since the US' gun deaths are mostly due to suicides, Europe should consider that it has a comparable suicide rate despite having a tiny fraction of the gun ownership that the US does before criticizing the US for Nonsensical Rifle Addiction.

Relative to gun ownership per capita, the US has less suicides than many European nations do. Denmark has a tenth of the gun ownership but three quarters of the suicide rate. Is Denmark also addicted to guns?
Click to expand...

This line of argument feels like this...

giphy.gif
 
zinfamous said:
The technology of the gun was designed for the purpose of shooting at trees.
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You're right (in your sarcasm). It was however, designed for the purpose of shooting bullets.

zinfamous said:
Yeah, that makes sense. Killing is what they were absolutely meant to do, and do so effectively. They simply would not exist otherwise, or you are just being silly with yourself.
Click to expand...

Can you tell me why, if is was designed to kill, that almost none of them (percentage wise) has ever been used to do so? Is it just shitty at it's purpose? Are the people who use them just shitty at killing? Could it be that people who build them and buy them and use them don't actually have that purpose in mind?
 
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vi edit said:
This line of argument feels like this...

giphy.gif
Click to expand...

I don't see why. It's a minor amendment to my original argument, that Europe has a higher suicide rate than the US. It doesn't, but it's awfully close, 11.9 to the US' 12.6.

Yet Europe has hardly anywhere near the number of guns per capita that the US does. That seems relevant to me.
 
NetWareHead said:
Im curious, boar need power to take them down. And you can do it with air?!? Yes please i will need to see this
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Holy shit...I didn't even know these things existed. .357 and 800fps. That is definitely lethal. Very lethal.

http://www.crosman.com/airguns/benjamin-airguns/bulldog-synthetic

Funny story...when my wife and I lived in IL my firearms owner card had expired. I wanted to get a new air rifle. I needed to get a new card to buy one. Both my wife and I went ahead and applied. She got hers processed in a week. Mine took 3 months. She ended up buying the rifle on her card.

😛
 
vi edit said:
Funny story...when my wife and I lived in IL my firearms owner card had expired. I wanted to get a new air rifle. I needed to get a new card to buy one. Both my wife and I went ahead and applied. She got hers processed in a week. Mine took 3 months. She ended up buying the rifle on her card.
😛
Click to expand...

firearms card for an air rifle? thats kinda stupid
 
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