The high school I start teaching at on Wed has no Scantron machine!

[coomar]

i had a physics teacher in high school who had brilliant mc

he actually in his first 2 or 3 years spent time creating a huge mc bank for himself

then he typed up the notes so he didn't really have to write up the notes every day (he just went a lot of examples every day)

his mc was pretty standard but it worked well

i remember the safety quiz, we had questions such as where is the fire blanket located or where is the fire extinguisher located (which is fairly hard when its the 2nd class and he's taken everything out, though the eyewash station question was easy)

 

[tw1164]

my HS only used scantron for the state/fed standardized testing

 

[Deeko]

Originally posted by: Ronstang

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: Ronstang
So what you are saying is you do not want to work, right? Grading is part of the job.

I'd rather have a teacher work on their lesson plan and ways to improve the class than have them waste hours grading multiple choice tests.

I would rather have my kids tested with real tests that cannot be graded in a scantron so they might actually learn something. School, whether it is grade/middle/high or college has become a joke in my opinion. If teachers use scantron tests that means they usually have a bank of questions they draw from in making tests. Collect a few years worth of back tests from other students and you don't have to actually learn anything. You simply study 500 questions. I saw it done all the time in college. My stepdaughters told me of all the ways they got around tests in HS too. It is sickening. No wonder this country is falling apart. The kids are only getting smarter in how to be lazy.

:roll: You've GOTTA be kidding me, if you think the country is falling apart because teachers give scantron tests.

Also, have you read what the OP has said? He's teaching BIO. Bio is a memorization class, this isn't a lit class, you don't write essays, you memorize loads of information. Plus, its AP...did they have AP tests when you were in high school old man? They are multiple choice, and the purpose of an AP class is to prepare students for the AP test, thus, it makes perfect sense to prepare them using multiple choice tests.

It was a good try though, to try to use the OP as an excuse to whine about how todays youth are useless. I applaud your effort, even if you failed.

 

[Deeko]

Originally posted by: Ipno
Dude you get a 3 month vacation every year, I haven't had more than a weeks vacation (at a time) in 10 years so just kindly STFU.

You know nothing of teaching. Everyone in my family but me is a teacher or went into teaching, they put in a lot more than 8 hours of work a day during the year, and they get paid sh!t for the work they do, so why don't YOU kindly stfu.

 

[JungleMan1]

Make all your answers "A". 😉

 

[Ipno]

Originally posted by: Deeko

Originally posted by: Ipno
Dude you get a 3 month vacation every year, I haven't had more than a weeks vacation (at a time) in 10 years so just kindly STFU.

You know nothing of teaching. Everyone in my family but me is a teacher or went into teaching, they put in a lot more than 8 hours of work a day during the year, and they get paid sh!t for the work they do, so why don't YOU kindly stfu.

I can't help it that they get paid crap, they must work for a bad school district.

I would gladly put in 10-12 hour days if it meant I got half as much vacation as teachers, oh wait... I do put in 10-12 hour days... pfft.

 

[montanafan]

My high school has a Scantron machine, but I've never used it. Of course, the subjects I teach are American history, world history, civics, geography, etc., and multiple choice tests just don't cut it with those.

I like to make my tests by hand from the notes and lectures in each individual class because the discussions in each can vary and touch on such a wide array of material and perspectives. For example, the notes and discussion of the Battle of Gettysburg would include all the basic information in all the classes, but then in one class the students may be much more interested in the actual battle and we may go into more detail about a portion of that, wheras another class might be more interested in the aftermath and Lincoln's writing of the Gettysburg Address and we'd go into more detail on that. The exact same test would not work well for both classes. I like to see what they got out of the discussion and exchange of ideas and opinions.

In those types of classes you have to test to see if they understand cause and effect and if they can form their own opinions and draw conclusions from open ended questions. You also have to grade for writing skills. So many kids today cannot organize their thoughts into a clear and concise written form. I also think it's important to check for spelling, I don't think I should give the same credit for Abe Linkin' as an answer as for Abe Lincoln. 🙂

I make new tests every time a night or two before I give them and I make them a mix of fill in the blank, short answers, multiple choice, true or false, essay, and open ended questions. Then I grade them all by hand because I want to see each individual's strengths and weaknesses, improvements, effort or lack thereof, critical thinking skills, and creative thought.

It is an extremely time consuming absolute pain in the ass, but it gives me the feeling of having that one on one teacher-student relationship that I've always thought being a teacher is all about.

I can see TheChort's side of it too though. Those are very different subjects and if he's preparing them for the AP tests and other standardized tests, the students have to get used to studying for and taking those types of tests. And all that grading by hand does take away just about any time for researching new and more detailed information on your subject, and for creating new and innovative lessons. I'd love to have more time for reading new material on my subjects and developing more creative lesson plans.

Maybe I'll wipe the dust off that Scantron machine and give it a try. At the very least it would help me to get some of these red ink stains off of my fingers. 🙂

 

[Analog]

Originally posted by: Ronstang

Originally posted by: yellowfiero
Heh, I teach in a university, and my students don't like the fact that my motto is:

"Life is not a multiple choice question...."

I cannot stand multiple choice - its only positive is that it is easier to grade. It promotes cheating, guessing, does not allow work to be shown, and may I say it gives an unrealistic outlook on life....

Thank You. My respect for you just went up exponetnially......even though you are a GM guy. 😉

GM guy - yeah I guess so.... BTW, the new mustang rocks.

 

[cavemanmoron]

wtf is a scranto machine?>

 

[Deeko]

Originally posted by: Ipno

Originally posted by: Deeko

Originally posted by: Ipno
Dude you get a 3 month vacation every year, I haven't had more than a weeks vacation (at a time) in 10 years so just kindly STFU.

You know nothing of teaching. Everyone in my family but me is a teacher or went into teaching, they put in a lot more than 8 hours of work a day during the year, and they get paid sh!t for the work they do, so why don't YOU kindly stfu.

I can't help it that they get paid crap, they must work for a bad school district.

I would gladly put in 10-12 hour days if it meant I got half as much vacation as teachers, oh wait... I do put in 10-12 hour days... pfft.

ALL teachers get paid bad numbskull.

I can't help it YOU apparently work a sh!tty job. Teachers get the summer off, big deal, they work long hours & weekends during the school year, and get paid like sh!t to do so, so don't act like they've got it cushy.

 

[JACKHAMMER]

I love how every thread on education turns into a teacher bashing fest. For those of you who think public schools are failing, if you look at the literature people have been saying that since the 1920's, and since many generations have gone thruogh since then I fail to see the relevance. Scores on some math test that ranks us in the 30's, who gives a sh1t?

 

[alkemyst]

From your profile:
City: Los Angeles
Province/State: California

I call shens.

 

[IAteYourMother]

Originally posted by: Ronstang

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: Ronstang
So what you are saying is you do not want to work, right? Grading is part of the job.

I'd rather have a teacher work on their lesson plan and ways to improve the class than have them waste hours grading multiple choice tests.

I would rather have my kids tested with real tests that cannot be graded in a scantron so they might actually learn something. School, whether it is grade/middle/high or college has become a joke in my opinion. If teachers use scantron tests that means they usually have a bank of questions they draw from in making tests. Collect a few years worth of back tests from other students and you don't have to actually learn anything. You simply study 500 questions. I saw it done all the time in college. My stepdaughters told me of all the ways they got around tests in HS too. It is sickening. No wonder this country is falling apart. The kids are only getting smarter in how to be lazy.

Some of the hardest tests I've ever taken were multiple choice

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: IAteYourMother

Originally posted by: Ronstang

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: Ronstang
So what you are saying is you do not want to work, right? Grading is part of the job.

I'd rather have a teacher work on their lesson plan and ways to improve the class than have them waste hours grading multiple choice tests.

I would rather have my kids tested with real tests that cannot be graded in a scantron so they might actually learn something. School, whether it is grade/middle/high or college has become a joke in my opinion. If teachers use scantron tests that means they usually have a bank of questions they draw from in making tests. Collect a few years worth of back tests from other students and you don't have to actually learn anything. You simply study 500 questions. I saw it done all the time in college. My stepdaughters told me of all the ways they got around tests in HS too. It is sickening. No wonder this country is falling apart. The kids are only getting smarter in how to be lazy.

Some of the hardest tests I've ever taken were multiple choice

dude is a troll, thinks all of NO problems are because they are black. I am a white guy.

his sig is:

My Rigs

1957 Thunderbird
1966 Shelby G.T.350H #1781
1966 Mustang Fastback restomod project
1966 Mustang Coupe restomod project (this one will get over 30 mpg!!)

I'm a car guy, a computer is a tool not a pastime!



the last line seems to take the cake since he is one.

 

[DrPizza]

Yes, of course you can make a multiple choice test easy or hard. That's not a problem.

I'd love to see a multiple choice test that adequately measures how well students learned at a higher cognitive level. Multiple choice questions are great for testing knowledge, comprehension, and application, but rarely suffice for testing analysis, synthesis, and evaluation. But, if you really don't set your expectations that high for students, then multiple choice tests should be just fine. Personally, I feel a combination of types of questions is best. Some content may lend itself well to multiple choice exams, especially when merely learning vocabulary words or basic knowledge.

As far as your argument about AP classes having multiple choice exams - I'll have to look at the math curriculum (as I'm most familiar with it - I teach math and physics) The Calculus AP exam is highly multiple choice. In my opinion, that's because it's the only way to rapidly correct that much student work. I would never in a million years give my calculus students a multiple choice test; but if we were studying for the AP exam, I would bombard them with sample questions for a few weeks prior, just to "prepare them for the test."

Teach to the test, if you must. I'd rather that my students learned the material.

Oh, and for whoever it was who said something about a 2 or 3 month vacation... screw you. Most teachers that I know easily work just as many hours annually as other full time workers. Because you only get one week vacations just means you've been screwed over by the system of working the rats to death; it doesn't give you a right to attack teachers. Look at vacation times for many European nations.

 

[Mermaidman]

That reminds me of a grade school teacher of mine who built her own "Scan-Tron" gadget. You can make your own too!

 

[TheChort]

thanks guys for the supportive comments,
I will probably put some of the suggestions in this thread to use. 😉

Originally posted by: allisolm
Somehow, when considering all of the inequities, injustices and inappropriate tasks meted out to teachers, the lack of a scantron scarcely registers.

your point is well taken, but i am coming from a private school with a decent administration, so many of those problems are infrequent. So in this case, I think acquiring a scantron machine would be something that would help me use my time better.

Originally posted by: krany
Aren't those machines $3,000-$4,000, plus you have to buy special forms to use in them?

Im not entirely sure yet. I've done some research and found really cheap ones for as low as $100 on ebay. But I wouldn't be surprised if they can be that expensive. As far as the special forms go, that just the scantron paper, which is really cheap last time i checked.

Originally posted by: alkemyst
From your profile:
City: Los Angeles
Province/State: California

I call shens.

400 person private school in hollywood that doesn't have a scantron machine, trust me, it's possible

 

[montanafan]

Originally posted by: cavemanmoron
wtf is a scranto machine?>

Scantron Machine

Edit: Not advocating the use of the chapstick method. 😛

 

[phreakah]

Originally posted by: JoeKing

Originally posted by: TheChort

Originally posted by: JoeKing
when will you learn.... you get a TA to grade them for you during class. DUH!



newbie teachers :roll:

point taken 😀
but if my school can't afford a couple hundred dollar scantron machine, I don't see myself getting a TA anytime soon

if you make it to next year just grab a "mature" senior that want's a zero period 😉

if you request one for the period before lunch... watch them line up trying to sign up under you. Let the senior out 5 mins early to lunch and you've made their life and got yourself a grading machine.

Yup.. then watch the TA become wealthy and some of your students suddenly getting really good grades in your class 🙂

 

[Blayze]

Originally posted by: Pepsi90919
they never used scantron for my multiple choice tests in high school

same and a few were even on the scantron sheets. They still graded them by hand.

Public school is getting bad in my area. They were teaching my cousin in Kindergarden how to spell using some method I have never even heard of. For cat they had to write CT. Hat? HT Stuff like that. If they messed up and put KT for cat it was still right. It was like just put something down and you get a smiley face and a check.

Sure its Kindergarden, but these kids will be so confused when they actually have to read and spell in 1st grade, etc...

 

[webcammie]

i hate MC questions because it's so tricky. Sometimes, the answer COULD be right but it is NOT the BEST answer. I hate that, "choose the best answer." I would take an essay or short answer over MC questions any day.

 

[Kelemvor]

Just make up an answer sheet and then make a template that has holes punched in it for the right answers. Lay the template over each answer sheet and everywhere you don't see the circle colored in, mar it wrong. That's how lots of teachers did it when I was in school. Pretty damn fast too.

 

[oboeguy]

Originally posted by: Ipno

Originally posted by: Deeko

Originally posted by: Ipno
Dude you get a 3 month vacation every year, I haven't had more than a weeks vacation (at a time) in 10 years so just kindly STFU.

You know nothing of teaching. Everyone in my family but me is a teacher or went into teaching, they put in a lot more than 8 hours of work a day during the year, and they get paid sh!t for the work they do, so why don't YOU kindly stfu.

I can't help it that they get paid crap, they must work for a bad school district.

I would gladly put in 10-12 hour days if it meant I got half as much vacation as teachers, oh wait... I do put in 10-12 hour days... pfft.

You're pathetically ignorant and obviously clueless. Your generalizations show this quite clearly.

Three months vacation for teachers is a myth. Do you know what a lot of (most?) teachers do during their "vacation"? Take other jobs and / or teach summer school. Plus at least in NYC it's only nominally two months in the first place.

Also stating that "schools bad ==> teachers bad" while at the same time bashing teachers for complaining about a lack of resources is completely idiotic. Look for some change between your couch pillows and buy yourself a clue, kid.

If you don't like your long hours and lack of vacation time, get another job, genius.

(that felt good 😀)

 

[Orsorum]

Originally posted by: oboeguy

Originally posted by: Ipno

Originally posted by: Deeko

Originally posted by: Ipno
Dude you get a 3 month vacation every year, I haven't had more than a weeks vacation (at a time) in 10 years so just kindly STFU.

You know nothing of teaching. Everyone in my family but me is a teacher or went into teaching, they put in a lot more than 8 hours of work a day during the year, and they get paid sh!t for the work they do, so why don't YOU kindly stfu.

I can't help it that they get paid crap, they must work for a bad school district.

I would gladly put in 10-12 hour days if it meant I got half as much vacation as teachers, oh wait... I do put in 10-12 hour days... pfft.

You're pathetically ignorant and obviously clueless. Your generalizations show this quite clearly.

Three months vacation for teachers is a myth. Do you know what a lot of (most?) teachers do during their "vacation"? Take other jobs and / or teach summer school. Plus at least in NYC it's only nominally two months in the first place.

Also stating that "schools bad ==> teachers bad" while at the same time bashing teachers for complaining about a lack of resources is completely idiotic. Look for some change between your couch pillows and buy yourself a clue, kid.

If you don't like your long hours and lack of vacation time, get another job, genius.

(that felt good 😀)

And it was well-deserved.

<--- mother had a 40-year career as a public school elementary teacher

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: DrPizza
Yes, of course you can make a multiple choice test easy or hard. That's not a problem.

I'd love to see a multiple choice test that adequately measures how well students learned at a higher cognitive level. Multiple choice questions are great for testing knowledge, comprehension, and application, but rarely suffice for testing analysis, synthesis, and evaluation. But, if you really don't set your expectations that high for students, then multiple choice tests should be just fine. Personally, I feel a combination of types of questions is best. Some content may lend itself well to multiple choice exams, especially when merely learning vocabulary words or basic knowledge.

Where did your education end? There are tons of certifications out there as well with high level analytical answers based on multiple choice. I find multiple choice tests harder to answer at that level, but grading then becomes a problem. If you are not getting papers back in time to review prior to the next exam it's not good.

Originally posted by: DrPizza

As far as your argument about AP classes having multiple choice exams - I'll have to look at the math curriculum (as I'm most familiar with it - I teach math and physics) The Calculus AP exam is highly multiple choice. In my opinion, that's because it's the only way to rapidly correct that much student work. I would never in a million years give my calculus students a multiple choice test; but if we were studying for the AP exam, I would bombard them with sample questions for a few weeks prior, just to "prepare them for the test."

Teach to the test, if you must. I'd rather that my students learned the material.

Oh, and for whoever it was who said something about a 2 or 3 month vacation... screw you. Most teachers that I know easily work just as many hours annually as other full time workers. Because you only get one week vacations just means you've been screwed over by the system of working the rats to death; it doesn't give you a right to attack teachers. Look at vacation times for many European nations.

I don't think anyone was attacking the teachers...expect when they are complaining they have to work so hard.